THE ANGELS THAT SINNED

[donadams]

How can an adjective be a noun?
Besides, if you take Satan as Lucifer the angel, well, the angels that sinned are all locked up.
You can't make an adjective a noun when the Holy Spirit wants it to be an adjective.

Please explain

 

[donadams]

How did eating a piece of forbidden fruit change Adam and Eve's nature? It was the righteous angel's act of disobedience in leaving their habitation or principality which changed their nature into the fallen state, in the same manner as a single act of disobedience did for the original couple's nature.

Both are still the same nature just fallen
Adam don’t cease to be a man?

 

[jeremiah1five]

Please explain

Many places the word "devil" and "Satan" are adjectives in the KJV.
The word "devil" means "traducer" which means "false accuser/liar."
The word "Satan" means "adversary" and has been described to man.

There are no fallen angels that sinned loose on the planet because they are all locked up.

4 For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment; 2 Pet. 2:4.

 

[CrowCross]

Gen 6:4

4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.

Line one: giants in the land
Line five: offspring

The first offspring were Cain and Able, were they giants?

Thanks

The giants in those days were eplained by the fallen angels.

I've noticed you never gave a reason for them.

 

[CrowCross]

How does leaving a habitation change their nature?

How would it not? They sinned...

 

[3 Resurrections]

Does men of renown mean large in stature or a great man?

Both, in the case of the hybrid race of angel / human children of the fallen angels. Those giants gave rise to the opponents of the people of Israel as they attempted to enter the land of Canaan: "a people great and tall, the children of the Anakims, whom thou knowest, and of whom thou hast heard say, Who can stand before the children of Anak!" (Deut. 9:2)

Were all the giants wiped out in the flood?

Yes, they were, but the same problem of the fallen angels again marrying the human daughters of men cropped up again after the flood. That is why there were the giants, the Anakim that the Israelites were too afraid of conquering when the spies brought back their report. in Numbers 13:32-33. "And they brought up an evil report of the land which they had searched unto the children of Israel, saying, the land, through which we have gone to search it, is a land that eateth up the inhabitants thereof; and all the people that we saw in it are men of a great stature. And there we saw the giants, the sons of Anak, which come of the giants: and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight."

Giants had also dwelled in times past in the land of Moab (Deut. 2:10-11) and in the land of Ammon ("That also was accounted a land of giants: giants dwelt therein in old time; and the Ammonites call them Zamzummims; A people great, and many, and tall, as the Anakims..." (Deut. 2:20-21).

It took King David and his mighty men to finally slay the last of the giants sons in 2 Samuel 21.

 

[Wordsmith]

Many places the word "devil" and "Satan" are adjectives in the KJV.

And many places it is a noun so you do not get make all references to satan and adjective just to fit your doctrine!


Strong's Concordance
Satanas: the adversary, Satan, i.e. the devil
Original Word: Σατανᾶς, ᾶ, ὁ
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: Satanas
Phonetic Spelling: (sat-an-as')
Definition: the adversary, Satan, the devil
Usage: an adversary, Satan.

 

[Wordsmith]

How does one error lead to another? Here is a perfect example.

2 Peter 2:4 For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;

Some teach this means all fallen angels but when comparing scripture with scripture it is not all but those that committed the sin of Jude 6 &7.

Jude 6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.

7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.

By insisting 2 Peter refers to all fallen angels you have to ignore the sin of fornication and going after strange flesh, which is the specific sin that got the angels of Jude 6 chained and those are the same angels of 2 Peter 2:4. Yes all angels that committed the sin of Jude 7 are chained up but not all fallen angels are in that category.

Some teach that all fallen angels fell in early Genesis and were locked up then but again that error leads to other error. Since some have declared there is no satan personality and no fallen angels doing mischief in our day, that error creates more error by ignoring many other scriptures many of which were the words of Jesus.

The Sethite concoction is needed to explain the sons of God in Genesis 6 to cover for the error of locking satan and all fallen angels up in early Genesis. Note: not one shred of actual scriptural evidence is offered too support the Sethite falsehood. There is no clear scriptural link from Seth to the term "sons of God" in the OT.

The references to satan and demons are explained away by saying they are in chains or bad attitudes which is another error caused by the first error mentioned here. This is explained by the error of satan being an adjective and not a noun when it clearly is a noun in many cases but those are ignored to support the cycle of errors.

Scriptural facts accepted by a large segment of Biblical scholars and believers today and the early church.

