Is Immersion required by Scripture when a baptism is performed?

[donadams]

Only source of Divine truth!

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Jesus answered, “It is written: ‘Man shall not live on bread alone, but on every word that comes ​

from the mouth of God.’” Mt 4:4​

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Now, brothers and sisters, I have applied these things to myself and Apollos for your benefit, ​

so that you may learn from us the meaning of the saying, “Do not go beyond what is written.” ​

Then you will not be puffed up in being a follower of one of us over against the other." 1 Cor 4:6​

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.........​

The mouth of God is not written scripture but tradition!

Apostolic tradition is what the apostles heard Christ teach and what they taught, some part of which was committed to writing by some apostles or under some apostles as the HS inspired!

Does the church need scripture to know the truth?

Now, brothers and sisters, I have applied these things to myself and Apollos for your benefit, ​

so that you may learn from us the meaning of the saying, “Do not go beyond what is written.” ​

Applies to the laity not the apostolic church! Which is the light (truth) and the pillar of truth! Matt 5:14 1 Tim 3:15
Thanks

 

[donadams]

Wonder of wonders.....

"And don’t call anyone on earth ‘Father.’ You have one Father. He is in heaven." Mat 23:9​

And..... note!

It does not say...

Do not say that anyone is a father on earth. Father is also a descriptive term!
Jesus said not to use the term "Father" as a title for a man.

Rightly dividing the Word is the issue.

Are you allowed to refer to our forerunners as father or fathers?
Jn 4:20

Why do Paul and John both apostles make themselves spiritual fathers? 1 Tim 1:2 & 1 Jn 2:1

All fatherhood on earth!
Ephesians 3:15
Of whom the whole family in heaven and earth is named

Thanks

 

[donadams]

Jesus was speaking of two births. Was he not?

And the second birth is by both and
Water and the spirit!

And you cannot enter the kingdom on your own Jn 3:5
Must be administered 2 pet 1:11
By the apostolic church 2 cor 8:19

Did John the Baptist prepared the way for Christ by preaching fundamentalist tradition of “accept Christ as your personal lord and savior” or by water baptism?

Then the new birth in the new covenant of grace is by water baptism as the initiation!

The second birth is by water and the spirit not the spirit alone!

Faith and baptism acts 8:37-38
How does the eunuch know about water baptism unless the apostles taught him?

Mk 16:16 he who believes and is baptized shall be saved.

 

[donadams]

[John 20:21 NASB20] So Jesus said to them again, "Peace [be] to you; just as the Father has sent Me, I also send you."

... no "and their successors". Jesus sent them to start a Church and write the new Scripture for the New Covenant. The Apostles (those Jesus actually sent) accomplished the work they were anointed for and sent to accomplish. It is the "posers" that came on their heels that started to mess things up. So I say, let's get back to what Jesus started and the Apostles actually said ... you know ... the church in and of the BIBLE.

Ok the apostles are the light (truth) of the world Matt 5:14 and the apostolic church is the pillar of truth 1 Tim 3:15

What did Andrew or Nathaniel write?

Thanks

 

[donadams]

[John 20:21 NASB20] So Jesus said to them again, "Peace [be] to you; just as the Father has sent Me, I also send you."

... no "and their successors". Jesus sent them to start a Church and write the new Scripture for the New Covenant. The Apostles (those Jesus actually sent) accomplished the work they were anointed for and sent to accomplish. It is the "posers" that came on their heels that started to mess things up. So I say, let's get back to what Jesus started and the Apostles actually said ... you know ... the church in and of the BIBLE.

Jesus is an apostle with authority to appoint and send other apostles but those apostles who have the same authority can’t send more apostles? Why?

 

[atpollard]

Jesus is an apostle with authority to appoint and send other apostles but those apostles who have the same authority can’t send more apostles? Why?

Can the Pope sit down and add a new book to the Bible?
Why or why not?

[The reason why the Pope cannot reopen Scripture ... even IF he does have the mantle of Peter ... is the same reason why Peter cannot create an apostle just like Jesus did.]

 

[atpollard]

What did Andrew or Nathaniel write?

Nothing that survived as far as I know.
Do you have any information to the contrary?

"The Apostles (those Jesus actually sent) accomplished the work they were anointed for and sent to accomplish."

I guess "writing" was not the work that God annotated Andrew and Nathaniel to accomplish. Evangelism in Greece and Turkey (Andrew) and India and Armenia (Nathaniel) appears to have been enough for them.

