Is Immersion required by Scripture when a baptism is performed?

[Carbon]

Until I was shown, I was confused about Jesus saying we must be born of water and the Spirit.

I used to think that meant we had to be water baptized for the Spirit to beget our human spirit.

It did not seem right, but I had no other recourse.

Then I was shown by a pastor that Jesus was referring to two types of birth when speaking of "born of water and the Spirit."

And, having witnessed to a pregnant woman breaking water, it all made sense.

The pastor said first we must be born physically = mother broke water. Physical birth.

Then born again, by the Spirit begetting our human spirit causing regeneration.

That suddenly clicked into place. It made sense.


grace and peace ..........

Thanks

 

[donadams]

Thanks

Ez 36:25-27
Mk 16:16

 

[donadams]

Proper intention of valid baptism:

The initiation into the new covenant of grace unto the salvation of the soul, nicene creed, “one baptism for the forgiveness of sins”.

Brought to life. Jn 14:6 eph 2:1 quickened.

Believers baptism is not valid and not found in scripture.
Adult only baptism is not found in scripture.

Proper form of valid baptism:

Valid Christian baptism requires flowing water over the forehead three times.

With the words:

I baptize you in the name of the father and of the son and of the Holy Spirit! Matt 28:19

Immersion, pouring, or sprinkling 3 time with pure water are the valid matter of baptism.

Ez 36:25 I will sprinkle you with clean water and you shall be made white as snow.

Isa 52:15 So shall he sprinkle many nations; (baptism)

1 pet 1:2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied. (Baptism)

Heb 10:22
Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.

Examples
Sprinkle, sprinkled, sprinkling:

Blood:
Ex 24:6
Ex 24:8
Ex 29:16
Lev 1:5
2 kings 16:13
2 chron 29:22
1 pet 1:2

Water:
Num 8:7
Num 19:18

Sprinkle: refers to baptismal regeneration!
Isa 52:15
Ez 36:25
Heb 10:22

Immersion is not found in scripture!

 

[atpollard]

The initiation into the new covenant of grace unto the salvation of the soul, nicene creed, “one baptism for the forgiveness of sins”.

Since only God forgives sins, the “ONE BAPTISM“ that is EFFECTIVE is “not by human hands” and is FROM God and BY God. The stuff with water is like the earthly tabernacle … a representation of a Heavenly REALITY. Immersion of a believer is a better representation of being buried and raised with Christ than sprinkling water on a clueless infant. It just is.

 

[atpollard]

Immersion is not found in scripture!

Except for EVERYWHERE that the word “Baptize” appears in some form since the Greek word used means “to whelm” … like dying cloth or sinking a ship or soaking a cucumber in vinegar to make a pickle … “baptizo”.

βαπτίζω baptízō, bap-tid'-zo; from a derivative of G911; to immerse, submerge; to make whelmed (i.e. fully wet)

