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The mystery of works in the gospel of faith: The works we are justified by vs. the works we are not justified by

Ghada

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No works of man by man and for man alone, can save nor justify any man with God, lest we should boast. Only the works of God done by man for Jesus Christ alone, can save and justify any man with God, that gives Him the glory.

Nowhere does the Bible ever say we are saved through faith, and not by works, nor of works. That is a false quote cutting short the rest of Scripture. Nowhere does the Bible excluded any and all works from being saved and justified by Christ.

The Bible however does plainly say we are saved and justified by works. And only adds that no one is saved nor justified by faith alone, without any works.

Everywhere the Bible excludes works from being saved and justified by God, those works are always specifically identified apart from the works we are justified by.

For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast. (Eph 2)

The verse does not end as some write it, not of works. (As being any works at all.)

Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified. (Gal 2)

But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared, Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; (Titus 3)


None of these verses stop at works, but they all go on to identify the kind of works they are.

But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away.

And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.


They are the works of man without God, without the love of God from the heart. They are works of man's own will, that can be boasted of, whether by law, righteousness, sacrifice, or philanthropy.

The mystery of the gospel of faith is that without God, all men's works alone are in vain toward being saved and justified by God through Jesus Christ. We can do nothing of our own selves through our own faith and good will toward man, to ever be worthy of being justified with God, lest any man should have just cause to boast.

The only works included in being saved and justified by Christ, are the works of God done by man through the faith and love of Jesus Christ:

I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me. (Phil 4)

I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me. (Gal 2)

But by the grace of God I am what I am: and his grace which was bestowed upon me was not in vain; but I laboured more abundantly than they all: yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me. (1 Cor 15)

And whatsoever ye do, do it heartily, as to the Lord, and not unto men; (Col 3)


As we see, the works we do only for Jesus' sake, are not to even be claimed as our own, much less boasting of them. They are not our works we do, but only the Lord's by Him, so much so that we can give Him all the glory and say 'Not I', but Christ in me.

These are the only works, that justify a man with God in Christ Jesus. All other works of our own will by law, righteousness, sacrifice, and philanthropy, than man can indeed boast of, are excluded.
 
The only works included in being saved and justified by God, are done by the grace and charity of God through the faith of Jesus, where no man can boast, but only give glory to the Lord.

For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God.
The works of Abraham were his own by faith, both good and bad, until he had offered up Isaac for one cause alone: Because His Lord God told him too.

There was nothing of Abraham's own will in the work, any more than Jesus had desire to be crucified on a cross. It was all God's work that Abraham did, that justifed him with God, and as with Jesus' work on the cross, gave glory to God by obedience from the heart.

(For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth) (Rom 9)

This only says the babes had done neither good nor evil, but they had done works by struggling within the womb, after which works God declared His choice for Jacob. And being babes, the election was not of any works Jacob could boast of.
 
It is plain contradiction to teach not being justified by any works, and it is absurdity to believe God excludes His own works, from saving and juistifying us.

Afterall, God judges us by the works we do to justify or condemn us.

And whatsoever ye do, do it heartily, as to the Lord, and not unto men; Knowing that of the Lord ye shall receive the reward of the inheritance: for ye serve the Lord Christ. (Col 3)

And if ye call on the Father, who without respect of persons judgeth according to every man's work, pass the time of your sojourning here in fear: (1 peter 1)


And we see the only Christians trying to preach themselves being saved and justified apart from any works they do, are also them that trumpet their continued sinning in life, and even declare no Christians can do all the works of God, without doing their own righteousness.

And then they go on to preach an unjust judgment of God, who has respect of persons for their own faith, and so does not condemn them for their sinful works the same as others, that 'believe not'.

And thinkest thou this, O man, that judgest them which do such things, and doest the same, that thou shalt escape the judgment of God?

No works of man by man and for man alone, can save nor justify any man with God, lest we should boast. Only the works of God done by man for Jesus Christ alone, can save and justify any man with God, that gives Him the glory.
 
No works of man by man and for man alone, can save nor justify any man with God, lest we should boast. Only the works of God done by man for Jesus Christ alone, can save and justify any man with God, that gives Him the glory.

Nowhere does the Bible ever say we are saved through faith, and not by works, nor of works. That is a false quote cutting short the rest of Scripture. Nowhere does the Bible excluded any and all works from being saved and justified by Christ.

The Bible however does plainly say we are saved and justified by works. And only adds that no one is saved nor justified by faith alone, without any works.

Everywhere the Bible excludes works from being saved and justified by God, those works are always specifically identified apart from the works we are justified by.

For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast. (Eph 2)

The verse does not end as some write it, not of works. (As being any works at all.)

Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified. (Gal 2)

But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared, Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; (Titus 3)


None of these verses stop at works, but they all go on to identify the kind of works they are.

