Genesis 6:1-5 who are the sons of God and daughters of man that is talked about?

[EarlyActs]

Nothing. You are being way too simplistic. You are handling a profound piece of archeology in written form. Don't handle it with a back hoe!

For proper work, you need to know: regional history
*language features (unless you know that)
*literary features (a standard tool here is BDB's literary lexicon of the OT. Unlike a dictionary without references, a lit. lexicon prints the lines including the example under discussion)
*transmission features (how did the text originate and get to the point of being written when Hebrew writing starts about 1800 BC/E?) Since that is the date of Hebrew writing, you can see that the people writing (Joseph) would use idioms from his time about that time. Joseph was in Egypt and addressed some Egyptian issues when he wrote. This must be kept in mind.

We always cross-check what we are saying so that the end-product is strong and does not crumble by being ignorant of something obvious or by over-simplifying.

Unfortunately, the early material is full of such things in very terse form, and we have a lot 'invested' in what that means. For ex., the Bab-el incident. Very few words have so much consequence.

I assume you know what terse means.

 

[EarlyActs]

No it is the cities: in like Maner as sodom and Gomorrah

The cities were acting like the angels.

 

[GeneZ]

What authority do rabies have?
I thought they were just laymen teachers not priests
What English translation do you recommend?

In this day and age? If you want to get a very exacting translation from the Hebrew? You would painfully
have to learn from Hasidic Jewish rabbis who read from the Hebrew. But they will blind you with their bias
when it comes to finding Jesus in the OT. Or, find a very rare Christian scholar who is both skilled at rendering
the historic background and Hebrew grammar, to place the Scripture in its right context.

I have only found one such teacher who is capable to teach on that level for both Hebrew and Greek Scriptures.
I have found only a few who are very helpful with the NT Greek languages.

If you want to sit down and study and concentrate here is someone I can recommend someone to you.
Start a private conversation if you want to.

Translations do not convey too many times what is needed to gain a correct understanding.
That is why God gave only some to be pastor teachers. The good ones are rare today.

Here is the painful problem we face today in regards to pastor teachers ....

​

​

For the time will come when people will not put up with sound doctrine. ​

Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great ​

number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear." 2 Timothy 4:3​

2 Timothy 4:3 warns... Many pastors are trained to be selling their version of Christianity to those who will like their "spiritual marketing."

A good pastor will stick with what is being said in the Greek and Hebrew and will not spare you when your bias gets exposed and dealt with. That is why Jesus said if we are to follow Him we must deny self and take up our own cross. For man's tradition in teaching and bias must die in its ever to be replaced with the true life in Christ.

Life in Christ = the thinking of Christ = God's Word presented in accuracy.

grace and peace ..............

 

[3 Resurrections]

No it is the cities: in like Maner as sodom and Gomorrah

If you read the whole context, it starts out with the angels which kept not their principality, but left their habitation "Even AS" Sodom and those other cities had gone after other flesh. The similarity was between the angels offense against God and humanity in Sodom, Gomorrah, and other cities all committing the same offense against God in going after other types of flesh than their own. As "LIKEWISE ALSO" the "filthy dreamers" in Jude's day had "defiled the flesh".

 

[EarlyActs]

If you read the whole context, it starts out with the angels which kept not their principality, but left their habitation "Even AS" Sodom and those other cities had gone after other flesh. The similarity was between the angels offense against God and humanity in Sodom, Gomorrah, and other cities all committing the same offense against God in going after other types of flesh than their own. As "LIKEWISE ALSO" the "filthy dreamers" in Jude's day had "defiled the flesh".

so actually there are 2 instances that are similar: S&G and the corrupt people of Jude's letter period. Both involved in 'ekporneia', and the revolting angels are accused of that.

 

[donadams]

The cities were acting like the angels.

No, there are two distinct examples
The angels fall do to the sin of pride

And s & g and the cities sin of sexual perversion

Thanks

 

[EarlyActs]

No, there are two distinct examples
The angels fall do to the sin of pride

And s & g and the cities sin of sexual perversion

Thanks

No, you are simply not reading it completely, not understanding the double reference of Jude: the ancient cities and the corrupt teachers were both involved in 'ekporneia' like the revolting angels.

