THE ERROR OF SUPERSESSIONISM

[Rufus]

What if one holds that the Gentile plus the Jewish believers take the place (in terms of promises, but not the Land) of Ancient Israel? Is that 'supersessionist?

Ephesians 2:14-15 NKJV
For He Himself is our peace, who has made both one, and has broken down the middle wall of separation, [15] having abolished in His flesh the enmity, that is, the law of commandments contained in ordinances, so as to create in Himself one new man from the two, thus making peace,


Why even the Mosaic Covenant never superseded the Abrahamic Covenant. Gal 3:17

Galatians 3:17-18 NKJV
[17] And this I say, that the law, which was four hundred and thirty years later, cannot annul the covenant that was confirmed before by God in Christ, that it should make the promise of no effect. [18] For if the inheritance is of the law, it is no longer of promise; but God gave it to Abraham by promise.

Thank God for that! How else would the temporal and physical aspects to the Abrahamic Covenant ever been fulfilled? The Abrahamic and Mosaic covenants connection is to Israelites what the Abrahamic and New covenants are to Abraham's spiritual seed -- the Gentiles.

 

[Rufus]

God made no covenant with Gentiles of the seed of Gentiles in the Law, the Psalms, and the Prophets. None. Gentiles are precluded from the covenants God made with Abraham (Hebrew), the children of Israel (Mosaic) or the House of Israel (New Covenant.)
The writings of the New Covenant such as Saul, Peter, James, Jude, etc., have them talking about things contained in the Law, the Psalms, and the Prophets. There are no new covenants in their writings. The discussion in their letters concerns the Law, the Psalms, and the Prophets and everything having to do with Israel, their history, their culture, their Messiah, their religion and their practices.

To be clear: Are you saying, then, that the Gentile believers today, who are heirs of the covenant promise God made with Abraham (Rom 4:17-18), are nevertheless not in a covenant relationship God?

 

[jeremiah1five]

To be clear: Are you saying, then, that the Gentile believers today, who are heirs of the covenant promise God made with Abraham (Rom 4:17-18), are nevertheless not in a covenant relationship God?

I am saying that in the Jewish Scriptures of their Law, their Psalms, and their Prophets there is NO covenant God has made with Gentiles and definitely Gentiles are not once mentioned or referred to in Genesis 17 where God makes Covenant with Abraham.
But what I do get is none response from Gentile Christians who cannot answer my question about the Abraham Covenant and instead do what you do and that is quote New Covenant Scripture of Saul merely discussing Jewish history not creating doctrine that includes Gentiles in a Covenant in which no Gentiles are part of the Covenant in Genesis 17. IF GOD wanted Gentiles to be included in the Abrahamic Covenant, He would have said so when making Covenant with Abraham in Genesis 17.

God is saving Gentiles without a covenant. The Times of the Gentiles is a one-time blip on God's radar of salvation. This is a sideshow. Everything concerning God's relationship with men is made with a certain family line. The House that will come to be known as Israel from the seed of Abraham.
You can talk about being with Christ makes you automatically included in the Abrahamic Covenant but not even Christ says such a thing. Salvation is of the Jews.

Show me in Genesis 17 where God makes covenant with Abraham that Gentiles are also included.

 

[3 Resurrections]

Show me in Genesis 17 where God makes covenant with Abraham that Gentiles are also included.

Abraham WAS a Gentile coming from Ur of the Chaldees.

 

[prism]

Thank God for that! How else would the temporal and physical aspects to the Abrahamic Covenant ever been fulfilled? The Abrahamic and Mosaic covenants connection is to Israelites what the Abrahamic and New covenants are to Abraham's spiritual seed -- the Gentiles.

I wouldn't clump the Abrahamic Covenant in with the Mosaic Covenant, as one is conditional and the other unconditional. Neither would I associate believing Gentiles with the 'Spiritual seed of Abraham. (That's the Amplified Bible's 'bracketed' interpretation of Gal 3:29), otherwise, not scriptural.

 

[Josheb]

Abraham WAS a Gentile coming from Ur of the Chaldees.

