THE BIBLICAL DEFINITION OF LOVE

[David1701]

Messiah was Promised to Israel
Messiah came to Israel
He is a "Jewish" Messiah.
Sadly, Christians hellenize the Gospel and the Word of God not considering the roots of the redemptive plan of God.
The roots are Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.
And twelve natural tribes.
Christianity is Completed Judaism.

The Messiah was not only promised to Israel. He was also promised to be a light to the Gentiles.

As things stand, most who believe in the Messiah come from a Gentile background, and there is a small remnant of those from a Jewish background; although, I do believe that, once the fulness of the Gentiles has come in, there will be a revival amongst the Jews.

Yes, Jesus and the earliest disciples were Jewish and we mustn't forget that, but we also mustn't overemphasise it.

 

[civic]

16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. Jn 3:16.

"loved" Greek Word: ἀγαπάω
Transliteration: agapaō
Part of Speech: verb

English Words used in KJV:
love 135
beloved 7
[Total Count: 142]

perhaps from agan (much) [or compare <H5689> (`agab)]; to love (in a social or moral sense).
[from James Strong].

So, Godly love which is Holy love is a verb, a word that describes "action."

This love has NOTHING to do with emotions, especially human emotions.

God's Love for His people called out of the world (John 17:6) is a Holy love. And as Christians we are commanded to not give that which is holy to dogs (unsaved, non-Covenant people.)
God's love given is to those He saves, and we are commanded to give this holy love to fellow believers in Covenant with God for the believer's edification.
There is no edification at all when holy love is given to reprobates who do not know Christ and are "none of His" (Rom. 8:9.)

Sadly, there are Christians that disobey God's command and waste Godly love when they give it to an ungodly people. This in effect is to support their ungodly living and by loving God's enemies is treason to the King of kings.
I KNOW what I as a Christian I 'got coming to me' from fellow believers and when Christians give holy love God commanded be given to brethren this is a betrayal to the fellowship of believers. It is spiritual adultery. It is spiritual fornication. And it is offensive.

That’s one type of love . Here is another type of love based upon relationship .

5368 philéō (from 5384 /phílos, "affectionate friendship") – properly, to show warm affection in intimate friendship, characterized by tender, heartfelt consideration and kinship.

So below would be accurate :


Jesus: "Peter, do you love Me?"
Peter: "Yes Lord, you know that I love you."

Jesus: "Peter, do you love Me?"
Peter: "Yes Lord, you know that I have intimate friendship, heartfelt affection for you."

Jesus: "Peter, do you love Me?"
Peter: *busted* "Yes Lord, you know that I have intimate friendship, heartfelt affection for you."."


Here is the amplified bible and youngs literal which conveys the meaning.

Amplified Bible
He said to him the third time, “Simon, son of John, do you love Me [with a deep, personal affection for Me, as for a close friend]?” Peter was grieved that He asked him the third time, “Do you [really] love Me [with a deep, personal affection, as for a close friend]?” And he said to Him, “Lord, You know everything; You know that I love You [with a deep, personal affection, as for a close friend].” Jesus said to him, “Feed My sheep.

Young's Literal Translation
He saith to him the third time, 'Simon, son of Jonas, dost thou dearly love me?' Peter was grieved that he said to him the third time, 'Dost thou dearly love me?' and he said to him, 'Lord, thou hast known all things; thou dost know that I dearly love thee.' Jesus saith to him, 'Feed my sheep;


John 5:20 V-PIA-3S
GRK: γὰρ πατὴρ φιλεῖ τὸν υἱὸν
NAS: For the Father loves the Son,
KJV: For the Father loveth the Son, and
INT: indeed [the] Father loves the Son

John 11:3 V-PIA-2S
GRK: ἴδε ὃν φιλεῖς ἀσθενεῖ
NAS: behold, he whom You love is sick.
KJV: behold, he whom thou lovest is sick.
INT: Behold he whom you love is sick

John 11:36 V-IIA-3S
GRK: Ἴδε πῶς ἐφίλει αὐτόν
NAS: See how He loved him!
KJV: Behold how he loved him!
INT: Behold how he loved him

John 12:25 V-PPA-NMS
GRK: ὁ φιλῶν τὴν ψυχὴν
NAS: He who loves his life loses
KJV: He that loveth his life
INT: He that loves the life

John 15:19 V-IIA-3S
GRK: τὸ ἴδιον ἐφίλει ὅτι δὲ
NAS: the world would love its own;
KJV: the world would love his own: but
INT: the own loved because moreover

