The 2 Natures in Christ

[GeneZ]

That's not true at all. History lesson for you. "No one who examines the Chalcedonian creed against the background of the Christological controversies which preceded it can charge it with attempting to define the person of Jesus Christ or to force the inexpressible into conceptual forms." (A Short History of Christian Doctrine, by Bernhard Lohse).

Scriptural reference for 'God in the Flesh':

⦁ God "in the flesh" (1 Timothy, 1 John 4:2, 2 John 7).

⦁ God took part in "flesh and blood" (Hebrews 2:14, 17).

⦁ God dwelled among us "in the flesh" (John 1:1, 14).

⦁ God with us "in the flesh" (Matthew 1:23).

⦁ God's flesh is touched physically "in the flesh" (1 John 1:1-2).

⦁ God suffered "in the flesh" (1 Peter 4:1).

⦁ God condemn sin "in the flesh" (Romans 8:3).

⦁ God Died "in the flesh" (1 Peter 3:18, Hebrews 5:7).

⦁ God is resurrected in "flesh and bones" (Luke 24:39).

⦁ God over all (Romans 9:5).

Leontius of Byzantium who coined the term enypostatos in its relation to Christ’s human nature and not the relation to his Divine Nature. He is the one that brought out the meaning and articulated the term. The term hypostasis to an adjectival form enypostatos simply means “in-hypostatic or in-personal." The human nature becomes hypostatized-actualized, instantiated, or personalized. Basically, the human nature of Christ did not have independent existence outside of the union. There is no time intervals between "flesh" and "Word." The created human nature has no person 'existing prior to or apart from' the Divine Son-Person, while instantaneously and synchronously, the human nature is 'existing in and through' the Divine Person. These terms were introduced as a defense for the Chalcedon Creed’s definitions (one hypostasis or one subsistence) in order to refute Monophysites, Nestorians, Eutychians, and Apollinarians. So, the term enypostatos indicates the human nature is “in” the Second Person in the Trinity and existing enhypostatically or hypostatically. From the Chalcedonian Creed:

"...and concurring in one Person and one Subsistence, not parted or divided into two persons,..."​

What I am about to say demands that one not rush to a conclusion after reading it.
For preconceived ideas and concepts are what usually causes a rushing to decide.

now.....

God setting forth The Son while He was functioning in His human nature (as demonstrating his ability to do so in the Incarnation)..

By having all creation being created specifically through Him?
Created while manifested Himself in the same manner as His soul functioned in the Incarnation?
Is what enabled God to create us all without interfering with our volition!

That is the key to the mystery as to how God could create us to have our volition without His omniscience interfering with our choices when deciding to create us.

God's desire towards all mankind was openly demonstrated by dying for even those whom would reject Him. 1 John 2:2

For when the Son initially created us in eternity past?
His desire for all was for all men and all angels to love and adore the Father like He does in his humanity.

Only after creating all mankind in the mind of God? Did He return to manifesting His own omniscience,
then to survey what our choices were to be.

In creating us in that way? God did not create anyone with the intention to send them to the Lake of Fire.


That is why its so important to realize that all things created were created THROUGH the Son!!!
For God the Son in the Incarnation had demonstrated that He has the ability to compartmentalize his function as Jesus did.

Jesus before going to the cross was not omniscient.
Nor omnipotent! But, though being God? Made Himself to be as a man in his ability! Philippians 2:6-8

For those who can see it?
The key to the mystery is right there!

​

Colossians 1:16-17

For in him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, ​

whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things have been created through him ​

and for him. He is before all things, and in him all things hold together. ​

Not created through the Father.
Not created through the Holy Spirit.

All things created had to be created through Him, according to his nature of the humanity of Christ!!!

grace and peace....

 

[Mr GLee]

Jesus has two natures, human and divine, in one person.

Jesus is both human and divine, being the divine Son of God become man.

That is Christian orthodoxy.

Eternal God is supernatural without nature beginning (not born ) He has no mother or father beginning of days or end of Life

Hebrews 7:3-5 Young's Literal Translation without father, without mother, without genealogy, having neither beginning of days nor end of life, and being made like to the Son of God, doth remain a priest continually. And see how great this one [is], to whom also a tenth Abraham the patriarch did give out of the best of the spoils, and those, indeed, out of the sons of Levi receiving the priesthood, a command have to take tithes from the people according to the law, that is, their brethren, even though they came forth out of the loins of Abraham;

God is not man as us. Never was, never could become a creation.

Christ the Holy Spirit dwells in the heart and soul of dying mankind.

