[Matthew 5:14 NKJV] "You are the light of the world. A city that is set on a hill cannot be hidden."
[Matthew 13:11 NKJV] He answered and said to them, "Because it has been given to you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it has not been given.
If “scripture is the only authority” or source of truth, how can the church be a source of truth? Light is another word for truth.[Matthew 5:14 NKJV] "You are the light of the world. A city that is set on a hill cannot be hidden."
[NLT] "You are the light of the world--like a city on a hilltop that cannot be hidden."
I don't see the contradiction, myself.
You got me figured out! Lol![Matthew 13:11 NKJV] He answered and said to them, "Because it has been given to you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it has not been given.
[NLT] He replied, "You are permitted to understand the secrets of the Kingdom of Heaven, but others are not.
So admit it, you just selected these at random because you thought nobody would actually check, right?
So how long have you heard "Apostles" speaking to you? "I hear dead people talking" is grounds to consider an exorcism.
Then why does scripture say the church is the light of truth? Matt 5:14 and the pillar of truth 1 Tim 3:15So how long have you heard "Apostles" speaking to you? "I hear dead people talking" is grounds to consider an exorcism.
On a serious note: Sure, there are lots of other authorities if we are going to get pedantic.
However, when I heard about this Jesus and his offer and wondered about getting baptized ... did I need it? should I do it? what is the right way to obey what God wants?
- The police man holding a gun is CERTAINLY an authority.
- The Spanish Inquisition and the Geneva Council both burning heretics were another "authority" (equal opportunity to pick on Catholics and Protestants).
- Jesus speaking to Saul on the road to Damascus ... BIG TIME authority.
- The Apostles talking and performing miracles under the power of the Holy Spirit ... authority.
So SCRIPTURE becomes the norma normans non normata “the norm of norms that is not normed” ... the standard according to which all other standards or rules of the Christian faith are measured, and the one standard which has no higher standard against which it is measured.
- The Policeman and his gun had no authoritative answer.
- The Spanish Inquisition and Geneva Council only made me want to run back to Atheism.
- Jesus did not appear to me like He did on the road to Damascus to answer the question personally.
- The original Apostles were not alive to ask and those claiming to be modern apostles lacked credibility.
- WHAT I HAD was:
- The written letters from the actual apostles ... the Word of God.
- Lots of opinions from people that all claimed to have the definitive answer (but disagreed).
That is the meaning of Sola Scriptura (Scripture Alone).
Then why does scripture say the church is the light of truth? Matt 5:14 and the pillar of truth 1 Tim 3:15So how long have you heard "Apostles" speaking to you? "I hear dead people talking" is grounds to consider an exorcism.
On a serious note: Sure, there are lots of other authorities if we are going to get pedantic.
However, when I heard about this Jesus and his offer and wondered about getting baptized ... did I need it? should I do it? what is the right way to obey what God wants?
- The police man holding a gun is CERTAINLY an authority.
- The Spanish Inquisition and the Geneva Council both burning heretics were another "authority" (equal opportunity to pick on Catholics and Protestants).
- Jesus speaking to Saul on the road to Damascus ... BIG TIME authority.
- The Apostles talking and performing miracles under the power of the Holy Spirit ... authority.
So SCRIPTURE becomes the norma normans non normata “the norm of norms that is not normed” ... the standard according to which all other standards or rules of the Christian faith are measured, and the one standard which has no higher standard against which it is measured.
- The Policeman and his gun had no authoritative answer.
- The Spanish Inquisition and Geneva Council only made me want to run back to Atheism.
- Jesus did not appear to me like He did on the road to Damascus to answer the question personally.
- The original Apostles were not alive to ask and those claiming to be modern apostles lacked credibility.
- WHAT I HAD was:
- The written letters from the actual apostles ... the Word of God.
- Lots of opinions from people that all claimed to have the definitive answer (but disagreed).
That is the meaning of Sola Scriptura (Scripture Alone).
Because it is ...
... a mixture of truth and heresy as the early church (believers) struggled to understand hard questions (Trinity, Presence, Hypostatic union).
As YOU should (since you are Catholic and embrace the magisterium and Sacred Tradition and Apostolic succession - all interrelated), however I disagree with your exegesis that scripture rejects it. All the other authorities (Jesus and the 12 Apostles) are no longer walking among us and available to speak to us EXCEPT through their writings ... which brings us back to Sola Scriptura as the norma normans non normata (see post #153 for definition).
Then the statement “the Bible is the only authority” is false?
What happened to the eternal words of Christ? Matt 16:17-19
I did not say that ... I said "not any hierarchical denominational organization." [A Baptist Distictive ... autonomous local Churches answering directly to Jesus Christ, the Head.]
???? You should read a Protestant Bible if they have gone missing from your Catholic Bible. They are still there, safely recorded where they have always been. The Early Church Fathers expressed a mixture of biblical quotes and their own personal thoughts. Some of their thoughts were correct and some proved in error.
Help me out here. What is the one specific point of comment or inquiry you want discussed in this thread? And can you make a more conscious effort to include punctuation because a string of words put together like, "Church not dependent on scripture" is meaningless. If that is meant to say, "The Church is not dependent on scripture" then my response is, "That is utterly false" and I will vigorously contest that statement. I will do the same with the premise, "The Church came first, existed first, and exercised authority and taught before there was a New Testament," because there was a pile of scripture upon which the Church was dependent prior to the New Testament being written.
What about in the church?
Wrong according to what?
Th council in Jerusalem to which RevRV was referring was comprised of apostles. Acts 15
The apostolic council of Acts 15 did in fact change the nature of the Church. They sanctioned the gospel being taken to the Gentiles and the negation of several prior beliefs and practices.