John 16:27 V-PIA-3S
GRK: ὁ πατὴρ φιλεῖ ὑμᾶς ὅτι
NAS: Himself loves you, because
KJV: the Father himself loveth you, because
INT: the Father loves you because

John 16:27 V-RIA-2P
GRK: ὑμεῖς ἐμὲ πεφιλήκατε καὶ πεπιστεύκατε
NAS: you, because you have loved Me and have believed
KJV: because ye have loved me, and
INT: you me have loved and have believed

John 20:2 V-IIA-3S
GRK: μαθητὴν ὃν ἐφίλει ὁ Ἰησοῦς
NAS: Jesus loved, and said
KJV: whom Jesus loved, and saith
INT: disciple whom loved Jesus

1 Corinthians 16:22 V-PIA-3S
GRK: τις οὐ φιλεῖ τὸν κύριον
NAS: anyone does not love the Lord,
KJV: If any man love not the Lord
INT: anyone not love the Lord

Titus 3:15 V-PPA-AMP
GRK: Ἄσπασαι τοὺς φιλοῦντας ἡμᾶς ἐν
NAS: those who love us in [the] faith.
KJV: thee. Greet them that love us in
INT: greet those who love us in

Revelation 3:19 V-PSA-1S
GRK: ὅσους ἐὰν φιλῶ ἐλέγχω καὶ
NAS: Those whom I love, I reprove
KJV: As many as I love, I rebuke
INT: as many as if I love I rebuke and

 

[jeremiah1five]

The Messiah was not only promised to Israel. He was also promised to be a light to the Gentiles.

As things stand, most who believe in the Messiah come from a Gentile background, and there is a small remnant of those from a Jewish background; although, I do believe that, once the fulness of the Gentiles has come in, there will be a revival amongst the Jews.

Yes, Jesus and the earliest disciples were Jewish and we mustn't forget that, but we also mustn't overemphasise it.

Messiah was Promised to Israel, not Gentiles.
Gentiles were brought in later.
There was no Promise or Covenant made to Gentiles.
It was the Abrahamic Covenant.
Is it 'overemphasizing this truth' when Gentile Christendom has forgotten this truth and act and speak as thought Jesus Christ belongs to ONLY them?
Gentiles are grafted in.
But they think they're the root.

 

[David1701]

Messiah was Promised to Israel, not Gentiles.
Gentiles were brought in later.
There was no Promise or Covenant made to Gentiles.
It was the Abrahamic Covenant.
Is it 'overemphasizing this truth' when Gentile Christendom has forgotten this truth and act and speak as thought Jesus Christ belongs to ONLY them?
Gentiles are grafted in.
But they think they're the root.

Is. 42:5-7 (KJV)
5 ¶ Thus saith God the LORD, he that created the heavens, and stretched them out; he that spread forth the earth, and that which cometh out of it; he that giveth breath unto the people upon it, and spirit to them that walk therein:
6 I the LORD have called thee in righteousness, and will hold thine hand, and will keep thee, and give thee for a covenant of the people, for a light of the Gentiles;
7 To open the blind eyes, to bring out the prisoners from the prison, and them that sit in darkness out of the prison house.

Is. 49:5,6
5 ¶ And now, saith the LORD that formed me from the womb to be his servant, to bring Jacob again to him, Though Israel be not gathered, yet shall I be glorious in the eyes of the LORD, and my God shall be my strength.
6 And he said, It is a light thing that thou shouldest be my servant to raise up the tribes of Jacob, and to restore the preserved of Israel: I will also give thee for a light to the Gentiles, that thou mayest be my salvation unto the end of the earth.

The Lord was not given only to Jews.

Look, I'm from a Gentile background. I don't at all think that Jesus Christ belongs only to Gentiles; in fact, that's the wrong way round - we (all of his people, whether from a Jewish or Gentile background) belong to him.

Yes, Gentiles are grafted in.

No, I don't think that Gentiles are the root.

 

[jeremiah1five]

Is. 42:5-7 (KJV)
5 ¶ Thus saith God the LORD, he that created the heavens, and stretched them out; he that spread forth the earth, and that which cometh out of it; he that giveth breath unto the people upon it, and spirit to them that walk therein:
6 I the LORD have called thee in righteousness, and will hold thine hand, and will keep thee, and give thee for a covenant of the people, for a light of the Gentiles;
7 To open the blind eyes, to bring out the prisoners from the prison, and them that sit in darkness out of the prison house.