But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away.

And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.


They are the works of man without God, without the love of God from the heart. They are works of man's own will, that can be boasted of, whether by law, righteousness, sacrifice, or philanthropy.

The mystery of the gospel of faith is that without God, all men's works alone are in vain toward being saved and justified by God through Jesus Christ. We can do nothing of our own selves through our own faith and good will toward man, to ever be worthy of being justified with God, lest any man should have just cause to boast.

The only works included in being saved and justified by Christ, are the works of God done by man through the faith and love of Jesus Christ:

I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me. (Phil 4)

I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me. (Gal 2)

But by the grace of God I am what I am: and his grace which was bestowed upon me was not in vain; but I laboured more abundantly than they all: yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me. (1 Cor 15)

And whatsoever ye do, do it heartily, as to the Lord, and not unto men; (Col 3)


As we see, the works we do only for Jesus' sake, are not to even be claimed as our own, much less boasting of them. They are not our works we do, but only the Lord's by Him, so much so that we can give Him all the glory and say 'Not I', but Christ in me.

These are the only works, that justify a man with God in Christ Jesus. All other works of our own will by law, righteousness, sacrifice, and philanthropy, than man can indeed boast of, are excluded.
Yes born again believers are justified by the work of Christ that he works in us to both hear the gospel and move us according to the working of his power (Philippians 2:13)

It's the better things that accompany( Not work to gain) salvation. God promises he will not forget the good works we can offer according to the power of his name . No power from dying mankind .

Hebrew 6:9 But, beloved, we are persuaded better things of you, and things that accompany salvation, though we thus speak.
For God is not unrighteous to forget your work and labour of love, which ye have shewed toward his name, in that ye have ministered to the saints, and do minister.
 
No works of man by man and for man alone, can save nor justify any man with God, lest we should boast. Only the works of God done by man for Jesus Christ alone, can save and justify any man with God, that gives Him the glory.

Nowhere does the Bible ever say we are saved through faith, and not by works, nor of works. That is a false quote
And so quoting Eph 2:8-9 makes it false.
cutting short the rest of Scripture. Nowhere does the Bible excluded any and all works from being saved and justified by Christ.
Of course those saved and justified by Christ perform good works. It's the normal consequences of being saved and justified.
 
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Yes born again believers are justified by the work of Christ that he works in us
Nieither the faith nor the Spirit of Jesus Christ is working in anyone, that is working against Him by dead works of their own.


It's the better things that accompany( Not work to gain) salvation.
Not necessarily gain, but to obtain enternal salvation by obeying Him.

I like to use Bible words for Bible doctrine.

God promises he will not forget the good works we can offer according to the power of his name .
Anyone hearing the gospel can do His will. Only those doing His will, can be resurrected unto life in the judgement of works.

For whosoever is doing the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.

And the world is passing away, and the lust thereof: but he that is doing the will of God is abiding for ever.



No power from dying mankind .

No power, faith, will, nor works of man without Christ can possibly please God, and be judged worthy to walk with Him forever.

Cast away from you all your transgressions, whereby ye have transgressed; and make you a new heart and a new spirit: for why will ye die, O house of Israel?

But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.


I reject the gospel of our own faith alone with sinning, and only preach the gospel of Jesus' faith with doing His righteousness.




Hebrew 6:9 But, beloved, we are persuaded better things of you, and things that accompany salvation, though we thus speak.
For God is not unrighteous to forget your work and labour of love, which ye have shewed toward his name, in that ye have ministered to the saints, and do minister.
God never forgets the good works of His obedient sons.

He does forget any good works of the past, when doing present unrighteousness.

When I shall say to the righteous, that he shall surely live; if he trust to his own righteousness, and commit iniquity, all his righteousnesses shall not be remembered; but for his iniquity that he hath committed, he shall die for it.

When the righteous turneth from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, he shall even die thereby.

Doing God's works by Jesus Christ, does not include doing old dead works of sin and trespass.

Ephraim, he hath mixed himself among the people; Ephraim is a cake not turned.
I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot. So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.

As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.

I also reject the gospel of double-hearted hearers of the word, and only preach the gospel of faithful doers of God's will.

But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation; Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy.

Blessed are they that keep judgment, and he that is doing righteousness at all times.
 
And so quoting Eph 2:8-9 makes it false.

Quoting only part of any Scripture, makes it false.

Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever.

Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!

Of course those saved and justified by Christ perform good works. It's the normal consequences of being saved and justified.
True. And without doing God's good works, no man is saved nor justified by Jesus Christ.

Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin.

Especially anyone doing unrighteous works against God.
 
Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Jesus is never without His faith, nor His works.

His brethren are never without His faith, nor His works.

Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.

But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared, Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;


No man is justified with Christ by their own faith alone, nor by their own dead works, but man can only be justified by doing His works through His faith and Spirit.
 