Post it a couple of more times and maybe it will reach him. ALL this time he's been posting about God making a covenant ONLY with the House of Israel and the epistolary written only for Jewish Christians when the facts of scripture are that Abraham was not of the house of Israel, he was not a Jew, and God made His covenant with a Gentile!!!

Well done. Let's see if you have any better effect than I have. I'm rooting for you

 

[Rufus]

I am saying that in the Jewish Scriptures of their Law, their Psalms, and their Prophets there is NO covenant God has made with Gentiles and definitely Gentiles are not once mentioned or referred to in Genesis 17 where God makes Covenant with Abraham.
But what I do get is none response from Gentile Christians who cannot answer my question about the Abraham Covenant and instead do what you do and that is quote New Covenant Scripture of Saul merely discussing Jewish history not creating doctrine that includes Gentiles in a Covenant in which no Gentiles are part of the Covenant in Genesis 17. IF GOD wanted Gentiles to be included in the Abrahamic Covenant, He would have said so when making Covenant with Abraham in Genesis 17.

God is saving Gentiles without a covenant. The Times of the Gentiles is a one-time blip on God's radar of salvation. This is a sideshow. Everything concerning God's relationship with men is made with a certain family line. The House that will come to be known as Israel from the seed of Abraham.
You can talk about being with Christ makes you automatically included in the Abrahamic Covenant but not even Christ says such a thing. Salvation is of the Jews.

Show me in Genesis 17 where God makes covenant with Abraham that Gentiles are also included.

Others here have beat me to the punch by pointing out what should have been obvious to you: God made his covenant with Abraham the Gentile! Moreover, there are Gentiles in Christ's lineage. And finally, you should ponder Gen 12:1-3. God promised Abraham that "all peoples on earth will be blessed through you". How would God specifically fulfill this particular promise, since it's not fulfilled by the New Covenant, according to you?

 

[Arial]

Post it a couple of more times and maybe it will reach him. ALL this time he's been posting about God making a covenant ONLY with the House of Israel and the epistolary written only for Jewish Christians when the facts of scripture are that Abraham was not of the house of Israel, he was not a Jew, and God made His covenant with a Gentile!!!

Well done. Let's see if you have any better effect than I have. I'm rooting for you

Not only that but the entire line of the Seed bearer, is rampant with Gentiles. Possibly in all, I would have to track it down, and you probably know, but we do know that David's gr grandmother was a Gentile.

 

[Josheb]

Not only that but the entire line of the Seed bearer, is rampant with Gentiles. Possibly in all, I would have to track it down, and you probably know, but we do know that David's grandmother was a Gentile.

All valid points, but the response will be those are outliers, exceptions to the rule. Hard to get around the fact the promises were made to 1) Abraham, the Gentile and 2) Jesus, the seed.

Galatians 3:16
Now the promises were spoken to Abraham and to his seed. He does not say, "And to seeds," as referring to many, but rather to one, "And to your seed," that is, Christ.

The promises were made to Abraham and Jesus. No Israel, no Jews mentioned. Israel and Jews did not even exist at that time.

 

[jeremiah1five]

Abraham WAS a Gentile coming from Ur of the Chaldees.

Abram was Hebrew from the family of Noah and Shem.
Ham and Japheth are the beginnings of Gentiles.

13 And there came one that had escaped, and told Abram the Hebrew; Gen. 14:13.

Gentiles did not become slaves in Egypt. Hebrews, on the other hand, did.

It's always the other hand that floors us, isn't it.
No matter. Let the Word of God tell you what to believe rather than you tell the Word of God what to say. Now, say it with me...

Abram was Hebrew.
Abram was Hebrew.
Abram was Hebrew.

Say it back to me.

 

[jeremiah1five]

Others here have beat me to the punch by pointing out what should have been obvious to you: God made his covenant with Abraham the Gentile! Moreover, there are Gentiles in Christ's lineage. And finally, you should ponder Gen 12:1-3. God promised Abraham that "all peoples on earth will be blessed through you". How would God specifically fulfill this particular promise, since it's not fulfilled by the New Covenant, according to you?

Abram was Hebrew.

13 And there came one that had escaped, and told Abram the Hebrew; Gen. 14:13.

Gentiles did not go to Egypt and become slaves. On the other hand, the Hebrews did.
Gentiles come from Ham and Japheth.
The people that were later to be identified as Jews came from Abraham, Shem, and Noah.