 

[GeneZ]

The mouth of God is not written scripture but tradition!

Apostolic tradition is what the apostles heard Christ teach and what they taught, some part of which was committed to writing by some apostles or under some apostles as the HS inspired!

Does the church need scripture to know the truth?

Now, brothers and sisters, I have applied these things to myself and Apollos for your benefit, ​

so that you may learn from us the meaning of the saying, “Do not go beyond what is written.” ​

Applies to the laity not the apostolic church! Which is the light (truth) and the pillar of truth! Matt 5:14 1 Tim 3:15
Thanks

Don? How did we get what we have in writing?

 

[donadams]

I'll just pick one of the slew you presented to show you do not know how to interpret the Word of God.


That one makes your position look good....
That is... Until one understands it in its Biblical context.

"To those who were disobedient long ago when God waited patiently in the days of Noah ​

while the ark was being built. In it only a few people, eight in all, were saved through water, ​

and this water symbolizes baptism that now saves you also—not the removal of dirt from ​

the body but the pledge of a clear conscience toward God. It saves you by the resurrection ​

of Jesus Christ." 1 Peter 320-21​

The flood came.. Did Noah get wet? Did Noah become immersed?
No! It was not a water baptism. Noah remained dry!

That flood water RAISED Noah up and above the destruction taking place below him.
That water saved him from the evils of the world that would have destroyed him.

How does that apply to us?

How does Spirit Baptism now save us?

Like the waters of the flood of Noah raised up Noah to safety?
Spirit baptism now raises us up and above into the heavens where we are now seated with Christ!

But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, made us alive with Christ ​

even when we were dead in transgressions—it is by grace you have been saved. ​

And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus,​

in order that in the coming ages he might show the incomparable riches of his grace, expressed in his ​

kindness to us in Christ Jesus." Eph 2:4-7​

We are seated with Him in Heaven?
For the Spirit has baptized us into the Body of Christ!
That body will be revealed in our resurrection when we discover our body is just like his own glorious body!

For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body—whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free—​

and have all been made to drink into one Spirit. " 1 Cor 12:13​

grace and peace ................

So spirit baptism is really just faith?
Thanks

 

[GeneZ]

So spirit baptism is really just faith?
Thanks

Don.... How did you get that conclusion?

 

[donadams]

I'll just pick one of the slew you presented to show you do not know how to interpret the Word of God.


That one makes your position look good....
That is... Until one understands it in its Biblical context.

"To those who were disobedient long ago when God waited patiently in the days of Noah ​

while the ark was being built. In it only a few people, eight in all, were saved through water, ​

and this water symbolizes baptism that now saves you also—not the removal of dirt from ​

the body but the pledge of a clear conscience toward God. It saves you by the resurrection ​

of Jesus Christ." 1 Peter 320-21​

The flood came.. Did Noah get wet? Did Noah become immersed?
No! It was not a water baptism. Noah remained dry!

That flood water RAISED Noah up and above the destruction taking place below him.
That water saved him from the evils of the world that would have destroyed him.

How does that apply to us?

How does Spirit Baptism now save us?

Like the waters of the flood of Noah raised up Noah to safety?
Spirit baptism now raises us up and above into the heavens where we are now seated with Christ!

But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, made us alive with Christ ​

even when we were dead in transgressions—it is by grace you have been saved. ​

And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus,​

in order that in the coming ages he might show the incomparable riches of his grace, expressed in his ​

kindness to us in Christ Jesus." Eph 2:4-7​

We are seated with Him in Heaven?
For the Spirit has baptized us into the Body of Christ!
That body will be revealed in our resurrection when we discover our body is just like his own glorious body!

For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body—whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free—​

and have all been made to drink into one Spirit. " 1 Cor 12:13​

grace and peace ................

Check my thread in Bible study forum
Biblical hijinks!
For context etc.
thanks

 

[GeneZ]

Check my thread in Bible study forum
Biblical hijinks!
For context etc.
thanks

Gee, thanks.

Wood, hay, and stubble.... for sale.


For no other foundation can any one lay than that which is laid, which is Jesus Christ. Now if any one builds on the foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble— each man’s work will become manifest; for the Day will disclose it, because it will be revealed with fire, and the fire will test what sort of work each one has done. If the work which any man has built on the foundation survives, he will receive a reward. If any man’s work is burned up, he will suffer loss, though he himself will be saved, but only as through fire." 1 Cor 3:11-15

bye.

