Jesus was never prayed to once in the Bible

[Fred]

So in Revelation when John is speaking to elders in heaven in a vision it isn't prayer. When Stephen was having a vision then it isn't prayer either. haha classic. You have lost your argument buddy. Good game.

See post 818.

https://christcentered.community.forum/threads/jesus-was-never-prayed-to-once-in-the-bible.1479/page-41#post-82560

Classic!

 

[Rella]

Asking someone on earth for something isn't prayer. Before Jesus was taken to heaven, in John 16:23-28, he said stop asking him for anything once he's with God, but rather ask the Father directly.

Before Jesus was taken to heaven, in John 16:23-28, he said stop asking him for anything once he's with God, but rather ask the Father directly.

Really....

Then you admit on earth He was prayed to and asked

Which is the title of this thread that says he was not.... but he was

 

[Runningman]

Before Jesus was taken to heaven, in John 16:23-28, he said stop asking him for anything once he's with God, but rather ask the Father directly.

Really....

Then you admit on earth He was prayed to and asked

Which is the title of this thread that says he was not.... but he was

That's an oversimplification because we would have to make asking someone anything in the Bible a prayer and that's wrong. You're overthinking this. Just stick with the fact that Jesus only taught about praying to the Father in Matt 6:6-9 and you'll be fine.

 

[David1701]

Jesus prayed that in eternal life we may know the Father, the only true God, and himself. So what you said isn't what Scripture says.

John 17
3And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

Knowing someone and comprehending everything about that person are not equivalent. Surely you can see that?

Thank you for admitting that your argument is confined to that of grammatical construct.

LOL!

I did no such thing. You are the one who brought up grammar.

Where does the Bible say what you are proposing then?

Deut. 6:4 IKJV) Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD:

The word translated as "one" is "echad", which means "a group united".

Ancient Hebrew Lexicon of the Bible

AHLB#1165-C (N)

C (N) Unity: A group united are one of a group. [freq. 951]

If human analogies don't work properly then why are you using them?

I used my analogy, because it gives a reasonable approximation, in simple terms.

Jesus didn't say he is the I AM. Check out Acts 3:13 and Exodus 3:14,15 where the God of Abraham is the I AM, but Jesus is only mentioned as His Son or servant. I recommend we take a look at the context of John 8 to understand how Jesus was not claiming deity. Here's a good place to start... in John 8:40, contrary to their accusations, Jesus denied being God, but rather a man who heard the truth from God.

John 8:23,24
23 And He said to them, You are from beneath; I am from above. You are from this world; I am not from this world.
24 Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do not believe that I AM, you will die in your sins.

John 8:58 Jesus said to them, Truly, truly, I say to you, Before Abraham came to be, I AM.

Jesus certainly, and very clearly, was proclaiming his deity.

 

[Runningman]

Jesus certainly, and very clearly, was proclaiming his deity.

How is that when Jesus said he isn't God?

Mark 10
18“Why do you call Me good?” Jesus replied. “No one is good except God alone.

 

[Carbon]

How is that when Jesus said he isn't God?

Mark 10
18“Why do you call Me good?” Jesus replied. “No one is good except God alone.

Th Unitarian twist. Your leaders cannot help you, seems you bought into their lies.

 

[Papa Smurf]

Prayer is a different word in Scripture than appeal, called on, spoke to, etc. The words you are saying are prayer in Acts 7 are used repeatedly through the New Testament and they aren’t prayers. You and I are also talking and this isn’t a prayer. So what you’re trying to do is make speaking to Jesus a prayer, but speaking to other people is not a prayer. See the inconsistency and invalidity of your argument? What would help you is if there were actually any examples of Jesus being prayed to in the Bible or if it was something he or others taught.

Hello again Runningman, people on Earth don't "pray" to other people on Earth, even if the other Person is God incarnate/Jesus Christ/Emmanuel. The disciples "talked with" Jesus when He walked among them, and they will do so again on the New Earth, but He resides in Heaven with His Father now, so we "pray to" Him instead, just like we pray to His Father.

In Acts 7, Stephen (on Earth) "prayed" to Jesus (in Heaven) to "receive his spirit" as he was dying. That is main point, the one that truly needs to be discussed from this passage, the one that you keep avoiding, so let's take another look. If the Lord Jesus is not Divine, but instead, merely the human being that you believe Him to be, then why would Stephen (who was filled with the Holy Spirit at the time) choose to call upon Him (a mere man) instead of calling upon His Father (who is God) to "receive his spirit" as he was dying

Thanks

--Papa Smurf

 

[Fred]

How is that when Jesus said he isn't God?