Is. 49:5,6
5 ¶ And now, saith the LORD that formed me from the womb to be his servant, to bring Jacob again to him, Though Israel be not gathered, yet shall I be glorious in the eyes of the LORD, and my God shall be my strength.
6 And he said, It is a light thing that thou shouldest be my servant to raise up the tribes of Jacob, and to restore the preserved of Israel: I will also give thee for a light to the Gentiles, that thou mayest be my salvation unto the end of the earth.

The Lord was not given only to Jews.

Look, I'm from a Gentile background. I don't at all think that Jesus Christ belongs only to Gentiles; in fact, that's the wrong way round - we (all of his people, whether from a Jewish or Gentile background) belong to him.

Yes, Gentiles are grafted in.

No, I don't think that Gentiles are the root.

You're still elbowing your way to get some of the glory in being Gentile and grafted into the Covenant.

Israel is that light.

 

[David1701]

You're still elbowing your way to get some of the glory in being Gentile and grafted into the Covenant.

Israel is that light.

When you start spreading misrepresentations and insults like this, you've lost the argument. Goodbye.

 

[jeremiah1five]

When you start spreading misrepresentations and insults like this, you've lost the argument. Goodbye.

I tell you "Salvation is of the Jews" [edit by mod, insulting language] You have issue with "Jews," and you have issue with Samaritans.
I think your own words represented you most accurately.

 

[David1701]

I tell you "Salvation is of the Jews" and your arrogance and pride surfaces. You have issue with "Jews," and you have issue with Samaritans.
I think your own words represented you most accurately.

I know that salvation is of the Jews. I have no issues with Jews at all. I have not even mentioned Samaritans.

Please stop misrepresenting and being insulting; it's very ungodly.

 

[ChristB4us]

16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. Jn 3:16.

"loved" Greek Word: ἀγαπάω
Transliteration: agapaō
Part of Speech: verb

English Words used in KJV:
love 135
beloved 7
[Total Count: 142]

perhaps from agan (much) [or compare <H5689> (`agab)]; to love (in a social or moral sense).
[from James Strong].

So, Godly love which is Holy love is a verb, a word that describes "action."

This love has NOTHING to do with emotions, especially human emotions.

God's Love for His people called out of the world (John 17:6) is a Holy love. And as Christians we are commanded to not give that which is holy to dogs (unsaved, non-Covenant people.)
God's love given is to those He saves, and we are commanded to give this holy love to fellow believers in Covenant with God for the believer's edification.
There is no edification at all when holy love is given to reprobates who do not know Christ and are "none of His" (Rom. 8:9.)

Sadly, there are Christians that disobey God's command and waste Godly love when they give it to an ungodly people. This in effect is to support their ungodly living and by loving God's enemies is treason to the King of kings.
I KNOW what I as a Christian I 'got coming to me' from fellow believers and when Christians give holy love God commanded be given to brethren this is a betrayal to the fellowship of believers. It is spiritual adultery. It is spiritual fornication. And it is offensive.

@CrazyCalvinistUncle & @Fred & @David1701 & @civic & @ReverendRV & @Sparrow & @Carbon & @Alive & @preacher4truth

Christ's love to sinners is to tell them the truth that they need Jesus Christ to save them from their sins of what the world says it is not a sin. Especially professing believers that need to know that truth so that when they see that sin destroying their lives as it gets worse & worse, then they may see their need for Christ to save them from their sins and not just for salvation for having believed in Him for when they were saved.

In a world where the churches are compromising with social values, many saved believers are led astray in not seeing their need for Jesus to also save them from those sins that the world says is okay or natural or just plain saying it is not a sin when it is.

There is that altar call to sinners to repent from sin that is leading potential believers away from Jesus Christ because they know they cannot do it.

If we remember how we love because He first loved us and while we were yet sinners, He died for us, then by His grace & by His help, we should share the gospel to sinners today of the hope they can have in Him for delivering them from their bondage to sin as well as give them eternal life by believing in Him to be saved.

1 John 4:19 We love him, because he first loved us.

Romans 5:7 For scarcely for a righteous man will one die: yet peradventure for a good man some would even dare to die. 8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. 9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.

Acts 3:26 Unto you first God, having raised up his Son Jesus, sent him to bless you, in turning away every one of you from his iniquities.

1 John 3:3 And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure..... 8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

2 Timothy 4:18 And the Lord shall deliver me from every evil work, and will preserve me unto his heavenly kingdom: to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.

