Rome's tactics.

[Mr GLee]

No, Christ's Catholic Church was/is not a denomination. If you have read the ECF's, you would know they are Catholic.

Really?The kingdom of God comes by observing the temporal dying things seen. Where did get that kind idea from?

Is there a division between the Roman Catholic sect and the Eastern Orthodox sect??? ?The Bible Gods living words infallibly informs us there must be division as denomination

1 Corinthians 11:17-19King James Version Now in this that I declare unto you I praise you not, that ye come together not for the better, but for the worse.18 For first of all, when ye come together in the church, I hear that there be divisions among you; and I partly believe it.For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you.

Luke 17:20 And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation: (the temporal dying)

Matthew 23:3All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.

Sounds like those kind of brothers who serve lying sings to wonder after doctrine.(Satan the king of lying signs to wonder after? )

Reminds me of what some call "patron saints"workers of familiarity , , , .unheard doctrine according to sola scriptura the living, abiding word that works in believers or trust The words of men(I heard it through the dying fathers' grapevine of unseen God as it is written sola scriptura

Our unseen Holy Father, the unseen head of the churches

I will offer a few verses to observe and study to understand the difference from heaven or earthy inspired of dying mankind???

Mark 11:30-32 King James Version30 The baptism of John, was it from heaven, or of men? answer me.And they reasoned with themselves, saying, If we shall say, From heaven; he will say, Why then did ye not believe him? But if we shall say, Of men; they feared the people: for all men counted John, that he was a prophet indeed.

John 4:48 Then said Jesus unto him, Except ye see signs and wonders, ye will not believe.

Does that represent His kingdom comes by observation looking at things?They avoided the warning in vere above made a mockery of him below

Making Jesus into s circus seal. . . work a miracle perform some trick the when we see it we with our own eyes Then Maybe we will believe

John 6:30 They said therefore unto him, What sign shewest thou then, that we may see, and believe thee? what dost thou work?

God is not tempted by dying mankind at all .

 

[Mr GLee]

One Church, One Faith! Peter had the keys and gave them to the next in line [Linus].

THe faith of our brother in the Lord Peter the denier.??? . And not the powerful faith of Christ, the Faithful Creator?

Powerfully declaring "let there be" . . . . .and the "testimony was God alone good."

I think God as our heavenly Holy Father has more power than Peter, our brother in the Lord.

 

[Arch Stanton]

Really?

Yes, 100%

Is there a division between the Roman Catholic sect and the Eastern Orthodox sect?

schism

 

[Arch Stanton]

I think God as our heavenly Holy Father has more power than Peter, our brother in the Lord.

Quite Catholic of you!

 

[Mr GLee]

Quite Catholic of you!

LOL in which way? Sharing the love like that of our brother in the Lord, Peter ?????

 

[Arch Stanton]

LOL in which way?

knowing that God is first and Peter is not.....

 

[Bob Carabbio]

PSST! We aren't a denomination.

Chuckle!!! Only in your own mind!!! Roman Catholicism is as DENOMINATIONAL as it gets. Right now you appear to be fragmenting into several Denominations, at least until you get your "Pope Crisis" sorted out.

 

[Arial]

The only evidence for a church in the first few centuries is the Catholic Church.... no Methodists, Baptists, Anglicans, Lutherans, Non-d, etc.

One Church, One Faith! Peter had the keys and gave them to the next in line [Linus].

That is not what the keys were and there is no next in line. And the first century church was not the Catholic church but catholic---universal, not just Rome. There were churches (congregations of believers) scattered all over. That refers to all places, unity of sorterology, the doctrines of God, salvation by grace through faith in Jesus alone. And then came the RCC which set itself up as the one true system and attainment to salvation, which itself is in violation of the scriptural foundation laid by the twelve apostles and Paul, with Jesus as the cornerstone. It is because of the RCC that other denominations arose and because of its anti-biblical teaching, But even in the NT we see factions trying to infiltrate and tear apart the clear teaching of the apostles. They were constantly dealing with it. Judaizers, Gnostics, pagan infiltration. So this dividing has always been going on whether they were called denominations or not.

You are simply way off base and blinded by traditions and doctrines of men so that you cannot stop repeating these traditions and doctrines of men as though that settled the issue. Can you even see the blind spot?

 

[Arch Stanton]

Chuckle!!! Only in your own mind!!!

and Christ's one true Catholic Church.

 

[Arch Stanton]

That is not what the keys were

You don't get to decide what the keys were 2,000 years after the fact.

and there is no next in line.

Linus

And the first century church was not the Catholic church but catholic---universal, not just Rome

Correct, Antioch, Jerusalem, Smyrna, etc.

There were churches (congregations of believers) scattered all over.

Under the leadership of Peter and then his successor.

You are simply way off base and blinded by traditions and doctrines of men

that would be you and the movement starting in the sixteenth century

Can you even see the blind spot?

Yes, that is why we are here trying to help you take the scales from your eyes.