[Mat 3:6, 11, 13-14, 16 NASB20] 6 and they were being baptized[G907] by him in the Jordan River, as they confessed their sins. ... 11 "As for me, I baptize[G907] you with water for repentance, but He who is coming after me is mightier than I, and I am not fit to remove His sandals; He will baptize[G907] you with the Holy Spirit and fire. ... 13 Then Jesus arrived from Galilee at the Jordan, [coming] to John to be baptized[G907] by him. 14 But John tried to prevent Him, saying, "I have [the] need to be baptized[G907] by You, and [yet] You are coming to me?" ... 16 After He was baptized[G907], Jesus came up immediately from the water; and behold, the heavens were opened, and he saw the Spirit of God descending as a dove [and] settling on Him,
[Mat 28:19 NASB20] 19 "Go, therefore, and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing[G907] them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit,
[Mar 1:4-5, 8-9 NASB20] 4 John the Baptist[G907] appeared in the wilderness, preaching a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins. 5 And all the country of Judea was going out to him, and all the people of Jerusalem; and they were being baptized[G907] by him in the Jordan River, confessing their sins. ... 8 "I baptized[G907] you with water; but He will baptize[G907] you with the Holy Spirit." 9 In those days Jesus came from Nazareth in Galilee and was baptized[G907] by John in the Jordan.
[Mar 6:14, 24 NASB20] 14 And King Herod heard [about it,] for His name had become well known; and [people] were saying, "John the Baptist[G907] has risen from the dead, and that is why these miraculous powers are at work in Him." ... 24 And she went out and said to her mother, "What shall I ask for?" And she said, "The head of John the Baptist[G907]."
[Mar 7:4 NASB20] 4 and [when they come] from the marketplace, they do not eat unless they completely[G907] cleanse[G907] themselves; and there are many other things which they have received [as traditions] to firmly hold, [such as] the washing of cups, pitchers, and copper pots.)
[Mar 10:38-39 NASB20] 38 But Jesus said to them, "You do not know what you are asking. Are you able to drink the cup that I drink, or to be baptized[G907] with the baptism with which I am baptized[G907]?" 39 They said to Him, "We are able." And Jesus said to them, "The cup that I drink you shall drink; and you shall be baptized[G907] with the baptism with which I am baptized[G907].
[Mar 16:16 NASB20] 16 "The one who has believed and has been baptized[G907] will be saved; but the one who has not believed will be condemned.
[Luk 3:7, 12, 16, 21 NASB20] 7 So he was saying to the crowds who were going out to be baptized[G907] by him, "You offspring of vipers, who warned you to flee from the wrath to come? ... 12 Now even tax collectors came to be baptized[G907], and they said to him, "Teacher, what are we to do?" ... 16 John responded to them all, saying, "As for me, I baptize[G907] you with water; but He is coming who is mightier than I, and I am not fit to untie the straps of His sandals; He will baptize[G907] you with the Holy Spirit and fire. ... 21 Now when all the people were baptized[G907], Jesus also was baptized[G907], and while He was praying, heaven was opened,
[Luk 7:29-30 NASB20] 29 When all the people and the tax collectors heard [this,] they acknowledged God's justice, having been baptized[G907] with the baptism of John. 30 But the Pharisees and the lawyers rejected God's purpose for themselves, not having been baptized[G907] by John.
[Luk 11:38 NASB20] 38 When the Pharisee saw [this,] he was surprised that [Jesus] had not first ceremonially[G907] washed[G907] before the meal.
[Luk 12:50 NASB20] 50 "But I have a baptism to undergo[G907], and how distressed I am until it is accomplished!
[Jhn 1:25-26, 28, 31, 33 NASB20] 25 They asked him, and said to him, "Why then are you baptizing[G907], if you are not the Christ, nor Elijah, nor the Prophet?" 26 John answered them, saying, "I baptize[G907] in water, [but] among you stands One whom you do not know. ... 28 These things took place in Bethany beyond the Jordan, where John was baptizing[G907] [people.] ... 31 "And I did not recognize Him, but so that He would be revealed to Israel, I came baptizing[G907] in water." ... 33 "And I did not recognize Him, but He who sent me to baptize[G907] in water said to me, 'He upon whom you see the Spirit descending and remaining upon Him, this is the One who baptizes[G907] in the Holy Spirit.'
[Jhn 3:22-23, 26 NASB20] 22 After these things Jesus and His disciples came into the land of Judea; and there He was spending time with them and baptizing[G907]. 23 Now John also was baptizing[G907] in Aenon, near Salim, because there was an abundance of water there; and [people] were coming and being baptized[G907]-- ... 26 And they came to John and said to him, "Rabbi, He who was with you beyond the Jordan, to whom you have testified--behold, He is baptizing[G907] and all [the people] are coming to Him."
[Jhn 4:1-2 NASB20] 1 So then, when the Lord knew that the Pharisees had heard that He was making and baptizing[G907] more disciples than John 2 (although Jesus Himself was not baptizing[G907]; rather, His disciples [were]),
[Jhn 10:40 NASB20] 40 And He went away again beyond the Jordan to the place where John was first baptizing[G907], and He stayed there.
[Act 1:5 NASB20] 5 for John baptized[G907] with water, but you will be baptized[G907] with the Holy Spirit not many days from now."
[Act 2:38, 41 NASB20] 38 Peter [said] to them, "Repent, and each of you be baptized[G907] in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. ... 41 So then, those who had received his word were baptized[G907]; and that day there were added about three thousand souls.
[Act 8:12-13, 16, 36, 38 NASB20] 12 But when they believed Philip as he was preaching the good news about the kingdom of God and the name of Jesus Christ, both men and women were being baptized[G907]. 13 Now even Simon himself believed; and after being baptized[G907], he continued on with Philip, and as he observed signs and great miracles taking place, he was [repeatedly] amazed. ... 16 (For He had not yet fallen upon any of them; they had simply been baptized[G907] in the name of the Lord Jesus.) ... 36 As they went along the road they came to some water; and the eunuch said, "Look! Water! What prevents me from being baptized[G907]?" ... 38 And he ordered that the chariot stop; and they both went down into the water, Philip as well as the eunuch, and he baptized[G907] him.
[Act 9:18 NASB20] 18 And immediately [something] like [fish] scales fell from his eyes, and he regained his sight, and he got up and was baptized[G907];
[Act 10:47-48 NASB20] 47 "Surely no one can refuse the water for these to be baptized[G907], who have received the Holy Spirit just as we [did,] can he?" 48 And he ordered them to be baptized[G907] in the name of Jesus Christ. Then they asked him to stay on for a few days.
[Act 11:16 NASB20] 16 "And I remembered the word of the Lord, how He used to say, 'John baptized[G907] with water, but you will be baptized[G907] with the Holy Spirit.'
[Act 16:15, 33 NASB20] 15 Now when she and her household had been baptized[G907], she urged [us,] saying, "If you have judged me to be faithful to the Lord, come into my house and stay." And she prevailed upon us. ... 33 And he took them that [very] hour of the night and washed their wounds, and immediately he was baptized[G907], he and all his [household.]
[Act 18:8 NASB20] 8 Crispus, the leader of the synagogue, believed in the Lord together with his entire household; and many of the Corinthians, as they listened [to Paul,] were believing and being baptized[G907].