Hebrews 12:1Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us, 2 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

Jude 1:24 Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy, 25 To the only wise God our Saviour, be glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and ever. Amen.

 

[Deleted member 5]

There is a...call to sinners to repent from sin that is leading potential believers away from Jesus Christ because they know they cannot do it.

Sorry, your Gospel is truncated and incorrect. You won't listen to anyone and continue to tag many of us to repeat your same errors.

"Repent, and believe the gospel" - Jesus Christ, Mark 1:15

"The times of ignorance God overlooked, but now he commands all people everywhere to repent..." Acts 17:30, preaching the Gospel by the power of the Spirit of God.

"And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit..." Acts 2:38; preaching the Gospel by the power of the Spirit of God.

"And that repentance for the forgiveness of sins should be proclaimed in his name to all nations, beginning from Jerusalem." Luke 24:47, via theopneustos word of God.

"...testifying both to Jews and to Greeks of repentance toward God and of faith in our Lord Jesus Christ." Acts 20:21 preaching of the Gospel via the power of the Holy Spirit of God.

Also Luke 13:1-5 shows the necessity of repentance.

The elect will be granted repentance unto life when they hear the Gospel.

FYI, I will continue to preach the entirety of the message, whether you think it is impossible, chasing sinners away, &c &c &c. Your accusations are incessant, unbiblical, and false.

Being true to the Gospel isn't truncating the message to acquiesce to man, nor bowing to your unbiblical methods. No one is chasing sinners away by preaching repentance. That's a false accusation on your part.

You've compromised the Gospel and have become pragmatic, unbiblical, user friendly/seeker sensitive, scratching the ears of the hearers.

Finally, all that Christ came to save will be saved; John 6:37ff. Therefore, your claim that we are "chasing them away" is proven false by the very word of God itself.

 

[jeremiah1five]

I know that salvation is of the Jews. I have no issues with Jews at all. I have not even mentioned Samaritans.

Please stop misrepresenting and being insulting; it's very ungodly.

[edit by mod: personal insults]
Christians through testing and tribulation are ordained by God in this way among others to "get a spine."
Be strong, be courageous. [edit by mod: personal insults]

 

[ChristB4us]

Sorry, your Gospel is truncated and incorrect. You won't listen to anyone and continue to tag many of us to repeat your same errors.

"Repent, and believe the gospel" - Jesus Christ, Mark 1:15

"The times of ignorance God overlooked, but now he commands all people everywhere to repent..." Acts 17:30, preaching the Gospel by the power of the Spirit of God.

"And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit..." Acts 2:38; preaching the Gospel by the power of the Spirit of God.

"And that repentance for the forgiveness of sins should be proclaimed in his name to all nations, beginning from Jerusalem." Luke 24:47, via theopneustos word of God.

"...testifying both to Jews and to Greeks of repentance toward God and of faith in our Lord Jesus Christ." Acts 20:21 preaching of the Gospel via the power of the Holy Spirit of God.

Also Luke 13:1-5 shows the necessity of repentance.

The elect will be granted repentance unto life when they hear the Gospel.

FYI, I will continue to preach the entirety of the message, whether you think it is impossible, chasing sinners away, &c &c &c. Your accusations are incessant, unbiblical, and false.

Being true to the Gospel isn't truncating the message to acquiesce to man, nor bowing to your unbiblical methods. No one is chasing sinners away by preaching repentance. That's a false accusation on your part.

You've compromised the Gospel and have become pragmatic, unbiblical, user friendly/seeker sensitive, scratching the ears of the hearers.

Finally, all that Christ came to save will be saved; John 6:37ff. Therefore, your claim that we are "chasing them away" is proven false by the very word of God itself.

Just as a reminder that I said people are reading that "to repent of sin" as given to sinners to repent from sin rather than looking to God to help them to repent from sin for why many are walking away.

And you claim that repent from sin was not repenting from general sin or all sins, but the sin of unbelief and that I was confused for why I was reading it another way and yet @David1701 confirmed that it was indeed from general sin, but you overlooked that.

From your scriptural references, it sure does seem like you are referring to more than just repenting from the sin of unbelief.

@ReverendRV seem to be confirming David's stance in trying to explain that to me also about how one born again is not necessarily saved and I had asked both of them for scripture, but wanted to try to reason it out instead through some clever line of man's wisdom.

Bottom line: You guys are not saying the same thing and each of you seem to state contrary statements for why I am confused as to where exactly you guys actually stand.