Satan's goal to make our invisible God into a creation a god seen. Lucifer who has no form as the god of this world is claiming to be the Creator right from the beginning.

 

[GeneZ]

Eternal God is supernatural without nature beginning (not born ) He has no mother or father beginning of days or end of Life

Hebrews 7:3-5 Young's Literal Translation without father, without mother, without genealogy, having neither beginning of days nor end of life, and being made like to the Son of God, doth remain a priest continually. And see how great this one [is], to whom also a tenth Abraham the patriarch did give out of the best of the spoils, and those, indeed, out of the sons of Levi receiving the priesthood, a command have to take tithes from the people according to the law, that is, their brethren, even though they came forth out of the loins of Abraham;

God is not man as us. Never was, never could become a creation.

Christ the Holy Spirit dwells in the heart and soul of dying mankind.

Satan's goal to make our invisible God into a creation a god seen. Lucifer who has no form as the god of this world is claiming to be the Creator right from the beginning.

His human body was 'born." His eternal soul that entered that body was not born.

His soul was in Heaven in union with God before the Incarnation.
I had to be shown this to see what the OT has to say about his Soul that is being in union with God.

One could just read these passages and not even make thew connection.
It needs to be pointed out and illuminated to our soul by the Spirit.


Here are some examples.

'You will eat the old supply and clear out the old because of the new. Moreover, ​

I will make my dwelling among you, and my soul will not reject you.'I will also ​

walk among you and be your God, and you shall be My people." Lev 26:10-12



And they began to remove the foreign gods from their midst and to serve Jehovah, ​

so that his soul became impatient because of the trouble of Israel. Judges 10:16



Jehovah himself examines the righteous one as well as the wicked one, and ​

anyone loving violence his soul certainly hates." Ps 11:5​

We need to keep in mind something to see that.
God is "spirit."
Spirit is not the same essence as a "soul."
Two natures!

Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship ​

the Father in the Spirit and in truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father ​

seeks. God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in the Spirit and in truth.” John 4:23-24
​

When I was shown this it was like I heard a knock on the door and God walked in...

What a surprise!

The two natures (soul and spirit) in union being the very soul that entered the body provided through Mary!

That is why He could claim to be God!

grace and peace ..........

 

[Mr GLee]

The Son of man Jesus became a born-again son of God just like all of his brothers and sisters. Marvel not!


God is supernatural without beginning. He has no nature.

Whosoever does the will of the father.

Matthew 12:50 For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.

Mark 3:35 For whosoever shall do the will of God, the same is my brother, and my sister, and mother.

God is not a man. It's the goal of Satan to deceive all the nations God is a Jewish man as King of kings.

John 4:23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him

I do not see any commandments to worship the dying flesh of the Son of man, Jesus.

 

[GeneZ]

The Son of man Jesus became a born-again son of God just like all of his brothers and sisters. Marvel not!

Be careful how you choose your words, please.

Only those born in fallen bodies of sin need to be born again.

Jesus was like Adam as Adam came straight from the hand of God.
Adam began being spiritually alive.
Only after he ate did Adam die (spiritually).

grace and peace ..............

 

[Mr GLee]

'You will eat the old supply and clear out the old because of the new. Moreover, I will make my dwelling among you, and my soul will not reject you.'I will also walk among you and be your God, and you shall be My people." Lev 26:10-12

Yes. God is God and not the Son of man, Jesus. born of woman, dying flesh and blood just like any human

God is of one mind and always does whatever his soul pleases. No man can turn him . He performs that which he appoints to us making our hearts soft through the water of the word. The gospel of salvation

 

[GeneZ]

Yes. God is God and not the Son of man, Jesus. born of woman, dying flesh and blood just like any human

God is of one mind and always does whatever his soul pleases. No man can turn him . He performs that which he appoints to us making our hearts soft through the water of the word. The gospel of salvation

Have you read Philippians 2:6-8?

It says in the Greek tense that He was eternally existing in the form of God.
That means the Soul of God had no beginning.
That Soul when in union with the powers of Deity/Jehovah is a Soul being God.
That power granted to only One Soul is unique to the Son of God.

Philippians 2:6-8

Who {Christ}, though He eternally existed in the essence of God,​

He did not think equalities with God​

a gain to be seized [means to violently take]​

and held​

but emptied himself​

by taking the form of a slave,​

by becoming in the likeness of people.​

And being found in appearance like a man,​

he humbled himself​

by becoming obedient to the point of death,​

that is, death on a cross.​

grace and peace .............