The "nations" and "kings that God said would "come out of thee" are the descendants of Ishmael (who had twelve sons), and Esau whom God blessed greatly.
Gentiles do not come from the loins of Abraham nor do Gentiles "come out of thee" (Abraham.)

God made no covenant with Gentiles. The sign of the Abrahamic Covenant is circumcision to separate the men (Jews) from the boys (Gentiles), and Gentiles did not circumcise themselves. They were what David called "uncircumcised Philistines and dogs!"

Go, King David.

By the way the "strangers" and "foreigners" are still the descendants of Ishmael and Esau. They were stranger and foreigners to the Abrahamic Covenant. They were allowed close access to the children of Israel, but Gentiles were verboten. Israel was commanded to NOT mingle with the Gentiles nor learn their ways. Nothing has changed. The New Covenant Jewish Christians were told by John and James:

15 Love not the world [non-covenant people], neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him. 1 Jn 2:15.

and

4 Ye adulterers and adulteresses, know ye not that the friendship of the world is enmity with God? whosoever therefore will be a friend of the world is the enemy of God. James 4:4.

The original command of God to Israel in WHO they were to love is found in Leviticus 19:18-19, and God has instructed Israel in the desert to love covenant brethren ONLY.

The New Covenant by which the Holy Spirit was prophesied was made between God and the House of Israel (northern kingdom) and the House of Judah (southern kingdom), NOT with Gentiles.
God made NO COVENANT with Gentiles. Gentile Christians are joined to Christ by the Spirit. They are NOT joined to Abraham. God is saving Gentiles without a covenant. As a Gentile you should be extremely grateful for your salvation and stop trying to steal the covenants and promises God made with Israel.

 

[Josheb]

Abram was Hebrew from the family of Noah and Shem.
Ham and Japheth are the beginnings of Gentiles.

13 And there came one that had escaped, and told Abram the Hebrew; Gen. 14:13.

Gentiles did not become slaves in Egypt. Hebrews, on the other hand, did.

It's always the other hand that floors us, isn't it.
No matter. Let the Word of God tell you what to believe rather than you tell the Word of God what to say. Now, say it with me...

Abram was Hebrew.
Abram was Hebrew.
Abram was Hebrew.

Say it back to me.

NO, we won't say it back to you because it is irrelevant, a deceit of irrelevancy. His being Hebrew is NOT in dispute. What is in dispute is you claim the covenant was with the House of Israel and not Gentile converts to Christ. The promises of the covenant were spoken to Abraham, the Gentile and Jesus, the Son of God. Abraham was Hebrew, but he was not Jewish. Abraham was Hebrew, but he was not of the house of Israel.

You've been wrong since you joined this forum.

 

[David1701]

Supersessionism, also called replacement theology or fulfillment theology, is a Gentile Christian theological doctrine which describes the theological conviction that the Gentile Christian Church has superseded the nation of Israel assuming their role as God's covenanted people, thus asserting that the New Covenant through Jesus Christ has superseded or replaced the Mosaic covenant exclusive to Jews. Supersessionist theology also holds that the universal Gentile Christian Church has succeeded ancient Israel as God's true Israel and that Gentile Christians have succeeded the ancient Israelites as the people of God.

For most of Gentile Christian history, supersessionism has been the mainstream interpretation of the New Testament of all three major historical traditions within Christianity – Orthodox, Roman Catholic and Protestant. The text most often evident in favor of the supersessionist view is Hebrews 8:13: "In speaking of 'a new covenant' (Jer. 31.31–32) he has made the first one obsolete."

Paul's views on the Jews are complex, but he is generally regarded as the first person to make the claim that by not accepting claims of Jesus's divinity, Jews disqualified themselves from salvation. Paul himself was born a Jew, but after a conversion experience he came to accept Jesus's divinity later in his life.

Modern Protestants hold to a range of positions on supersessionism and the relationship between the Gentile Church and the Jewish people. These differences arise from dissimilar literal versus figurative approaches to understanding the relationships between the covenants of the Bible, particularly the relationship between the covenants of the Old Testament and the New Covenant.

