Gen 6...who are the sons of God?

[Carbon]

There's a rapture (caught up) but there's no secret rapture! This will happen on the last day, at the resurrection of the dead, of both the righteous and the unrighteous~the rapture, the resurrection at the last day and Christ's second coming...the last trump are one and the same event....there is no time period separating them, like, not even a second, all events happening in a twinkling of an eye, according to God's testimony of eschatology timeline of events.



I'll stop keep from hijacking this thread, but let's go to a thread dealing with this subject, one of my favorite doctrines to discuss. Is there a link we can go to? Still trying to find my way around here.

That's what I'm saying.

 

[CrowCross]

No, that is not what the Job 38 text states. Additions to the text were posted. A book of literature (i.e., art, which is highly figurative and allegorical) has been treated as literal instruction and historical fact when that's not what the book is about. There's a completefailure in understanding the entire stanza is rhetorical! Who provided counsel to God? NO ONE!!! Not only was the text mistreated by ignoring its genre and adding to what is stated, but the additions directly contradict what New Testament states.

• The fact is Job is considered a book of art, like the psalms, the proverbs, Ecclesiastes, and Songs and that is why it is included in that portion of scripture alongside. That's not up for debate.
• No scripture, whether it be from Job or any other book, can or should be made to contradict other scripture. That's not up for debate, either. According to Genesis 1, there were no creatures created until the fourth day, which was after the "cornerstones" were laid.
• According to the New Testament, sons of God are those who make peace, are like angels but are not angels, are also sons of resurrection, led by the Spirit, and it is by faith in Jesus Christ through which a person becomes a son of God. All of these facts are explicitly stated in the New Testament (and have already been posted in the thread). They're not up for debate.
• A simple search of the phrase shows there are only 10 occasions where the phrase, "sons of God" are found in the Bible. That's not up for debate. All ten mentions should be read together to understand what scripture means when using the term and you, @CrowCross, did not do that. Not only did that NOT happen, but doing so has been resisted every day for the past week and nine pages worth of posts. Those are the facts in evidence. They are not up for debate.

Why the choice is made to use scripture selectively is the problem to be solved. Why the refusal to use ALL that scripture states about sons of God was made is the problem to be solved. Why the choice was made to argue against some of the most plain, explicit statements declared in scripture is the problem to be solved. If you want to deny the facts of scripture, then have at it.

You might consider doing a study of "cornerstone" in scripture because Job 38 is not about cosmology. The Bible is not a textbook on astronomy.

Isaiah 28:16
Therefore, thus says the Lord GOD, "Behold, I am laying in Zion a stone, a tested stone, a costly cornerstone for the foundation, firmly placed. He who believes in it will not be disturbed."

John 1:1-3
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being.

1 Peter 1:20-21
For He was foreknown before the foundation of the world but has appeared in these last times for the sake of you who through Him are believers in God, who raised Him from the dead and gave Him glory, so that your faith and hope are in God.

Ephesians 2:19-22
So then you are no longer strangers and aliens, but you are fellow citizens with the saints, and are of God's household, having been built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Christ Jesus Himself being the corner stone, in whom the whole building, being fitted together, is growing into a holy temple in the Lord, in whom you also are being built together into a dwelling of God in the Spirit.

How the inherent Christological significance of the Job 38 text can be ignored and nonsense added to it about created creatures observing God creating creation in contradiction to the definitions explicitly provided in the New Testament is irrational and incomprehensible. Very bad exegesis.

You're trying to hard to make the bible say what it doesn't say.

Job said the angels watched as the earth was created.

 

[CrowCross]

It would have been rape.... Or, "consensual rape."
No marriage involved!

The women were seduced by the beauty of the angels bodies.
No marriage!

With all due respect....my bible as well as the other translations say marriage. Now, if you don't like that....well then, what can I say.

 

[Carbon]

There's a rapture (caught up) but there's no secret rapture! This will happen on the last day, at the resurrection of the dead, of both the righteous and the unrighteous~the rapture, the resurrection at the last day and Christ's second coming...the last trump are one and the same event....there is no time period separating them, like, not even a second, all events happening in a twinkling of an eye, according to God's testimony of eschatology timeline of events.



