Sign of presdestination!

[donadams]

donadams said:
I don’t but I think makesends doubts the word! Jn 21:20-23

Just judging by your ( @donadams ) use of other scriptures, if I held to a similar use of Jn 21:20-23 as yourself, I would want to take a long hard look at why I did.

I've gone out of my way to show that any supposed authority of even the original apostles was only by the authority of Christ and not of themselves. THEY did not forgive sin. God alone can do that.

But, astonishingly (if you do have evidence, like, perhaps, a lineage to demonstrate, where apostleship was handed down to a latter from a former apostle,) you have shown in all this time nothing to demonstrate the identities of persons bridging the gulf between the original apostles to those you claim to be the successors modern day. Try as I might, I get only obfuscation, accusations, red herrings and goal post shifting in return.

Jesus Christ extends his mission, power, and authority to His church of His apostles! The apostles have the same mission, ministry, power, and authority as Christ! Jn 20:21 as the father sent me, so I send you!

Even His judging!
Matt 19:28 and 1 cor 6:2
His teaching authority!
Matt 28:19 and Jn 20:21
His power to forgive sins!
Jn 20:23
Jn 17:22 / rom 2:10 / 1 pet 1:7 Christ shares His glory with His saints!
His being the light of the world!
Matt 5:14
Must hear church Matt 18:18
His ministry of reconciliation!
2 cor 5:18
His authority in governing the church and administering the kingdom!
Matt 16:18-19 & 18:18 Jn 21:17
Lk 22:29
Apart from me you can do nothing. Jn 15:5
Acts 2:42 doctrine of the apostles!
So the church is subject to Christ!
Eph 5:24
Christ shares His glory! 2 thes 1:10 rev 12:1

The pillar and foundation of TRUTH!
1 Tim 3:15

 

[Arial]

Jesus Christ extends his mission, power, and authority to His church of His apostles! The apostles have the same mission, ministry, power, and authority as Christ! Jn 20:21 as the father sent me, so I send you!

They did. They laid the doctrinal foundation. They have all been dead for centuries, none have been raised from the dead. The Catholic church lay claim to possessing new apostles, calls them popes, and priests, and bishops of the Catholic religion only. Not only does this institution build on another foundation than the one laid, it teaches an entirely different gospel from the one given to us by the apostles. An Apostle wrote the last word and then closed what would become with the canonization of our Bible, the book. He gave a severe warning for adding anything to it or taking anything away from it. Something the Catholic hierarchy ought to be paying attention to. They should run to reforming themselves. An attempt they soundly rejected doing centuries ago. How many millstones do they want hung around their necks?

 

[donadams]

They did. They laid the doctrinal foundation. They have all been dead for centuries, none have been raised from the dead. The Catholic church lay claim to possessing new apostles, calls them popes, and priests, and bishops of the Catholic religion only. Not only does this institution build on another foundation than the one laid, it teaches an entirely different gospel from the one given to us by the apostles. An Apostle wrote the last word and then closed what would become with the canonization of our Bible, the book. He gave a severe warning for adding anything to it or taking anything away from it. Something the Catholic hierarchy ought to be paying attention to. They should run to reforming themselves. An attempt they soundly rejected doing centuries ago. How many millstones do they want hung around their necks?

Matt 23:1 hint these are the successors of moses and Christ demands their authority be obeyed, and this same authority was taken from them matt 21:43 and given to Peter the apostles and their successors matt 16:18-19 & 18:18
This authority Christ still expects us to obey! Heb 13:7-17
Thks

 

[Arial]

Matt 23:1 hint these are the successors of moses and Christ demands their authority be obeyed, and this same authority was taken from them matt 21:43 and given to Peter the apostles and their successors matt 16:18-19 & 18:18
This authority Christ still expects us to obey! Heb 13:7-17
Thks

The Catholic church is not that authority. The Scriptures are their own authority. We follow them, not the Catholic church.

 

[donadams]

The Catholic church is not that authority. The Scriptures are their own authority. We follow them, not the Catholic church.

What happened to your allegiance to Christ the king?

 

[Arial]

What happened to your allegiance to Christ the king?

Nothing happened to it. It is alive and well, so stop with the snark.

 

[donadams]

Nothing happened to it. It is alive and well, so stop with the snark.

Then do you not believe that obedience to His authentic ministers is obedience to Christ?

Thks

 

[Arial]

Then do you not believe that obedience to His authentic ministers is obedience to Christ?

Thks

I don't think his authentic ministers are the hierarchy of the Catholic church. I am not that gullible. Authentic ministers of Christ do not corrupt his word, worship idols, or replace Christ's authority with their own. They don't try to be as Christ. Reminds me of what the serpent said to Eve. "Go on, eat it, and you will be as God."