Quoting only part of any Scripture, makes it false.
Not necessarily. . .

"For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith. . ." (Eph 2:8-9) is not false.
 
Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.
Jesus is never without His faith, nor His works.
His brethren are never without His faith, nor His works.
Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared, Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

No man is justified with Christ by their own faith alone, nor by their own dead works, but man can only be justified by doing His works through His faith and Spirit.
Now that above is false. The truth is:

"This righteousness from God comes to all who believe. There is no difference, for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and
are justified freely by his grace
through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus (Ro 3:22-24).
"For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from observing (without works of) the law (good works)." (Ro 3:28)

Those who have been justified by faith alone do good works, but those good works do not justify them, just as they did not save them (Eph 2:8-9). Those good works are the fruit of justification, and salvation, from God alone, by grace alone, through faith alone, so that no one can boast (Eph 2:9, Ro 4:2, 1 Co 1:29).
 
Nieither the faith nor the Spirit of Jesus Christ is working in anyone, that is working against Him by dead works of their own
I was addressing the Faith of Christ as God
Not necessarily gain, but to obtain enternal salvation by obeying Him.

I like to use Bible words for Bible doctrine.
You make acquisitions But show no evidence.
God never forgets the good works of His obedient sons.
Again I never said Gods forgets the good works according to the power of his name.
I reject the gospel of our own faith alone with sinning, and only preach the gospel of Jesus' faith with doing His righteousness
The gospel is not based on the faith as coming from dying mankind .It come from Christ's mighty work of faith or called a labor of His love.

:The let there be" and "it was good faith".

His Faith as power moves mountains. He gives us little and calls us of little faith .Again Christ is the storeroom. His barn are always full
 
Not necessarily. . .

"For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith. . ." (Eph 2:8-9) is not false.
Is false, if also preach against all works, without respect to justifying works in Christ Jesus, and unjustifying works of sinful man.

That makes the verse cut short for false purposes.
 
Now that above is false. The truth is:

"This righteousness from God comes to all who believe. There is no difference, for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and
are justified freely by his grace
through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus (Ro 3:22-24).
"For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from observing (without works of) the law (good works)." (Ro 3:28)
From the first post, I already showed the difference between works of man by law, and works of God in Christ Jesus.

Those who have been justified by faith alone
Are decieving themselves.

Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.



do good works,
So do all the religious on earth to one degree or another. Even the atheists help their neighbors from time to time.

And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.


but those good works do not justify them,
Exactly.

Only those works done in Christ Jesus justify a man with God.

I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

Neither one's own faith alone, nor one's own good works alone, justify any man with Christ Jesus.



just as they did not save them (Eph 2:8-9).
Neither our own works alone, nor our own faith alone, can save us.

What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?

But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared, Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

Those good works are the fruit of justification, and salvation, from God alone, by grace alone, through faith alone, so that no one can boast (Eph 2:9, Ro 4:2, 1 Co 1:29).
We see you do not say doing good works alone.

The doctrine of saving faith alone with good works following, is lame and decietful, since it also includes doing continued works of darkness, and not doing good works alone.

Either make the tree good, and his fruit good; or else make the tree corrupt, and his fruit corrupt: for the tree is known by his fruit.

Doth a fountain send forth at the same place sweet water and bitter?

Ephraim, he hath mixed himself among the people; Ephraim is a cake not turned.


No man is justified by faith nor works, with the works of darkness mingled with good works.

For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.

Man's religion of sinning less in life, by their own faith alone, is not God's pure religion of sinning not in Christ Jesus, through His faith alone.
 
Again I never said Gods forgets the good works according to the power of his name.

Unless the evil works come, to blot them out.
The gospel is not based on the faith as coming from dying mankind .
Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

The faith of Jesus is only in them that are keeping His comandments.


It come from Christ's mighty work of faith or called a labor of His love.

The faith of Jesus is the gift of God to them that repent of sinning against Him, to now keep His commandments.
 
No man is justified by faith nor works, with the works of darkness mingled with good works.
Yes, we are justified by His faith or labor of love . Can't separate faith from his works its all together one thing.

By faith (let there be) and the testimony of the work seen was God good.

The work of faith God's labor of Love that he works in us to both will (let there be) and (to do)_ the good testimony of God not seen

Philipian 2:13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.
 
Yes, we are justified by His faith or labor of love . Can't separate faith from his works its all together one thing.
People do when they separate God's works from what they do.

We are justified by doing the works of God, through Christ working in us.

Christ is not working in anyone doing dead works of their own.

 
Not necessarily. . .

"For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith. . ." (Eph 2:8-9) is not false.
True. Through faith alone... is false.

And those teaching faith alone for Eph 2 without saying so, are decievers.
 
Is false, if also preach against all works, without respect to justifying works in Christ Jesus, and unjustifying works of sinful man.

