Jesus is God {title edited}

[Mercy_Shown]

There aren't any examples of Jesus pre-existing with divine power. Many have tried to find them, but it isn't scripture. Please enlighten us if you know of any.

Have you not read the Old Testament. It is full of Christ and his power. Did you not know it was he who brought Israel out of Egypt and cared for them throughout their desert wondering?

1 Cor10
4 For I do not want you to be ignorant of the fact, brothers and sisters, that our ancestors were all under the cloud and that they all passed through the sea. 2 They were all baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea. 3 They all ate the same spiritual food 4 and drank the same spiritual drink; for they drank from the spiritual rock that accompanied them, and that rock was Christ.

What was the visible manifestation of God‘s power? It was the Shekinah Glory. Jesus, when he prayed for his disciples to see him that way during the transfiguration said, “Father, give me the glory I shared with you…“ Of course, that glory was the Shekinah Glory.

 

[Mercy_Shown]

According to the Bible it all came from the Father.

In order to maintain a Unitarian theology one must deny a lot of what Christ had to say about himself. Of course, I think that is true of all fallen human nature. We want to pick and choose who Jesus was rather than let him tell us himself. Jesus said, “I am the way the truth and the life…“ And here you are to say he is wrong because your Unitarian theology demands such a denial.

 

[Arial]

John 1
1 In the beginning was the word, and the word was with God, and what God was the word was.

What translation is this?

 

[Mercy_Shown]

he doesn't have the power and authority of God and he isn't the Lord of heaven and earth. Jesus is at the "right hand of God" meaning he isn't God.

What do you think “all power in Heaven and Earth” means? Of course His power and authority is also one with The Father.

You seem to pit one against the other.

 

[Fred]

Classic ad hominem.

Classic dodge of what you asserted.

 

[Mercy_Shown]

~
FAQ: Did Jesus have human blood in his body, or did he have God's blood?

REPLY: According to Lev 17:11, the life of the flesh is in the blood. Well
then, had there been God's life in his flesh instead of David's life, then Jesus
would've been precluded from inheriting David's throne because Jesus
would've failed to satisfy the biological requirement of Ps 132:11 which
says:

"The Lord has sworn in truth unto David; and He will not turn from it: "Of
the fruit of your body will I set upon your throne"

Plus: Acts 2:29-30 & Rom 1:3 would be easily proven false statements.

FAQ: Why are a number of Christians insistent upon Jesus having God's
blood in his body?

REPLY: They're overly infatuated with Jesus as the savior per Luke 2:8-11
instead of including him in their thinking as the Jewish monarch in the same
gospel per Luke 1:30-33. Consequently, they typically discount the
chemistry of Jesus' human genealogy because they sincerely believe human
blood isn't pure enough to offer as an atonement for the sins of the world.
Their logic is reasonable, I'll give them that; but under the microscope of
inspired writ, it turns out to be little more than sophistry.
_

This is a tempest in a tea pot. But if you really want to prove your point you must prove that Mary was a descendent of David or you could deny the virgin birth. But don’t take it too seriously.

 

[Odë:hgöd]

~
FAQ: Did Jesus' virgin conception isolate him from the so-called original sin, i.e. the
forbidden fruit incident?

REPLY: That particular sin isn't inherited, rather, it was imputed. And it was
imputed to the total of Adam's biological posterity all together, all at once, rather
than each in his own time.

FAQ: Isn't Jesus easily proven among Adam's biological posterity?

REPLY: Jesus biologically descended from Adam's flesh via his mom's flesh. (Gal 4:4)

FAQ: Rom 5:12 and Rom 5:19 made him complicit in Adam's sin the same as
everyone else?

REPLY: Yes.

FAQ: How then can 1Pet 1:19 honestly say Jesus was a lamb without blemish or
spot?

REPLY: Jesus committed no personal sins of his own to answer for. (John 8:29,
2Cor 5:21, Heb 4:15, 1Pet 2:22)

FAQ: Wasn't Adam's sin a hell-worthy offense?

