No repentance for God is by our own will power alone

[brightfame52]

I would add that the Holy Spirit has to convict us of our sin and the Father has to draw us toward Christ but the final choice to submit or resist God leaves with us. There is no love without choice. Try raising your kids without giving them a choice.

Thats false, the Spirit convicts of sin in regeneration, drawing is regeneration, both faith and repentance comes with regeneration, God has made the choice

 

[Runningman]

Thats false, the Spirit convicts of sin in regeneration, drawing is regeneration, both faith and repentance comes with regeneration, God has made the choice

??

What is your religion if I may ask? You talk about some strange things as if they are attached to the Bible.

This is what the Bible says.

John 16
8And when He comes, He will convict the world in regard to sin and righteousness and judgment: 9in regard to sin, because they do not believe in Me; 10in regard to righteousness, because I am going to the Father and you will no longer see Me; 11and in regard to judgment, because the prince of this world has been condemned.

 

[Mercy_Shown]

Thats false, the Spirit convicts of sin in regeneration, drawing is regeneration, both faith and repentance comes with regeneration, God has made the choice

Even though you pronounced it false doesn't make it so. God desires that all people be saved so if it were God's choice all would be saved. It is not that He is not sovereign enough to do so, it is that He is sovereign enough to do so but doesn't. This is not some charade that God is playing. He is making a kingdom of saints who worship them out of their own free choice rather than manipulating sinners into not sinning so He can call them saints. He died so that whosoever believes in him shall not perish.

 

[jeremiah1five]

God says otherwise.

Unless, you can show anywhere in the Bible that God acknowledges someone sinning, is at the same time hating it, then you can continue to delude yourself about it.

Gid says you do it because you still enjoy it more than loving Him.

It's what not repenting is for. God calls it hardening the heart toward Him:

Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye.

I'm your Steven.

1 Have mercy upon me, O God, according to thy lovingkindness:
According unto the multitude of thy tender mercies blot out my transgressions.
2 Wash me throughly from mine iniquity,
And cleanse me from my sin.
3 For I acknowledge my transgressions:
And my sin is ever before me.
4 Against thee, thee only, have I sinned,
And done this evil in thy sight:
That thou mightest be justified when thou speakest,
And be clear when thou judgest.
5 Behold, I was shapen in iniquity;
And in sin did my mother conceive me.
6 Behold, thou desirest truth in the inward parts:
And in the hidden part thou shalt make me to know wisdom.
7 Purge me with hyssop, and I shall be clean:
Wash me, and I shall be whiter than snow.
8 Make me to hear joy and gladness;
That the bones which thou hast broken may rejoice.
9 Hide thy face from my sins,
And blot out all mine iniquities.
10 Create in me a clean heart, O God;
And renew a right spirit within me.
11 Cast me not away from thy presence;
And take not thy holy spirit from me.
12 Restore unto me the joy of thy salvation;
And uphold me with thy free spirit.
13 Then will I teach transgressors thy ways;
And sinners shall be converted unto thee.
14 Deliver me from bloodguiltiness, O God, thou God of my salvation:
And my tongue shall sing aloud of thy righteousness.
15 O Lord, open thou my lips;
And my mouth shall shew forth thy praise.
16 For thou desirest not sacrifice; else would I give it:
Thou delightest not in burnt offering.
17 The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit:
A broken and a contrite heart, O God, thou wilt not despise.
Ps 51:1–17.

 

[jeremiah1five]

Ok then. Another new one to add to the list. The devil is not a real angel once name Lucifer. He's just an adjunct hyperbole. Just as sinning with him is only a shady pigmentation, not a deed God judges the doer by.

Duly noted and recorded.


True. But, it's not the angels that sinned, but only the leading one seducing man in the garden and on earth today.

And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan.


Spiritual millennialism is another topic.

In any case, sinning in Christ's thousand year reign on earth, only means that it will be counted worse, than when the devil was roaming to tempt people on earth as today.

All you do is give yourself even less excuse for sinning. Afterall, according to your own doctrine, you can't say the devil makes you do it today, tomorrow, and the next...



True. There are unrepented Christian liars that justify their continued sinning. Sometimes they go so far as to accuse the righteous, of being lying boasters.

Whether unrighteous Jews or Christians: it's still the same.

Anything to excuse their continued sinning.


Another new one. Thanks.