 

[Arial]

I've always believed that 'church' neither saves or condemns a person. If a Catholic believes in Jesus' virgin birth, life, miracles, crucifixion, burial, resurrection, and ascension - they are saved. I know a lot of Catholics as I play in a band where most of them are Catholic. The Catholics I know are as Christian as any Protestant/Evangelical I know.

I too believe there are saved people in the Catholic church---and of course it is dependant upon God----but a lot of Catholics are not fully aware of what their religion teaches or how it compares to what the Bible says on the same subject. They are taught that it is the Catholic church alone who is anointed by God to interpret scripture and therefore whatever they say it means is what it means. And there are no doubt as many of them as there are Protestant Christians who do not spend time studying the Bible, not just reading it, but studying it.

The doctrinal teaching of the Catholic church makes the life, death, resurrection, and ascension of Christ insufficient. It teaches that though Jesus made salvation possible, it is only acquired through the administration of a Catholic priest, membership in the Catholic church, and the intercession of Mary for us with Jesus, and then Jesus mediating with the Father. It teaches that the Catholic church alone administers grace and forgives sins through their priests.

 

[Arial]

You don't get to decide what the keys were 2,000 years after the fact.

But you do? It is the Bible that tells us what the keys are and I do not have time right now to show you. Which would be a waste of time since already you believe one thing. That only the Pope gets to decide what it means and you believe in the authority of the RCC rather than the authority of scripture. Nor do you believe in sola scriptura or faith alone.

Linus

Who declared him next in line? Show me the evidence.

Correct, Antioch, Jerusalem, Smyrna, etc.

And those were churches made up of believers.

Under the leadership of Peter and then his successor.

They were not all under the leadership of Peter. The church in Rome had likely not even been founded by one of the apostles. And there is no evidence that Peter was ever outside of Israel.

that would be you and the movement starting in the sixteenth century

False. The breaking away from the RCC was ongoing, had dissenters, long before that. The RCC even made punishment of death to translate the Bible into common languages so that people could read it for themselves. Why do you suppose they did that. It was those within the RCC who actually had access to the Scriptures who read it and began to say "Wait a minute here! What we are teaching and doing is anti-biblical. The opposite of blindly following the traditions and doctrines of men. As for me---sure I read the writings of Reformed, but I do not blindly follow it for I have not had my brain washed to do so. I check against His word.

Yes, that is why we are here trying to help you take the scales from your eyes.

I have no scales on my eyes. I have not been taught the traditions and doctrines of men in a way that blinds me. SO let me reword the question. Can you even see your blind spot?

 

[Arch Stanton]

But you do?

No, His Church

It is the Bible that tells us what the keys are and I do not have time right now to show you.

Whatever you find, will be attached to Peter in Mt. 16.... great place to start.

Which would be a waste of time since already you believe one thing.

I believe His Church.... otherwise we flounder with millions of personal, fallible interpretations leading to separate ecclesial communities.

That only the Pope gets to decide what it means

The magisterium is made up of more than one.

and you believe in the authority of the RCC rather than the authority of scripture.

1 Tim 3:15 But if I should be delayed, you should know how to behave in the household of God, which is THE CHURCH of the living God, the PILLAR AND FOUNDATION OF [THE] TRUTH

Eph 3:10 so that the manifold WISDOM of God might now be made known THROUGH the CHURCH to the principalities and authorities in the heavens.

Nor do you believe in sola scriptura or faith alone.

not scriptural [see a fellow Catholic's thousand posts to you regarding this] @donadams

Who declared him next in line? Show me the evidence.

The NT... Peter was the undisputed leader, given the keys of authority by Christ Himself!

And those were churches made up of believers.

all part of the one universal Catholic Church established by Christ

They were not all under the leadership of Peter.

Acts 9:31-32 The CHURCH THROUGHOUT all Judea, Galilee, and Samaria was at peace. It was being built up and walked in the fear of the Lord, and with the consolation of the holy Spirit it grew in numbers.

As PETER was passing THROUGH EVERY REGION, he went down to the holy ones living in Lydda.

The church in Rome had likely not even been founded by one of the apostles.

Founded by Peter and Paul...

And there is no evidence that Peter was ever outside of Israel.

Jerusalem to Antioch to Rome

False. The breaking away from the RCC was ongoing, had dissenters, long before that.

Yes, we were warned about dissent ....

Mt 7:15 “Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but underneath are ravenous wolves.

Eph 4:14 so that we may no longer be infants, tossed by waves and swept along by every wind of teaching arising from human trickery, from their cunning in the interests of deceitful scheming.

I have no scales on my eyes.

then you would be Catholic if you wanted to truly follow Christ and His Church

 

[Arial]

No, His Church

So we are back to that. Your circular reasoning. And that is the blind spot. You cannot hear the word "church" without identifying it automatically with the RCC no matter how many times and ways it is pointed out that there is no verification, no validation, no witness to that except that of the RCC itself.

 

[fastfredy0]

I've always believed that 'church' neither saves or condemns a person. If a Catholic believes in Jesus'
virgin birth, life, miracles, crucifixion, burial, resurrection, and ascension - they are saved.