1. All "sons of God" references in the OT are not humans.
2. Satan (the devil) is still seeking whom he may devour. 1Peter 5:8
3. Demons are evil entities not attitudes. Jesus delt with them and told us to deal with them.
4 Giants in scripture were very tall people.
5. God ordered the elimination of giant clans men , women and children
6. In Daniel 10:12-14 "the prince of the kingdom of Persia" hindered for 21 the angel sent to answer Daniels prayer and the angel Michael was sent to help over come. That prince of Persia could be nothing other than a fallen angel because no human could withstand an angel sent by God. The original error pointed out in this post ignores this passage and has no scripturally viable way to explain it away.

One error leads to problems that create more error to cover for the original error and this is a cycle of errors that confuse the body of Christ as to the realties of the world today.

 

[Hobie]

There is only ONE God.
There is NONE like Him.
He gives His glory (of which holiness and righteous are His glory) to NO ONE.
Several things: First, God created Adam and the woman sinful, that is, as the Greek word "harmatia" is defined as "missing the mark."
What is the "mark?" The glory of God. Or the glory that is God.
That's the only way God could create man. They were fallen short of the glory of God and that is also sin. We know that sin comes from sinner. Adam sinned. It was because he was a sinner created sinful.
Adam was not created 'holy' or 'righteous' for these are attributes of God and God does not share, copy, duplicate His glory to anyone.
Adam sinned because he was a sinner. The Law is in place to show all mankind that we are sinners. If there are people that spit on the ground (and there are) but there's no law against it then they are not lawbreakers if and when they spit. This was the explanation of Paul in Romans (as well as in the Old Testament), but this is what Paul said:

7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet. Rom. 7:7.

If there was no law against coveting and Paul lusted for something he is not a lawbreaker. But since there is a law against coveting then such existence of this law shows Paul and everyone that lusting for something, or someone is sin. Many Christians understand this, but they ignore this one little fact. There was a law/command in the Garden of Eden:

17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die. Gen. 2:17.

Taking what Paul said about coveting is applicable to Adam and the woman in the Garden. It would sound like this if Adam was doing the talking:

ADAM: "What shall we say then? Is the law/command sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law/command: for I had not known disobedience, except the law/command had said, Thou shalt not eat [of it.]"

And Paul goes on in Romans: (read carefully.)

8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.
9 For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.
10 And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death.
11 For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it slew me.
12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.
13 Was then that which is good made death unto me? God forbid. But sin, that it might appear sin, working death in me by that which is good; that sin by the commandment might become exceeding sinful. Rom. 7:8–13.

Since there is only ONE God the idea that Adam was created 'holy' or 'righteous' falls short if he were to stand before God and that's what it was. There is only ONE Person that can stand before a Holy God and that is a Holy Son. IF Adam was created holy he would not sin, for one, and for two, Adam by necessity would have to possess ALL the Nature and Deific Attributes of God and be god in order to stand before the One True God on his own. But Adam was not holy, he was not righteous, he was not All-Wise, nor Omnipotent, nor Omnipresent, nor Omniscient. Thus, he was less, very less than God and this means he was fallen short of the glory of God and that means sin and sinful. Plus, the fact that he sinned shows that he was a sinner for sin does not come from holy. The last Adam proved this.

13 As saith the proverb of the ancients, Wickedness proceedeth from the wicked: 1 Sam. 24:13.

Who's to say this ancient proverb did not come from the Garden of Eden and developed when Adam passed on his story to his children?
We sin because we are sinner. We are not sinners because we sin.

Take a closer read on Romans 5:12-19 with these things in mind. In verse 12 Paul does not mention any sinful act. He merely says that by one man sin entered into the world. That one man was Adam who was created sinful/sinner/sin. The existence of a law shows us that we are lawbreakers of that law else there would be no law or command against it. But this is more than spitting on the ground. For before the Law sin was in the world. And that sin was Adam.

Paul adds:
13 (For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law.
14 Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.

I think you missed the part where God created and it was "good". not full of sin or corrupted.....

 

[jeremiah1five]

And many places it is a noun so you do not get make all references to satan and adjective just to fit your doctrine!


Strong's Concordance
Satanas: the adversary, Satan, i.e. the devil
Original Word: Σατανᾶς, ᾶ, ὁ
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: Satanas
Phonetic Spelling: (sat-an-as')
Definition: the adversary, Satan, the devil
Usage: an adversary, Satan.