After the establishment of the political state of Israel in the wake of the Holocaust, mainstream Christian theologians and denominations began to re-examine supersessionism and some communities came to outright reject the doctrine. The prominent Protestant alternatives to supersessionism are covenant theology, New Covenant theology, classical dispensationalism, progressive dispensationalism and covenant premillennialism. Another alternative, dual-covenant theology, contrasts with supersessionism by holding that the Mosaic covenant remains valid for Talmudic Jews.

Extensive discussion is found in Christian views on the Old Covenant and in the respective articles for each of these viewpoints: for example, there is a section within dispensationalism detailing that perspective's concept of Israel. Differing approaches influence how the land promise in Genesis 12, 15 and 17 is understood, whether it is interpreted literally or figuratively, both with regard to the land and the identity of people who inherit it.

The church is not Gentile! The first Christians were almost all Jewish. In any case, in Christ, there is neither Jew nor Gentile; we are all one in Him.

 

[jeremiah1five]

The church is not Gentile! The first Christians were almost all Jewish. In any case, in Christ, there is neither Jew nor Gentile; we are all one in Him.

Saul was writing to Jewish Christians who had concern about the effect Messiah had on the Abrahamic Covenant.

23 But before faith came, we [Jews] were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
24 Wherefore the law was our [Jews] schoolmaster to bring us [Jews] unto Christ, that we [Jews] might be justified by faith.
25 But after that faith is come, we [Jews] are no longer under a schoolmaster.
26 For ye [Jews] are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you [Jews] as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye [Jews] are all [Jews] one in Christ Jesus.
29 And if ye [Jews] be Christ’s, then are ye [Jews] Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise. Gal. 3:23–29.

Do you see Saul trying to explain to Jewish Christians at their Jewish home churches in Ephesus that everything is OK? Do you see the Jewishness of his letter to Jewish Christians? They worried at what it meant to be a Messiah-follower and how this affected their standing in the Abrahamic Covenant. Saul is not teaching a new covenant of Jews and Gentiles. There is NO NEW COVENANT in the New Covenant writings of Saul, or James, or Peter, or John. All their letters are spent discussing and explaining Messiah's effect on their Law, their Psalms, and their Prophets - their Judaic religion.

The New Covenant is between God and the House of Israel (northern kingdom) and the House of Judah (southern kingdom) - Jer. 31:31-34. There are no Gentiles mentioned nor are they included in the New Covenant. God is saving Gentiles without a covenant.
Israel is betrothed to God and is His Bride. Israel is the True Church of the Living God and the Church Jesus said He was going to build began at the Feast of Harvest (Pentecost) as a Jewish Church which is a continuation of the Church of God in the desert at the time of the Tabernacle, only they were called the "Great Congregation."
At the Marriage Supper Israel is there through Covenant.
Gentiles are there by invitation (Matt. 22.)
Throughout the Jewish Scriptures of the Law, the Psalms, and the Prophets which record the history of Israel's Redemption there is no place where God made covenant with Gentiles. None.

 

[jeremiah1five]

And for those that reject the Word of God I will post the New Covenant again for those that receive the Word of God and who are trained by its truth:

31 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD,
That I will make a new covenant
With the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:
32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers
In the day that I took them by the hand
To bring them out of the land of Egypt;
Which my covenant they brake,
Although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD:
33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel;
After those days, saith the LORD,
I will put my law in their inward parts,
And write it in their hearts;
And will be their God,
And they shall be my people.
34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour [member of another tribe living next to any tribe around the Tabernacle], and every man his brother [member of the same tribe], saying,
Know the LORD:
For they shall all know me,
From the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD:
For I will forgive their iniquity,
And I will remember their sin no more.
Jer. 31:31–34.

ANYONE with eyes to read and the comprehension of a child can see there are no Gentiles mentioned nor are there any Gentiles part of the New Covenant.
NONE.
Christ died for His Bride Israel.
The True Church of God is Israel, the Great Congregation that begun in the desert at the time of the Tabernacle. Over 3 million Jews included also in the Mosaic Covenant, and neither were there Gentiles in that Covenant.
Hallelu-JAH!

