Prove the Practice of Worshipping the Holy Spirit with the Father & the Son

[Fred]

The Father knows our hearts, Jesus knows our hearts, the Holy Spirit knows our hearts. To say only Jesus knows our hearts because that is His job is to remove the very character of God from the Father and the Holy Spirit. To say that only Jesus mediates between us and God and therefore the Holy Spirit does not intercede for us in prayer (even though the Bible says He does) is in essence to remove deity from the Holy Spirit.

Very well said.

 

[ReverendRV]

Back in 381 A.D., the Nicene Council modified the creed in 325 A.D. to add the testimony that the Holy Spirit is the Giver of Life and Lord while at the same time introducing the practice of worshipping the Holy Spirit with the Father & the Son.

What Is the Nicene Creed of 325 A.D. & 381 A.D.?

"And in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the Giver of Life; who proceedeth from the Father and the Son; who with the Father and the Son together is worshiped and glorified; "
Granted, it starts off in both creeds as crediting the Father for being the maker of the Heaven and the earth when Jesus is.

John 1:1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made...... 10 He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not. 11 He came unto his own, and his own received him not. 12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: 13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God. 14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

But in 381 A.D. they took away the glory of Jesus Christ being that bread of life that gives life to the world to the Holy Spirit.

John 6:30 They said therefore unto him, What sign shewest thou then, that we may see, and believe thee? what dost thou work? 31 Our fathers did eat manna in the desert; as it is written, He gave them bread from heaven to eat. 32 Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Moses gave you not that bread from heaven; but my Father giveth you the true bread from heaven. 33 For the bread of God is he which cometh down from heaven, and giveth life unto the world. 34 Then said they unto him, Lord, evermore give us this bread. 35 And Jesus said unto them, I am the bread of life: he that cometh to me shall never hunger; and he that believeth on me shall never thirst.
John 5:39 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me. 40 And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life.

There is no scripture for the practice of worshipping the Holy Spirit with the Father & the Son BUT there are scripture that limits how we are to honor the Father in worship and how we are to come to God the Father in worship as it is written by how the Father will judge us by that standard.

John 5:22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son: 23 That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him.
No wiggle room for honoring the Holy Spirit.

John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
John 10:1Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not by the door into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber.... 7 Then said Jesus unto them again, Verily, verily, I say unto you, I am the door of the sheep.
There is no reason to broaden the way in the worship place or in fellowship or in prayer in coming to God the Father by.

Yes, the Holy Spirit is God and One of the Three witnesses within the Godhead, but the Holy Spirit is sent to bear testimony of the Son thru us in roder to glorify the Son and we shall not be led by the indwelling Holy Spirit in any other way.

John 15:26 But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me: 27 And ye also shall bear witness, because ye have been with me from the beginning.

John 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come. 14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you. 15 All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

This is the mind of Christ Paul said for us to have in worship as he emphasizes this to be done in obedience in his absence.

Philippians 2:5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: 6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God: 7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men: 8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross. 9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name: 10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; 11 And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father. 12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. 13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.

Philippians 1:6 Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ: 7 Even as it is meet for me to think this of you all, because I have you in my heart; inasmuch as both in my bonds, and in the defence and confirmation of the gospel, ye all are partakers of my grace. 8 For God is my record, how greatly I long after you all in the bowels of Jesus Christ. 9 And this I pray, that your love may abound yet more and more in knowledge and in all judgment; 10 That ye may approve things that are excellent; that ye may be sincere and without offence till the day of Christ. 11 Being filled with the fruits of righteousness, which are by Jesus Christ, unto the glory and praise of God.

How important is this issue? You see all those movement of the "spirit" out there? By broadening the way in the worship place where even a few hymnals just about the Holy Spirit, can invite spirits of the antichrist to come in with their visitations of signs and lying wonders to seduce and lead others astray in chasing after them to receive again for a sign.

So narrow the way back to the straight gate or risk being left behind. Look at the iniquity for why He did not know them; by the direction they took in going to God the Father be it by the Holy Spirit or the broad way of the blessed "Trinity" which is the same as going around the narrow way of the Son.