I'll stop keep from hijacking this thread, but let's go to a thread dealing with this subject, one of my favorite doctrines to discuss. Is there a link we can go to? Still trying to find my way around here.

Maybe @GeneZ will consider what you have to say.

 

[GeneZ]

You're trying to hard to make the bible say what it doesn't say.

Job said the angels watched as the earth was created.

Job said specifically, that some cheered and some sang as they watched the earth being created.

.Job 38:4-7​

​

4 “Where were you when I laid the earth’s foundation?​

Tell me, if you understand.​

5 Who marked off its dimensions? Surely you know!​

Who stretched a measuring line across it?​

6 On what were its footings set,​

or who laid its cornerstone—​

7 while the morning stars sang together​

and all the angels shouted for joy?​

Take note, please.

'Morning stars' were light bearing angels .. like Lucifer was.
He was one of them.


grace and peace .................

 

[CrowCross]

Job said specifically, that some cheered and some sang as they watched the earth being created.

.Job 38:4-7​

​

4 “Where were you when I laid the earth’s foundation?​

Tell me, if you understand.​

5 Who marked off its dimensions? Surely you know!​

Who stretched a measuring line across it?​

6 On what were its footings set,​

or who laid its cornerstone—​

7 while the morning stars sang together​

and all the angels shouted for joy?​

Take note, please.

'Morning stars' were light bearing angels .. like Lucifer was.
He was one of them.


grace and peace .................

When I read the verse you posted...it says ALL the angels....not "some"....but it you need it to read 'some"....have at it.

 

[CrowCross]

There's a rapture (caught up) but there's no secret rapture! This will happen on the last day, at the resurrection of the dead, of both the righteous and the unrighteous~the rapture, the resurrection at the last day and Christ's second coming...the last trump are one and the same event....there is no time period separating them, like, not even a second, all events happening in a twinkling of an eye, according to God's testimony of eschatology timeline of events.

Jesus comes back twice...at the rapture/resurrection when Jesus returns like He left...see Acts 1...and then a second time on a white horse...see Rev 19.
Jesus didn't ascend on a white horse.

 

[Mr GLee]

Ah - the question for the ages - AND the possible motivation for the flood. IF some portion of humanity was non-Adamic, there would be a Problem for the plan of redemption, so a "Cleansing" was required to return humanity to an "Adamic only" state.

That's all theoretical, of course, so something I'll ask later - if I even have to. PERSONALLY I tend toward the "Sons of God" not being Adamic humans.

Another kind of humans?

 

[Carbon]

Jesus comes back twice...at the rapture/resurrection when Jesus returns like He left...see Acts 1...and then a second time on a white horse...see Rev 19.
Jesus didn't ascend on a white horse.

Nope. Just once. The second coming

 

[CrowCross]

Nope. Just once. The second coming

If Jesus left on a white horse you might have a point.

Here's another...at the end of the tribulation when you claim the rapture occurs....things are pretty nasty. Real nasty. In fact if Jesus didn't return there would be no human survivors...Now, Jesus speaks of the return and likens it to the days of Noah when people are partying, getting married and having a grand old time...does that sound like the end of the trib to you?

So, Carbon, you need to explain why the white horse is missing during Chrit ascension and show how people are having a good time such as with the days of Noah.

Get your crown back...start looking for the appearing of Christ.....why are you afraid of the rapture?

2 Timothy 4:8 From now on there is laid up for me the crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous Judge, will award to me on that day—and not only to me, but to all who crave His appearing.

 

[GeneZ]

When I read the verse you posted...it says ALL the angels....not "some"....but it you need it to read 'some"....have at it.

7 while the morning stars sang together​

and all the angels shouted for joy?​

All the angels shouted for joy (in contrast to those who were singing)
refers to all the regular angels that were not designed to be 'morning stars.'

Job 38:7 was speaking of the two different races of angels that God created!

Yes, even with the angels, God created different races!
For, not all angels are light bearing morning stars.

That would be like saying that the Army band played, while all the crowd cheered.
All would be human beings, but not all the human beings were musicians in the Army band.

Likewise, not all angels are morning stars.
But, all morning stars were angels.

cheers!

 

[Carbon]

If Jesus left on a white horse you might have a point.