Satan is used of men also. So, if used of a man and it is a noun it cannot mean the angel whom God locked up before God created man.

 

[jeremiah1five]

I think you missed the part where God created and it was "good". not full of sin or corrupted.....

The word "good" means "good enough" or "to specification." This means God created as was His purpose and it was "good enough" and to specification.
If you want to say the word means morally "good" look elsewhere. That word is not in the Genesis record concerning creation.

If Adam was "not full of sin" and he sinned, then sin comes from someone "not full of sin." How do you account for something you say is not "corrupted" and yet had sinned?

Do you think it [good] means "morally good?"

 

[Hobie]

The word "good" means "good enough" or "to specification." This means God created as was His purpose and it was "good enough" and to specification.
If you want to say the word means morally "good" look elsewhere. That word is not in the Genesis record concerning creation.

If Adam was "not full of sin" and he sinned, then sin comes from someone "not full of sin." How do you account for something you say is not "corrupted" and yet had sinned?

Do you think it [good] means "morally good?"

The Bible is clear on it, but you seem to 'miss the mark' on it as they say. When it says here that God makes something 'good' its perfect to His standard, and on every level.

 

[Wordsmith]

Satan is used of men also. So, if used of a man and it is a noun it cannot mean the angel whom God locked up before God created man.

You can't get out off this circle of error. God didn't lock them up before the creation of man you have no scripture to support that error, only by circular reasoning which creates more theological problems than you can explain your way out of.

 

[donadams]

Many places the word "devil" and "Satan" are adjectives in the KJV.
The word "devil" means "traducer" which means "false accuser/liar."
The word "Satan" means "adversary" and has been described to man.

There are no fallen angels that sinned loose on the planet because they are all locked up.

4 For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment; 2 Pet. 2:4.

Satan
The devil
Belzibub
The red dragon
Are all the person Lucifer

Please explain

Matt 4:1 Then was Jesus led up of the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted of the devil.

Matt 12:24 But when the Pharisees heard it, they said, This fellow doth not cast out devils, but by Beelzebub the prince of the devils.

25 And Jesus knew their thoughts, and said unto them, Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and every city or house divided against itself shall not stand:

26 And if Satan cast out Satan, he is divided against himself; how shall then his kingdom stand?

27 And if I by Beelzebub cast out devils, by whom do your children cast them out? therefore they shall be your judges.

28 But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God is come unto you.




James 4:7
Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.

1 Peter 5:8
Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:

Matthew 8:28-34
And when he was come to the other side into the country of the Gergesenes, there met him two possessed with devils, coming out of the tombs, exceeding fierce, so that no man might pass by that way. And, behold, they cried out, saying, What have we to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of God? art thou come hither to torment us before the time? And there was a good way off from them an herd of many swine feeding. ...

Thanks

 

[donadams]

The giants in those days were eplained by the fallen angels.

I've noticed you never gave a reason for them.

The entire context of Gen 6 is man, men, mankind!

Angels are never even mentioned!

Elsewhere in genesis the writer refers to angels and actually call them “angels”!

Scripture does not say these giants are fallen angels

How does Goliath exist after the flood? Is he a giant? From an angel or a philistine?

If angels had bodies they would have died out in the flood!

Thanks

 

[donadams]

How would it not? They sinned...

A man sins and he is still a man
He don’t become a baboon?

What as their habitation?

 

[donadams]

Both, in the case of the hybrid race of angel / human children of the fallen angels. Those giants gave rise to the opponents of the people of Israel as they attempted to enter the land of Canaan: "a people great and tall, the children of the Anakims, whom thou knowest, and of whom thou hast heard say, Who can stand before the children of Anak!" (Deut. 9:2)

Yes, they were, but the same problem of the fallen angels again marrying the human daughters of men cropped up again after the flood. That is why there were the giants, the Anakim that the Israelites were too afraid of conquering when the spies brought back their report. in Numbers 13:32-33. "And they brought up an evil report of the land which they had searched unto the children of Israel, saying, the land, through which we have gone to search it, is a land that eateth up the inhabitants thereof; and all the people that we saw in it are men of a great stature. And there we saw the giants, the sons of Anak, which come of the giants: and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight."

Giants had also dwelled in times past in the land of Moab (Deut. 2:10-11) and in the land of Ammon ("That also was accounted a land of giants: giants dwelt therein in old time; and the Ammonites call them Zamzummims; A people great, and many, and tall, as the Anakims..." (Deut. 2:20-21).

