Free will--a Calvinistic proposition?

[atpollard]

Again, every person is influenced by the Lord at some point in their life (John 12:32).

In what sense does that response define “freedom”?
That merely argues that God “tries and fails” … most of the time (wide road).

[I have a problem with that definition of God, as that describes “a god” with a small ‘g’.]

 

[atpollard]

Calvinism is based on the acronym TULIP; not the Bible.

The 5 doctrines originate with the Synod of Dort that was refuting the Remonstrances (of Arminius).
The Acronym “TULIP” originates in a sermon, then a pamphlet and then a book on theology all written in English in the early 20th Century.

I will let you research the Synod of Dort and Remonstrances and see just how far “Calvinism” predates “T.U.L.I.P.”(but it was a clever acrostic).

 

[fastfredy0]

My question: usually I get an obtuse definition from Arminians like "free will is the ability to choose"

That definition is not obtuse as far as I'm concerned.

B.I.N.G.O. !!!
You're definition is obtuse because it ignores the essential question ... who or what determines your choice. People don't put the adjective FREE in front of FREE WILL for no reason. The word FREE, being an adjective, has meaning. You, and so many "free willies" won't define your terms because you have not thought it out. WHAT IS THE CAUSE OF YOU DECIDING TO DO 'X' OR 'Y'. THAT IS THE CRUX OF THE DIFFERENCE OF OPINION, THAT IS WHY THE WORD FREE IS USED.
We can't discuss an idea if you won't state the deeper facets of your position.

So, what of evil desires. (what do you mean, they hedge their bets)?

It seems to me that if God is the First Cause of evil desires, that God is therefore the author of evil.

Ah, a discussion for another day. Besides, my opinion on the subject is not in agreement with most Calvinists and this thread is about Calvinist positions.

 

[justbyfaith]

Where does the Bible say when we are draw to Christ we are given motivation to receive Him? Scriptures please.

You need to support this. We can't be expected to just take your word for it.

Then reject what I am saying ("harden your heart to it"); it is no skin off my back...

 

[justbyfaith]

That's not a valid Argument, because Calvinists believe the same thing about TULIP and the Solas...

Strike one...

Do you have a valid point?

Which substantiates my point that Calvinism is based on TULIP rather than the Bible;

especially since TULIP is contradicted by the Bible.

(I will leave it up to you to do your own study on this)...

You can look up the thread Is TULIP biblical in the Pentecostal section.

 

[justbyfaith]

Yes, Paul did. So did Jesus and John.

I can make a case for entire sanctification in the word.

It's for another day and another thread.

 

[justbyfaith]

In what sense does that response define “freedom”?
That merely argues that God “tries and fails” … most of the time (wide road).

[I have a problem with that definition of God, as that describes “a god” with a small ‘g’.]

God has given to every man a degree of sovereignty and this does not deny His sovereignty as He did this as the result of His own sovereign choice.

 

[ReverendRV]

Which substantiates my point that Calvinism is based on TULIP rather than the Bible;

especially since TULIP is contradicted by the Bible.

(I will leave it up to you to do your own study on this)...

You can look up the thread Is TULIP biblical in the Pentecostal section.

No, Hyper Calvinism is based on TULIP. Calvinism is based on TULIP and the 5-Solas. One of the 5-Solas is Sola Fide. Calvinism is based on Justification through Faith Alone...

 

[justbyfaith]

B.I.N.G.O. !!!
You're definition is obtuse because it ignores the essential question ... who or what determines your choice. People don't put the adjective FREE in front of FREE WILL for no reason. The word FREE, being an adjective, has meaning. You, and so many "free willies" won't define your terms because you have not thought it out. WHAT IS THE CAUSE OF YOU DECIDING TO DO 'X' OR 'Y'. THAT IS THE CRUX OF THE DIFFERENCE OF OPINION, THAT IS WHY THE WORD FREE IS USED.
We can't discuss an idea if you won't state the deeper facets of your position.