 

[donadams]

Don? How did we get what we have in writing?

Some apostles were inspired by the HS to write some things

 

[donadams]

Don.... How did you get that conclusion?

Trying to understand your idea of spirit baptism, if it’s not water baptism, question is it faith or faith alone?

Ez 36:25-27 has two spirit baptisms?

Lk 1:41 And it came to pass, that, when Elisabeth heard the salutation of Mary, the babe leaped in her womb; and Elisabeth was filled with the Holy Ghost:

Lk 1:67 And his father Zacharias was filled with the Holy Ghost, and prophesied, saying,

Jn 20:22 And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost:

Act 1:15 acts 2:11 acts 15:7 Peter stood up and spoke with authority

Acts 4:8 Then Peter, filled with the Holy Ghost, said unto them, Ye rulers of the people, and elders of Israel,

3rd time for Peter to receive “spirit baptism”! He must be special for some reason! Jn 20:22 acts 2:4

Are these also spirit baptism?

 

[GeneZ]

Some apostles were inspired by the HS to write some things

The Greek says what the prophets and the apostles wrote was was "God breathed."

"God breathed." = From the mouth of God!

All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness,​

so that the servant of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work.." 2 Timothy 3:16-17​

All Scripture is God-breathed - not just some.

 

[donadams]

Gee, thanks.

Wood, hay, and stubble.... for sale.


For no other foundation can any one lay than that which is laid, which is Jesus Christ. Now if any one builds on the foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble— each man’s work will become manifest; for the Day will disclose it, because it will be revealed with fire, and the fire will test what sort of work each one has done. If the work which any man has built on the foundation survives, he will receive a reward. If any man’s work is burned up, he will suffer loss, though he himself will be saved, but only as through fire." 1 Cor 3:11-15

bye.

Don’t sound like spirit baptism, sounds like work’s salvation!

Thanks anyway

 

[GeneZ]

Trying to understand your idea of spirit baptism, if it’s not water baptism, question is it faith or faith alone?

Ez 36:25-27 has two spirit baptisms?

Try posting the passage. The Word of God is beautiful. Why do you hide it in a closet?

Here! Ezekiel 36:25-27

I will sprinkle clean water on you, and you will be clean; I will cleanse you from all your impurities and from all your idols. I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit in you; I will remove from you your heart of stone and give you a heart of flesh. And I will put my Spirit in you and move you to follow my decrees and be careful to keep my laws."

Water baptism never does that. Water baptism is only a ritual at best.


The words of the mouth are deep waters, but the fountain of wisdom is a rushing stream." Proverbs 18:4

Its not about baptism!

Here....

Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ also loved the church and gave Himself for her,
that He might sanctify and cleanse her with the washing of water by the word," Ephesians 5:25-26


The water of the Word is what cleanses our soul.

 

[GeneZ]

Don’t sound like spirit baptism, sounds like work’s salvation!

Thanks anyway

Sounds like you can not understand Scripture.

All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness." 2 Tim 3:16

The Lord has given us all time to be corrected.
He is patient with all of us.
He wants us to win. To become winners...

 

[atpollard]

I would argue that nowhere does the Bible specify that baptize means immersion in water, and, furthermore, would say that it strongly suggests sprinkling/pouring.

Except for the WORD ITSELF (baptizo):

• "to whelm" (make fully wet);
• to plunge under (used to describe a sinking ship);
• to immerse (used to describe placing a cucumber in vinegar to make a pickle)

... all distinct from:

• "bapto" ("to dip")
• "paspalízo" ("to sprinkle")
• "epicheō" ("to pour")

Now, one can argue that the Bible calls for IMMERSION into other things ... (we are immersed into Christ) ... but it always calls for IMMERSION [baptizo] and not pour or dip or sprinkle.

 

[GeneZ]

Except for the WORD ITSELF (baptizo):

• "to whelm" (make fully wet);
• to plunge under (used to describe a sinking ship);
• to immerse (used to describe placing a cucumber in vinegar to make a pickle)

... all distinct from:

• "bapto" ("to dip")
• "paspalízo" ("to sprinkle")
• "epicheō" ("to pour")

Now, one can argue that the Bible calls for IMMERSION into other things ... (we are immersed into Christ) ... but it always calls for IMMERSION [baptizo] and not pour or dip or sprinkle.

That's how Baptism is used in reference to water.

But, baptism does not mean water by default...

"They were all baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea."