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Sign of presdestination!

how does that extend to the RCC? What makes you think the RCC is THE CHURCH? Where is the lineage?
Read the early church fathers!

Christ
The apostles
The apostolic fathers
The bishops
The priests
Are all Catholic!

One, holy, catholic, and apostolic church! Jn 10:16

Not thousands of sects full of errors all the tradition of men!

The church is of divine origin and cannot be reformed!

Tkks
 
Read the early church fathers!

Christ
The apostles
The apostolic fathers
The bishops
The priests
Are all Catholic!

One, holy, catholic, and apostolic church! Jn 10:16

Not thousands of sects full of errors all the tradition of men!

The church is of divine origin and cannot be reformed!

Tkks
Show me. You know I'm not going to look it up. You have not demonstrated a lineage of apostles from the 12 to the present.

BTW are there still 12, or...?
 
makesends said:
C'mon! WHO are the successors between the NT apostles and the RCC magisterium. Stop side-stepping and fishing for red herrings.
The apostolic fathers

Unbroken line of apostolic succession

Dogma
137. The Church was founded by the God-Man Jesus Christ.
138. Our Redeemer Himself conserves with divine power the society founded by Him, the
Church.
139. Christ is the Divine Redeemer of His Body, the Church.
140. Christ founded the Church in order to continue His work of redemption for all time.
141. Christ gave His Church a hierarchical constitution.
142. The powers bestowed on the Apostles have descended to the bishops.
143. Christ appointed the Apostle Peter to be the first of all the Apostles and to be the visible head
of the whole Church, by appointing him immediately and personally to the primacy of jurisdiction.
144. According to Christ’s ordinance, Peter is to have successors in his Primacy over the whole
Church and for all time.
145. The successors of Peter in the Primacy are the bishops of Rome.
146. The Pope possesses full and supreme power of jurisdiction over the whole Church, not
merely in matters of faith and morals, but also in Church discipline and in the government of
the Church.
147. The Pope is infallible when he speaks ex cathedra.
148. By virtue of Divine Right the bishops possess an ordinary power of government over their
dioceses.
149. Christ is the Head of the Church.
150. In the final decision on doctrines concerning faith and morals the Church is infallible.
151. The primary object of the Infallibility is the formally revealed truths of Christian Doctrine
concerning faith and morals.
152. The totality of the Bishops is infallible, when they, either assembled in general council or
scattered over the earth, propose a teaching of faith or morals as one to be held by all the
faithful.
153. The Church founded by Christ is unique and one.
154. The Church founded by Christ is holy.
155. The Church founded by Christ is catholic.
156. The Church founded by Christ is apostolic.
157. Membership of the Church is necessary for all men for salvation.
Red Herrings all.

I don't consider you silly enough to consider the Dogma to BE the apostolic succession. So why show that in answer to my request? Show me WHO are the persons between the original 12 and modern day RCC apostles.
 
Then you won’t explain Jn 20:23?
I already did. Jesus Christ, the Son of God, is the one who forgives the sins. The act of the apostles (note: you still haven't show a logical progression that even that transfers to modern day priests) in 'remitting' is founded on the authority of Christ, and not on the apostles' authority.
 
Per arial this posting here

Sign of predestination to eternal life is the love of Mary!

Thanks
Hello, donadams. I was wondering how you come up with this stuff. It's like, out of no where. :)
 
Show me. You know I'm not going to look it up. You have not demonstrated a lineage of apostles from the 12 to the present.

BTW are there still 12, or...?
The church is universal whole world!
 
I already did. Jesus Christ, the Son of God, is the one who forgives the sins. The act of the apostles (note: you still haven't show a logical progression that even that transfers to modern day priests) in 'remitting' is founded on the authority of Christ, and not on the apostles' authority.
I agree Jn 15:5 apart from Christ they do nothing but they must be the instruments of Christ and hear our confession administer the forgiveness absolution

They also administer the entrance to the kingdom by baptism 2 pet 1:11
 
The church is universal whole world!
And the Catholic denomination is not it. It violates scripture where Christ's church is found, again and again and again.
 
Hello, donadams. I was wondering how you come up with this stuff. It's like, out of no where. :)
Reading church fathers and documents church doctors and saints

Thks

Devotion to Mary is a sure sign of predestination to him who possesses it. Mary is the Mysterious Book of Predestination to glory. Love of Mary and devotion to her are a sure sign of obtaining eternal salvation. O Mother of Perpetual Help, confidence in thee is a certain pledge of everlasting salvation.

Listen, all you who desire the Kingdom of God! Honor and serve the Most Blessed Virgin Mary, and you will find life and eternal salvation! St. Bonaventure

The sign of those who will be saved consists in this: that they have a great devotion to Mary in their hearts. Bl. John of Avila

I believe that devotion to thee, O Lady, is a certain sign of eternal salvation. St. Gabriel of the Most Sorrowful Virgin

Devotion to Mary is a sure sign of predestination to him who possesses it. Bl. Alan de la Roche

Mary is the Mysterious Book of Predestination to glory.
St. Frances Xavier Cabrini

Love of Mary and devotion to her are a sure sign of obtaining eternal salvation. St. Bernard

O Mother of Perpetual Help, confidence in thee is a certain pledge of everlasting salvation.

Whoever honors, loves, serves, and invokes Mary with humility and confidence will ascend to Paradise. St. John Eudes

If you persevere until death in true devotion to Mary, you salvation is certain. St. Alphonsus Maria Liguori

O Holy Mother of God, all those who will be partakers of eternal happiness dwell in thee.
(On the Maternity of the Blessed Virgin Mary)

He Who made me rested in my tabernacle, and He said to me: Let thy dwelling be in Jacob and thy inheritance in Israel, and take root in My Elect . . . And I took root in an honorable people and in the portion of my God His inheritance, and my abode is in the full assembly of the Saints. Ecclesiasticus 24:12-16

In the multitude of the Elect she shall have praise, and among the blessed she shall be blessed.
Ecclesiasticus 24:4

All generations (Christians) shall call me blessed! Lk 1:48

Blessed art thou, O daughter, by the Lord the most high God, above all women upon earth . . . because He hath so magnified thy name that thy praise shall not depart out of the mouth of men who shall be mindful of the power of the Lord forever . . . Thou art the glory of Jerusalem, the joy of Israel, the honor of our people . . . and therefore thou shalt be blessed forever! Judith 13:23, 25; 15:10,11

O Mary, blessed are you among women, for you have brought forth life for both men and women. The mother of our race brought punishment into the world; the Mother of Our Lord brought salvation to the world. Eve was the originator of sin, Mary was the originator of merit.
St. Augustine

Mary is the Mother of those who live by grace, as Eve is the mother of those who die according to nature.
St. Peter Chrysologus

Eve was the cause of death, but Mary restored life to us.
St. Bruno

Death through Eve, life through Mary.
St. Jerome

Instead of Eve, we have Mary.
St. John Chrysostom

The Mother of all the living. Genesis 3:20

Eve was by nature the mother of the children of death;
Mary is by grace the Mother of the children of life.
St. Peter Chrysologus

Mary is the first fruits of the new creation! Mother of all who live in Christ!

Although in the most pure womb of Mary there was but one kernel of grain, which was Jesus Christ, nevertheless her womb is called a "heap of wheat" (Canticles 7:2) because all the Elect were virtually contained in it. St. Ambrose

This Man and that man is born in her . . . This is the Gate of the Lord: the just shall enter into it.
Psalm 86:5; 117:20

Mary is that Happy Ark, in which those who take refuge will never suffer the shipwreck of eternal perdition. St. Bernard

Everyone has been saved in the Virgin. St. Peter Chrysologus

He who is faithful in the service of Mary will certainly be saved . . .There is no one, however wicked, whom Mary does not save by her intercession when she wishes . . . He who has recourse to Mary shall be saved. St. Alphonsus Maria Liguori

No one, not even a sinner, who devoutly recommends himself to her shall ever become the prey of Hell. St. Catherine of Siena

However great a sinner may have been, if he shows himself devout to Mary he will never perish.
St. Hilary of Poitiers

Mary was made Mother of God to obtain salvation for many who, on account of their wicked lives, could not be saved according to the rigor of Divine justice, but might be saved with the help of her sweet mercy and powerful intercession.
St. John Chrysostom

He who is devout to the Virgin Mother will certainly never be lost.
St. Ignatius of Antioch

Many more! https://www.catholictradition.org
Mary necessary for salvation


Eve: Disobedience / offense / curse / loss of grace and salvation!

Mary: obedience / faithful / pleasing to God / blessings / full of grace / redemption & salvation!
(Possibility of salvation for all men)

What the virgin Eve lost by her unbelief, the virgin Mary gained by her faith! (Lk 1:45 Faithful)

Mary received all God had destined for the angels and men before the fall, created without original sin and in a state of sanctifying grace!

Eve was taken out of Adam.
The eternal Word is taken out of Mary.

In heaven the Word has a father without a mother.
On earth the Word has a mother without a father.

The creator obeys and honors the His creation in the person of Mary, the mother of the Word incarnate.

“Honor Thy father and mother”

God clothed Mary in grace (Lk 1:28-30 rev 12:1) so Mary could clothe the eternal Word with flesh & blood!

Mary is the holy city, the tabernacle of the Lord, the holy of holies!
The dwelling place of the Immortal Creator, the eternal Word made flesh!

Mary is the mystical city of God!

(((Mary is the new covenant, the new holy city, the new Jerusalem “our mother”!))) gal 4:26
 
The church is universal whole world!
Doesn't answer either question, unless you think all believers in Christ are apostles.
 
I agree Jn 15:5 apart from Christ they do nothing but they must be the instruments of Christ and hear our confession administer the forgiveness absolution

They also administer the entrance to the kingdom by baptism 2 pet 1:11
"Note: you still haven't show a logical progression that even that transfers to modern day priests"

Show the lineage. I'm beginning to think you know that there is no such thing.
 
I agree Jn 15:5 apart from Christ they do nothing but they must be the instruments of Christ and hear our confession administer the forgiveness absolution

They also administer the entrance to the kingdom by baptism 2 pet 1:11
Since you Mean the Catholic church and its priests-----Who says they are or do?

Hebrews 4:14-16 Therefore, since we have a great High Priest who has ascended into heaven, Jesus the Son of God, Let us hold firmly to the faith we Progress. For we do not have a high priest who is unable to empathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are---but did not sin. Let us then approach God's throne of grace with confidence, so that we may receive mercy and find grace to help in our time of need.

Nothing there about approaching the Popes throne first or is lesser priests. Nothing there about an intermediary needing to secure our access to God's throne. Jesus is already there, mediating for us.
 
Since you Mean the Catholic church and its priests-----Who says they are or do?

Hebrews 4:14-16 Therefore, since we have a great High Priest who has ascended into heaven, Jesus the Son of God, Let us hold firmly to the faith we Progress. For we do not have a high priest who is unable to empathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are---but did not sin. Let us then approach God's throne of grace with confidence, so that we may receive mercy and find grace to help in our time of need.

Nothing there about approaching the Popes throne first or is lesser priests. Nothing there about an intermediary needing to secure our access to God's throne. Jesus is already there, mediating for us.
Not even Mary
 
@donadams
Videos go in the video forum only. Repost it there. It will be examined by staff to see if it is acceptable for the forum. That is why videos go in a special section. So they can be reviewed before they are posted. It was deleted and will not be accepted in videos. It has nothing to do with anything, certainly not in the thread where you posted it.
 
donadams said:
I don’t but I think makesends doubts the word! Jn 21:20-23
I highly doubt @makesends doubts God's word. I think you both understand it differentlty.
Just judging by your ( @donadams ) use of other scriptures, if I held to a similar use of Jn 21:20-23 as yourself, I would want to take a long hard look at why I did.

I've gone out of my way to show that any supposed authority of even the original apostles was only by the authority of Christ and not of themselves. THEY did not forgive sin. God alone can do that.

But, astonishingly (if you do have evidence, like, perhaps, a lineage to demonstrate, where apostleship was handed down to a latter from a former apostle,) you have shown in all this time nothing to demonstrate the identities of persons bridging the gulf between the original apostles to those you claim to be the successors modern day. Try as I might, I get only obfuscation, accusations, red herrings and goal post shifting in return.
 
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