The Atonement

[civic]

Spiritually dead men don't do anything spiritual, including repentance.

The NT presents our re-birth into the eternal life Adam lost for us as a sovereign act of the Holy Spirit, dependent on nothing but his sovereign choice, not on repentance, faith, works, etc., but as a sovereign act as unaccountable as the wind (Jn 3:7-8).

It follows the writer's plea not to fail to go into salvation rest in Jesus Christ, rest from one's own work to save and in Jesus' work which saves.
It presents the word of God as judging.

The new birth is the direct action of the Holy Spirit (Tit 3:5) enabling one to respond to the word of God in the gospel with faith and repentance.

They accepted the word of God because of their sovereign rebirth.

Read what the prince of preachers has to say about the resurrection.

The Spurgeon Library | “If There be no Resurrection,—.”

www.spurgeon.org

 

[Eleanor]

Read 1 Cor 15 and Roman’s 6 which I referenced and says what I’m stating .

I think we're saying basically the same thing.

First of all, the resurrection is proof of all that Christ said, did and is.
If there is no resurrection, the whole gospel (the nature of the Christian and Christian life, to which I refer as resurrection power in the believer) falls.

The nature of the Christian and the Christian life are what the Holy Spirit of Jesus accomplishes in the believer who is now reconciled to God by the removal of his sin in the death of Jesus.
All that possibly remains as not accomplished by the resurrection is forgiveness of sin (by his death).

Yes?

 

[brightfame52]

What does the hi-lighted mean?

Christ is the author of our obedience/faith

 

[civic]

I think we're saying basically the same thing.

First of all, the resurrection is proof of all that Christ said, did and is.
If there is no resurrection, the whole gospel (the nature of the Christian and Christian life, to which I refer as resurrection power in the believer) falls.
All that possibly remains is forgiveness of sin (by his death).

Yes?

Thanks for clarifying

 

[civic]

Christ is the author of our obedience/faith

Does He believe and obey for you ?

 

[brightfame52]

Does He believe and obey for you ?

What does author mean ?

 

[civic]

What does author mean ?

I asked you the question.

 

[ReverendRV]

Jesus is the Author and Finisher of our Faith, but it doesn't mean we do not author and finish our faith too. There are more Verses in the Bible to apply to the Doctrine of the Will...

 

[civic]

This is for the readers what Author means.

◄ 747. archégos ►

Strong's Concordance archégos: founder, leader​ Original Word: ἀρχηγός, οῦ, ὁ Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine Transliteration: archégos Phonetic Spelling: (ar-khay-gos') Definition: founder, leader Usage: originator, author, founder, prince, leader. HELPS Word-studies 747 arxēgós(from 746 /arxḗ, "the first" and 71 /ágō, "to lead") – properly, the first in a long procession; a file-leader who pioneers the way for many others to follow. 747 (arxēgós) does not strictly mean "author," but rather "a person who is originator or founder of a movement and continues as the leader – i.e. 'pioneer leader, founding leader' " (L & N, 1, 36.6). NAS Exhaustive Concordance Word Origin from archó and hégeomai Definition founder, leader NASB Translation author (2), Prince (1), prince (1). ​ Thayer's Greek Lexicon STRONGS NT 747: ἀρχηγός ἀρχηγός, ἀρχηγόν, adjective, leading, furnishing the first cause or occasion: Euripides, Hipp. 881; Plato, Crat., p. 401 d.; chiefly used as a substantive, ὁ, ἡ, ἀρχηγός (ἀρχή and ἄγω); 1. the chief leader, prince: of Christ, Acts 5:31; (Aeschylus Ag. 259; Thucydides 1, 132;. The Sept. Isaiah 3:5; 2 Chronicles 23:14, and often). 2. "one that takes the lead in anything (1 Macc. 10:47, ἀρχηγός λόγων εἰρηνικῶν) and thus affords an example, a predecessor in a matter": τῆς πίστεως, of Christ, Hebrews 12:2 (who in the prominence of his faith far surpassed the examples of faith commemorated in Hebrews 11) (others bring this under the next head; yet cf. Kurtz at the passage). So ἀρχηγός ἁμαρτίας, Micah 1:13; ζήλους, Clement of Rome, 1 Cor. 14, 1 [ET]; τῆς στάσεως καί διχοστασίας, ibid. 51, 1; τῆς ἀποστασιας, of the devil, Irenaeus 4, 40, 1; τοιαυτης φιλοσοφίας, of Thales, Aristotle, met. 1, 3, 7 (p. 983{b} 20). Hence, 3. the author: τῆς ζωῆς, Acts 3:15; τῆςσωτηρίας, Hebrews 2:10. (Often so in secular authors: τῶν πάντων, of God (Plato) Tim. Locr., p. 96 c.; τοῦ γένουςτῶν ἀνθρώπων, of God, Diodorus 5, 72; ἀρχηγός καί αἴτιος, leader and author, are often joined, as Polybius 1, 66, 10; Herodian, 2, 6, 22 (14, Bekker edition)). Cf. Bleek on Heb. vol. ii. 1, p. 301f.

 

[civic]

Jesus is the Author and Finisher of our Faith, but it doesn't mean we do not author and finish our faith too. There are more Verses in the Bible to apply to the Doctrine of the Will...

It means founder/ leader . See my last post. Having a dialogue is not easy sometimes lol.

 

[Eleanor]

What does author mean ?

"The work of God is this. . ." in light of the context, means the work God would have you do.

 

[ReverendRV]

It means founder/ leader . See my last post. Having a dialogue is not easy sometimes lol.

So, how is Briteframe disagreeing?

 

[civic]

So, how is Briteframe disagreeing?

Ask him and see if he gives an answer not a question

 

[brightfame52]

I asked you the question.

He is the causer of our obedience, not the doer of it. Its promised in the New Covenant Ezk 36:26-27

26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

 

[Bob Carabbio]

Do you understand the Atonement {In Scripture} as,

Limited
or
unlimited

Did the Atonement actually save?
or
Make it possible for salvation?

Passages?

Potentially UNLIMITED, but practically LIMITED - obviously, since the MAJORITY of humanity WILL NOT become Born again, and will perish. (Mat 7:14)

OF COURSE the "Atonement" when appropriated by FAITH saves. nothing else can. (Eph 2:8,9)

 

[Carbon]

Potentially UNLIMITED, but practically LIMITED - obviously, since the MAJORITY of humanity WILL NOT become Born again, and will perish. (Mat 7:14)

OF COURSE the "Atonement" when appropriated by FAITH saves. nothing else can. (Eph 2:8,9)

You do have a unique way of saying things.

 

[brightfame52]

Potentially UNLIMITED, but practically LIMITED - obviously, since the MAJORITY of humanity WILL NOT become Born again, and will perish. (Mat 7:14)

OF COURSE the "Atonement" when appropriated by FAITH saves. nothing else can. (Eph 2:8,9)

So mans appropriating act saves and not the atonement in and of itself, correct ?

 

[Ritajanice]

He is the causer of our obedience, not the doer of it. Its promised in the New Covenant Ezk 36:26-27

26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

Amen!!

 

[Eleanor]

So mans appropriating act saves and not the atonement in and of itself, correct ?

No, faith is the means (second cause) by which God saves, he likewise being the author of the gift of faith (Php 1:29, Ac 13:48, Av 18:27, 2 Pe 1:1, Ro 12:3).

 

[Bob Carabbio]

So mans appropriating act saves and not the atonement in and of itself, correct ?

CORRECT. If NOT MIXED WITH FAITH, it accomplishes NOTHING. Heb 4:2