Luke 13:24 Strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, I say unto you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. 25 When once the master of the house is risen up, and hath shut to the door, and ye begin to stand without, and to knock at the door, saying, Lord, Lord, open unto us; and he shall answer and say unto you, I know you not whence ye are: 26 Then shall ye begin to say, We have eaten and drunk in thy presence, and thou hast taught in our streets. 27 But he shall say, I tell you, I know you not whence ye are; depart from me, all ye workers of iniquity. 28 There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, and all the prophets, in the kingdom of God, and you yourselves thrust out. 29 And they shall come from the east, and from the west, and from the north, and from the south, and shall sit down in the kingdom of God. 30 And, behold, there are last which shall be first, and there are first which shall be last.

We're to prove to ourselves, and to Saint James; that we Worship the Holy Spirit along with the Father and the Son. Proving this, is Proven when Saint James and our Consciences approve of us. When our Conscience and Saint James approves of us, more than the fact that we Worship the Spirit is Proven; everything the Bible says about the Christian and Christianity is also proven. It's also Proven that we're Indwelt by the Holy Spirit...

Scrutinizing a Creed correctly, doesn't prove that we Worship the Holy Spirit...

 

[ChristB4us]

Try answering my question this time:

Does the Father answer prayer?

No. The Father gives permission or an agreement to the Son for the Son to answer that prayer for why thanks are given to the Father in Jesus's name for how the Father is glorified for His Son answering that prayer. Where do I get that from in scripture?

John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me...... 13 And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son. 14 If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it.

1 Thessalonians 5:17 Pray without ceasing. 18 In every thing give thanks: for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus concerning you.

Ephesians 5:20Giving thanks always for all things unto God and the Father in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ;

Colossians 1:3We give thanks to God and the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, praying always for you,

Colossians 1:12Giving thanks unto the Father, which hath made us meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light:

Colossians 3:17And whatsoever ye do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God and the Father by him.

 

[ChristB4us]

So the Holy Spirit knows when we are grieving Him, but He doesn't know are our hearts?

Since Jesus is the One that searches our hearts for why He is the Only Mediator between God and men, why should the Holy Spirit be doing the same job?

As far as I can see, it is because we are in the infirmity of our flesh is why the Holy Spirit is grieved and makes silent intercessions for us with groanings He cannot utter. <---- You really have to wonder why they put that in there unless it is when we grieve the Holy Spirit for when He makes intercessions for us and yet He cannot give them to the Father directly Himself for why the Son has to know the mind of the Spirit to do this for the Spirit.

This is ludicrous beyond explanation.

I leave it to God to cause the increase.

As it is, it does appear you are subverted to what you have been taught & going far & wide for inferences in the scripture to support it without acknowledging how the plainness of scripture narrows that way and honor to the Son for coming to & honoring the Father by.

So we agree to disagree.

 

[ChristB4us]

You make distinctions where you shouldn't because there are none, and fail to make distinctions where there are distinctions. I am not sure why this happens for in many respects your knowledge of the word is good, and the meanings found. Then in other places it seems to go a bit haywire.

You have to prove that by showing it by rightly dividing the word of truth since scripture cannot go against scripture.

From my observation is seems to be in places where the focus is so much directed toward specific things that are really not against the gospel but also not the gospel, (they are pariffial or a different subject,)and begin to make things pertain to that focus that in no way pertain to it. Such as KJV and speaking in tongues. And what you address in this post concerning the jobs of each person of the Trinity. What you say does not produce a unity of Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, but completely separates them from one another. As though they are not allowed to overstep certain boundaries, and to have them doing so is iyo antichrist.

The native American Indians dance & chant for the Great Spirit to come. When alcohol was introduced to them, they said when getting drunk, that it was very much like communing with the Great Spirit.

From the Azusa Street Revival where they had placed an emphasis on the baptism with the Holy Ghost with evidence of tongues, they were committing spiritual adultery for doing that. That is considered as climbing up another way for sinners to be saved by.

Matthew 12:38 Then certain of the scribes and of the Pharisees answered, saying, Master, we would see a sign from thee. 39 But he answered and said unto them, An evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given to it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas: 40 For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.

Yet at that Azusa Street Revival was that being drunk in the spirit phenomenon, much like the American Indians were subjected to.

Becoming drunk in the Holy Spirit?

"This same manifestation showed up at the Azusa Street revival that took place in 1906 in Los Angeles, where there was a powerful outpouring of the Holy Spirit, that paved the way for the Pentecostal and charismatic movements we have today.

After the revival started, the Azusa Street Mission began publishing a newspaper called The Apostolic Faith, which contained testimonies, and teachings from the revival.