 

[grace2]

Yes. God is God and not the Son of man, Jesus. born of woman, dying flesh and blood just like any human

Jesus was Son of man when He was on earth.

 

[GeneZ]

Jesus was Son of man when He was on earth.

He had to become fully as a man.
He volunteered to deny His humanity all the glories His Deity granted Him while reigning as the Lord God of Israel.

If he did not deny Himself His right to the powers of God?

He could have never died in our place.

 

[Mr GLee]

Jesus was Son of man when He was on earth.

It is the only place he could be a human.

Have you read Philippians 2:6-8?

It says in the Greek tense that He was eternally existing in the form of God.
That means the Soul of God had no beginning.
That Soul when in union with the powers of Deity/Jehovah is a Soul being God.
That power granted to only One Soul is unique to the Son of God.

Philippians 2:6-8

Who {Christ}, though He eternally existed in the essence of God,​

He did not think equalities with God​

a gain to be seized [means to violently take]​

and held​

but emptied himself​

by taking the form of a slave,​

by becoming in the likeness of people.​

And being found in appearance like a man,​

he humbled himself​

by becoming obedient to the point of death,​

that is, death on a cross.​

grace and peace .............

God invisible is not a creature. The wrath of God comes to those who say he is

Roman 1:20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

Jesus the Son of Man is one of the things our invisible God made.

Roman 1:25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature (Jesus the Son of man)more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

God is not a Jewish man as king of Kings.

That satan idea.

God works in all men. Jesus is no different. Jesus the Son of man is 100 percent human

 

[grace2]

He had to become fully as a man.
He volunteered to deny His humanity all the glories His Deity granted Him while reigning as the Lord God of Israel.

If he did not deny Himself His right to the powers of God?

He could have never died in our place.

Jesus was given the power and authority from His Father to become our Lord and Christ.

If you believe Jesus is God, you are not reading the Bible.

 

[Mr GLee]

Be careful how you choose your words, please.

Only those born in fallen bodies of sin need to be born again.

Jesus was like Adam as Adam came straight from the hand of God.
Adam began being spiritually alive.
Only after he ate did Adam die (spiritually).

grace and peace ..............

I thanks yes

Remember a body typified as sinful flesh was needed to demonstration how God mightily puts sin away in the flesh.

Pouring out His Holy Spirit on the dying flesh of mankind He did not sin.

Real flesh and blood again was needed, a vision or theophany would not work

Romans 8:3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

 

[GeneZ]

I thanks yes

Remember a body typified as sinful flesh was needed to demonstration how God mightily puts sin away in the flesh.

Pouring out His Holy Spirit on the dying flesh of mankind He did not sin.

Real flesh and blood again was needed, a vision or theophany would not work

Romans 8:3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

Please try again....


I speak everyday English.

 

[donadams]

Chalcedonian Creed (451 A.D)

We, then, following the holy Fathers, all with one consent, teach men to confess one and the same Son, our Lord Jesus Christ, the same perfect in Godhead and also perfect in manhood; truly God and truly man, of a reasonable [rational] soul and body; consubstantial [co-essential] with the Father according to the Godhead, and consubstantial with us according to the Manhood; in all things like unto us, without sin; begotten before all ages of the Father according to the Godhead, and in these latter days, for us and for our salvation, born of the Virgin Mary, the Mother of God, according to the Manhood; one and the same Christ, Son, Lord, only begotten, to be acknowledged in two natures, inconfusedly, unchangeably, indivisibly, inseparably; the distinction of natures being by no means taken away by the union, but rather the property of each nature being preserved, and concurring in one Person and one Subsistence, not parted or divided into two persons, but one and the same Son, and only begotten, God the Word, the Lord Jesus Christ; as the prophets from the beginning [have declared] concerning Him, and the Lord Jesus Christ Himself has taught us, and the Creed of the holy Fathers has handed down to us.

 

[SeventhDay]

Sorry you feel that the NT is a myth, for it witnesses throughout that the man Jesus is God.

I. The NT identifies Jesus as the YHWH of the OT in

Mt 3:3, Lk 1:67-68, 76 (Isa 40:3) - Jesus is the YHWH of whom the voice calling in the wilderness (John the Baptist) prepared the way.

Ro 10:9, 13 (Joel 2:32) - Paul teaches Jesus is the YHWH of Joel's prophecy that "everyone who calls on the name of YHWH will be saved."

Heb 1:6 (Dt 32:43) - Heb quotes Moses' song referring to YHWH and says it applies to Jesus.

Rev 1:12-18 (Isa 44:6, 48:12) - the man in the vision is Jesus (1:18, 2:8) who identifies himself as the First and the Last which is YHWH identification of himself.

