Hebrews 6

[Eleanor]

So you are saying Peter would not of been His sheep and not elect if he died with an unconfessed sin. Is that right ?

What do you mean by unconfessed sin?

 

[civic]

What do you mean by unconfessed sin?

if Peter died of a heart attack before he could repent after the cock crowed a 3rd time he would of been condemned right ?

 

[HIM]

So if one sins they lose their salvation and if they don’t sin they keep their salvation . Salvation then is based on perfect obedience and not on Christ. Christ saves us but we must keep ourselves saved. That’s a works based salvation and not one based on grace through faith apart from works .

No salvation is based on Christ in you working. If He is not we are not. We shall be known by the fruits.
And the text says what it says. If it disagrees with our dogma than it is our dogma that is in error not the text

 

[civic]

No salvation is based on Christ in you working. If He is not we are not. We shall be known by the fruits.
And the text says what it says. If it disagrees with our dogma than it is our dogma that is in error not the text

So if I yell at my wife and say something mean to her and die immediately without a chance to confess my sin I'm doomed ?

 

[Eleanor]

Unbelief is disobedience. sinning. Do not fall after the same example.

Heb 3:17 But with whom was he grieved forty years? was it not with them that had sinned, whose carcases fell in the wilderness?

Heb 3:19 So we see that they could not enter in because of unbelief.

Heb 3 is dealing with rebellion = apostasy = unbelief = disobedience = sin.

The Greek word translated Unbelief as understood From the BDAG. Bold emphasis added.

ἀπείθεια, ας, ἡ (s. ἀπειθής; X., Mem. 3, 5, 5 et al.; ins; pap; 4 Macc 8:9, 18: 12:4; PsSol 17:20) disobedience, in our lit. always of disob. toward God (cp. Jos., Ant. 3, 316); somet. w. the connotation of disbelief in the Christian gospel (see ἀπειθέω). Those who oppose God are called υἱοὶ τῆς ἀ. Eph 2:2; 5:6; Col 3:6 (some mss. om.; s. KKuhn, NTS 7, ’61, 339 for Qumran parallels). Of disob. of Israelites Ro 11:30; Hb 4:6, 11; of all humanity Ro 11:32. Personified Hs 9, 15, 3.—DELG s.v. πείθομαι. M-M. TW.

From Abbot Smith's work:
G543
** ἀπείθεια
(WH, -θία, exc. Heb 11:1-40. c.), -ας, ἡ (< ἀπειθής),
[in LXX 4Ma 8:9; 4Ma 8:18; 4Ma 12:4 *;]
disobedience (MM, VGT, s.v.): Rom 11:30; Rom 11:32, Heb 4:6; Heb 4:11; υἱοὶ τῆς ἀ. (gen. of definition, v. M, Pr., 73 f.), Eph 2:2; Eph 5:6, Col 3:6 (T, WH R, mg., omit).†
ἀπειθία, -ας, ἡ, see ἀπείθεια.

 

[GeneZ]

So you are saying Peter would not of been His sheep and not elect if he died with an unconfessed sin. Is that right ?

Not to mention, if they had lived a little longer, and first believed? That unconfessed sin would have been paid for.

Confessing sin gets us back in the Spirit filling us. It does not get us saved. (1 John 1:9)

What gets people saved is simply believing in Jesus Christ.



He then brought them out and asked, “Sirs, what must I do to be saved?”

They replied, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved—you and your household.”

Acts 16:30-31

 

[Eleanor]

if Peter died of a heart attack before he could repent after the cock crowed a 3rd time he would of been condemned right ?

I don't think denial was ever in his heart, he was just trying to save his hide.

Were the apostles born again at that point?

That is the issue in their salvation.

 

[GeneZ]

So if I yell at my wife and say something mean to her and die immediately without a chance to confess my sin I'm doomed ?

Only if she immediately follows you to heaven!

 

[Eleanor]

So if I yell at my wife and say something mean to her and die immediately without a chance to confess my sin I'm doomed ?

Are you born again?

 

[civic]

Are you born again?

Since 1980

 

[Eleanor]

Since 1980

Then you're not doomed.

 

[Carbon]

Are we the standard. What we do or don’t doesn’t matter unless we living in willful sin. If we are continuing in sin thinking grace shall abound. We have no more sacrifice for sin. Only certain fearful looking forward to judgement and fiery indignation which shall devour the adversary, those continuing in willful sin.

Ha, why can't you just answer the simple question?

 

[Carbon]

So was that a yes or no to the sin question ?

Do you sin by accident ?

I don't sin by accident.

 

[Carbon]

Except Heb. 6 and 10., 1 Cor 9 and 3, Gal 5 and Rev 2 and 3 to name a few.

Nope. No exceptions. You can take that rollercoaster ride if you like. I won't get back on.

 

[HIM]

Nope. No exceptions. You can take that rollercoaster ride if you like. I won't get back on.

Rather subjective comment. There is no serious rebuttal for what the text say so I get it. Take care

 

[Eleanor]

Nope. No exceptions. You can take that rollercoaster ride if you like. I won't get back on.

Been there, done that, got the T-shirt?

 

[HIM]

Your understanding of Hebrews 10:26 is amiss, failing the test of 2 TImothy 2:15, which is literally sin, to miss the mark.

Is that accidental or willful on your part?

Your understanding of what was shared to you is amiss, failing the test of 2 Tim 2:15 which is literally sin, to miss the mark.
Is that accidental or willful on your part?

 

[David1701]

Hebrews 6:
4 For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5 and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6 and then have fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame. 7 For ground that drinks the rain which often falls on it and produces vegetation useful to those for whose sake it is also tilled, receives a blessing from God; 8 but if it yields thorns and thistles, it is worthless and close to being cursed, and it ends up being burned.

If you are interested I am curious how you understand this passage.

Or anyone actually. This could be a great discussion.

This refers to Hebrews (Jews) who had heard the gospel and experienced the things of the kingdom of God (they had probably been in meetings and seen the gifts of the Holy Spirit in operation, including experiencing first-hand the Holy Spirit operating upon them, e.g. conviction of sin). If such people then do not go on to repent and believe in the Messiah, but return to Judaism, they will end up being cursed.

 

[Carbon]

This refers to Hebrews (Jews) who had heard the gospel and experienced the things of the kingdom of God (they had probably been in meetings and seen the gifts of the Holy Spirit in operation, including experiencing first-hand the Holy Spirit operating upon them, e.g. conviction of sin). If such people then do not go on to repent and believe in the Messiah, but return to Judaism, they will end up being cursed.

I agree. And that is it wrapped up in a nutshell.

But what do you believe these mean?
Enlightened,
Tasted on the heavenly gift,
Made partakers of the Holy Spirit,
Tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come,


As I said, I agree with you but I am curious how you understand these points.

Thanks.

 

[civic]

Rather subjective comment. There is no serious rebuttal for what the text say so I get it. Take care

Where do any of your referenced texts call them any of these below :

Believers
Brethren
Beloved
Saved
Saints

If you can find a single instance you might have a case. Until then it’s an argument from silence that in any passage they were saved and lost their salvation. I don’t base my beliefs or theology on arguments from silence .

Also the Hebrews 6 passage makes the distinction between the unsaved ( 4-8 ) and those who are saved and accompany salvation whom he calls his beloved in 6:9

hope this helps !!!