 

[Sereni-tea]

Saul was writing to Jewish Christians who had concern about the effect Messiah had on the Abrahamic Covenant.

23 But before faith came, we [Jews] were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
24 Wherefore the law was our [Jews] schoolmaster to bring us [Jews] unto Christ, that we [Jews] might be justified by faith.
25 But after that faith is come, we [Jews] are no longer under a schoolmaster.
26 For ye [Jews] are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you [Jews] as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye [Jews] are all [Jews] one in Christ Jesus.
29 And if ye [Jews] be Christ’s, then are ye [Jews] Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise. Gal. 3:23–29.

Do you see Saul trying to explain to Jewish Christians at their Jewish home churches in Ephesus that everything is OK? Do you see the Jewishness of his letter to Jewish Christians? They worried at what it meant to be a Messiah-follower and how this affected their standing in the Abrahamic Covenant. Saul is not teaching a new covenant of Jews and Gentiles. There is NO NEW COVENANT in the New Covenant writings of Saul, or James, or Peter, or John. All their letters are spent discussing and explaining Messiah's effect on their Law, their Psalms, and their Prophets - their Judaic religion.

As I have tried to explain to you elsewhere, your views expressed here are simply wrong.
In the passage above you will notice the pronoun changes from "we/our/our" in verses 23-25, referring to the Jews, to "ye/you/all" referring to the Gentiles. If all the pronouns referred to the Jews, why the change? It simply wouldn't make sense.

The church in Galatia was predominantly Gentile. This is evidenced by Galatians 4:8 where Paul says:
Formerly, when you did not know God, you were enslaved to those that by nature are not gods.
Paul would not be saying such a thing to Jewish Christians.

The New Covenant is between God and the House of Israel (northern kingdom) and the House of Judah (southern kingdom) - Jer. 31:31-34. There are no Gentiles mentioned nor are they included in the New Covenant. God is saving Gentiles without a covenant.
Israel is betrothed to God and is His Bride. Israel is the True Church of the Living God and the Church Jesus said He was going to build began at the Feast of Harvest (Pentecost) as a Jewish Church which is a continuation of the Church of God in the desert at the time of the Tabernacle, only they were called the "Great Congregation."
At the Marriage Supper Israel is there through Covenant.
Gentiles are there by invitation (Matt. 22.)
Throughout the Jewish Scriptures of the Law, the Psalms, and the Prophets which record the history of Israel's Redemption there is no place where God made covenant with Gentiles. None.

You can continue holding to your ideas, but to me it is very clear in Scripture that God promised Abraham that through his seed (i.e. Jesus) all nations (i.e. Gentiles or non-Jews) would be brought into covenant together with the Jews. This seems to be in agreement with what Paul is telling the Galatians:
And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel beforehand to Abraham, saying, “In you shall all the nations be blessed.” So then, those who are of faith are blessed along with Abraham, the man of faith. Galatians 3:8-9

He goes on referring again to the promises given to Abraham regarding the Gentiles:
Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us—for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who is hanged on a tree”— so that in Christ Jesus the blessing of Abraham might come to the Gentiles, so that we might receive the promised Spirit through faith. Galatians 3:13-14

He ends this chapter in this way:
For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek [i.e. Gentile], there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's offspring, heirs according to promise. Galatians 3:27-29

I'm not sure it can get any more explicit than that. Jews and Gentiles are now both members of the covenant people of God.

 

[jeremiah1five]

As I have tried to explain to you elsewhere, your views expressed here are simply wrong.
In the passage above you will notice the pronoun changes from "we/our/our" in verses 23-25, referring to the Jews, to "ye/you/all" referring to the Gentiles. If all the pronouns referred to the Jews, why the change? It simply wouldn't make sense.

Those Gentiles would be circumcised proselytes. They are the only Gentiles Jews would allow to be near them. When the Jews that went to the Feast of Harvests recorded in Acts 2 returned to their homes from where they came from they returned a changed people. Their experience baptized by the Spirit and Peter's sermon explaining the tongues would have been enough to open the door for the Holy Spirit to save others in their synagogues and if any Gentiles were saved they would be proselytes in these synagogues. But the recipients of the epistles are Jewish Christians and the writers - all Jewish Christians - referring to Gentiles would be these circumcised proselytes. If you can see the reasonableness of this then we are on the same page in identifying "Gentiles" in Saul's letters. And this is a big key to understanding more about the early church populated and controlled by Jewish Christians.