If you will diagram the sentence and account for each word, like I have my HS students do, you will not make this mistake.

 

[donadams]

If you read the whole context, it starts out with the angels which kept not their principality, but left their habitation "Even AS" Sodom and those other cities had gone after other flesh. The similarity was between the angels offense against God and humanity in Sodom, Gomorrah, and other cities all committing the same offense against God in going after other types of flesh than their own. As "LIKEWISE ALSO" the "filthy dreamers" in Jude's day had "defiled the flesh".

5 I will therefore put you in remembrance, though ye once knew this, how that the Lord, having saved the people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed them that believed not.

6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.

7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.

Then you must admit the fallen angels are held in judgment for unbelief and not pride which is the sin that caused their fall?

These are isolated and not connected examples of disobedience unto God

Jude is warning Christians to remain faithful

Thanks

 

[donadams]

No, you are simply not reading it completely, not understanding the double reference of Jude: the ancient cities and the corrupt teachers were both involved in 'ekporneia' like the revolting angels.

If you will diagram the sentence and account for each word, like I have my HS students do, you will not make this mistake.

Then you must admit the fallen angels are held in judgment for unbelief and not pride which is the sin that caused their fall?

These are isolated and not connected examples of disobedience unto God

Jude is warning Christians to remain faithful

Thanks

 

[3 Resurrections]

Then you must admit the fallen angels are held in judgment for unbelief and not pride which is the sin that caused their fall?

All the fallen angels are now dead. God killed Satan and destroyed the entire Satanic realm back in AD 70. Yes, pride had much to do with the different sins (plural) which the third of the righteous angels committed, causing their fallen condition. One of those sins was in taking human women to sire hybrid sons, since all angels in scripture are presented as male, with no way to propagate their own species among themselves.

In revolt against that limitation on their species, some angels over time during the OT left their principality and habitation in which they were created and infiltrated humankind's gene pool. For which crime they were held in judgment until their destruction.

Another way the angels fell into pride was in accepting worship from the Gentiles - and from the Jews when they fell into idolatry.
Satan's sin which caused his fall from perfection was definitely characterized by pride, as Ezekiel 28:17 and 1 Timothy 3:6 both describe.

 

[EarlyActs]

So also[ag] Sodom and Gomorrah and the neighboring towns,[ah] since they indulged in sexual immorality and pursued unnatural desire[ai] in a way similar to[aj] these angels,[ak] are now displayed as an example by suffering the punishment of eternal fire.

subject verbal clause
S&G&towns are displayed...as an example...
\
explanatory clause: (since) they indulged in sexual immorality and pursued unnatural desire in a way similar to these angels

 

[GeneZ]

If you read the whole context, it starts out with the angels which kept not their principality, but left their habitation "Even AS" Sodom and those other cities had gone after other flesh. The similarity was between the angels offense against God and humanity in Sodom, Gomorrah, and other cities all committing the same offense against God in going after other types of flesh than their own. As "LIKEWISE ALSO" the "filthy dreamers" in Jude's day had "defiled the flesh".

Genesis 6 concerning the angels comes under great opposition when discussed.

Why? It reveals that angels were originally created by God to receive females which never materialized because of Satan's rebellion.

And, what did that leave the angels with who resented God? Becoming the very first drag queens and homosexuals out of their frustration
and lust for having a heterosexual relationship as they witnessed to with humans.

God's faithful angels became recipients of grace to be celibate. But, not the rebellious angels.

Its also why we see in Romans 1 the heterosexual males turning into flaming homosexuals after they rejected knowing God as God revealed Himself and made Himself know to them. Romans 1:18-23

They turned into uncontrollable homosexuals because after they rejected God, God handed them over the invisible powers that they were inspired to lie against with God. It says they became haters of God.

​

Furthermore, just as they did not think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God, ​

so God gave them over to a depraved mind, so that they do what ought not to be done. ​

They have become filled with every kind of wickedness, evil, greed and depravity. They are ​

full of envy, murder, strife, deceit and malice. They are gossips, slanderers, God-haters, insolent, ​

arrogant and boastful; they invent ways of doing evil; they disobey their parents; they have no ​

understanding, no fidelity, no love, no mercy." Romans 1:28-31​

Romans 1:28-31 sounds just like commentary about our corrupt media and socialist politicians we have festering today.


grace and peace ...........