My belief is that everyone has an unhindered ability to make a free decision to receive or reject Christ at whatever juncture in their lives that they are being drawn to Him (2 Corinthians 3:17).

 

[ReverendRV]

My belief is that everyone has an unhindered ability to make a free decision to receive or reject Christ at whatever juncture in their lives that they are being drawn to Him (2 Corinthians 3:17).

Then why did you say earlier that people are Enabled to come to Christ?

 

[justbyfaith]

No, Hyper Calvinism is based on TULIP. Calvinism is based on TULIP and the 5-Solas. One of the 5-Solas is Sola Fide. Calvinism is based on Justification through Faith Alone...

So, it is hyper-Calvinism, and not Calvinism, that preaches that regeneration precedes faith?

It might help me if the hyper-Calvinists who talk to me would identify themselves as such.

 

[justbyfaith]

Then why did say earlier that people are Enabled to come to Christ?

They are enabled in being drawn. How are these things contradictory?

 

[ReverendRV]

So, it is hyper-Calvinism, and not Calvinism, that preaches that faith precedes regeneration?

It might help me if the hyper-Calvinists who talk to me would identify themselves as such.

No, both teach Prevenient Regeneration. But Prevenient Regeneration isn't Hyper Calvinism. Hyper Calvinists believe Jesus is LORD, but believing Jesus is LORD isn't Hyper Calvinism. It's a Genetic Fallacy to say whatever Hyper Calvinism believes is automatically Hyper...

 

[atpollard]

God has given to every man a degree of sovereignty and this does not deny His sovereignty as He did this as the result of His own sovereign choice.

Whose PLAN is it (everything)?
If it is God’s plan (like Joseph being sold into slavery), then God IS 100% Sovereign. If God surrendered His sovereignty, then whose plan is it?

A God that is not in control, is a mere god. Zeus was never claimed to exercise total control over everything. Yahweh does claim to exercise complete control. Zeus is a god. Yahweh is God. If Yahweh surrendered control, then God became a god.

I have a problem with that theology.

 

[ReverendRV]

So, it is hyper-Calvinism, and not Calvinism, that preaches that regeneration precedes faith?

It might help me if the hyper-Calvinists who talk to me would identify themselves as such.

There's only one Hyper Calvinist here. And by the way; you're trying harder right now. Thanks...

 

[justbyfaith]

No, both teach Prevenient Regeneration. But Prevenient Regeneration isn't Hyper Calvinism. Hyper Calvinists believe Jesus is LORD, but believing Jesus is LORD isn't Hyper Calvinism. It's a Genetic Fallacy to say whatever Hyper Calvinism believes is automatically Hyper...

Makes it confusing for me and more difficult to navigate the points that I am trying to get across.

 

[justbyfaith]

Whose PLAN is it (everything)?
If it is God’s plan (like Joseph being sold into slavery), then God IS 100% Sovereign. If God surrendered His sovereignty, then whose plan is it?

A God that is not in control, is a mere god. Zeus was never claimed to exercise total control over everything. Yahweh does claim to exercise complete control. Zeus is a god. Yahweh is God. If Yahweh surrendered control, then God became a god.

I have a problem with that theology.

But if God is the First Cause of everything then He is responsible for murder and rape and incest.

I have a problem with THAT theology.

 

[ReverendRV]

Makes it confusing for me and more difficult to navigate the points that I am trying to get across.

Would you like to talk about Prevenient Regeneration?

 

[ReverendRV]

But if God is the First Cause of everything then He is responsible for murder and rape and incest.

I have a problem with THAT theology.

Would you like to talk about God's Primary Causation?

 

[justbyfaith]

Makes it confusing for me and more difficult to navigate the points that I am trying to get across.

But I have an issue with basic Calvinism in that they preach that regeneration precedes faith. I don't find that doctrine to be biblical.