In its January 1907 edition, Myrtle Shideler shared how she was so overcome by the Holy Spirit, that she was drunk:

“By the time the chorus ended, the power of God was so heavy upon me. I could scarcely open my mouth, and every fibre of my being was trembling. Yet my feet felt glued to the floor and my knees stiff, so I could not sit down. I only got out a few broken sentences that I remember. (I never fainted in my life and was never unconscious, but God certainly took me out of myself.) He showed me things which there are not words enough in the English language to express. . . . I was under the power the remainder of the meeting, and for three days was as one drunken. . . . Since then, such waves of power roll over me from time to time. I can scarcely keep my feet, and I am sure if my old friends in California could see me, they would think I was indeed insane.“

During the 1990s Toronto Blessing, I witnessed many unusual Holy Spirit manifestations, including one person becoming drunk in the Spirit.

I would argue, probably more than ever, that we need another outpouring of the Holy Spirit today." End of quote from the link.

Now that article was written to be in favor of that phenomenon and so how you reprove someone like that? How can you get them away from focusing on the Holy Spirit thus allowing the spirit of the antichrist to come in again?

How can God calls sinners that are native Americans away from those spirits unless the way is really narrow and that is by coming to the Son?

How can God keep saved believers from going after that which is not after Christ unless they are to keep striving to come to the Son?

The Father knows our hearts, Jesus knows our hearts, the Holy Spirit knows our hearts. To say only Jesus knows our hearts because that is His job is to remove the very character of God from the Father and the Holy Spirit. To say that only Jesus mediates between us and God and therefore the Holy Spirit does not intercede for us in prayer (even though the Bible says He does) is in essence to remove deity from the Holy Spirit. You have them all working separately instead of in unity. The Holy Spirit did not do the work of redemption. Only Jesus did. But that does not remove the Holy Spirit from being an equal participant in redemption with the Father and the Son. They are One. The Father knows our mind and heart, the Holy Spirit knows the Father's mind and intercedes for us accordingly.

And if the Holy Spirit does not know our hearts and is grieved by what He sometimes finds there, them you presume that we have no hidden sins, concealed often even from ourselves (i.e.) speaking kind words towards another while having hatred for them in their heart. Would that grieve the Holy Spirit? It presumes that it is only our outward visible sins that grieve Him.

The real indwelling holy Spirit & scripture points to the Son in testifying of the Son in seeking the glory of the Son and by him, the glory of God the Father. There is no other way God can be glorified by.

John 13:31 Therefore, when he was gone out, Jesus said, Now is the Son of man glorified, and God is glorified in him. 32 If God be glorified in him, God shall also glorify him in himself, and shall straightway glorify him.

So should we be led by the Holy Spirit to do what the Holy Spirit has been sent to do not only in outward ministry but in worship as well?

John 15:26 But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me: 27 And ye also shall bear witness, because ye have been with me from the beginning.

John 16:14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

What does the spirits of the antichrist do but to lead believers away from the Son as in "instead of Christ". How can anyone think the indwelling Holy Spirit would be offended when He is leading us to honor the Son by tetsifying of the Son to glorify the Son & by Him, God the Father?

Those who pray to, honor, worship, testify of the Holy Spirit to seek the glory of the Holy Spirit in worship or in any of those movements of the Spirit are NOT being led by the Holy Spirit to do that.

 

[ChristB4us]

We're to prove to ourselves, and to Saint James; that we Worship the Holy Spirit along with the Father and the Son. Proving this, is Proven when Saint James and our Consciences approve of us. When our Conscience and Saint James approves of us, more than the fact that we Worship the Spirit is Proven; everything the Bible says about the Christian and Christianity is also proven. It's also Proven that we're Indwelt by the Holy Spirit...

Scrutinizing a Creed correctly, doesn't prove that we Worship the Holy Spirit...

I know nothing of proving to St. James. We need the help of the Lord Jesus Christ's to prove all things by His words as kept n the KJV.

1 Thessalonians 5:21 Prove all things; hold fast that which is good. 22 Abstain from all appearance of evil. 23 And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. 24 Faithful is he that calleth you, who also will do it.

Scrutinizing the Nicene creed by Him & His words is for proving it is not Biblical for any one to say.

In both creeds, they credit the Father as the Maker of the Heaven and the earth and that is not true.

John 1:1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.....