Here is that Statement of Faith again. with another one before that one;

5) We believe that, out of love for us, the Lord Jesus Christ died to atone for our sins according to the Scriptures and that all who repent of sin and place their faith in Him alone are reconciled to God by His shed blood. (Is 53:4-6; Mark 1:14-15; John 14:6; Rom 5:8; 6:23; 8:3; 1John 4:10; 1Pet 2:24-25)

The inconsistency in #5 is you say place their faith in Him "alone" and yet put repent of sin came before that as if requiring from the sinner.

7) We believe that all who repent of sin and receive the Lord Jesus Christ, which is by grace alone, through faith alone, are born of the Holy Spirit and thereby become the children of God and shall not come into condemnation and that the Lord Jesus Christ gives them everlasting life. (John 1:12-13; 3:16-18,36; 5:24-29; 10:27-29; Acts 4:12; Rom 8:1, 9-12.15-17, 10:9-11;Gal 4:24-29; Eph 1:5; 1John 5:12-13

You say who repent of sin & receive the Lord Jesus Christ and yet say that by grace alone through faith alone are born again of the Spirit.

And you guys cannot see my alarm for why I see sinners walking away from Jesus Christ because they are being honest with themselves that they cannot stop sinning first. This is why I would be coming across sinners thinking they have to clean up their lives first before coming to & believing in Jesus Christ when they should hope in Him to destroy the works of the devil in their lives to free them from sin's dominion also.

If I am confuse, then that should be enough to go before that throne of grace to ask if He has a better way of saying your faith that it does not get misunderstood in those evangelicals' heretical call to sinner to repent from sin as in all sin, before coming to & believing in Jesus Christ that you both seem to claim that is not what you are doing or saying.

 

[Carbon]

@CrazyCalvinistUncle & @Fred & @David1701 & @civic & @ReverendRV & @Sparrow & @Carbon & @Alive & @preacher4truth

Christ's love to sinners is to tell them the truth that they need Jesus Christ to save them from their sins of what the world says it is not a sin. Especially professing believers that need to know that truth so that when they see that sin destroying their lives as it gets worse & worse, then they may see their need for Christ to save them from their sins and not just for salvation for having believed in Him for when they were saved.

The lost sinner does not come to Christ because they see sin destroying their lives. They come to Christ because the enmity has been removed through regeneration. Not sure where you're getting your info from?

In a world where the churches are compromising with social values, many saved believers are led astray in not seeing their need for Jesus to also save them from those sins that the world says is okay or natural or just plain saying it is not a sin when it is.

The Holy Spirit will convict believers of sin. It's important to stay in scripture for the renewing of our minds.
Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect. Romans 12:2.
By being in the Word, it is not so easy for the world to fool us into sins. Though it still can as it does to so many. The world, the flesh and the devil are our great enemies.

There is that altar call to sinners to repent from sin that is leading potential believers away from Jesus Christ because they know they cannot do it.

There is no altar call in the bible.

If we remember how we love because He first loved us and while we were yet sinners, He died for us, then by His grace & by His help, we should share the gospel to sinners today of the hope they can have in Him for delivering them from their bondage to sin as well as give them eternal life by believing in Him to be saved.

It seems to me you have a desire to proclaim the gospel to the lost, which is good to see.

 

[ChristB4us]

The lost sinner does not come to Christ because they see sin destroying their lives. They come to Christ because the enmity has been removed through regeneration. Not sure where you're getting your info from?

I am saying sinner turns away from Christ because sin has dominion over their lives for why they cannot do it first on their own.

I am also saying as we see churches making compromises with sin as the world does, saved believers may not be aware of that sin that is making their lives worse and worse because they do not see it as a sin that they need Jesus to deliver them from that sin also when they do.

2 Timothy 3:13 But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived.

The Holy Spirit will convict believers of sin. It's important to stay in scripture for the renewing of our minds.
Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect. Romans 12:2.
By being in the Word, it is not so easy for the world to fool us into sins. Though it still can as it does to so many. The world, the flesh and the devil are our great enemies.

The only sin the Holy Spirit will convict of is the sin of unbelief which means He will be condemning unbelievers of that unforgiveable sin.

John 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you. 8 And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: 9 Of sin, because they believe not on me; 10 Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more; 11 Of judgment, because the prince of this world is judged.

As the Spirit of Christ, He may be grieved by our sins which we were warned not to do that, but it is by His words that a believer can be convinced of what is heresy & what are the works of the flesh.