 

[EarlyActs]

Then you must admit the fallen angels are held in judgment for unbelief and not pride which is the sin that caused their fall?

These are isolated and not connected examples of disobedience unto God

Jude is warning Christians to remain faithful

Thanks

What does the "then" refer back to? You are quite a difficult person to follow.

At the NET version with the most text notes out there, read note ai and aj on 'ekporneia.' Of course pride can be involved in sexual sin, but cannot be compartmentalized. The NET is available at biblegateway.com.

 

[EarlyActs]

All the fallen angels are now dead. God killed Satan and destroyed the entire Satanic realm back in AD 70. Yes, pride had much to do with the different sins (plural) which the third of the righteous angels committed, causing their fallen condition. One of those sins was in taking human women to sire hybrid sons, since all angels in scripture are presented as male, with no way to propagate their own species among themselves.

In revolt against that limitation on their species, some angels over time during the OT left their principality and habitation in which they were created and infiltrated humankind's gene pool. For which crime they were held in judgment until their destruction.

Another way the angels fell into pride was in accepting worship from the Gentiles - and from the Jews when they fell into idolatry.
Satan's sin which caused his fall from perfection was definitely characterized by pride, as Ezekiel 28:17 and 1 Timothy 3:6 both describe.

"One of those sins..." Important point; this may explain I Cor 10's reference to the head-covering that women should wear "...because of the angels."

That's quite a claim about 70 AD. Please reference.

 

[donadams]

No, you are simply not reading it completely, not understanding the double reference of Jude: the ancient cities and the corrupt teachers were both involved in 'ekporneia' like the revolting angels.

If you will diagram the sentence and account for each word, like I have my HS students do, you will not make this mistake.

What does diagram the sentence mean?

 

[GeneZ]

All the fallen angels are now dead. God killed Satan and destroyed the entire Satanic realm back in AD 70.

Are you saying Jews are Satan?

 

[EarlyActs]

What does diagram the sentence mean?

It identifies the subject (compound) and the verbal clause (about being an example of destruction).

This sentence also has an explanatory clause "since..." The corrupt teachers will end up like the cities and the angels.

Two sexual sins are identified, and the cities and the corrupt teachers did them as the rebellious angels did. You see, in Judaism at the time, there were groups which said that they had heard from the same angels that delivered the torah (Col 2) and that resulted in Judaizers. But in Jude and 2 Peter 2, you are dealing with sexual perversion, quite opposite to Judaizing. But what do they appeal to for their basis? Angels again.

Would you please explain in detail what you are expecting rebellious angels to act like? They mess up EVERYTHING about God's creation that they can.

 

[EarlyActs]

A comentary note on v10:

Like irrational animals, these false teachers do grasp one thing—the instinctive behavior of animals in heat. R. Bauckham (Jude, 2 Peter [WBC], 63) notes that “Though they claim to be guided by special spiritual insight gained in heavenly revelations, they are in fact following the sexual instincts which they share with the animals.”

Please see above about this 'revelation' coming through Judaism. That's what we would expect of revolting angels.

 

[3 Resurrections]

"One of those sins..." Important point; this may explain I Cor 10's reference to the head-covering that women should wear "...because of the angels."

That's quite a claim about 70 AD. Please reference.

Well, if the head covering of women actually was related to the angels who might again have been tempted to commit the same sin again as in Genesis 6, it would no longer be a problem after they were all destroyed in the AD 70 era, leaving only the "elect angels" who have been preserved in a righteous standing before God.

I understand it does give people cause to question why I would claim this Satanic realm was completely destroyed back then in the AD 70 era, but I do this with a list of a number of scriptures which are quite plain that angels had their imminent destruction looming in those first-century days, and they were well aware of it. However, I should probably put all that information in a post dedicated to that theme alone, for clarity.

 

[3 Resurrections]

Are you saying Jews are Satan?

No, I'm not, although I realize that the word "satan" can and is also used simply as an "accuser" in scripture. I am referring to the celestial fallen angels and unclean spirits whose entire realm led by the Devil / the Dragon / that "Old Serpent" / and Satan were all destroyed from the earth and have not been in existence now since the AD 70 era. God did a complete purge of them at that time.