Genesis 6:1-5 who are the sons of God and daughters of man that is talked about?

[3 Resurrections]

May be more than one meaning to the term “son’s of God” just there is more than one meaning to the word “father”.

Yes, there is. "Behold what love the Father has bestowed on us that we should be called the sons of God". We as believing humanity are recipients of the adoption, which makes us also the "sons of God", comparable to the angels' status as the original "sons of God" in heaven before humanity was created.

Jesus says angels do not marry (Gen 6 wives = marriage)

Matthew 22:30
For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.

Not quite. Jesus said that the angels of God in heaven do not marry. That is why Jude specifically emphasizes the fact that the fallen angels had "left their first estate" (or "principality"). Their taking of women / wives on earth was not a marriage union in heaven.

 

[3 Resurrections]

Psalm 104:4
Who maketh his angels spirits; his ministers a flaming fire:
“pure spirits” “no bodies”

In Psalms 104:4, that word "spirits" is "winds". We are not really talking about an angelic being that is solely composed of a spirit and no flesh. After all, the "anointed cherub" in Ezekiel 28:14 is presented as "walking up and down in the midst of the stones of fire". Satan in Job 1:7 told God that he had been "going to and fro in the earth and walking up and down in it." This would seem to require some kind of form with legs to do this "walking", unless one is going to attribute this to merely a metaphorical expression.

 

[donadams]

I'm afraid not in this 1 Cor. 15:40 passage. The sun, moon, and stars are given as addititonal types of glory in the next verse #41 - not the same as the glory which the angelic celestial bodies have, or the glory which the terrestrial bodies of humanity have.

The context of Jude 6-8 tells us that the angels, just as Sodom, Gomorrah, and the other cities, as well as the "filthy dreamers" of Jude's day had all similarly "defiled the FLESH". It's a different kind of flesh for the angels, with different capabilities to be sure, but flesh nonetheless.

Why not also connect verses 5 & 6?

Jesus says angels do not marry (Gen 6 wives = marriage)

Matthew 22:30
For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.



Psalm 104:4
Who maketh his angels spirits; his ministers a flaming fire:
“pure spirits” “no bodies”

Lk 24:39 Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.

Angels don’t have bodies and cannot procreate

Elsewhere in genesis it Does not say “son’s of God” but angels!
Gen 19:1
Gen 28:12
Gen 32:1

Satan is the leader of the fallen angels and he never lusts after eve? He communicated with her but did not desire her, why not?
May be more than one meaning to the term “son’s of God” just there is more than one meaning to the word “father”.

 

[donadams]

The comparison is to their sexual deviance. You are breaking the established grammar of "since they indulged in sexual immorality and pursued unnatural desire[ai] in a way similar to[aj] these angels," which is also found in the corrupt teachers. Very explicit terms are used. Yes it takes pride and unbelief, but you are the one avoiding what it is saying, not me.

I now know that even if the text said so, you would have a problem. Why?

Cos angels are pure spirits and have no bodies no sex

6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.

7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.

The only mention of “angels” is in vs 6 line one: “they left their habitation”

Nothing about sexual sin

Va 7 line two & three
“In like maner”

In like maner refers to the cities who “in like maner” as sodom & Gomorrah sinned not referring to any angels

Thanks

 

[donadams]

You are way off Don. You are not following the narrative of Genesis. Food was offered to "the visitors" and S&G wanted to have sexual relations with "the visitors."

In other cases, when angels appear, they make people afraid. That's not a pure spirit, it is visible.

That’s an apparition not a body

 

[donadams]

The rebellion acted out in a sexual way, to see what kind of creatures they could create. That's where the evil creatures of Gen 6 come from. You are breaking the narrative.

Scripture for this assertion please?

The evil creatures, what evil creatures Gen 6 says “giants” and “men of old” and “men of renoun”.

Gen 6 the whole context is mankind not angels

Gen 6:1 And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them,

(Men not angels)

2 That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose.

(Men not angels)

3 And the Lord said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.

(Men not angels)

4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.

(Men not angels)

5 And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

(Men not angels)

6 And it repented the Lord that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.

(Men not angels)

7 And the Lord said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.

(Men not angels)

8 But Noah found grace in the eyes of the Lord.

(Noah a man not angels)

Never says evil creatures or sins of angels

Thanks


Men or mankind began to multiply not “angels and women”

 

[3 Resurrections]

Jesus says angels do not marry (Gen 6 wives = marriage)

That's not quite the way the quote in Matthew 22:30 goes. As I wrote above in comment #201, Jesus said that the angels in heaven do not marry. When the rebellious angels "left that habitation" or principality in heaven to marry the daughters of men on earth, they went outside the bounds which restricted the righteous angels in heaven.

Satan is the leader of the fallen angels and he never lusts after eve? He communicated with her but did not desire her, why not?

Just as there are differences in humanity when it comes to what is most tempting for each individual, so it must have been with the angels. There was diversity among them as well. Some Christ called "more wicked" than others in Matthew 12:45.
Satan the "anointed cherub" apparently lusted after power and the worship of mankind more than anything else.