The church in Galatia was predominantly Gentile. This is evidenced by Galatians 4:8 where Paul says:
Formerly, when you did not know God, you were enslaved to those that by nature are not gods.
Paul would not be saying such a thing to Jewish Christians.

As above. Stop being stiff-necked.

You can continue holding to your ideas, but to me it is very clear in Scripture that God promised Abraham that through his seed (i.e. Jesus) all nations (i.e. Gentiles or non-Jews) would be brought into covenant together with the Jews. This seems to be in agreement with what Paul is telling the Galatians:
And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel beforehand to Abraham, saying, “In you shall all the nations be blessed.” So then, those who are of faith are blessed along with Abraham, the man of faith. Galatians 3:8-9

The "all nations" are not Gentiles for no Gentiles come from his loins, but the descendants of Ishmael (who had twelve sons and kings did rise from his loins), and the descendants of Esau.

He goes on referring again to the promises given to Abraham regarding the Gentiles:
Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us—for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who is hanged on a tree”— so that in Christ Jesus the blessing of Abraham might come to the Gentiles, so that we might receive the promised Spirit through faith. Galatians 3:13-14

Saul writes to Jewish Christians: "Christ redeemed us (Jews) from the curse of the Law...is referring to Jews. Gentiles were NEVER under the Law. But circumcised Gentile proselytes would qualify as the "Gentiles" in Saul's letters. There would be no idol-worshiping, hard-core, uncircumcised Gentiles even three streets from the nearest synagogue at this time as everything happening in Israel and to Jews would come from their Law, Psalms, and Prophets about this New Covenant they found themselves in.

He ends this chapter in this way:
For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek [i.e. Gentile], there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's offspring, heirs according to promise. Galatians 3:27-29

I'm not sure it can get any more explicit than that. Jews and Gentiles are now both members of the covenant people of God.

No, you're making them "members of the covenant" when the covenant is not even being mentioned. Saul is addressing these Jewish Christians' concern about being Messiah-followers made such by the Holy Spirit and their standing in the Abrahamic Covenant. Promises and covenants were NEVER made to Gentiles (Jer. 31:31-34.)
Tell me you agree the New Covenant described by Jeremiah is with the House of Israel and Judah and no Gentiles are being mentioned or included. Let's see if "explicit" works both ways.

 

[David1701]

Saul was writing to Jewish Christians who had concern about the effect Messiah had on the Abrahamic Covenant.

23 But before faith came, we [Jews] were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
24 Wherefore the law was our [Jews] schoolmaster to bring us [Jews] unto Christ, that we [Jews] might be justified by faith.
25 But after that faith is come, we [Jews] are no longer under a schoolmaster.
26 For ye [Jews] are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you [Jews] as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye [Jews] are all [Jews] one in Christ Jesus.
29 And if ye [Jews] be Christ’s, then are ye [Jews] Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise. Gal. 3:23–29.

Do you see Saul trying to explain to Jewish Christians at their Jewish home churches in Ephesus that everything is OK? Do you see the Jewishness of his letter to Jewish Christians? They worried at what it meant to be a Messiah-follower and how this affected their standing in the Abrahamic Covenant. Saul is not teaching a new covenant of Jews and Gentiles. There is NO NEW COVENANT in the New Covenant writings of Saul, or James, or Peter, or John. All their letters are spent discussing and explaining Messiah's effect on their Law, their Psalms, and their Prophets - their Judaic religion.

The New Covenant is between God and the House of Israel (northern kingdom) and the House of Judah (southern kingdom) - Jer. 31:31-34. There are no Gentiles mentioned nor are they included in the New Covenant. God is saving Gentiles without a covenant.
Israel is betrothed to God and is His Bride. Israel is the True Church of the Living God and the Church Jesus said He was going to build began at the Feast of Harvest (Pentecost) as a Jewish Church which is a continuation of the Church of God in the desert at the time of the Tabernacle, only they were called the "Great Congregation."
At the Marriage Supper Israel is there through Covenant.
Gentiles are there by invitation (Matt. 22.)
Throughout the Jewish Scriptures of the Law, the Psalms, and the Prophets which record the history of Israel's Redemption there is no place where God made covenant with Gentiles. None.