It's right up there with doing righteousness to be righteous with God, is not a formula for being righteous with God.


Another case of lost reasoning ability. You've changed history of Paul preaching to Athenians, and now you change when Christ was born.

There is no OT quote of confessing the Lord Jesus with the mouth. That's not possible until after Jesus Christ is come in the flesh.

Your Jews-only messianism forbids rational thought pertaining to the Bible. Like them, you would be more rational, if you just throw the NT out altogether.







Beautiful! Awesome! Spoken like a messianic Jew based entirely upon physical birth!

The problem is, unlike true messianic Jews rejecting Jesus, you don't even include works of the law. You base your special chosenness entirely upon fleshly birth.

You are a liberal Jew! There are conservative Jews that believe the promise of the flesh at least includes keeping the law, and not just by birth.

Now I see the liberal Jews trust in birth alone? Am I right?

The Christian version of it, is being justified by faith alone, and not by doing the word.

Thank you very much for clarifying these things for me. It's the comparison between liberal Jews with birth alone, and liberal Christians with faith alone.

They both are dead without profit toward God and His Christ.

Which is what you, do, you sinner.

 

[jeremiah1five]

Well, it can be sooner than you think. First Jesus comes again to the earth to inherit all nations and rule as King and Lord over His kingdom. Then after the warfare that false Christian Jews and Gentiles alike with fight with Him, then Abraham and his continuing natural seed on earth, will indeed receive the promised land that he walked on.

However, that will only begin with newly born again Jews, that did not die by plague, nor war, nor by of nations between sheep and goats.

And any such Jew transgressing the King's law at that time, will still die by two or three witnesses, even as all subjects of the King on earth.

The great error of both Jews and Christians, is that God is ever a respecter of persons in His judgement, whether by flesh or by faith.



I know. And Satan has thousands of years doing so. But the time will come when all such mouths will be shut.

Whose mouths must be stopped, who subvert whole houses, teaching things which they ought not.

(You're old hat stuff I no longer respond to. As I said, the time will come when you offer nothing new, but just repeat yourself. That's when I'll be moving on. But, I say again, you have been a fount of new error to contend with.)

Textbook.
Don't you have any original thinking?

 

[brightfame52]

As stated, repentance is a Gift from the Saviour. Now to be more specific, how is it applied to them its given to as a Gift, namely Gods Elect ? Peter tells us here 1 Pet 1:3

Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

All for whom Christ died, by His Resurrection from the Dead, they shall be begotten again ! These words begotten again are in the greek anagennaó and means:

I beget again, beget into a new life.

to produce again, beget again, beget anew; metaphorically: τινα, thoroughly to change the mind of one, so that he lives a new life and one conformed to the will of God

Notice that it changes the mind of one, this being begotten again. Now what is repentance ? Its the greek word metanoia and means:

repentance, a change of mind, change in the inner man.

So this repentance that is given by and through the resurrection of Christ, being begotten again, effects a change of mind, which what primarily what repentance entails. It gives also change in the inner man.

And so repentance is confirmed to be the Gift of Christ through His resurrection from the dead, and its given to all for whom He died as their Saviour !

 

[brightfame52]

??

What is your religion if I may ask? You talk about some strange things as if they are attached to the Bible.

This is what the Bible says.

John 16
8And when He comes, He will convict the world in regard to sin and righteousness and judgment: 9in regard to sin, because they do not believe in Me; 10in regard to righteousness, because I am going to the Father and you will no longer see Me; 11and in regard to judgment, because the prince of this world has been condemned.

I know what that says, thats describing the results and effects of regeneration by the Spirit.

 

[brightfame52]

Even though you pronounced it false doesn't make it so. God desires that all people be saved so if it were God's choice all would be saved. It is not that He is not sovereign enough to do so, it is that He is sovereign enough to do so but doesn't. This is not some charade that God is playing. He is making a kingdom of saints who worship them out of their own free choice rather than manipulating sinners into not sinning so He can call them saints. He died so that whosoever believes in him shall not perish.

Oh its so, you just cant and dont believe it.

 

[Ghada]

Which is what you, do, you sinner.

And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.

No thanks, I'm not interested in being made part of your faith, church, nor congregation.

For the congregation of hypocrites shall be desolate, and fire shall consume the tabernacles of bribery.

I have hated the congregation of evil doers; and will not sit with the wicked.

Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.

That of course goes double for Jews-only Christians.