 

[atpollard]

[Act 19:3-5 NASB20] 3 And he said, "Into what then were you baptized[G907]?" And they said, "Into John's baptism." 4 Paul said, "John baptized[G907] with a baptism of repentance, telling the people to believe in Him who was coming after him, that is, in Jesus." 5 When they heard this, they were baptized[G907] in the name of the Lord Jesus.
[Act 22:16 NASB20] 16 'Now why do you delay? Get up and be[G907] baptized[G907], and wash away your sins by calling on His name.'
[Rom 6:3 NASB20] 3 Or do you not know that all of us who have been baptized[G907] into Christ Jesus have been baptized[G907] into His death?
[1Co 1:13-17 NASB20] 13 Has Christ been divided? Paul was not crucified for you, was he? Or were you baptized[G907] in the name of Paul? 14 I am thankful that I baptized[G907] none of you except Crispus and Gaius, 15 so that no one would say you were baptized[G907] in my name! 16 But I did baptize[G907] the household of Stephanas also; beyond that, I do not know if I baptized[G907] anyone else. 17 For Christ did not send me to baptize[G907], but to preach the gospel, not with cleverness of speech, so that the cross of Christ would not be made of no effect.
[1Co 10:2 NASB20] 2 and they all were baptized[G907] into Moses in the cloud and in the sea;
[1Co 12:13 NASB20] 13 For by one Spirit we were all baptized[G907] into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, and we were all made to drink of one Spirit.
[1Co 15:29 NASB20] 29 For otherwise, what will those do who are baptized[G907] for the dead? If the dead are not raised at all, why then are they baptized[G907] for them?
[Gal 3:27 NASB20] 27 For all of you who were baptized[G907] into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ.