Here's another...at the end of the tribulation when you claim the rapture occurs....things are pretty nasty. Real nasty. In fact if Jesus didn't return there would be no human survivors...Now, Jesus speaks of the return and likens it to the days of Noah when people are partying, getting married and having a grand old time...does that sound like the end of the trib to you?

So, Carbon, you need to explain why the white horse is missing during Chrit ascension and show how people are having a good time such as with the days of Noah.

Get your crown back...start looking for the appearing of Christ.....why are you afraid of the rapture?

2 Timothy 4:8 From now on there is laid up for me the crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous Judge, will award to me on that day—and not only to me, but to all who crave His appearing.

Do you believe the white horse is a literal horse? You do don't you.

 

[GeneZ]

There's a rapture (caught up) but there's no secret rapture!

So much is missed.

No, secret rapture?

​

Behold! I tell you a mystery. We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, in a moment, ​

in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be ​

raised imperishable, and we shall be changed." 1 Corinthians 15:51-52​

We shall not all sleep? It was a way to say .... Not all shall be dead.

​

Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord ​

in the air, and so we will always be with the Lord. " 1 Thessalonians 4:17​

I feel sorry for you and those who keep stumbling over this issue.
I know I am making myself clear, because I know others already knew what I said is true.

Why you do fail to see?

I am simply told to present what I have come to know as true.

Keep in mind.
Feeling bold is meaningless.
For the Devil was not afraid to present to Jesus false doctrine when Jesus was led into the wilderness.

How you feel is not a sign of being right with God.
Its knowing you have been made able (by grace) to understand God's Word correctly that counts.

Satan knows the Word of God better than both of us.

But, he does not know it to understand it.
Its known as his means to keep believers from understanding it.

We all need to have our eyes opened to be humbled to see how we really are in our flesh.
Whet we choose to believe will either reveal it, or expose us.

​

Behold! I tell you a mystery. We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, in a moment, ​

in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be ​

raised imperishable, and we shall be changed." 1 Corinthians 15:51-52​

We shall not all sleep?
It was a way to say ....
Not all shall be dead when it happens.

​

Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord ​

in the air, and so we will always be with the Lord. " 1 Thessalonians 4:17​

Don't think you are going to surprise me if you come up with some way to rationalize that away.

If you did?
You may sadden me.

But, not surprise me.

In Christ .............

 

[Carbon]

Do you believe the white horse is a literal horse? You do don't you.

@CrowCross no offense, but this is where dispensationalism has such an effect on your interpretations.

 

[Carbon]

So much is missed.

I don't think so.

No, secret rapture?

​

Nope. Every eye will see.

 

[GeneZ]

@CrowCross no offense, but this is where dispensationalism has such an effect on your interpretations.

Paul Revere was not an American.

He was a colonist.

Right?

Dispensationalism is a means to set the time in which something took place, as seen by men when it took place.

 

[Carbon]

Paul Revere was not an American.

He was a colonist.

Right?

Dispensationalism is a means to set the time in which something took place, as seen by men when it took place.

Try to stay focused friend.

 

[GeneZ]

I don't think so.

Nope. Every eye will see.

“Look, he is coming with the clouds,” and “every eye will see him,
even those who pierced him"; and all peoples on earth “will mourn
because of him.” So shall it be! Amen.



He will be coming WITH the clouds. Not, IN the clouds as with the Rapture.

All on earth shall see Him. That is when He is to return to land and stand and rule on the earth.

In contrast.
The Rapture will be up in the clouds.
Only seen by believers who will be resurrected up there.
Being, out of sight of the knuckle heads left on earth who will be too dull to know what is going on.

 

[GeneZ]

Try to stay focused friend.

I'll pray for you

 

[Carbon]

“Look, he is coming with the clouds,” and “every eye will see him,
even those who pierced him"; and all peoples on earth “will mourn
because of him.” So shall it be! Amen.



He will be coming WITH the clouds. Not, IN the clouds as with the Rapture.

All on earth shall see Him. That is when He is to return to land and stand and rule on the earth.

In contrast.
The Rapture will be up in the clouds.
Only seen by believers who will be resurrected up there.
Being, out of sight of the knuckle heads left on earth who will be too dull to know what is going on.

There is only one second coming. And that is the end.