There is no altar call in the bible.

I do not see an altar call as necessary for salvation but coming forward to be water baptized in His name as a public witness in being His disciple can be seen as an altar call.

It seems to me you have a desire to proclaim the gospel to the lost, which is good to see.

I thank the Lord for that.

 

[jeremiah1five]

I am saying sinner turns away from Christ because sin has dominion over their lives for why they cannot do it first on their own.

But Christ does not turn away from those He's saved. Not even the one whom He has saved:

28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. Jn 10:28.

38 For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, 39 Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord. Rom. 8:38–39.

I am also saying as we see churches making compromises with sin as the world does, saved believers may not be aware of that sin that is making their lives worse and worse because they do not see it as a sin that they need Jesus to deliver them from that sin also when they do.

True believers know sin in their lives. But Jesus Christ is the Author and Finisher of their faith and will bring the born-again believer to completion and eternal life when this life ends. Let the church follow the churches. YOU follow ME, Jesus said and let the dead bury their dead.

2 Timothy 3:13 But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived.

The only sin the Holy Spirit will convict of is the sin of unbelief which means He will be condemning unbelievers of that unforgiveable sin.

When a person meets Almighty God they KNOW it. They never forget who their Father is. Even if the world, the flesh, and the devil get the better of them in a certain point in their lives God may allow that believer to travel into the valley in order to again bring them to the mountaintop, better, stronger, wiser than they were before they went into the valley and back into sin. What God began when a believer gets entangled in sin God will complete in the day of Christ.
Unbelief is NOT the "unforgivable sin" for Christ died for unbelief in His elect people. The unforgivable sin is the presence of a non-elect person in this world who stands before a Holy Spirit whose Ministry is to apply the work of Christ's atonement to God's elect people. This work is NOT applied to the non-elect and the Holy Spirit is blasphemed. But it is not a sin of the tongue but of the heart/life of a non-elect person. These persons who are not chosen by God from all eternity are a blasphemy to the Presence of the Holy Spirit.

John 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you. 8 And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: 9 Of sin, because they believe not on me; 10 Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more; 11 Of judgment, because the prince of this world is judged.

As the Spirit of Christ, He may be grieved by our sins which we were warned not to do that, but it is by His words that a believer can be convinced of what is heresy & what are the works of the flesh.

ONLY through knowledge of the Word of God do we discern truth and lie with regard to heresy. WE MUST LEARN THE SCRIPTURE.

I do not see an altar call as necessary for salvation but coming forward to be water baptized in His name as a public witness in being His disciple can be seen as an altar call.

I thank the Lord for that.

In Scripture there is no such thing as an "altar-call." Jesus never practiced it, the apostles never practiced it. The "altar-call" originated with Charles Finney in the 1820s which was a gimmick in order to increas profit of donations to his cause. And it worked.
God doesn't use gimmicks. God uses Himself to draw any and all elect sinner to whom Christ died and for whom He is to save at the appointed TIME.
God will do all His good pleasure.

 

[ChristB4us]

But Christ does not turn away from those He's saved. Not even the one whom He has saved:

28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. Jn 10:28.

38 For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, 39 Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord. Rom. 8:38–39.

Granted; but if a former believer would deny him, He will deny them but in light of your verses, is why He still abides in former believers, even though they risk being denied by him when He comes as the Bridegroom, unless they repent.

2 Timothy 2:10 Therefore I endure all things for the elect's sakes, that they may also obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory. 11 It is a faithful saying: For if we be dead with him, we shall also live with him: 12 If we suffer, we shall also reign with him: if we deny him, he also will deny us: 13 If we believe not, yet he abideth faithful: he cannot deny himself.
This is why we endure for the elect's sake so that the former believers and saved believers living in iniquity may look to Him for help to see the lies and to depart from iniquity to be that vessel unto honor in His House which is the eternal glory that comes with our salvation in Christ Jesus.
2 Timothy 2: 18 Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some. 19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity. 20 But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour. 21 If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.

Any unrepentant iniquity that is still on that foundation that denies Him, He wll deny them but they are still in His House even though they are left behind at the pre great tribulation rapture event to die, but their spirits will be with the Lord in Heaven to wait for their resurrection after the great tribulation as vessels unto dishonor in His House for not departing from iniquity, as vessels of wood & earth, but still in His House.

True believers know sin in their lives. But Jesus Christ is the Author and Finisher of their faith and will bring the born-again believer to completion and eternal life when this life ends. Let the church follow the churches. YOU follow ME, Jesus said and let the dead bury their dead.