What a twister!

When a Gentile is saved, he is grafted in to the natural vine (spiritual Israel). There is only one body of the saved, comprising people from Jewish and Gentile backgrounds, who believe in the Messiah. We (from Jewish and Gentile backgrounds) are in covenant with the Lord, through faith in Jesus Christ.

The Lord broke down the middle wall of partition between Jews and Gentiles, creating one new man. In the Kingdom of God, there is no longer a spiritual distinction between Jews and Gentiles - we are all one in Christ Jesus and partakers in the New Covenant.

 

[jeremiah1five]

What a twister!

If you're calling me a [tongue] twister I'll take that as a compliment. I DO speak tongues.

When a Gentile is saved, he is grafted in to the natural vine (spiritual Israel). There is only one body of the saved, comprising people from Jewish and Gentile backgrounds, who believe in the Messiah. We (from Jewish and Gentile backgrounds) are in covenant with the Lord, through faith in Jesus Christ.

The spiritual body of Christ and natural Israel are two different entities. I am preparing a post to address this.
I think you'll love it.

The Lord broke down the middle wall of partition between Jews and Gentiles, creating one new man. In the Kingdom of God,

The kingdom of God is a Person: Christ. The ne new man is a spiritual man and is not natural branch Israel but a spiritual man, one that is of the spiritual body of Christ - NOT Israel nor her covenants.

there is no longer a spiritual distinction between Jews and Gentiles - we are all one in Christ Jesus and partakers in the New Covenant.

There never was a spiritual distinction between the two because the Spirit had not yet come. But there is a natural "wall" that did come down.
I don't think you twist Scripture, but I do think you just don't know what I know.

 

[Arial]

They are the only Gentiles Jews would allow to be near them.

That is a false statement. One of many. Either you are really uninformed or intentionally elevating Jews above non-ethnic Jews, even though God Himself shows no partiality in that regard. Acts 10:28-29,34-35. But the OT is full of examples of the Jews allowing Gentiles near them. They married Gentiles, they worshiped their gods in their high places. They were thrown out of their covenant land for it. They broke that covenant. It was God who forbid them from associating with the Gentiles and for the very reasons that occurred when they did so. They took on their pagan practices when they were to have only Him as their God.

And for you to continue to insist that God made no covenant with the Gentiles but only Israel, it simply shows your ignorance in your knowledge of covenant and why God relates to humanity through covenants and that He does so.

You present your case as though you were Jewish and are anti Gentile. If a non-Jew were to say the things about Jews that you say about Gentiles, I feel certain you would at once play the anti-Semantic card. And in fact it would not be allowed for anyone to do so on the forum. That is a two way street, so keep yourself under control.

You have claimed that you are not a Jew and you are not a Gentile. So I can only presume, from that and the way in which you declare full knowledge of all things and the final authority on Christianity and the Bible, that the other option is that you perceive yourself as an angelic being?

if any Gentiles were saved they would be proselytes in these synagogues.

Another lie that you simply state and do not support. They may have sometimes preached in the synagogues but if they did they would be thrown out and quickly. Often they spoke in the outer courts where Gentiles were. For all we know they preached along the wayside as they traveled back home.

But the recipients of the epistles are Jewish Christians and the writers - all Jewish Christians - referring to Gentiles would be these circumcised proselytes. If you can see the reasonableness of this then we are on the same page in identifying "Gentiles" in Saul's letters. And this is a big key to understanding more about the early church populated and controlled by Jewish Christians.

The recipients of the epistles were whoever was in the churches, and they were not exclusively Jews. History shows this and a spiritual being sent by God would definitely know this. And Saul wrote no letters. Paul wrote them. Saul was appointed by Jesus to be the apostle to the GENTILES, and was given the new name Paul. He wrote entire sections in some of his letters condemning the Judaizers in the area who claimed the insufficiency of Christ, demanding the Gentiles be circumcised and keep the Jewish customs. Were you there with those Judaizers?