It took King David and his mighty men to finally slay the last of the giants sons in 2 Samuel 21.

If angels had bodies they would have died in the flood!

 

[3 Resurrections]

Scripture does not say these giants are fallen angels

You're right, it doesn't. The giants were the CHILDREN of the fallen angels, as Genesis 6 wrote.

If angels had bodies they would have died in the flood!

You are mixing up celestial-fleshed beings (angels) and terrestrial-fleshed beings as humans (as in 1 Cor. 15:40). The giants were a forbidden mix of both, so they were capable of dying in the flood. Celestial-fleshed beings (angels) have different characteristics and capabilities, of much greater power and might than humanity's terrestrial flesh (2 Peter 2:11).

 

[donadams]

You're right, it doesn't. The giants were the CHILDREN of the fallen angels, as Genesis 6 wrote.

You are mixing up celestial-fleshed beings (angels) and terrestrial-fleshed beings as humans (as in 1 Cor. 15:40). The giants were a forbidden mix of both, so they were capable of dying in the flood. Celestial-fleshed beings (angels) have different characteristics and capabilities, of much greater power and might than humanity's terrestrial flesh (2 Peter 2:11).

Gen 6 NEVER says angels or fallen angels

The whole context of Gen 6 is mankind

Notice Gen 4 & 5 have many references to the offspring and never a word about angels or giants

Notice also the similarities between Gen 3:6 and Gen 6:2 saw it was beautiful and took it

 

[jeremiah1five]

Satan
The devil
Belzibub
The red dragon
Are all the person Lucifer
Please explain
Matt 4:1 Then was Jesus led up of the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted of the devil.

The Holy Spirit uses the Greek word "diabolos" which is an adjective and it means "traducer" which means "false accuser."
Although the human nature of Christ was without sin it still needed to be tested. There was no need to test the Divine nature of Christ (Logos.)
You must first understand that it was the Divine (God) becoming flesh (man) and not flesh becoming God. So, it had to be tested.
Jesus Christ knew full well who He was and what He came to do. At the age of twelve He said that He must be about 'my Father's business.' So as a holy child living in this sinful world, He knew why He came into the world.

Matt 12:24 But when the Pharisees heard it, they said, This fellow doth not cast out devils, but by Beelzebub the prince of the devils.
25 And Jesus knew their thoughts, and said unto them, Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and every city or house divided against itself shall not stand:
26 And if Satan cast out Satan, he is divided against himself; how shall then his kingdom stand?
27 And if I by Beelzebub cast out devils, by whom do your children cast them out? therefore they shall be your judges.
28 But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God is come unto you.

Jesus cast out "devils" (adj.) by the Spirit of God.

James 4:7
Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.

(Adj.)
As with Christ but not holy we deal with our flesh daily. The Spirit is contrary/adversary to the flesh. The flesh is a traducer, liar, and false accuser. and this happens as it did with Christ when He was tempted. The Word of God says one thing or other about us in Christ. This is what we are to trust, what God says about us. When our thoughts, as what happened to Christ when He was tested, tell us one thing and it is a fallacy and a lie we are to resist those thoughts and trust God's Word about us.

1 Peter 5:8
Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:

As above, our adversary is our flesh. It is constantly with us accusing us to God. Our minds do that as we struggle with our flesh daily. Do I obey, or do I disobey? Who rules my life? Spirit or flesh? And giving in to the flesh one time leads to another submission and soon if not countered we are devoured and become servants to our sin, and this leads to backsliding.

Matthew 8:28-34
And when he was come to the other side into the country of the Gergesenes, there met him two possessed with devils, coming out of the tombs, exceeding fierce, so that no man might pass by that way. And, behold, they cried out, saying, What have we to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of God? art thou come hither to torment us before the time? And there was a good way off from them an herd of many swine feeding. ...
Thanks

These two mentally deranged men knew the gossip and stories about Jesus. They even accepted that He was the Son of God through their knowledge of the OT Scripture prophecies. There are Scripture that recounts Jesus healing physical deformities and sickness, but where in Scripture does it say Jesus healing the mentally ill? And there were mentally ill persons in Scripture. This is one of those times. There was nothing wrong with them physically, but they did have some mental issues afflicting them.

Jesus healed their mind, as a matter of fact when Jesus was done, they were in their right mind.