When a person meets Almighty God they KNOW it. They never forget who their Father is. Even if the world, the flesh, and the devil get the better of them in a certain point in their lives God may allow that believer to travel into the valley in order to again bring them to the mountaintop, better, stronger, wiser than they were before they went into the valley and back into sin. What God began when a believer gets entangled in sin God will complete in the day of Christ.
Unbelief is NOT the "unforgivable sin" for Christ died for unbelief in His elect people. The unforgivable sin is the presence of a non-elect person in this world who stands before a Holy Spirit whose Ministry is to apply the work of Christ's atonement to God's elect people. This work is NOT applied to the non-elect and the Holy Spirit is blasphemed. But it is not a sin of the tongue but of the heart/life of a non-elect person. These persons who are not chosen by God from all eternity are a blasphemy to the Presence of the Holy Spirit.

ONLY through knowledge of the Word of God do we discern truth and lie with regard to heresy. WE MUST LEARN THE SCRIPTURE.

When the world lies about sin and saying it is normal or not a sin and the liberal churches follow suit, this is why we need the scriptures.

2 Timothy 3:13 But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived. 14 But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them; 15 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. 16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17 That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.

In Scripture there is no such thing as an "altar-call." Jesus never practiced it, the apostles never practiced it. The "altar-call" originated with Charles Finney in the 1820s which was a gimmick in order to increas profit of donations to his cause. And it worked.
God doesn't use gimmicks. God uses Himself to draw any and all elect sinner to whom Christ died and for whom He is to save at the appointed TIME.
God will do all His good pleasure.

It depends on what you refer to what an altar call is about; coming forward to be saved? But a sinner is believing in Him, they are saved before they get up there. So an altar call is more like an opportunity as a public witness that you are a believer in Jesus Christ and usually, as far as the Bible goes, there is an altar call for saved believers to come forward and be water baptized in his name to declare themselves as disciples of Jesus Christ in bearing witness of their new found faith and their hope in Him as their Good Shepherd to help them to follow Him.

Acts 10:43 To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins. 44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word. 45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost. 46 For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter, 47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we? 48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.

That may be considered as an altar call in the Bible but it is for water baptizing new believers in their first step in their desire to be disciples of Jesus Christ in following Him; it is not a means to salvation when they were saved before they got water baptized.

 

[jeremiah1five]

Any unrepentant iniquity that is still on that foundation that denies Him, He wll deny them but they are still in His House even though they are left behind at the pre great tribulation rapture event to die, but their spirits will be with the Lord in Heaven to wait for their resurrection after the great tribulation as vessels unto dishonor in His House for not departing from iniquity, as vessels of wood & earth, but still in His House.

There will be no unrepentant iniquity as any foundation as all sin of the elect had been atoned on the cross.
There is no rapture. The way Jesus ascended is the same way He's coming back:

10 And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel; 11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven. Acts 1:10–11.

It depends on what you refer to what an altar call is about; coming forward to be saved? But a sinner is believing in Him, they are saved before they get up there. So an altar call is more like an opportunity as a public witness that you are a believer in Jesus Christ and usually, as far as the Bible goes, there is an altar call for saved believers to come forward and be water baptized in his name to declare themselves as disciples of Jesus Christ in bearing witness of their new found faith and their hope in Him as their Good Shepherd to help them to follow Him.

Yup. That's the altar-call developed by Finney. As I said, Christ didn't use it, the apostles never used it. So why do churches do extra-biblical stuff in their churches? And the ignorant follow them.

That may be considered as an altar call in the Bible but it is for water baptizing new believers in their first step in their desire to be disciples of Jesus Christ in following Him; it is not a means to salvation when they were saved before they got water baptized.

Keep your altar-call. I know the truth.

 

[ChristB4us]

There will be no unrepentant iniquity as any foundation as all sin of the elect had been atoned on the cross.
There is no rapture. The way Jesus ascended is the same way He's coming back:

The iniquity is not in that foundation but rather on it for how and why that fire will burn it away unless they turn to Him for help to depart from it before He comes in that day verse 13 as the Bridegroom, judging His House first for why some will be left behind.

1 Corinthians 3:10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon. 11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ. 12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble; 13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is. 14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. 15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire. 16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? 17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

10 And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel; 11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven. Acts 1:10–11.

Jesus did warn that some believers will draw back.

