Gen 6...who are the sons of God?

[Tambora]

OK.... got to feed you when you're hungry.
My Lord said so...

So here!

He said to another man, “Follow me.”​

​

But he replied, “Lord, first let me go and bury my father.”​

​

Jesus said to him, “Let the dead bury their own dead, ​

but you go and proclaim the kingdom of God.” Luke 9:59-60​

You did not know?
Spiritually dead people do bury physically dead people all the time.

​

"Jesus said to him, “Let the dead bury their own dead." ​

Right you are.
And the prodigal son in Luke 15 was said to be dead even though he had not died physically.

 

[LeviR]

Right you are.
And the prodigal son in Luke 15 was said to be dead even though he had not died physically.

How can someone be said to be right when the scripture never mentions anything about “spirituality dead”?

And when it most certainly says “you will surely die” and “from dust you are and to dust you shall return”

It seems to me it’s preferred to agree with the scripture than ideas men bring to them.

“There is no more condemnation for those in Christ Jesus”

Does not say “ there is no more spiritual death for those in Christ Jesus”

But everyone is free to believe what they want.

 

[CrowCross]

In brief, it's my understanding that the "sons of heaven," or the "sons of God," refer to the sons of Seth—that is, the descendants of Seth through Enos, Cainan, Mahalaleel, Jared, Enoch of Jared—not to be confused with Enoch of Cain—Methuselah, Lamech, and Noah, the father of Shem, Ham, and Japeth, and the "daughters of man" refer to the daughters of Cain. After the sons of Seth had intercourse with the daughters of Cain, they bore them sons: the Nephilim. It was then that God—to keep the branch of the children of God from being entirely corrupted by the branch of the children of men—sent the universal deluge to extinguish them. It's also my understanding that the discovered skeletons of "ape-men" in a cave back in 1946 were that of the Nephilim.

What do you have to say about Job identifying them as angels?

Where did the giants come from?

 

[CrowCross]

demons are dead?
The JW’s can’t link demons with fallen angels either. So they just say the angels changed their name to demons.

No, Demons are not dead. Thy are the "spirit" of those who were the Nephilim.
The Nephilim were the offspring of the fallen watcher angels and the daughters of men.

 

[CrowCross]

How can someone be said to be right when the scripture never mentions anything about “spirituality dead”?

And when it most certainly says “you will surely die” and “from dust you are and to dust you shall return”

It seems to me it’s preferred to agree with the scripture than ideas men bring to them.

“There is no more condemnation for those in Christ Jesus”

Does not say “ there is no more spiritual death for those in Christ Jesus”

But everyone is free to believe what they want.

What is spiritual death? I understand physical death.

 

[LeviR]

What is spiritual death? I understand physical death.

Spiritual death is an invented idea not taught in scripture.
People are dead when they are born because they have been condemned in Adam.
Christ makes those who are dead alive with hope of eternal life.

 

[Arial]

No, Demons are not dead. Thy are the "spirit" of those who were the Nephilim.
The Nephilim were the offspring of the fallen watcher angels and the daughters of men.

What do you think "watchers" means in reference to angels?

 

[LeviR]

No, Demons are not dead. Thy are the "spirit" of those who were the Nephilim.
The Nephilim were the offspring of the fallen watcher angels and the daughters of men.

The RCC teaches a doctrine they call “the immortal soul”.
I asked a RCC scholar “When was Adam given an immortal soul?” He told me Adam was given an immortal soul at his creation.

From what I gather, the idea is that when “man became a living soul” God had caused the body of Adam to have within it a soul that never dies.
My question is “that means if everyone receives an immortal soul than no one ever dies. How is it then that souls are said to die?”
The word “mortal” means subject to death.
The word “Immortal” means not subject to death. Therefore, the doctrine of the RCC is flawed.
When we read the text of man’s creation, it is said “The man became a living soul”.
The man did not receive an immortal soul, the man itself became a living soul.

Again, looking at the verse:

“And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living being.”