There are Jews of the flesh that still hate Gentiles of the flesh, and they are not Jews and Christians of God:

For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

Not only of the flesh, but also circumcision of the flesh. It's the one main reason the Jews of old and today hate Jesus and have Him crucified to themselves daily.

I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.

And no matter what they name their Jews-only messiah, it's still just another tired old version of the first one, Korah. He was so exclusive, he didn't even want Moses or and other keepers of the law under his own messianic lordship.

(I believe I can make a fair case, that the last great antichrist, before the Lord returns to earth, will actually be Korah raised from the dead to live again on earth, for that very purpose.)

 

[Ghada]

Textbook.
Don't you have any original thinking?

Now this makes perfect sense. Your inserted perspective is to be original as well as corrupt.

For all the Athenians and strangers which were there spent their time in nothing else, but either to tell, or to hear some new thing.
However all your self-justifying stuff is just old old hat itself:

Ye shall not surely die. For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.
You see the thing is nothing after the devil is new nor original, but just the same tired old lie to justify oneself while disobeying the true God.

"I am going to sin later, tomorrow, and most likely the next day, but God sees me as holy, sinless, righteous."

Although I still admit you do it so originally without shame, that you make the devil blush and roll his eyes. He at least likes to be subtill about it.

 

[jeremiah1five]

And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.

No thanks, I'm not interested in being made part of your faith, church, nor congregation.

I never invited you.

For the congregation of hypocrites shall be desolate, and fire shall consume the tabernacles of bribery.
I have hated the congregation of evil doers; and will not sit with the wicked.

Same here. I point my index finger in their faces, say "thus saith the Lord" and they hate it, even want my death or crucifixion.

Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.

Those would be Gentile Christians that say they are seed of Abraham BUT ARE NOT. They use Gal. 3:28-29 as their false basis and lie through their false teeth.

That of course goes double for Jews-only Christians.
There are Jews of the flesh that still hate Gentiles of the flesh, and they are not Jews and Christians of God:
For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.
Not only of the flesh, but also circumcision of the flesh. It's the one main reason the Jews of old and today hate Jesus and have Him crucified to themselves daily.

But at Pentecost 3000 natural Olive tree Jews became SPIRITUAL Olive tree Jews.

I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.
And no matter what they name their Jews-only messiah, it's still just another tired old version of the first one, Korah. He was so exclusive, he didn't even want Moses or and other keepers of the law under his own messianic lordship.
(I believe I can make a fair case, that the last great antichrist, before the Lord returns to earth, will actually be Korah raised from the dead to live again on earth, for that very purpose.)

Nah.

 

[jeremiah1five]

Now this makes perfect sense. Your inserted perspective is to be original as well as corrupt.

For all the Athenians and strangers which were there spent their time in nothing else, but either to tell, or to hear some new thing.
However all your self-justifying stuff is just old old hat itself:

Hellenized Jews lived in Athenia. They were scattered all over the place. And like Samaritans who were denied their own covenant Scriptures by the Jews so, too, were Hellenized Jews holding to false theology of the God of their ancestors.

Ye shall not surely die. For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.
You see the thing is nothing after the devil is new nor original, but just the same tired old lie to justify oneself while disobeying the true God.
"I am going to sin later, tomorrow, and most likely the next day, but God sees me as holy, sinless, righteous."
Although I still admit you do it so originally without shame, that you make the devil blush and roll his eyes. He at least likes to be subtill about it.

Without shame. Truth doesn't shame me. Lies about God, on the other hand, do.

 

[Ghada]

I never invited you.

Oh yes. Of course. I have to remember to filter things through the lens of others, when be talked to by them.

When you call others sinners, you don't meaning sinning non-sinners like you.

I would much rather be a sinning sinner than a sinning non-sinner.

But of course a non-sinning non-sinner is a saint in Christ Jesus. Whether Jew or Greek

 

[Ghada]

Hellenized Jews lived in Athenia. They were scattered all over the place. And like Samaritans who were denied their own covenant Scriptures by the Jews so, too, were Hellenized Jews holding to false theology of the God of their ancestors.

Without shame. Truth doesn't shame me. Lies about God, on the other hand, do.

Ok, so we're done here.

Thanks for the new stuff to add to the growing list. I've never a met a Jews-only messiah, that also names the name of Jesus Christ.

Very unique. But then, the last great antichrist will be claiming to be Jesus Christ come again in the flesh. From some place on earth, not from the air.