Hebrews 10:37 For yet a little while, and he that shall come will come, and will not tarry. 38 Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him. 39 But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul.

He even warned believers not to even go back to get something from their house ( that they treasure ) as if they can take it with them for why He reminded them of Lot's wife.

Luke 17:26 And as it was in the days of Noe, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man. 27 They did eat, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noah entered into the ark, and the flood came, and destroyed them all. 28 Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot; they did eat, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they builded; 29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all. 30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.

31 In that day, he which shall be upon the housetop, and his stuff in the house, let him not come down to take it away: and he that is in the field, let him likewise not return back. 32 Remember Lot's wife. 33 Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it; and whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it.

34 I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. 35 Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left. 36 Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. 37 And they answered and said unto him, Where, Lord? And he said unto them, Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together.

That is why Jesus taught us to set our hearts on the treasures in Heaven and not on the earth, because that can be a snare. We need His help not to value anything or anyone on earth so that He has us as willing to go and not just for abiding in him and not in iniquity still when He comes.

Yup. That's the altar-call developed by Finney. As I said, Christ didn't use it, the apostles never used it. So why do churches do extra-biblical stuff in their churches? And the ignorant follow them.

What did Finney say about it that is not Biblical? How did he put it?

Keep your altar-call. I know the truth.

Well, what do you call what Peter had asked of those saved Gentiles to come forward and be water baptized in Jesus's name then? Some may call that an altar call but that does not necessarily mean that is what an altar call is and so what would you call that?

 

[jeremiah1five]

The iniquity is not in that foundation but rather on it for how and why that fire will burn it away unless they turn to Him for help to depart from it before He comes in that day verse 13 as the Bridegroom, judging His House first for why some will be left behind.

1 Corinthians 3:10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon. 11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ. 12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble; 13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is. 14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. 15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire. 16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? 17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

Jesus did warn that some believers will draw back.

Hebrews 10:37 For yet a little while, and he that shall come will come, and will not tarry. 38 Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him. 39 But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul.

He even warned believers not to even go back to get something from their house ( that they treasure ) as if they can take it with them for why He reminded them of Lot's wife.

Luke 17:26 And as it was in the days of Noe, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man. 27 They did eat, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noah entered into the ark, and the flood came, and destroyed them all. 28 Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot; they did eat, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they builded; 29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all. 30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.

31 In that day, he which shall be upon the housetop, and his stuff in the house, let him not come down to take it away: and he that is in the field, let him likewise not return back. 32 Remember Lot's wife. 33 Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it; and whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it.

34 I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. 35 Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left. 36 Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. 37 And they answered and said unto him, Where, Lord? And he said unto them, Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together.

That is why Jesus taught us to set our hearts on the treasures in Heaven and not on the earth, because that can be a snare. We need His help not to value anything or anyone on earth so that He has us as willing to go and not just for abiding in him and not in iniquity still when He comes.

What did Finney say about it that is not Biblical? How did he put it?

Well, what do you call what Peter had asked of those saved Gentiles to come forward and be water baptized in Jesus's name then? Some may call that an altar call but that does not necessarily mean that is what an altar call is and so what would you call that?

They weren't Gentiles Peter addressed. They were the tribes of Israel:

14 But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them, Ye men of Judaea [Southern Tribes], and all ye that dwell at Jerusalem, be this known unto you, and hearken to my words: Acts 2:14.

16 But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel; Acts 2:16. [Gentiles know nothing of the prophet Joel for Joel was sent to Israel.]

36 Therefore let all the house of Israel [Northern Tribes] know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.
Acts 2:36.

There was no altar present when Peter spoke to Judaea and the House of Israel.

 

[ChristB4us]

They weren't Gentiles Peter addressed. They were the tribes of Israel:

14 But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them, Ye men of Judaea [Southern Tribes], and all ye that dwell at Jerusalem, be this known unto you, and hearken to my words: Acts 2:14.

16 But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel; Acts 2:16. [Gentiles know nothing of the prophet Joel for Joel was sent to Israel.]

36 Therefore let all the house of Israel [Northern Tribes] know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.
Acts 2:36.

There was no altar present when Peter spoke to Judaea and the House of Israel.

But what would you call that of what Peter had said even to the Jews to come forward to be water baptized?

And by the way, Peter did say that to the Gentiles too. This was what I was referring to when the Gentiles were saved first before asked to come and be water baptized in Jesus's name.

Acts 10:43 To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins. 44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word. 45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost. 46 For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter, 47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we? 48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.