Arch Stanton
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but there are so many definitions of sola scriptura... is it bible alone? bible is the final authority? etc.
Scripture is the only authority?
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What is the correct one? What do you think it is? It matters not that there are many unless you give the many. Maybe somewhere in there we could find the correct one. However, this thread has given the true meaning over and over and over. I have seen no other but the correct one given, no many different ones. And still you and @donadams stand claiming confusion and arguing from your false definition. Why is that necessary? That is the question you should ask yourselves.
Josheb
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She's correct, @donadams. Sola scriptura does not teach what you say it teaches and the best way for you to prove otherwise is to define the term and show us it's correctly understood.
Arch Stanton
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sola = alone
scripture = bible
the problem is that there are many [protestant] variations
Josheb
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No, there aren't. There are a lot of mistaken understandings but not so many definitions.
That is part of it, but not the whole of it and it is the portion @donadams has left out that matter.
If you do not know then you have no business criticizing it. Likewise, if don does not know then don has no business criticizing it. If I, or @Ariel, or Fred, or Ethel, Ricky, or Lucy did not correctly understand something then we disqualify ourselves from criticizing it. In don's case, that sort of thing happens a lot. As a Catholic, the inclination to support don is understandable, but as a Christian that cannot occur at the expense of the truth and in this instance don has not posted a correct definition of sola scriptura, doesn't appear to know the correct definition, and is proving unwilling to find out or collaborate with his own betterment. You, @Arch Stanton, can side with us asking don to provide a correct definition (or learn one) and still support your RC brother. On this occasion the two are not mutually exclusive conditions. You could even still disagree with the doctrine and want don to 1) understand it correctly, 2) cease posting straw men, and 3) discuss the correct definition. None of that is necessarily precluded for a Catholic (or any other Christian). Don't be so quick to throw your support behind don on this occasion.
Arch Stanton
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and yet we hear it
ok.. and the rest?
again, multiple definitions... what say you Josheb?
what truth Josheb?
Josheb
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No. That is incorrect. That is incorrect because it is incomplete.
If I pointed to the pickup truck in my driveway and said, "That's an automobile," but the truth is that chassis has no engine in it then I would be abusing the term "automobile" because that word means self-mobilizing. Sola Scriptura is a very specific doctrine that is fairly limited in definition and application. It does not mean scripture is the only authority. Nor does it mean scripture is the only authority for everything. Those are incorrect definitions. Furthermore, no Protestant believes scripture is the only authority and when asked to prove his claim to the contrary @donadams has been silent.
You should not be supporting him, except to provide an accurate definition.
Arch Stanton
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How is it incorrect when I stated this part as well...
Is the bible the only truth?
Is the bible the final authority?
Is the bible just profitable and not sufficient?
Josheb
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Shifting onus is a logical fallacy and I will not be a part of that subterfuge. You go and ask don to provide the correct definition, or at least what he understands the doctrine to assert, and yo do that until he other does so or he proves unwilling or incapable. It's his op, not mine.
A correct definition. There is no truth in straw men. The RCC does not teach Christians to argue fallaciously, and neither does God. You do not have to agree with the correct definition, but you do have to have a correct definition to criticize something reasonably, rationally, and scripturally. Jesus never invented stuff and then ragged on his own inventions.
Don can't do it, either. Neither can you, or I.
Josheb
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If you do not know the answers to those questions, then you should pull up a chair and lurk.
Arch Stanton
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so you don't want to clear up any confusion... got it
Arch Stanton
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pa leeeezzzzze.... I have been on protestant boards for over 25 years
I have heard of a church of Christ. Christ the invisible head or husband . but have not heard of a Church of apostles sent messengers, mailmen (speedy delivery ) can't trust fake meaning of the apostle' It cause much confusion and wonderment taking away Christ's eternal Spirit of peace . .
Highly venerable puffed up ones" As if they were the invisible head as our Holy Father in the end making the true one unseen Holy Father without effect in exchange for a legion of idol images (3500) and rising.