Rev 21:6, 22:12-13 (Rev 1:8) - the man in the vision (Jesus) identifies himself as the Alpha and Omega of Rev 1:8, which is YHWH.

Rev 21:5-7 (Rev 20:11-13) -Jesus, the one on the throne (Rev 20:11-13 with Jn 5:22, 27, 9:39), is God (Rev 21:7).

The Elohim and YHWH who created all things (Ge 1:1, Is 44:24, Jer 10:16) is Jesus (Jn 1:3, Col 1:16-17, Heb 1:2b, 10).

Jesus is
Immanuel (Isa 7:14, Mt 1:23) "God with us;"
Mighty God, Everlasting Father" (Isa 9:6);
God who came to save (Isa 35:4-6, 43:11),
YHWH Adonai of Eze 34:11-16 who is the shepherd of the sheep (Jn 10:11-15).

II. Jews understood that Jesus said he was God, seeking many times to stone him for blasphemy (Mk 2:3-7, Jn 6:41-42, 10:30-33, 5:18, 8:58-59, 19:7--Lev 24:16).

III. Paul said we are waiting for the glorious appearing of 'the great God and Savior of us Jesus Christ." (Tit 2:13)

IV. The NT testifies that Jesus is not an angel (Heb 1:4-14), that his "name" is Son--a name to which no angel can lay claim (Heb 1:4), that he is begotten of God (giving him the same nature as God, divine) and that he is the only begotten of God, he has no brothers like himself, divine.

V. The NT presents worship of Jesus together with his Father:
To the gods of paganism (Ac 17:22-27), Paul opposes one God the Father and one Lord Jesus Christ (1 Co 8:5-6) to be worshiped, and shows
worship of Jesus (Php 2:10),
prayer to Jesus (Ac 7:59, 9:14, 2 Co 12:8, 1 Co 1:2, 16:22, Rev 22:20)
praise to Jesus (Ro 9:5, 2 Tim 4:8, 2 Pe 3:18, Rev 1:5-6, 5:10, 7:13)
desired divine blessing of Jesus (1 Th 3:11-13, 2 Th 3:5, 16)
all of which are reserved to God alone (Ex 20:3-5, Mt 4:9-10, Ac 10:25-26, Rev 19:10, 22:8-9).

VI. The NT presents Jesus as having the attributes of God:
eternal existence - Jn 1:1, 2, 1 Jn 1:2, Rev 1:8, 22:13,
omnipresence - Mt 18:20, 28:20, Ac 18:10.
omniscience - Mt 9:4, Jn 2:24-25, 6:64, 21:17b, 16:30, Col 2:3,
omnipotence - Mt 28:18, Jn 3:35, 6:39b, 40b, 54b, 11:25, 13:3, Php 3:21, Col 1:17, 19, 2:9, Heb 1:3, 10-12, Rev 1:8, 21:5 (Da 7:14),
immutability - Heb 1:10-12, 13:8,
providence - Lk 10:22, Jn 3:35, 17:2, Eph 1:22, Col 1:17, Heb 1:3,
forgiveness of sin - Mk 2:7-11, Ac 5:31, Col 3:13,
judges sin - Mt 25:31-32, Jn 5:22, 27, Ac 10:42, 17:31, Ro 2:16, 14:10, 2 Co 5:10, 2 Tim 4:1,
gives eternal life - Jn 5:21, 6:54, 57, 11:25-26 1 Co 15:45,
source of eternal life - Jn 1:4, 5:26, 14:6, Ac 3:15, 1 Jn 1:1-2, 5:11-12, 20, Rev 1:18.

Confession that "Jesus is Lord" means to acknowledge that Jesus is a person to be invoked, trusted, known, praised and adored as God the Father is (Jn 5:23); i.e., as divine.

The NT witnesses throughout that Jesus is God.

Simply put Yahusha is the one and only Yah Elohim!

 

[SeventhDay]

Chalcedonian Creed (451 A.D)

We, then, following the holy Fathers, all with one consent, teach men to confess one and the same Son, our Lord Jesus Christ, the same perfect in Godhead and also perfect in manhood; truly God and truly man, of a reasonable [rational] soul and body; consubstantial [co-essential] with the Father according to the Godhead, and consubstantial with us according to the Manhood; in all things like unto us, without sin; begotten before all ages of the Father according to the Godhead, and in these latter days, for us and for our salvation, born of the Virgin Mary, the Mother of God, according to the Manhood; one and the same Christ, Son, Lord, only begotten, to be acknowledged in two natures, inconfusedly, unchangeably, indivisibly, inseparably; the distinction of natures being by no means taken away by the union, but rather the property of each nature being preserved, and concurring in one Person and one Subsistence, not parted or divided into two persons, but one and the same Son, and only begotten, God the Word, the Lord Jesus Christ; as the prophets from the beginning [have declared] concerning Him, and the Lord Jesus Christ Himself has taught us, and the Creed of the holy Fathers has handed down to us.