Mark 10
18“Why do you call Me good?” Jesus replied. “No one is good except God alone.

https://christcentered.community.forum/threads/the-new-testament-refers-to-jesus-as-god.1355/#post-60074

 

[David1701]

How is that when Jesus said he isn't God?

Mark 10
18“Why do you call Me good?” Jesus replied. “No one is good except God alone.

You misunderstand; Jesus did not say that he isn't God; rather, he asked why the questioner called him "good" (because the questioner was in unbelief). In other words, it's equivalent to Jesus saying to him, "Why do you call me good, since only God is good and you don't believe that I'm God.". It would along the same lines as me asking someone why he called me Scottish, since he didn't believe that I'm Scottish.

 

[Eleanor]

Jesus was never prayed to in the Bible,

Ac 7:59. . .

All hat. . .and no cowboy.

 

[Carbon]

Ac 7:59. . .

All hat. . .and no cowboy.

Oh, that one don’t count. you ruined everything for them

 

[Eleanor]

Oh, that one don’t count. you ruined everything for them

Surely they'll understand if I take Scripture as its word: "Stephen prayed (invoked), 'Lord Jesus. . .' " (Ac 7:59).

 

[Fred]

1. Frederick Danker: Just as Israel was to understand her role as one of obedience to the God who saved her, so the Christian is to see the moral and ethical implications of this recognition of Christ's claim to ownership expressed so often in such a phrase as "Paul, a slave of Christ Jesus." Out of such conviction the iron of steadfast confession was smelted. As the stones came flying at Stephen, he prayed, "Lord Jesus, receive my spirit." (Acts 7:59) (Creeds in the Bible, page 45, c. 1966).

2. A Greek and English Lexicon to the New Testament: To call upon, invoke, in prayer. Rom. 10:12, 14. 2 Tim. 2:22. Acts 7:59 (epikaleō, page 243)

3. Mounce's Complete Expository Dictionary of Old and New Testament Words: Jesus is the addressee when epikaleō is used in the sense of praying (Acts 7:59) (Call, page 93).

4. Robertson's New Testament Word Studies and Bible Commentary: they kept on stoning, they kept it up as he was calling upon the Lord Jesus and making direct prayer to him as "Lord Jesus"
http://www.godrules.net/library/robert/robertact7.htm

5. Theological Dictionary of the New Testament: Stephen prays: kurie Iesou dezai to pneuma mou (Ac.7:59) (5:771, paradeisos, J. Jeremias).

6. Vine's Expository Dictionary of Old and New Testament Words: Prayer is properly addressed to God the Father, Matt. 6:6; John 16:23; Eph. 1:17; 3:14, and the Son, Acts 7:59; 2 Cor. 12:8 (Prayer, page 872).

 

[Runningman]

Hello again Runningman, people on Earth don't "pray" to other people on Earth, even if the other Person is God incarnate/Jesus Christ/Emmanuel. The disciples "talked with" Jesus when He walked among them, and they will do so again on the New Earth, but He resides in Heaven with His Father now, so we "pray to" Him instead, just like we pray to His Father.

In Acts 7, Stephen (on Earth) "prayed" to Jesus (in Heaven) to "receive his spirit" as he was dying. That is main point, the one that truly needs to be discussed from this passage, the one that you keep avoiding, so let's take another look. If the Lord Jesus is not Divine, but instead, merely the human being that you believe Him to be, then why would Stephen (who was filled with the Holy Spirit at the time) choose to call upon Him (a mere man) instead of calling upon His Father (who is God) to "receive his spirit" as he was dying

Thanks

--Papa Smurf

So you admin Jesus was never prayed to then? He wasn't on earth when Stephen prayed to Him.

 

[Runningman]

Ac 7:59. . .

All hat. . .and no cowboy.

The Bible never says Jesus was prayed to or answers prayers. Can you even provide one example of Jesus answering a prayer then?

 

[Eleanor]

The Bible never says Jesus was prayed to

Contraire. . .see post #832.

The Bible never says, "God is sovereign."

All hat. . .and no cowboy. (1 Co 2:14)

 

[Carbon]

The Bible never says Jesus was prayed to or answers prayers. Can you even provide one example of Jesus answering a prayer then?

How many times do you have to be told?

 

[Eleanor]

How many times do you have to be told?

1 Co 2:14. . .they cannot because they have not.

 

[Arial]

So you admin Jesus was never prayed to then?

Not while HE WAS ON EARTH. He isn't on earth anymore.

 

[Eleanor]

Not while HE WAS ON EARTH. He isn't on earth anymore.

Do you think Ac 7:59 (Stephen) and 2 Co 12:8 (Paul) count?