That makes the verse cut short for false purposes.
The verse is not cut short.

Please show where my law keeping in Christ justifies me (declared by God to be righteous), when the NT states, "A man is justified by faith without works of the law." (Ro 3:28)
 
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From the first post, I already showed the difference between works of man by law, and works of God in Christ Jesus.
Are decieving themselves.
Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?
But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.

So do all the religious on earth to one degree or another. Even the atheists help their neighbors from time to time.
And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.
Exactly.
Only those works done in Christ Jesus justify a man with God.
I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.
Neither one's own faith alone, nor one's own good works alone, justify any man with Christ Jesus.
Neither our own works alone, nor our own faith alone, can save us.
What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?
You do not understand much of the NT,
Ro 4:2,
Ro 3:22-24,
Ro 3:28,
Eph 2:8-9,
1 Co 1:29,
etc., etc., etc.,
and set Scripture against itself.
I'm not sure I want to sort it all out for you.

True faith has works, but it is not the works of true faith which saves, it is only the faith itself---so that no one can boast that their works saved them. For salvation is by God, and God alone (Rev 7:10), he shares his glory (of salvation work) with no one (Isa 42:8, 48:11)
But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared, Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
We see you do not say doing good works alone.
The doctrine of saving faith alone with good works following, is lame and decietful, since it also includes doing continued works of darkness, and not doing good works alone.
Either make the tree good, and his fruit good; or else make the tree corrupt, and his fruit corrupt: for the tree is known by his fruit.
Doth a fountain send forth at the same place sweet water and bitter?
Ephraim, he hath mixed himself among the people; Ephraim is a cake not turned.

No man is justified by faith nor works, with the works of darkness mingled with good works.
For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.
Man's religion of sinning less in life, by their own faith alone, is not God's pure religion of sinning not in Christ Jesus, through His faith alone.
True. Through faith alone... is false.
And those teaching faith alone for Eph 2 without saying so, are decievers.
Your understanding of Biblical Christian doctrine is more distorted than I care to engage.
 
The verse is not cut short.
The verse is not cut short. Your doctrinal version of it is cut short from the verse. Nowhere does God ever say we are justified by faith, and not by works. Unless the rest of the verse is cut short.

And the only place God speaks of faith alone, without works, is that it's dead to Him.


Please show where my law keeping in Christ justifies me
Gladly.

Romans
{2:11} For there is no respect of persons with God. {2:12} For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law; {2:13} (For not the hearers of the law [are] just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.

James
{1:22} But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.

The word of the Lord is His law, and only doers of His will are justified by Him. And so, no one doing not His word, can possibly be justified by Him.

James
{2:24} Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.

No matter what the nondoers believe...
Please show where my law keeping in Christ justifies me
The key here of course, is works done in Christ, to the glory of the Father.

These are the only works that justify any man as an obedient son of God.




(declared by God to be righteous),
1 John
{3:7} Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.

{2:29} If ye know that he is righteous, ye know that every one that doeth righteousness is born of him.


This is called instruction in the righteousness of God, with the first principle of doing His righteousness, to be declared righteous as He.

1 John
{3:9} Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot be sin, because he is born of God.
{5:18} We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.


No one that is committing sin is born of God.

2 John
{1:11} Beloved, follow not that which is evil, but that which is good. He that doeth good is of God: but he that doeth evil hath not seen God.

Only them doing God's good will are born of God.
Rev
{14:12} Here is the patience of the saints: here [are] they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Faith alone is man's alone, not the saving faith of Jesus that is always keeping His commandments.


when the NT states, "A man is justified by faith without works of the law." (Ro 3:28)
Exactly. Not cut short here. Works of the law without the faith of Jesus, justifies no man.

Other unjustified works of man Christ, include doing our own righteousnes, philanthopy of man's purposes, and works of our own sacrifice for vain things not of God.

1 Cor
{13:3} And though I bestow all my goods to feed [the poor,] and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing


Those who want to separate all works from their own faith, salvation, and justification, are purposely blinding themselves to God's judgment of justified works done through His Son, and unjustified works of man's own will.

They aslo openly reject their works being judged by God unto justification or condemnation.

In this life on earth, people can believe wholeheartedly that they are saved and justified by their own faith alone, and none of their works, whether good or evil, will ever judged and condemned. But that doctrinal card doesn't last beyond the grave.

Genesis
{3:5} For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.
The subtle lie here is not that we can be as gods in this life, choosing for ourselves what to believe and do according to our own will. The lie is that it lasts forever like the pagan immortal gods of old.

At the end of this life, the righteous God and Judge will go right ahead and judge us all by our works, no matter what we believe or try to say about it. God doesn't care about any persons' doctrinal get-out-of-judgment-free card, played by their own faith alone.

Hebrews
{9:27} And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:
 
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