It was said man was created in the image and likeness of God. And here it’s said that the man is what was formed from the ground.
Therefore, what was formed from the ground called here “man”, is what was made in the image and likeness of God. Then it’s said, God breathed into the man the breath of life, and the man became a living soul.

Let “Us” make man in “Our” image, after,”Our likeness. This has to refer to God and angels.

The idea that there are independent incorporeal spirits going around is not taught in scripture. Man was created to resemble the physical appearance of God and angels.

 

[CrowCross]

The RCC teaches a doctrine they call “the immortal soul”.
I asked a RCC scholar “When was Adam given an immortal soul?” He told me Adam was given an immortal soul at his creation.

From what I gather, the idea is that when “man became a living soul” God had caused the body of Adam to have within it a soul that never dies.
My question is “that means if everyone receives an immortal soul than no one ever dies. How is it then that souls are said to die?”
The word “mortal” means subject to death.
The word “Immortal” means not subject to death. Therefore, the doctrine of the RCC is flawed.
When we read the text of man’s creation, it is said “The man became a living soul”.
The man did not receive an immortal soul, the man itself became a living soul.

Again, looking at the verse:

“And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living being.”

It was said man was created in the image and likeness of God. And here it’s said that the man is what was formed from the ground.
Therefore, what was formed from the ground called here “man”, is what was made in the image and likeness of God. Then it’s said, God breathed into the man the breath of life, and the man became a living soul.

Let “Us” make man in “Our” image, after,”Our likeness. This has to refer to God and angels.

The idea that there are independent incorporeal spirits going around is not taught in scripture. Man was created to resemble the physical appearance of God and angels.

I see some truth in that post.

I see a spirit as dying is being cast into the lake of fire.

When you say "The idea that there are independent incorporeal spirits going around is not taught in scripture" I have to ask, what did Jesus cast out and what went into the pigs?

I don't believe human spirits still roam the earth.

 

[LeviR]

I see some truth in that post.

I see a spirit as dying is being cast into the lake of fire.

When you say "The idea that there are independent incorporeal spirits going around is not taught in scripture" I have to ask, what did Jesus cast out and what went into the pigs?

I don't believe human spirits still roam the earth.

demon δαίμων, -ονος, ὁ, ἡ;
1. in Greek authors, a god, a goddess; an inferior deity, whether good or bad;,

This was the original understanding. And in the O.T. the understanding is the same.
A demon was nothing more than a false god. To worship a demon or idol image was to worship a god that does not exist.
God makes it very clear that there is no other God but He. He says “I know none”
“There is no other God besides me” no God but me.

I was wondering how that demon idea had carried over into the New Testament. Was it believed that gods who actually do not exist, are tormenting people?
Are they driving people mad and insane? Are they causing all types of illnesses And making people to be born blind or become blind?
The answer is no, because they don’t exist.

So, what is causing all these mental and physical problems for people?

The answer has to be sin. What else?
God did not create man to be sick physically and mentally.

If Adam’s sin has brought death to all of mankind, then the way in which people die are from all sorts of mental and physical diseases or illnesses. Some just die of old age, which is a disease itself. Death is the enemy(personification of death).

Therefore, we must ask the question what caused sin. What caused Adam to sin, and brought all these misery upon man?

It cannot be a false god, because they don’t exist. Again, it has to be sin.
If we say there are fallen angels called demons, then we are creating false gods. Gods that do not exist.

So it was either God that caused Adam to sin or something about Adam which caused him to sin……

I could continue if interested. Or you can just reject what I’ve said so fa?

 

[LeviR]

@CrowCross

To continue….

Adam’s sin brought death to all mankind. So death is the enemy. And the way in which people die are numerous. They die of all sorts of physical and mental diseases and illnesses. Which is the direct result of sin.

So what caused sin? We can’t say demon angels because that is to create false gods that do not exist. There is only one God and none other but He. All the gods of the Gentiles are false.

