What end time view do you hold to?

[Eleanor]

This is because Dispensational theology primarily concerns itself with Ecclesiology and Eschatology. These two are it's distinguishing characteristics and what are discussed the most. It's Soteriology and other "ologies" are "reformed". In other words outside these particulars it is the same as all other protestant churches with their positive and negative aspects.

No, dispensastionalists concern themselves more with dispensationalism than Christology or soteriology, which is why they get Christology wrong.

 

[Josheb]

I have found that Dispensationalists tend to focus on end-times speculation far more than anyone else, sometimes to the point of obsession.

Dispensationalism openly teaches this. It is, by their own acknowledgement, a theology that emphasizes ecclesiology and eschatology and not Christology and soteriology (historical places of emphasis). That wouldn't inherently be problematic, but the Christology, ecclesiology, and eschatology Dispensationalism teaches is very different than anything the Church has taught. Not only is it different, but it is different in substantive ways that make it irreconcilable with long-held and well-established thought, doctrine, and practice of the Church. The differences are so substantive that if Dispensationalism is correct then 20 centuries of Christianity is wrong.

• They've got a Jesus who isn't currently King on earth.
• They've got a Church that is corrupt, impotent, and in need of rescue, rather than one that is righteous, victorious, and powerful as Christ's body.
• They've got an end times view that has God handing His creation over to His adversary and having His creation destroyed.
• People claiming to adhere to it don't actually live it.

It's a bad theology.

 

[CrazyCalvinistUncle]

the soteriology of the Dispies I've met was almost entirely semi-Pelagianish, with the occasional Arminian.

They do exist. Went to a church, briefly, where that was the case. But then I've gone to what used to be staunchly reformed "churches" that have slid into Arminian soteriology. By and large we are reformed in our Soteriology.

There are a truckload of good books out there. There is also, of course, The Master's Seminary on YouTube if you want to verify.

 

[CrazyCalvinistUncle]

No, dispensastionalists concern themselves more with dispensationalism than Christology or soteriology, which is why they get Christology wrong.

Sis...you don't get to assert what a denomination does or does not do. You need to go to the sources and talk to the people. You have a particularly nasty horse in this race. Now you will note that I don't cast aspersions on Amil or Postmil thought or, at the very least, I certainly don't attempt to demonize them. So you might want to repent of that and expand your reading.

 

[CrazyCalvinistUncle]

For those interested in actually looking into the reality of Dispensationalism today and not your current traditions...misinformation...I have 4 books for you:

The smallest and most likely to cure you of whatever rabid dislike you have:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0979853923/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1
The other three are somewhat larger and discuss actual Dispensational beliefs, history, progression, and it's usefulness to the reformation's cause.

Now you have been informed so it's between you and God whether you decide to update your knowledge and put away your daggers. Or you can persist in misinforming people ( gossip ) and suffer the consequences.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0986444235/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003TFE5PE/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1945774193/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

[Eleanor]

Sis...you don't get to assert what a denomination does or does not do. You need to go to the sources and talk to the people.

And you know that I haven't, how?

You have a particularly nasty horse in this race.

I'm thinking some jockeys may likewise think that of horses which they do not favor.

Now you will note that I don't cast aspersions on Amil or Postmil thought or, at the very least, I certainly don't attempt to demonize them. So you might want to repent of that and expand your reading.

As you might want to stop getting your exercise from jumping to false conclusions.

 

[Josheb]

For those interested in actually looking into the reality of Dispensationalism today and not your current traditions...misinformation...I have 4 books for you:

The smallest and most likely to cure you of whatever rabid dislike you have:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0979853923/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1
The other three are somewhat larger and discuss actual Dispensational beliefs, history, progression, and it's usefulness to the reformation's cause.

Now you have been informed so it's between you and God whether you decide to update your knowledge and put away your daggers. Or you can persist in misinforming people ( gossip ) and suffer the consequences.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0986444235/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003TFE5PE/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1945774193/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Vlach's books are not the best source. He misrepresents both the history and the current state of Dispensationalism, selectively using information to paint a positive picture (implying he recognizes problems exist).

 

[CrazyCalvinistUncle]

And you know how that I haven't?

By your assertions about Dispensationalism.

As you might want to stop getting your exercise from jumping to false conclusions.

I'll be sure to do so once I have, thanks.

 

[Eleanor]

For those interested in actually looking into the reality of Dispensationalism today and not your current traditions...misinformation...I have 4 books for you:

The smallest and most likely to cure you of whatever rabid dislike you have:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0979853923/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1
The other three are somewhat larger and discuss actual Dispensational beliefs, history, progression, and it's usefulness to the reformation's cause.

Now you have been informed so it's between you and God whether you decide to update your knowledge and put away your daggers. Or you can persist in misinforming people ( gossip ) and suffer the consequences.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0986444235/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003TFE5PE/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1945774193/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

You would do better to Biblically, in agreement with authoritative NT apostolic teaching (in contrast to prophetic riddles not spoken clearly, Nu 12:8), demonstrate my error regarding such.

 

[CrazyCalvinistUncle]

You would do better to Biblically, in agreement with authoritative NT apostolic teaching (in contrast to prophetic riddles not spoken clearly, Nu 12:8), demonstrate my error regarding such.

 

[CrazyCalvinistUncle]

Vlach's books are not the best source. He misrepresents both the history and the current state of Dispensationalism, selectively using information to paint a positive picture (implying he recognizes problems exist).

Then I suggest you take that up with the Seminary he's been teaching in for many many years. But I can already tell you that Vlach and the other authors acknowledge the history of Dispensationalism, the objections, and all the sharp edges. It would be nice if the Amil and Postmil side did the same.

 

[ReverendRV]

No, dispensastionalists concern themselves more with dispensationalism than Christology or soteriology, which is why they get Christology wrong.

This would be important; resulting in worshipping another Jesus. How do they get Christology wrong?

Do they worship another Jesus?

 

[Eleanor]

By your assertions about Dispensationalism.

Unless you've spoken to every dispensationalist on the planet or read everything written thereby, that is assumption on your part.

Time to stop getting your exercise by jumping to false conclusions regarding beliefs of dispensationalists.

 

[Eleanor]

This would be important; resulting in worshipping another Jesus. How do they get Christology wrong?

Do they worship another Jesus

Some teach scenarios that require two different bodies of Christ.

 

[ReverendRV]

Some teach scenarios that require two different bodies of Christ.

Please explain...

How does it result in getting Christology wrong?

It sounds more like getting Ecclesiology wrong...

 

[Eleanor]

Please explain...

How does it result in getting Christology wrong?

It sounds more like getting Ecclesiology wrong...

Okay, I'll go with that.

I was thinking of Christ having two bodies.

 

[ReverendRV]

Okay, I'll go with that.

I was thinking of Christ having two bodies.

Now THAT might be a good point!

It's a close issue then...

 

[Eleanor]

Now THAT might be a good point!

It's a close issue then...

Maybe it's not either/or but both ecclesiology and Christology.

 

[ReverendRV]

Maybe it's not either/or but both ecclesiology and Christology.

It's something to chew on...

 

[CrazyCalvinistUncle]

Now THAT might be a good point!

It's a close issue then...

Dispensationalism ( this is addressed in the smaller book ) does not put forth 2 bodies for Christ.