 

[GeneZ]

Proper intention of valid baptism:

The initiation into the new covenant of grace unto the salvation of the soul, nicene creed, “one baptism for the forgiveness of sins”.

The penalty for sins (which would be to be forsaken by God) Jesus Himself bore on the Cross.
For, by default, the way were were born fallen, God would have automatically forsaken us all.

The forgiveness of sins we commit after salvation? Now that was also been taken care of by the Blood Atonement of Christ!

All we need to do is to believe. Then after we are saved, implement the following passage for for ourselves for the forgiveness of our post salvation sins.

" Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned."

When we believe we have been baptized by the Spirit into the body of Christ.

For we were all baptized by one Spirit so as to form one body—whether Jews or Gentiles, ​

slave or free—and we were all given the one Spirit to drink." 1 Corinthians 12:13​

Why someone insists that baptism has to mean water baptism. That indicates they have not yet learned how the word was used in that day.
Here is an example of what I speak of...

"They were all baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea." 1 Cor 10:2​

That right there should tell someone something. That its best to find out how the word was used in the culture of the time the Bible was written.

 

[David1701]

Is immersion required when Baptism is performed? can you back your belief with scripture?

And Jesus came and said to them, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. 19 Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you. And behold, I am with you always, to the end of the age.” Matt 28.

Yes, immersion is required; in fact, the Greek word translated "baptise" means "to dip" (as in dipping a piece of cloth under liquid, to die it) or "to immerse". It is occasionally used differently but that is its primary usage and meaning.

Most translations do not actually translate the Greek word at all, they merely transliterate it (create an English word with similar sounds to the original). That transliterated word has become part of English, but a proper translation would be, in most instances, "to immerse".

Here's a translation that does translate the Greek word properly.

Matt. 3:4-11 (VW)
4 And John himself was clothed in camel’s hair, with a leather waistband around his waist; and his food was locusts and wild honey.
5 Then Jerusalem, all Judea, and all the region around the Jordan went out to him
6 and were immersed by him in the Jordan, confessing their sins.
7 But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to his immersion, he said to them, Offspring of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the wrath to come?
8 Therefore bring forth fruits worthy of repentance,
9 and do not think to say within yourselves, We have Abraham as our father. For I say to you that God is able to raise up children to Abraham from these stones.
10 And now already the ax is laid to the root of the trees. Therefore any tree which does not bear good fruit is cut off and thrown into the fire.
11 I indeed immerse you in water unto repentance, but He who is coming after me is mightier than I, whose sandals I am not worthy to carry. He will immerse you in the Holy Spirit and fire

 

[GeneZ]

We as Christians are to be "immersed" into God.
Baptized into the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.
We have been baptized in the person of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.


We are to be immersed into learning Bible Doctrine as to have our cup running over.....
Immersed into the New Life in Christ.

What is better in God's eyes?
That?
Or 'water?'

Remember... the Bible teaches we can become immersed into a person.

"They were all baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea." 1 Cor 10:2

When you were immersed into water it was just for a moment.
You did not gain any knowledge (and probably some confusion) from it .

We are to become immersed into the Life as he shows us the Way in the Truth. John 14:6

In most forums only .0001% of the Bible gets covered.
And, even that much gets argued over.

Why?

 

[atpollard]

Why?

The genealogies are B O R I N G.

 

[GeneZ]

The genealogies are B O R I N G.

... at least they would be more genial...

 

[donadams]

The 1st century catacombs have pictures of baptism by pouring

Ez 36:25-27 does not say immersion
All three forms are valid
If applied three times with the words I baptize you in the name of the father and of the son and of the Holy Spirit!

 

[atpollard]

Ez 36:25-27 does not say immersion

No, but it DOES say that GOD will do it rather than any human hands.

 

[atpollard]

The 1st century catacombs have pictures of baptism by pouring

First century Gnostics believed that Jesus was fully God, but only APPEARED to be a man. Just because SOMEBODY in the First Century believed it, does not make it Biblical or correct.