 

[donadams]

I don't think his authentic ministers are the hierarchy of the Catholic church. I am not that gullible. Authentic ministers of Christ do not corrupt his word, worship idols, or replace Christ's authority with their own. They don't try to be as Christ. Reminds me of what the serpent said to Eve. "Go on, eat it, and you will be as God."

I don’t think!
I get to decide!
My private judgement!

I thought you followed Christ? Jn 14:6


Thks

 

[Carbon]

I don't think his authentic ministers are the hierarchy of the Catholic church. I am not that gullible. Authentic ministers of Christ do not corrupt his word, worship idols, or replace Christ's authority with their own. They don't try to be as Christ. Reminds me of what the serpent said to Eve. "Go on, eat it, and you will be as God."

Amen

 

[donadams]

Amen

Are you rejecting all the scripture verses in #109?

Matt 16:18-19 shall not prevail!

Matt 28:19 commanded to teach

Matt 28:20 Christ is united with His churches, a work of the apostolic church is a work of Christ!

Amen?

 

[Carbon]

Are you rejecting all the scripture verses in #109?

Matt 16:18-19 shall not prevail!

Matt 28:19 commanded to teach

Matt 28:20 Christ is united with His churches, a work of the apostolic church is a work of Christ!

Amen?

Don, I dont reject any scripture. So, the answer to your question is no.

Do you make a practice out of twisting scripture to meet your beliefs?

 

[Arial]

I don’t think!
I get to decide!
My private judgement!

Let me put that another way. I know the Catholic hierarchy are not Christ's ministers.

It isn't me deciding---as I said. It is the word of God declaring.

It is not my private judgment. It is held by the entire Christian Faith in its scripture derived tenants Now address what I said about the Catholic hierarchy.

Authentic ministers of Christ do not corrupt his word, worship idols, or replace Christ's authority with their own. They don't try to be as Christ. Reminds me of what the serpent said to Eve. "Go on, eat it, and you will be as God."

I am deleting your wall of scripture because no one will read it or bother to exegeted them for you as it is a waste of time. We will just get another wall of scriptures----and from your pov (the Catholic mandates and dictates) they are all talking about the Catholic religion and its hierarchy, which they are not doing. So quit trying to make your point more valid by doing that (as I have asked you to on a number of occasions.) You are using them in a perverted way and as such, they do nothing to support your "case." You have no case.

And why is it that you deny Sola scriptura and then use scripture to validate what you say?

 

[Arial]

I thought you followed Christ? Jn 14:6

I do. You follow the Pope.

 

[donadams]

Don, I dont reject any scripture. So, the answer to your question is no.

Do you make a practice out of twisting scripture to meet your beliefs?

How do you know? How can you know? “Scripture is the only authority” allows for no meaning or interpretation so how can you know my interpretation is wrong?

Shall we consult the church fathers, doctors, and saints or just accept the so called reformers understanding of scripture?

Thks

 

[donadams]

Are you rejecting all the scripture verses in #109?

Matt 16:18-19 shall not prevail!

Matt 28:19 commanded to teach

Matt 28:20 Christ is united with His churches, a work of the apostolic church is a work of Christ!

Amen?

I’m glad to hear you believe!

Does not scripture support the teaching authority of Christ in His apostolic church?

Thks

 

[Eleanor]

How do you know? How can you know? “Scripture is the only authority” allows for no meaning or interpretation so how can you know my interpretation is wrong?

Shall we consult the church fathers, doctors, and saints or just accept the so called reformers understanding of scripture?

Thks

Scripture agrees with Scripture.

Wrong interpretation can be shown from the rest of Scripture with which it disagrees.

 

[makesends]

Matt 23:1 hint these are the successors of moses and Christ demands their authority be obeyed, and this same authority was taken from them matt 21:43 and given to Peter the apostles and their successors matt 16:18-19 & 18:18
This authority Christ still expects us to obey! Heb 13:7-17
Thks

Show, by name, the progression from Peter to Modern Day Apostles. By Name. I'm becoming more and more sure there is no such list, the longer you delay in showing it --you, who are so well informed as to the veracity of the RCC being THE CHURCH.

 

[ElectedbyHim]

Then do you not believe that obedience to His authentic ministers is obedience to Christ?

Thks

His authentic ministers

Please tell who these people are.

Pope, priests, nuns?

 

[Arial]

I’m glad to hear you believe!

Does not scripture support the teaching authority of Christ in His apostolic church?

Thks

The Apostolic church refers to the church at the time the apostles were living and planting and teaching. They laid the foundation. No other foundation can be laid on it. Christ's church itself is not apostolic. And his church is not the Catholic denomination, or the Baptist or Presbyterian etc. His people gather in corporeal churches and he is the Head. If he is not the head but a usurper takes his place (Pope, priest, an institution) it is not his church. Fortunately, because God is sovereign and he saves who he will, wherever they are, some who sit in Catholic pews are saved by HIS grace, through true faith in the person and work of Jesus as sufficient.