Angels don’t have bodies and cannot procreate

Angels have "celestial bodies" (1 Cor. 15:40) and a different type of "other flesh" than humanity (Jude 7) and with different capabilities, since they are "greater in power and might" than humanity (2 Peter 2:11). They cannot possibly procreate among their own created kind, being all portrayed as males in the scripture, but that did not prevent them from taking human women for wives and procreating by that forbidden means.

Why not also connect verses 5 & 6?

You're right, I do think those two verses 5 & 6 connect with the entire theme in Jude.

TOTAL destruction of ALL those who came out of Egypt (save for Joshua and Caleb alone).
TOTAL destruction of ALL the fallen angels in the "judgment of the great day".
TOTAL destruction of ALL those in Sodom and Gomorrah and the cities of the plain (save for Lot and his two daughters).

Every one of these three massive destructions above were judgments concerning a "defiling of the flesh" (Jude 8).

We know that fornication in worship of the golden calf was a real problem for the children of Israel, as well as many falling into fornication at Baal-peor with the women of Moab.

The same problem with the fallen angels "defiling the flesh" with the daughters of men was a recurring problem in the OT.

Sodom and Gomorrah and the cities of the plain had the same problem by "defiling the flesh" with homosexual acts as well as demanding a physical union with the angelic visitors.

 

[donadams]

Yes, there is. "Behold what love the Father has bestowed on us that we should be called the sons of God". We as believing humanity are recipients of the adoption, which makes us also the "sons of God", comparable to the angels' status as the original "sons of God" in heaven before humanity was created.

Not quite. Jesus said that the angels of God in heaven do not marry. That is why Jude specifically emphasizes the fact that the fallen angels had "left their first estate" (or "principality"). Their taking of women / wives on earth was not a marriage union in heaven.

That don’t change the nature of the angels?

comparable to the angels' status as the original "sons of God" in heaven before humanity was created.

Where does scripture say this?
Thanks

 

[donadams]

In Psalms 104:4, that word "spirits" is "winds". We are not really talking about an angelic being that is solely composed of a spirit and no flesh. After all, the "anointed cherub" in Ezekiel 28:14 is presented as "walking up and down in the midst of the stones of fire". Satan in Job 1:7 told God that he had been "going to and fro in the earth and walking up and down in it." This would seem to require some kind of form with legs to do this "walking", unless one is going to attribute this to merely a metaphorical expression.

Yes but it’s just an apparition not a real body

It says His angels are spirits

Thanks

 

[donadams]

Gen 6 the whole context is mankind not angels

Gen 6:1 And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them,

(Men not angels)

2 That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose.

(Men not angels)

3 And the Lord said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.

(Men not angels)

4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.

(Men not angels)

5 And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

(Men not angels)

6 And it repented the Lord that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.

(Men not angels)

7 And the Lord said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.

(Men not angels)

8 But Noah found grace in the eyes of the Lord.

(Noah a man not angels)

 

[donadams]

That's not quite the way the quote in Matthew 22:30 goes. As I wrote above in comment #201, Jesus said that the angels in heaven do not marry. When the rebellious angels "left that habitation" or principality in heaven to marry the daughters of men on earth, they went outside the bounds which restricted the righteous angels in heaven.


Just as there are differences in humanity when it comes to what is most tempting for each individual, so it must have been with the angels. There was diversity among them as well. Some Christ called "more wicked" than others in Matthew 12:45.
Satan the "anointed cherub" apparently lusted after power and the worship of mankind more than anything else.

Angels have "celestial bodies" (1 Cor. 15:40) and a different type of "other flesh" than humanity (Jude 7) and with different capabilities, since they are "greater in power and might" than humanity (2 Peter 2:11). They cannot possibly procreate among their own created kind, being all portrayed as males in the scripture, but that did not prevent them from taking human women for wives and procreating by that forbidden means.

You're right, I do think those two verses 5 & 6 connect with the entire theme in Jude.

TOTAL destruction of ALL those who came out of Egypt (save for Joshua and Caleb alone).
TOTAL destruction of ALL the fallen angels in the "judgment of the great day".
TOTAL destruction of ALL those in Sodom and Gomorrah and the cities of the plain (save for Lot and his two daughters).

Every one of these three massive destructions above were judgments concerning a "defiling of the flesh" (Jude 8).

We know that fornication in worship of the golden calf was a real problem for the children of Israel, as well as many falling into fornication at Baal-peor with the women of Moab.

The same problem with the fallen angels "defiling the flesh" with the daughters of men was a recurring problem in the OT.

Sodom and Gomorrah and the cities of the plain had the same problem by "defiling the flesh" with homosexual acts as well as demanding a physical union with the angelic visitors.

Still no verse that’s says angels have sex or are sons of God

 

[GeneZ]

Actually, I was a young parent with three young children growing up in that toxic environment during that time. It left a mark, but not one which has ruined my desire for fellowship, or I wouldn't be on here earnestly wanting to exchange views with others and examine the scriptures between us. There is a fine line between chucking all others' opinions and being a "noble Berean". I try to find the right balance as best I can.