10 He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not. 11 He came unto his own, and his own received him not.

14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

And since that is not the Truth, how is it that no one is seeing the other lies in that modified Nicene creed of 381 A.D.?

Indeed, if a congregation wants to avoid the spirits of the antichrist and that offense to God the Father by climbing up another way, a broad way, they should strive to enter thru that straight gate, the Lord Jesus Christ in coming to God the father in worship, prayer, & fellowship.

Luke 13:24 Strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, I say unto you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. 25 When once the master of the house is risen up, and hath shut to the door, and ye begin to stand without, and to knock at the door, saying, Lord, Lord, open unto us; and he shall answer and say unto you, I know you not whence ye are: 26 Then shall ye begin to say, We have eaten and drunk in thy presence, and thou hast taught in our streets. 27 But he shall say, I tell you, I know you not whence ye are; depart from me, all ye workers of iniquity. 28 There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, and all the prophets, in the kingdom of God, and you yourselves thrust out. 29 And they shall come from the east, and from the west, and from the north, and from the south, and shall sit down in the kingdom of God. 30 And, behold, there are last which shall be first, and there are first which shall be last.

 

[Keiw1]

And


Who do we call upon to save us? The Lord Jesus Christ.

Romans 10:8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach; 9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. 10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. 11 For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed. 12 For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him. 13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Who do we have to go to when we sin?

1 John 2:1My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous: 2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

1 John 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

Who do we go to, to get help to not sin?

Hebrews 4:12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. 13 Neither is there any creature that is not manifest in his sight: but all things are naked and opened unto the eyes of him with whom we have to do. 14 Seeing then that we have a great high priest, that is passed into the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our profession. 15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin. 16 Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need.

Who is the Mediator that answers prayers when the Father gives permission?

1 Timothy 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me...... 13 And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son. 14 If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it.

Your altered bible version has you mislead--Joel 2:21-22--All who call on the name of YHWH(Jehovah) will be saved. Quoted 2 x in NT-Acts 2:21( verse 16 proves it Joels quote) and Romans 10:13--- But since your bible has Gods name removed by satans will, you have LORD at Joel, thus Lord in both spots of NT, But YHWH(Jehovah) belongs at all 3 spots. Every spot in OT where-GOD or LORD all capitols is YHWH(Jehovah) belongs by Gods will. Wicked men removed the name, they had no right, satans will wanted it removed and replaced with titles. All keeping Gods name out of his bible are supporting satans will over Gods will--to mislead.

 

[Keiw1]

Since you are a Jehovah's Witness then you should know this:

The Watchtower: Jesus did not expect his followers to adhere rigidly to the wording of the model prayer. (Treasure Your Privilege of Prayer, Study Article 31, July 2022, page 21-22)
https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/2022486

That meant, don't just say a written prayer, but pray out of the heart in accordance to that model prayer, but always to the Father.

 

[Arial]

John 5:31 If I bear witness of myself, my witness is not true.

John 7:18 He that speaketh of himself seeketh his own glory: but he that seeketh his glory that sent him, the same is true, and no unrighteousness is in him.

John 8:17 It is also written in your law, that the testimony of two men is true.

Now combine the elements of what makes a false witness from a true witness and e see this happen at Jesus's water baptism.

Matthew 3:15 And Jesus answering said unto him, Suffer it to be so now: for thus it becometh us to fulfil all righteousness. Then he suffered him. 16 And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him: 17 And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.

They are witnesses that Jesus as Son of man is the promised Messiah, Son of God. What has that to do with the subject of the intercession of the Holy Spirit? Here's the thing. All mediation is intercession but not all intersession is mediation.

I understand your point here but what I had shared does not refute nor take away from that truth that the Son did have His own will to pray like that in the Garden of Gethsemane but He did and still does the will of the Father.

Of course! In His incarnation He had a human will. But this is what you said: "This does not speak against the Triune God but how they are each a separate person as a separate witness within the Godhead as it is also specified that it is the Father's will to be done and not the Son's will nor the will of the Holy Spirit." The two things you mention here---each separate person as a separate witness within the Godhead and not the Son's will nor the will of the Holy Spirit----have no connection with one another. You have, maybe only through the clumsy wording, but still have separated the Trinity into separate wills, not a unity of will. And witness of what? The scriptures you gave when I asked you what you meant by witness were speaking of the witness of the Father and the Holy Spirit bearing witness that Jesus, Son of man, was the promised Messiah, Son of God.