Catholiscim dark place in need of turning up the light as a lamp unto our feet and light to the path. Preach the gospel
Study the use of the Greek word apostles (messenger) and Hebrew word shaliach ( messenger) .used 283 times throughout . 175 in the new . It can help the understanding of our differences in opinions as private interpretation. iron does sharpen his two edged sword. . . cuts off in two ways. . .the power of life and death
Makes me wonder ?????out of all the words the bible why chose not to use the defined word in English Apostle sent messenger. The English word messenger should of been used all 283times.
If a person is married to a mail person then the message and the messenger can be the same as long as they keep the mail at home .the apostles are not the source of the message.
Apostle not a sacred secrets word as venerable ones .
My wife sends out her little apostle Mr. G Lee with a written message as a law not to add to or take away from (sola scriptura) the list on a mission to the super market her little apostles Mr GLee returns checks of the list twice and receives gold star and two peanut butter cookies . LOL mission to will and to do accomplished Beam. . .me up Lord .
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Name three. I will be waiting.
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As @Josheb said, incomplete.
Only truth about what?
Final authority of what?
Profitable for what?
Sufficient for what?
You are taking partial definitions and calling it many definitions.
Arch Stanton
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post 48
Arch Stanton
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What does sola scriptura mean that scripture is alone for? Sola scriptura is Latin for "by scripture alone."
“The whole counsel of God, concerning all things necessary for his own glory, man’s salvation, faith, and life, is either expressly set down in scripture, or by good and necessary consequence may be deduced from scripture: unto which nothing at any time is to be added, whether by new revelations of the Spirit, or traditions of men.” —Westminster Confession of Faith
It means that Scripture alone is authoritative for the faith and practice of the Christian.
There you and @donadams have no more excuse for using straw man arguments.
The Catholic church claims that authority, and the authority of only itself as the interpreter of Scripture. It adds to, takes away, includes traditions of men, according to their own interpretations, that are blatantly, provably false, right and left. They declare themselves the one true church of Christ, deny the sufficiency of Christ, add their traditions as necessary for salvation, due to His insufficiency.
I have ask many times on here for a definitionYou're dodging the question. I did not ask for a definition as scripture sees it. I asked for a definition as you see it. Can you post a definition of sola scriptura in your own words? Will you do so without further delay, digression or obfuscation?
You have also contradicted yourself operationally because you've used scripture and scripture alone as an authority. Your own posts demonstrate sola scriptura (albeit a misguided version).
Illogical sentence. Repost it so it makes sense.
ROTFLMBO!
No, what you do is misrepresent the doctrine and then argue against the misrepresentation. So far the entire thread is a straw man and NOTHING more.
And I am trying to help you. I'm trying to help you see some of the mistakes you've made, beginning with your understanding you've misunderstood the definition of sola scriptura. So, will you please post a definition - using your own words - defining what you understand sola scriptura to assert?
Scripture yes
Scripture alone no
Sola scriptura what’s it mean?
I would hope it says what it means and means what it says!
Sola = alone nothing added
Scripture = well for our purposes the Protestant canon 66 books with missing chapters
Sacred scripture is the only source of truth and Christian faith
What’s your understanding?
contradicted yourself operationallyYou're dodging the question. I did not ask for a definition as scripture sees it. I asked for a definition as you see it. Can you post a definition of sola scriptura in your own words? Will you do so without further delay, digression or obfuscation?
You have also contradicted yourself operationally because you've used scripture and scripture alone as an authority. Your own posts demonstrate sola scriptura (albeit a misguided version).
Illogical sentence. Repost it so it makes sense.
ROTFLMBO!
No, what you do is misrepresent the doctrine and then argue against the misrepresentation. So far the entire thread is a straw man and NOTHING more.
And I am trying to help you. I'm trying to help you see some of the mistakes you've made, beginning with your understanding you've misunderstood the definition of sola scriptura. So, will you please post a definition - using your own words - defining what you understand sola scriptura to assert?
Is it impossible to accept scripture and reject “scripture alone”?