I could have PM'd you... But.
Quite a few believers could be helped by these teaching series as well:

412 Child Abuse • Ephesians (1990) 1220–1234 15 hours

376 Child Abuse “Unfit Parents and Tragic Children”:
Matthew 18:1–14
• Spiritual Dynamics (1992) 31–57 27 hours

Those are just the titles and lesson numbers.

If interested in getting these live classes (without charge) PM me.

grace and peace ....

Jesus says angels do not marry (Gen 6 wives = marriage)

Matthew 22:30
For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.

That should answer your own doubting what I said...
For it says...

but are as the angels of God in heaven.

Not all angels are "angels of God!"


Think now....

 

[3 Resurrections]

Where does scripture say this?

The "sons of God" were there in Job 38:7 when God laid the foundations of the earth at creation and set the bounds of the sea, "when the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy..." This was before humanity was created.

Yes but it’s just an apparition not a real body

It says His angels are spirits

How is it possible for an "apparition" to be burned to ashes on the earth, which was going to be the fate of Satan the "anointed cherub" in Ezekiel 28:18-19?

 

[GeneZ]

Jesus says angels do not marry (Gen 6 wives = marriage)

Matthew 22:30
For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.

Not all angels are angels of God in heaven.

Are they?

Now, do you want to rethink what you claimed?

 

[GeneZ]

Still no verse that’s says angels have sex or are sons of God

This is why you can not find it...

"And this is my prayer: that your love may abound more and more in knowledge and depth of insight."​

​

Philippians 1:9​

grace and peace.....

 

[Hobie]

I know that alternate take. It will not explain with intellectual honesty why suddenly giants were born of them.

Adam was called a "son of God" while he was yet unfallen. From God's hand came a son of God.
After Adam fell he became (in his nature) the seed of Satan.

Well, if you comprehend how man has shrunk from the corruption of diet and health, to say nothing of what sin has done, then you would see how originally man was much bigger. When Adam was created he was bigger in both size and intellect, and the lineage from him kept to what was given more so than those who came from Cain.

 

[GeneZ]

Well, if you comprehend how man has shrunk from the corruption of diet and health, to say nothing of what sin has done, then you would see how originally man was much bigger. When Adam was created he was bigger in both size and intellect, and the lineage from him kept to what was given more so than those who came from Cain.

Then there would not be giants... Everything would seem normal and not worth commenting on.


NEXT!

 

[donadams]

Angels wiped out in the flood?

If angels have bodies “flesh” they must be wiped out in the flood, scripture only says 8 people were saved.

Gen 6:17 And, behold, I, even I, do bring a flood of waters upon the earth, to destroy all flesh, wherein is the breath of life, from under heaven; and every thing that is in the earth shall die


Gen 6 context is mankind, every verse refers to man, and men, angels are never even mentioned!

Elsewhere in Genesis the writer does refer to angels but always as “angels” never as “the sons of God”!


Are we really just Relying on our own private judgement of scripture?

Instead of Christ the light of the world, and the way, the truth, and the Life!

And Christ and His church are one unity in all truth and grace!

Really we are just believing in our own private fallible judgment!

When Christ established the church to teach and sanctify all men unto eternal salvation! Matt 28:19

Christians must be taught or instructed by the one, holy, catholic and apostolic Church! Lk 1:4
Matt 28:19, Lk 10:16, Jn 20:21
Acts 8:31, Colossians 2:7

Our understanding, study, interpretation, judgment, are all adding to scripture!


Truth known by “hearing” the apostles not the “Bible alone”!

1 John 4:6 We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.

The apostles in person:

2 John 1:12
Having many things to write unto you, I would not write with paper and ink: but I trust to come unto you, and speak face to face, that our joy may be full.

Doctrine of the apostles: acts 2:42

And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers.
Thanks

 

[donadams]

I could have PM'd you... But.
Quite a few believers could be helped by these teaching series as well:

412 Child Abuse • Ephesians (1990) 1220–1234 15 hours

376 Child Abuse “Unfit Parents and Tragic Children”:
Matthew 18:1–14
• Spiritual Dynamics (1992) 31–57 27 hours

Those are just the titles and lesson numbers.

If interested in getting these live classes (without charge) PM me.

grace and peace ....

That should answer your own doubting what I said...
For it says...



Not all angels are "angels of God!"


Think now....

How? All creation is of God!

 

[donadams]

The "sons of God" were there in Job 38:7 when God laid the foundations of the earth at creation and set the bounds of the sea, "when the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy..." This was before humanity was created.

How is it possible for an "apparition" to be burned to ashes on the earth, which was going to be the fate of Satan the "anointed cherub" in Ezekiel 28:18-19?

It says in Jude they are held in chains but it’s a metaphor not real chains

Is it possible that creation itself is the sons of God in job? God is the father of creation?