Jesus in His prayer in the Garden of Gethsemane did ask the Father for the cup of His coming crucifixion to be assed from Him but nevertheless His will to be done and not His own.

Matthew 26:39 And he went a little farther, and fell on his face, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless not as I will, but as thou wilt.

Make a distinction! Or do you not believe that Jesus was fully man and fully God, the two natures not mingling? You have to realize when Jesus says things, feels things, does things from which perspective it is coming from. Would you not desire that God remove the cup Jesus was about to drink if God was sending you to the cross? Even if you knew why and also knew that was why you came? Read John 17. Wouldn't your humanity cry out against it? Jesus was going to suffer and suffer beyond our imagination, even to the point of facing for us what we will never have to face as His children, the wrath of God, forsaken by God. And that is what is was to Jesus even though He knew what would happen after He endured that. Not forsaken by God but glorified by Him.

 

[Fred]

No. The Father gives permission or an agreement to the Son for the Son to answer that prayer

That doesn't rule out that the Father answers prayer.

John 15:16
so that whatever you ask of the Father in My name He may give to you.

James 1:5
But if any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask of God, who gives to all generously and without reproach, and it will be given to him.

I don't know where you are getting your doctrine from but it certainly doesn't accord with what the Bible teaches.

 

[Fred]

That meant, don't just say a written prayer, but pray out of the heart in accordance to that model prayer, but always to the Father.

Watch Tower Reprints: Although our Lord taught us to worship the Father in spirit and in truth, and again to pray, "Our Father which art in heaven," and although the Apostle said, "I bow my knees to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ," (Eph. 3:14), nevertheless the general sentiment of Scripture seems to imply that there will be nothing wrong in our addressing a petition to our Lord Jesus direct if any so desire at any time. As the head of the body it is but the appropriate thing that, as every member of the natural body makes known its desires, its petitions, to its own head, so the Church, the body of Christ, should be permitted to address him, and thus we read in our lesson that the apostles worshiped the ascended Jesus--they recognized his greatness and dignity and honor as the Messiah, the Son of the living God, the Redeemer of the world, who in due time shall come and receive his faithful to himself and establish his Kingdom for the blessing of the world. The Lord's own words are appropriate here: he says, "That all men should honor the Son even as they honor the Father."--John 5:23. ("This Same Jesus Shall So Come", December 15, 1906, Vol. 17, No. 24, page 3911)

 

[Eleanor]

And it didn't prove what you asserted.

This what you posted:
And God is the Father.
The Holy Spirit is God.
Thus, the Holy Spirit is the Father.


That fails to take into account the distinction of Persons of the Trinity, so therefore what you wrote about what I allegedly believe is in error.

The above is an analogous syllogism of your syllogism following, which fails to distinguish between the persons in the Trinity:

"And God is to be worshiped.
The Holy Spirit is God.
Thus, the Holy Spirit is to be worshiped."

Let God = A
Let the Holy Spirit = B
Let Father and worship = C

Your syllogism would be:
A = C
B = A
Therefore, B = C

My analogy of your syllogism would be:
A = C
B = A
Therefore, B = C

My (il)logic is the same as yours, demonstrating that your conclusion is not true just the same as mine is not true.

 

[Fred]

That is an analogy using the form of your illogic.

Which once again doesn't prove your assertion.

Keept trying.

 

[Keiw1]

Watch Tower Reprints: Although our Lord taught us to worship the Father in spirit and in truth, and again to pray, "Our Father which art in heaven," and although the Apostle said, "I bow my knees to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ," (Eph. 3:14), nevertheless the general sentiment of Scripture seems to imply that there will be nothing wrong in our addressing a petition to our Lord Jesus direct if any so desire at any time. As the head of the body it is but the appropriate thing that, as every member of the natural body makes known its desires, its petitions, to its own head, so the Church, the body of Christ, should be permitted to address him, and thus we read in our lesson that the apostles worshiped the ascended Jesus--they recognized his greatness and dignity and honor as the Messiah, the Son of the living God, the Redeemer of the world, who in due time shall come and receive his faithful to himself and establish his Kingdom for the blessing of the world. The Lord's own words are appropriate here: he says, "That all men should honor the Son even as they honor the Father."--John 5:23. ("This Same Jesus Shall So Come", December 15, 1906, Vol. 17, No. 24, page 3911)

Get real Fred. Its 2023--the light is much brighter. Why are you always trying to deceive others when you know 100% the JW,s do not teach that today? It shows the world who your Father is by doing so.