In Romans 7 Paul speaks of how sin has killed him. It did not kill him directly but indirectly from Adam. I believe Adam’s sin has killed us all because we are like him in nature.
When the law came, it made it possible for Adam’s nature to transgress God’s law.
I tend to view this as Adam’s misfortune to be given law that would expose his true nature.
It was actually Adam’s nature that did the sin. Paul says “it is no longer me that sins, but the sin that dwells in me, that is, in my flesh”
There is therefore a principle of sin that dwells in the flesh of man. And this principle is called “lust of the flesh” or,”sin in the flesh”.

James explains this by saying that when lust has conceived, it brings forth sin. And sin when it is full-grown, brings forth death.

If we have now determined what caused Adam to sin, we would say it is the lust of the flesh.

So what purpose does the serpent provide if man could just have desired the fruit on his own without any pressure to take it?


I suggest that the serpent is meant to be symbolic of the lust of the flesh which is the true cause of Adam’s sin. And therefore the serpent[lust of the flesh], or the devil, is father of sin.
And demons are the works of the devil [sin in the flesh] which causes all sickness, illness, and disease that comes along the path to death.

This idea would eliminate the idea of God’s angels in heaven as having fallen and become demons.

It would also mean that the sons of God in Job are men. And the adversary would be men who came among them as the tares among the wheat.
But we learn from Job that God permits all that happens to Job, and Job recognizes that it is the Lord who gives and the Lord who takes away.

When Jesus was tempted by the devil, it must be recognized that the devil is the lust of the flesh or desires of the flesh, as a personification of it, as is the serpent.
And the one who is the Temptor is recognized as being the devil because he is acting on his own desires to falsely accuse Jesus of being who he said he was.
And like Job, God is permitting this and must have a hand in it as Jesus was said to be led by the spirit into the wilderness of sinners to be tested like Job and Adam.

When the devil left him it is said he would return at a more opportune time.
The temptation for Jesus was to prove who he said he was. And the devil continually said to Jesus “if you be the son of God” do this or do that.
We find that the devil return in the group who mocked him and spit on him when he was being persecuted and put on the cross. And they said to him, “If you be the son of God, come down from that cross” and “if he be the son of God, let Him save him”
The devil had returned at a most opportune time.
They were the devil, they were the false accusers.
They were the serpents seed. And the lust of their father they do.

 

[LeviR]

@CrowCross

If you can admit it possible that the nature Adam was created with is responsible for his sin, and that we share his nature and therefore all sin we do is of that nature, you could admit that all suffering and death and misery this world experiences is due to our nature. And if that sinful nature is what is referred to as the devil, you could also admit that each of us has a devil in our own flesh.

If this be true, then we also must admit Jesus shared our nature.

I want to show you something that I believe is so true it would be impossible to deny.

Heb 2:14 - Inasmuch then as the children have partaken of flesh and blood, He Himself likewise shared in the same, that through death He might destroy him who had the power of death, that is, the devil,

Rom 8:3 - For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh,

Look closely at these two verses. They parallel each other.

Jesus himself has shared in the same flesh and blood nature that by his death he might destroy “him” who had the power of death, the devil.

The “him” who has the power of death is the lust of the flesh personified as the devil. The power of death came by Adam’s sin

Now the next verse which is say the same thing.

The law was make weak by the flesh, so God sent His son in the likeness of that sinful flesh, so that the sin in the flesh would be condemned.

Condemning sin in the flesh is the same as saying the devil was destroyed when Jesus’ flesh was killed.
The thing is, he was destroyed in Jesus’ flesh, but still resides in ours.
So we need to look to him to be healed.

Jhn 3:14 - “And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of Man be lifted up,

The serpent is a symbol of the sin in the flesh.

 

[CrowCross]

demon δαίμων, -ονος, ὁ, ἡ;
1. in Greek authors, a god, a goddess; an inferior deity, whether good or bad;,

This was the original understanding. And in the O.T. the understanding is the same.
A demon was nothing more than a false god. To worship a demon or idol image was to worship a god that does not exist.
God makes it very clear that there is no other God but He. He says “I know none”
“There is no other God besides me” no God but me.