 

[GeneZ]

The 1st century catacombs have pictures of baptism by pouring

Ez 36:25-27 does not say immersion
All three forms are valid
If applied three times with the words I baptize you in the name of the father and of the son and of the Holy Spirit!

Don. Peter was slow on the uptake. In the rush of excitement of the baptism of the Holy Spirit at Pentecost it completely slipped Peter's mind what Jesus had told him before Pentecost. He was told that Spirit would replace water.

Look at Acts 1:4-5.. (this took place after Jesus was resurrected)

On one occasion, while he was eating with them, he gave them this command: “Do not leave ​

Jerusalem, but wait for the gift my Father promised, which you have heard me speak about. ​

For John baptized with water, but in a few days you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.”​

See that?
" John baptized with water, but in a few days you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.”

The new type of baptism for the church age would change everything!

Peter was slow at first to remember, but considering all the strange things and excitement that was whirling around him
its easy to understand. It took Peter till the 11th chapter of Acts to finally remember what Jesus had told him about the
new baptism way! It is why Peter continued water baptizing in ignorance till he finally put 1 and 1 together to realize
Spirit baptism is to be the new baptism.

Many today when reading Acts are making the same mistake Peter did! It took a while for the new truth to finally sink in with Peter.
It took him all the way to Acts 11 to finally realize that water baptism was obsolete. And, Peter was not alone. Others also continued
with the same old way of thinking for some time, and were water baptizing even after the people were baptized by the Spirit.

​

It took eleven chapters for it to all click with Peter!​

​

“As I began to speak, the Holy Spirit came on them as he had come on us at the beginning. ​

Then I remembered what the Lord had said: ‘John baptized with water, but you will be ​

baptized with the Holy Spirit.’ Acts 11:15-16​

Up until then Peter was commanding water baptisms. Just like he always had done before Pentecost.
It was just like Peter had to be told by the Lord to stop having to keep kosher.

Kind of like a Catholic becoming born again, and when he first enters a Bible teaching church? He genuflects!

grace and peace ................

 

[donadams]

First century Gnostics believed that Jesus was fully God, but only APPEARED to be a man. Just because SOMEBODY in the First Century believed it, does not make it Biblical or correct.

Immersion, pouring, or sprinkling 3 time with pure water are the valid matter of baptism.

Ez 36:25 I will sprinkle you with clean water and you shall be made white as snow.

Isa 52:15 So shall he sprinkle many nations; (baptism)

1 pet 1:2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied. (Baptism)

Heb 10:22
Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.

Examples
Sprinkle, sprinkled, sprinkling:

Blood:
Ex 24:6
Ex 24:8
Ex 29:16
Lev 1:5
2 kings 16:13
2 chron 29:22
1 pet 1:2

Water:
Num 8:7
Num 19:18

Sprinkle: refers to baptismal regeneration!
Isa 52:15
Ez 36:25
Heb 10:22

 

[donadams]

First century Gnostics believed that Jesus was fully God, but only APPEARED to be a man. Just because SOMEBODY in the First Century believed it, does not make it Biblical or correct.

First century catacombs were where Christians hid out not the enemy of christ

 

[donadams]

Don. Peter was slow on the uptake. In the rush of excitement of the baptism of the Holy Spirit at Pentecost it completely slipped Peter's mind what Jesus had told him before Pentecost. He was told that Spirit would replace water.

Look at Acts 1:4-5.. (this took place after Jesus was resurrected)

On one occasion, while he was eating with them, he gave them this command: “Do not leave ​

Jerusalem, but wait for the gift my Father promised, which you have heard me speak about. ​

For John baptized with water, but in a few days you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.”​

See that?
" John baptized with water, but in a few days you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.”

The new type of baptism for the church age would change everything!