REPLY: The official penalty for Adam tasting the forbidden fruit is mortality (Gen
2:17, 1Cor 15:22, & Heb 9:27) In other words; when one of Adam's descendants
kicks the bucket, they're done with the forbidden fruit incident; but they still have
to answer for their own personal sins at the great white throne event depicted by
Rev 20:11-15.
_

 

[Runningman]

Have you not read the Old Testament. It is full of Christ and his power. Did you not know it was he who brought Israel out of Egypt and cared for them throughout their desert wondering?

1 Cor10
4 For I do not want you to be ignorant of the fact, brothers and sisters, that our ancestors were all under the cloud and that they all passed through the sea. 2 They were all baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea. 3 They all ate the same spiritual food 4 and drank the same spiritual drink; for they drank from the spiritual rock that accompanied them, and that rock was Christ.

It plainly says it's referring to spiritual things. The rock that was broken and gushed water out was foreshadowing of Jesus being pierced on the cross and water coming out. If you will just look back in the old testament, there is no mention of Christ following the Israelites around in the desert.

So I take it that was the best you could find. See, I told you it wouldn't be easy to prove the pre-existence of Jesus.

What was the visible manifestation of God‘s power? It was the Shekinah Glory. Jesus, when he prayed for his disciples to see him that way during the transfiguration said, “Father, give me the glory I shared with you…“ Of course, that glory was the Shekinah Glory.

God's power manifests in ways so subtle, yet imperceptible. You think God couldn't make us all disappear in the blink of an eye? He sure could. By His will alone is the universe sustained yet the universe is not itself God.

 

[Odë:hgöd]

~

if you really want to prove your point you must prove that Mary was a descendent of David

The information you seek is located back in post No.263
_

 

[Runningman]

In order to maintain a Unitarian theology one must deny a lot of what Christ had to say about himself. Of course, I think that is true of all fallen human nature. We want to pick and choose who Jesus was rather than let him tell us himself. Jesus said, “I am the way the truth and the life…“ And here you are to say he is wrong because your Unitarian theology demands such a denial.

Yes he is the way, truth, and life but, as I showed using scripture, Jesus got all of his truths from God, his life from God, and ways from God. Didn't God give Jesus the truth, resurrect him to eternal life, and show Jesus the ways to walk? Jesus is saying if you want to be like him and get what he has then you need to follow him and believe his ways. It requires obedience to his truths and ways that he got from God.

Hebrews 5
7He in the days of His flesh, having offered up both prayers and supplications with loud crying and tears to the One being able to save Him from death, and having been heard because of reverent submission, 8though being a Son, He learned obedience from the things He suffered, 9and having been perfected, He became the author of eternal salvation to all those obeying Him, 10having been designated by God a high priest according to the order of Melchizedek.

 

[Runningman]

What translation is this?

That's called the Revised English Version (REV)

 

[Eleanor]

~
FAQ: Did Jesus have human blood in his body, or did he have God's blood?

REPLY: According to Lev 17:11, the life of the flesh is in the blood. Well
then, had there been God's life in his flesh instead of David's life, then Jesus
would've been precluded from inheriting David's throne because Jesus
would've failed to satisfy the biological requirement of Ps 132:11 which
says:

"The Lord has sworn in truth unto David; and He will not turn from it: "Of
the fruit of your body will I set upon your throne"

Plus: Acts 2:29-30 & Rom 1:3 would be easily proven false statements.

FAQ: Why are a number of Christians insistent upon Jesus having God's
blood in his body?

REPLY: They're overly infatuated with Jesus as the savior per Luke 2:8-11
instead of including him in their thinking as the Jewish monarch in the same
gospel per Luke 1:30-33. Consequently, they typically discount the
chemistry of Jesus' human genealogy because they sincerely believe human
blood isn't pure enough to offer as an atonement for the sins of the world.
Their logic is reasonable, I'll give them that; but under the microscope of
inspired writ, it turns out to be little more than sophistry.
_

Who says Jesus had God's blood in his body?
Certainly not orthodox Christiainity.