So, what if one does not believe in one or more of your list:

• virgin birth
• life (not sure of the specifics on this one)
• miracles (does he have to believe in all X number of miracles; is one not saved if there is a particular miracle one does not believe or one doesn't believe Christ performed miracles ... do you have scripture to back this ascertain up)
• crucifixion (are there further particulars that one must believe?)
• burial (are there further particulars that one must believe?)
• resurrection
• ascension (are there further particulars that one must believe?)
• others you missed?

I've always believed that 'church' neither saves or condemns a person.

Agreed.
My post used the R.C. church's dogma as a definition of what a hypothetical person theological constution in order to ask if such a person was 'saved'.

 

[fastfredy0]

John 6:30 They said therefore unto him, What sign shewest thou then, that we may see, and believe thee? what dost thou work?

OK ... I'll bite ... why all the colors in your posts?

 

[Mr GLee]

OK ... I'll bite ... why all the colors in your posts?

Thanks
I've been thinking about stopping

Sorry for the confusion it is a practice I used on another board to emphasize a point . Satan would have us believe God is a man

Sort of like the red addition in some Bible which does not really distinguish between God and man. In that way the whole bible should be red.

Sort of like Black and White went out in the sixties replaced by Color new dimension . Like the Wizard of OZ a new world. Hear and See. Eyes and Ears

For instance to help distinguish between Jesus Christ the anointing Holy Spirit and Jesus the Son of man.

RED . . . . God ,the authority of God, faith or power of God,wisdom of God
GREEN. . . . .believers Son of man, Jesus ,all the sons of God born from above
BLACK (bold) . . . . .non converted faithless dying mankind . false prophecy wisdom of this world
PURPLE . . . . . Parable in sight or Satan
YELLOW. . . . unseen hidden glory of God

Matthew 26:63 But Jesus held his peace, And the high priest answered and said unto him, I adjure thee by the living God, that thou tell us whether thou be the Christ, the Son of God.

Son of God not almighty God the unseen Father

The first born again of many sons of God believers they are not God but are Sons. Christ the faithful the power of God

1 Peter 1;9-11 Receiving the end of your faith (not of our own self) even the salvation of your souls. Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you: Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.

Not suggesting it should be colorized again I was trying to make a point of some who did not distinguish God the Faithful Creator from God's work of creation. worshiping the dying things seen the temporal and not the eternal God not seen faith

I believe he would have mankind believe God is a Jewish man I would offer when the veil was rent there was no man in the Holy of Holies. God does not live in houses mde the the hnd as a wil of dying mankind

 

[Bob Carabbio]

I believe His Church.... otherwise we flounder with millions of personal, fallible interpretations leading to separate ecclesial communities.

So why is it that your "Holy Spirit Led One True Church" led by "Jesus Christ's vicar on earth" is floundering in confusion RIGHT NOW in the world???? The internal confusion among your Cardinals, and Bishops because of your "Pope thing" is on display for the world to see.

It would be infinitely better for you to do as the Bible instructs, and place your FAITH in the perfect SIN OFFERING of Jesus on the cross for the cleansing of your SIN. THEN as Christians, you can be indwelled by the Holy SPirit who is promised to lead you into truth.

 

[Mr GLee]

No, Christ's Catholic Church was/is not a denomination. If you have read the ECF's, you would know they are Catholic.

Did you search the scriptures or rather you searched the CCC the Catholic Bible of dying mankind that you must call devine sinners?

Sacred oral tradition of dying sinners sacred to who? The non venerable pew sitters? The big show watchers.

80 "Sacred Tradition and Sacred Scripture, then, are bound closely together, and communicate one with the other. For both of them, flowing out from the same "divine" well-spring come together in some fashion to form one thing, and move towards the same goal." Each of them makes present and fruitful in the Church the mystery of Christ, who promised to remain with his own "always, to the close of the age".

EFC.s or that call you must call "patron saints" They are dead. they no longer have any input in things under the Sun We have the one source of Christian faith the authority of God as it is writen "sola scriptura"

Ecclesiastes 9:5-7Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition5 For the living know that they shall die, but the dead know nothing more, neither have they a reward any more: for the memory of them is forgotten. Their love also, and their hatred, and their envy are all perished, neither have they any part in this world, and in the work that is done under the sun

Catholic alone practice necromancy seeking the dead for those still alive.Why seek the dead for the living?

Scripture as it is writen is the final authority in things of faith, the unseen things of the invisible head of the church, our Holy Father in heaven

He loving commands us to call no sinner on earth Holy Father. Holy See, Prince of the apostles ,Supreme Pontiff of the Universal Church and the beat goes on . Why all the titles for a sinner?

No such thing as non denominational. The Nazarene sect or the Way is the first one recorded on this side of the cross.(Acts 24)

1 Corinthians 11:19 For there must also be sects among you, that the approved may become manifest among you

Learn what is mean to walk by faith (the unseen things of God). Why seek the dead for the living? (necromancy) What is the hope in doing so Is there a award??

 

[Arch Stanton]

Did you search the scriptures

NT was written by Catholics.