Peter was slow at first to remember, but considering all the strange things and excitement that was whirling around him
its easy to understand. It took Peter till the 11th chapter of Acts to finally remember what Jesus had told him about the
new baptism way! It is why Peter continued water baptizing in ignorance till he finally put 1 and 1 together to realize
Spirit baptism is to be the new baptism.

Many today when reading Acts are making the same mistake Peter did! It took a while for the new truth to finally sink in with Peter.
It took him all the way to Acts 11 to finally realize that water baptism was obsolete. And, Peter was not alone. Others also continued
with the same old way of thinking for some time, and were water baptizing even after the people were baptized by the Spirit.

​

It took eleven chapters for it to all click with Peter!​

​

“As I began to speak, the Holy Spirit came on them as he had come on us at the beginning. ​

Then I remembered what the Lord had said: ‘John baptized with water, but you will be ​

baptized with the Holy Spirit.’ Acts 11:15-16​

Up until then Peter was commanding water baptisms. Just like he always had done before Pentecost.
It was just like Peter had to be told by the Lord to stop having to keep kosher.

Kind of like a Catholic becoming born again, and when he first enters a Bible teaching church? He genuflects!

grace and peace ................

Something wrong with kneeling or is God not present in their “sanctuary”?

The biblical mandate of God’s work of creation!

Water and the spirit!

First creation:

Gen 1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. 2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

(water and the spirit)

Noah:

Gen 8:8 Also he sent forth a dove (representing the spirit) from him…

(Water and the spirit)

Red Sea:

Led thru the waters by the spirit.
Exodus 13:21
And the Lord went before them by day in a pillar of a cloud, to lead them the way; and by night in a pillar of fire, to give them light; to go by day and night:

(Water and the spirit)

Josuha

Joshua and the people of Israel crossing of the Jordan led by the spirit.

Joshua 1:1 Now after the death of Moses the servant of the Lord it came to pass, that the Lord spake unto Joshua the son of Nun, Moses’ minister, saying, 2 Moses my servant is dead; now therefore arise, go over this Jordan, thou, and all this people, unto the land which I do give to them, even to the children of Israel.

(Water and the spirit)

Prophecy of the new creation: (new covenant)

Ez 36:25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you. 26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh. 27 And I will put my spirit within you…
acts 2:38-39 “this promise”

(Water and the Spirit)

Baptism of Jesus

Jn 1:31 I come baptizing with water. 32 And John bare record, saying, I saw the Spirit descending from heaven like a dove, and it abode upon him.

(Water and the spirit)

New creation by water and the spirit

Jn 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

(Water and the spirit)

Christian sacrament of baptismal regeneration is by: WATER AND THE SPIRIT!


No one is born again by:

“the spirit alone”!
Or
“Faith alone”!

Water AND the spirit is the biblical mandate!

 

[donadams]

Effects of faith & baptism!

Ez 36:25-27 washed in baptism, with a new heart and the Spirit
Matt 28:19 faith & baptism
Jn 3:5 born again in baptism
Mk 16:16 faith & baptist
Acts 2:38 repentance & baptism
Acts 8:36-38 faith & baptism
Acts 22:16 baptism washes away sin
Rom 6:3 died with Christ
Col 2:12 risen with Christ
1 cor 12:13 baptized into the church
Gal 3:27 by baptism put on Christ
2 Tim 1:10 eph 2:1 and 5 brought to life
2 cor 5:17 new creation
Eph 1:13 eph 4:30 sealed by the Holy Spirit
Eph 4:5 one faith, one baptism
Eph 5:26 faith and baptism
Titus 3:5 baptismal regeneration
1 pet 1:2 washed in Christ’s blood
1 pet 2:9 the kingdom of light
1 pet 3:20-21 baptism saves us!

Faith and baptism are required Mk 16:16 eph 4:5

Faith alone even all faith avails NOTHING! 1 cor 13:2

 

[donadams]

Zech 13:1 “In that day there shall be a fountain opened TO THE HOUSE OF DAVID, and to the INHABITANTS OF JERUSALEM, for sin and for uncleanness."