 

[Eleanor]

What translation is this?

According to it, it affirms the Godhood of Jesus.
God was God divine, then Jesus was likewise God divine.

 

[Eleanor]

This is a tempest in a tea pot. But if you really want to prove your point you must prove that Mary was a descendent of David or you could deny the virgin birth. But don’t take it too seriously.

Joseph being his legal father made Jesus legally a son of David (Mt 1:6) in the kingly line.
Was not Mary a descendant of David through Nathan (Lk 1:31), though not of the kingly line?

 

[Arial]

That's called the Revised English Version (REV)

The REV is a Unitarian translation, still ongoing, begun in 2000. So when you accuse the common, well established translations as being Trinitarian biased and therefore not reliable, and do not demonstrate that that is true with anything but a Unitarian biased text and explanation, you are once again doing what you accuse the Trinitarian of doing. The difference is there are centuries of consistency and agreement behind the common translations, and the more modern revised editions do not change any of the meanings, but simply make them more understandable with modern language. The REV is looking for ways to undo all that.

If I am not mistaken, it is also the translation associated with Open Theology. But when one does an internet search on the REV, the ones found are put out by Unitarians and they are very careful to not identify openly as being Unitarians. In speaking of those involved in the translation they merely say there are many and they know Greek and Hebrew. But they do not identify any of them so there is no way to do a search on them and get any information.

 

[Fred]

The REV is a Unitarian translation, still ongoing, begun in 2000. So when you accuse the common, well established translations as being Trinitarian biased and therefore not reliable, and do not demonstrate that that is true with anything but a Unitarian biased text and explanation, you are once again doing what you accuse the Trinitarian of doing.

Classic.

 

[Mr GLee]

It appears that you’re doing exactly what you condemned. You’re changing the meaning of the word eternal.

Thanks . What does it mean according to the Bible? It is used in two ways like many words Satan would make it all one in the same. . Does eternal mean Limbo or Purgatory? Two of the lying signs to wonder after .

Satan is the King of lying signs to wonder after the lying tongue or vision of this dying creation. . Limbo (eternal ) sufferings wondering never coming to the end faith (salvation) other than the queen mother of heaven the lying wonder) .

Eternal God remains without mother or father. Is it the Spirit of Christ represented as He? . . Or as one his and hers gods in the likeness of men some call patron saints not a term from the bible rather "I heard it through the legion of fathers grape vine" they make the living word of God without effect . . . . . can't serve two teaching masters. The temporal flesh seen and eternal God not seen. The temporal must be mixed with the eternal. . the gospel understanding, not of temporal but the eternal making us the power that can wok in us yoked with his labor of love our burdens can be lighter with a living hope beyond on last breath

I would think we must be careful how we hear who we hear as instruments of understanding revealing the hidden things of God Walk by the light of the gospel as a lamp unto our feet

2 Thessalonians 2:9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,

Believers have no need to wonder they have prophecy (sola scriptura) sealed with 7 seals til the last day under the Sun

 

[Eleanor]

It appears that you’re doing exactly what you condemned. You’re changing the meaning of the word eternal.

Eternal is without beginning and without end.
God's life is both divine, which is a matter of its quality, being different from angelic or human life,
and it is eternal , which is a matter of its having always existed and continuing to always exist.

 

[Mr GLee]

Jesus was both the son of a human (Mary) and the son of the divine God (Holy Spirit). (Lk 1:35)

I would agree Jesus as the Son of man dying makinkind when he became born again of the incorruptible seed the living word of God he became the Son of God the firsts of many (Christians) what we will be in not revealed. .

Romans 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

 

[Mercy_Shown]

Thanks . What does it mean according to the Bible? It is used in two ways like many words Satan would make it all one in the same. . Does eternal mean Limbo or Purgatory?

Neither. Those are nouns whereas "eternal" is an adjective. Adjectives are not things.