I was wondering how that demon idea had carried over into the New Testament. Was it believed that gods who actually do not exist, are tormenting people?
Are they driving people mad and insane? Are they causing all types of illnesses And making people to be born blind or become blind?
The answer is no, because they don’t exist.

So, what is causing all these mental and physical problems for people?

The answer has to be sin. What else?
God did not create man to be sick physically and mentally.

If Adam’s sin has brought death to all of mankind, then the way in which people die are from all sorts of mental and physical diseases or illnesses. Some just die of old age, which is a disease itself. Death is the enemy(personification of death).

Therefore, we must ask the question what caused sin. What caused Adam to sin, and brought all these misery upon man?

It cannot be a false god, because they don’t exist. Again, it has to be sin.
If we say there are fallen angels called demons, then we are creating false gods. Gods that do not exist.

So it was either God that caused Adam to sin or something about Adam which caused him to sin……

I could continue if interested. Or you can just reject what I’ve said so fa?

For all to read....are you saying demons don't exist?
It sounds like you're saying they don't....but I don't want to put words in your mouth.

 

[CrowCross]

@CrowCross

If you can admit it possible that the nature Adam was created with is responsible for his sin, and that we share his nature and therefore all sin we do is of that nature, you could admit that all suffering and death and misery this world experiences is due to our nature. And if that sinful nature is what is referred to as the devil, you could also admit that each of us has a devil in our own flesh.

If this be true, then we also must admit Jesus shared our nature.

I want to show you something that I believe is so true it would be impossible to deny.

Heb 2:14 - Inasmuch then as the children have partaken of flesh and blood, He Himself likewise shared in the same, that through death He might destroy him who had the power of death, that is, the devil,

Rom 8:3 - For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh,

Look closely at these two verses. They parallel each other.

Jesus himself has shared in the same flesh and blood nature that by his death he might destroy “him” who had the power of death, the devil.

The “him” who has the power of death is the lust of the flesh personified as the devil. The power of death came by Adam’s sin

Now the next verse which is say the same thing.

The law was make weak by the flesh, so God sent His son in the likeness of that sinful flesh, so that the sin in the flesh would be condemned.

Condemning sin in the flesh is the same as saying the devil was destroyed when Jesus’ flesh was killed.
The thing is, he was destroyed in Jesus’ flesh, but still resides in ours.
So we need to look to him to be healed.

Jhn 3:14 - “And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of Man be lifted up,

The serpent is a symbol of the sin in the flesh.

Yikes...lets ramp it up...are you now saying the "devil" doesn't exist?

 

[LeviR]

For all to read....are you saying demons don't exist?
It sounds like you're saying they don't....but I don't want to put words in your mouth.

Either you didn’t read it or my writing is incomprehensible .

I said you fallen Angel demon theory are false gods. I didn’t say demons aren’t a thing

 

[LeviR]

Yikes...lets ramp it up...are you now saying the "devil" doesn't exist?

Either you didn’t read it or my writing is incomprehensible .

I said your fallen Angel demon theory is a false god. The devil is the sin in the flesh.

 

[CrowCross]

Either you didn’t read it or my writing is incomprehensible .

You made it seem as if satan and demons only existed as mans fallen nature.

Perhaps you could post your position about satan and demons.

 

[LeviR]

You made it seem as if satan and demons only existed as mans fallen nature.

Perhaps you could post your position about satan and demons.

I’m not the best writer. I thought I explained in three posts.
To believe there are fallen angels called demons is to have false gods that do not exist.

 

[CrowCross]

I’m not the best writer. I thought I explained in three posts.
To believe there are fallen angels called demons is to have false gods that do not exist.

Who is to say the demons are not the dead Nephilim and their offspring?

 

[LeviR]

Who is to say the demons are not the dead Nephilim and their offspring?

Because demons are false gods. They are gods the Gentiles worship and whom the Jews get sucked in to worship.There is no other God but the one God.