 

[Eleanor]

Which once again doesn't prove your assertion.

Keept trying.

I'm not presenting an assertion, I'm only demonstrating your illogic.

 

[Fred]

Get real Fred. Its 2023--the light is much brighter.

No, you get real.

Why are you always trying to deceive others when you know 100% the JW,s do not teach that today?

Soon it will no longer be today (May 30th, 2023) so this will be old news. You've tried this ridiculous argument before, and it didn't work. I know you are programmed to repeat it because you have nothing else except a massive amount of contradictions.

The light is much brighter argument won't hold because the JW's have gone back and forth multiple times concerning what they have affirmed and what they have denied concerning the same topic.

 

[Fred]

I'm not presenting an assertion, I'm only demonstrating your illogic.

If you can't see the contradiction above, then you need even more help that I thought.

 

[Eleanor]

If you can't see the contradiction above, then you need even more help that I thought.

Methinks the pot is calling the kettle black.

 

[ChristB4us]

Your altered bible version has you mislead--Joel 2:21-22--All who call on the name of YHWH(Jehovah) will be saved. Quoted 2 x in NT-Acts 2:21( verse 16 proves it Joels quote) and Romans 10:13--- But since your bible has Gods name removed by satans will, you have LORD at Joel, thus Lord in both spots of NT, But YHWH(Jehovah) belongs at all 3 spots. Every spot in OT where-GOD or LORD all capitols is YHWH(Jehovah) belongs by Gods will. Wicked men removed the name, they had no right, satans will wanted it removed and replaced with titles. All keeping Gods name out of his bible are supporting satans will over Gods will--to mislead.

Believers have been saved by calling on the Lord Jesus Christ for quite some time before Jehovah's Witnesses had shown up FYI.

Plus; Jesus is the God men had seen in the Old Testament as that Jehovah while at the same time Jesus said He has seen the Father..

John 5:37 And the Father himself, which hath sent me, hath borne witness of me. Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seen his shape. 38 And ye have not his word abiding in you: for whom he hath sent, him ye believe not. 39 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me. 40 And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life. 41 I receive not honour from men. 42 But I know you, that ye have not the love of God in you. 43 I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive. 44 How can ye believe, which receive honour one of another, and seek not the honour that cometh from God only? 45 Do not think that I will accuse you to the Father: there is one that accuseth you, even Moses, in whom ye trust. 46 For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me; for he wrote of me. 47 But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?
John 6:46 Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he which is of God, he hath seen the Father.
Jesus said He had met Abraham before His incarnation.

John 8:56 Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad. 57 Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham? 58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am. 59 Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.

Jesus is the Lord Jehovah that had met Isaac & Jacob & even Moses for why He said Moses had written of Him.

Exodus 6:3And I appeared unto Abraham, unto Isaac, and unto Jacob, by the name of God Almighty, but by my name Jehovah was I not known to them.

Something to think about & pray about. Ask the Father to reveal His Son to you that Jesus is Lord to the glory of God the Father.

 

[ChristB4us]

That doesn't rule out that the Father answers prayer.

John 15:16
so that whatever you ask of the Father in My name He may give to you.

James 1:5
But if any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask of God, who gives to all generously and without reproach, and it will be given to him.

I don't know where you are getting your doctrine from but it certainly doesn't accord with what the Bible teaches.

John 14:13 And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son. 14 If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it.

John 8:17 It is also written in your law, that the testimony of two men is true.

I believe when God the Father permits the Son to answer a certain prayer is why we are to give thanks to the Father in Jesus's name. The Father is agreeing with that prayer request presented by Jesus for why the Son is answering that prayer with the Father behind it as well.... as the Two agree with the Holy Spirit in compliance as the Spirit of God as that Third Witness to establish the testimony of the Son answering that prayer, altering reality as it is a divine intervention, the prayer is answered by the Son for why thanks are to be given to the Father & the Son for answers to prayers.

I believe the reason the Holy Spirit is not mentioned to give thanks to is He speaks what He hears and He does what the Father & the Son agrees to be done as the Spirit of God and yet the Holy Spirit gives all credit & glory to the Son for everything the Holy Spirit does and say. By the Holy Spirit doing that the Holy Spirit glorifies God the Father at the same time. That is the Father's will being done there.