 

[Mercy_Shown]

Oh its so, you just cant and dont believe it.

Your pronouncements are simply your opinion. That is fine but you should not confuse them with facts. We are not God.

 

[Mercy_Shown]

As stated, repentance is a Gift from the Saviour. Now to be more specific, how is it applied to them its given to as a Gift, namely Gods Elect ? Peter tells us here 1 Pet 1:3

Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

All for whom Christ died, by His Resurrection from the Dead, they shall be begotten again ! These words begotten again are in the greek anagennaó and means:

I beget again, beget into a new life.

to produce again, beget again, beget anew; metaphorically: τινα, thoroughly to change the mind of one, so that he lives a new life and one conformed to the will of God

Notice that it changes the mind of one, this being begotten again. Now what is repentance ? Its the greek word metanoia and means:

repentance, a change of mind, change in the inner man.

So this repentance that is given by and through the resurrection of Christ, being begotten again, effects a change of mind, which what primarily what repentance entails. It gives also change in the inner man.

And so repentance is confirmed to be the Gift of Christ through His resurrection from the dead, and its given to all for whom He died as their Saviour !

What you write is true, it is a gift, a wonderful gift and as with all gifts it is not forced on us. We can accept it and live or reject it and perish. A gift forced would not be a gift.

 

[jeremiah1five]

Ok, so we're done here.

Thanks for the new stuff to add to the growing list. I've never a met a Jews-only messiah, that also names the name of Jesus Christ.

Very unique. But then, the last great antichrist will be claiming to be Jesus Christ come again in the flesh. From some place on earth, not from the air.

Let's be correct if you're going to say what I believe.

I have maintained that Messiah is Promised TO and FOR Israel as per covenant and prophecy.

I have also said Gentiles have NO COVENANT with God and this is biblically true.
I have also said God saves Gentiles who have no covenant with God without a covenant.
No doubt that hard-core, uncircumcised, non-covenant Gentiles were being born again and saved by the Holy Spirit Promised to Israel for the council in Jerusalem reveals this. It should also be noted that JEWS were presiding over this council to discuss what to do with Gentiles being given the Holy Spirit of Promise and although Gentiles were being saved their numbers were miniscule in contrast to the 3000 saved in ONE DAY at Pentecost, and taking Acts 2:47 which says, "AND THE LORD ADDED TO CHURCH DAILY SUCH AS SHOULD BE SAVED" and taking 3000 saved in one day as an average, then by weeks end 21,000 Jews were added to the Church Christ Promised to build in accordance to Jewish Covenants and Jewish prophecies. Even if you were to cut 3000 in half that will make 10,500 Jews being born-again in one week.

I also maintain that where Gentiles are named in the New Covenant writings of Matthew, Saul, James, John, Peter, etc., these are circumcised Gentile proselytes for they would be in the synagogue when Jewish Christians would testify of their experience with the Holy Spirit of Promise and would hear of this NEW THING God was doing in Israel and among the Jews of twelve tribes.

So, if you're going to say what I believe the Scriptures record and their correct interpretation say it the same as I say it. Don't add, don't twist, don't change anything I have said on these matters.
Thank you.

 

[brightfame52]

Repentance in the matter of Gospel Preaching !

Repentance in the matter of Gospel message is a Salvation Gift, its an Spiritual act that can be performed only by the Spiritual man or woman, the natural man in the state of nature cant perform it, neither is called to perform it. Remember John the Baptist told the hard hearted Pharisees that came to him while performing the baptism of repentance ? Notice his words TO THEM Matt 3:7-9

7 But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees come to his baptism, he said unto them, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?

8 Bring forth therefore fruits meet for repentance:

9 And think not to say within yourselves, We have Abraham to our father: for I say unto you, that God is able of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham.

However, Jesus teaches this Matt 7:18

18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.

Repentance toward God Acts 20:21

Testifying both to the Jews, and also to the Greeks, repentance toward God, and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ.

Thats a Good Fruit, and such that are left in nature cant bring it forth, simply because the natural man is evil and corrupt !

Thats right those in the flesh, the natural man, cant please God Rom 8:8

8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

Simply stated the unregenerate cant please God !

 

[brightfame52]

Your pronouncements are simply your opinion. That is fine but you should not confuse them with facts. We are not God.

An opinion formed by the word of Truth !