Jesus was not a God-man and scriptures do not teach it.

Jesus did not have two natures and scriptures do not teach it.

Jesus had the role of a human servant as the Son of God but Jesus is more than just the son of man and Son of God but is also the Fathers and scriptures teach it.

Scriptures teach that God is one person or one Lord and that is Yahusha who we worship. We do not worship three but worship one Lord God!

 

[SeventhDay]

What I am about to say demands that one not rush to a conclusion after reading it.
For preconceived ideas and concepts are what usually causes a rushing to decide.

now.....

God setting forth The Son while He was functioning in His human nature (as demonstrating his ability to do so in the Incarnation)..

By having all creation being created specifically through Him?
Created while manifested Himself in the same manner as His soul functioned in the Incarnation?
Is what enabled God to create us all without interfering with our volition!

That is the key to the mystery as to how God could create us to have our volition without His omniscience interfering with our choices when deciding to create us.

God's desire towards all mankind was openly demonstrated by dying for even those whom would reject Him. 1 John 2:2

For when the Son initially created us in eternity past?
His desire for all was for all men and all angels to love and adore the Father like He does in his humanity.

Only after creating all mankind in the mind of God? Did He return to manifesting His own omniscience,
then to survey what our choices were to be.

In creating us in that way? God did not create anyone with the intention to send them to the Lake of Fire.


That is why its so important to realize that all things created were created THROUGH the Son!!!
For God the Son in the Incarnation had demonstrated that He has the ability to compartmentalize his function as Jesus did.

Jesus before going to the cross was not omniscient.
Nor omnipotent! But, though being God? Made Himself to be as a man in his ability! Philippians 2:6-8

For those who can see it?
The key to the mystery is right there!

​

Colossians 1:16-17​

​

For in him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, ​

whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things have been created through him ​

and for him. He is before all things, and in him all things hold together. ​

Not created through the Father.
Not created through the Holy Spirit.

All things created had to be created through Him, according to his nature of the humanity of Christ!!!

grace and peace....

There is one creator not two thus if Jesus is creator then he is God and God includes Father and Son in a unified relationship not as two persons but as one person. Jesus said to Philip if you have seen me you have seen the Father because he is the Father. He is titled "mighty God and everlasting Father and thus is the one Yah Elohim of the scriptures!

 

[Mr GLee]

There is one creator not two thus if Jesus is creator then he is God and God includes Father and Son in a unified relationship not as two persons but as one person. Jesus said to Philip if you have seen me you have seen the Father because he is the Father. He is titled "mighty God and everlasting Father and thus is the one Yah Elohim of the scriptures!

I would offer. .

There is one Spirit as the one Faithful Creator. the Holy Spirit of the Father. That Holy Spirit worked in the Son of man Jesus to reveal to the world the character and power of the Father. You could say of the son a shadow of his Holy Father a chip off the eternal old mans block. LOL

 

[Fred]

but Jesus is more than just the son of man and Son of God but is also the Fathers and scriptures teach it.

Jesus is not the Father (John 14:23).

 

[GeneZ]

Jesus is not the Father (John 14:23).

Jesus is all the Father that we as humans can know...

​

No man has ever seen God at any time; the only unique Son, or the only begotten God, ​

Who is in the bosom [in the intimate presence] of the Father, He has declared Him ​

[He has revealed Him and brought Him out where He can be seen; He has interpreted ​

Him and He has made Him known]. John 1:18 Amplified Bible, Classic Edition​

The transcendental nature/essence of God is foreign to human thinking.

So, to make Himself knowable to us on our terms?
God utilizes His humanity of Christ (who is also God) to be the perfect interpreter of who and what the Father is
in accordance to our way of human understanding.

Note!​

​

[He has revealed Him and brought Him out where He can be seen; ​

He has interpreted Him and He has made Him known]. ​

​

​

That is why we see Jesus saying...

If you really know me, you will know my Father as well. ​

From now on, you do know him and have seen him.”​

​

Philip said, “Lord, show us the Father and that will be enough for us.”​

​

Jesus answered: “Don’t you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? ​

Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? John 14:7-9​

grace and peace ................