THE BIBLICAL DEFINITION OF LOVE

[jeremiah1five]

But what would you call that of what Peter had said even to the Jews to come forward to be water baptized?

This washing mimicked the baptism of the Law and John the Baptist. It was symbolic. To be water baptized prefigures the washing of the water of the word which is Spirit-baptism. The only baptism that effectually saves.

And by the way, Peter did say that to the Gentiles too. This was what I was referring to when the Gentiles were saved first before asked to come and be water baptized in Jesus's name.

Under the Abrahamic Covenant there were Gentiles in very small numbers converts and adherents. But they were NOT among the camp placements God assigned to the twelve tribes surrounding the Tabernacle. They were a great way off. And they were not among the twelve tribes but separate as a people from the Law of Moses. There may have been Gentiles among Peter's crowd, but the message was to the twelve tribes of Israel. ALL prophecies concerned Christ and Israel. Not Gentiles. The Roman centurion, the Samaritan woman at the well, the other Gentiles in the Gospels Jesus ministered to may have been there at Pentecost and the tongue-speaking event. But these Gentiles were converts to the Jewish religion and friends and allies to Israel. Even the certain lawyer/ruler who asked Jesus how he may inherit eternal life (Lk. 18:18) was saved.

Acts 10:43 To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins. 44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word. 45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost. 46 For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter, 47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we? 48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.

Gentiles were to be baptized "in the name of the Father, and in the Son, and in the Holy Spirit."
Jews were to be baptized in the Name of Jesus.

 

[ChristB4us]

This washing mimicked the baptism of the Law and John the Baptist. It was symbolic. To be water baptized prefigures the washing of the water of the word which is Spirit-baptism. The only baptism that effectually saves.

Yes, but we were talking about altar calls as not being found in the Bible. What do you call that in asking them to come froward to be water baptized if you do not consider that as an altar call.

Under the Abrahamic Covenant there were Gentiles in very small numbers converts and adherents. But they were NOT among the camp placements God assigned to the twelve tribes surrounding the Tabernacle. They were a great way off. And they were not among the twelve tribes but separate as a people from the Law of Moses. There may have been Gentiles among Peter's crowd, but the message was to the twelve tribes of Israel. ALL prophecies concerned Christ and Israel. Not Gentiles. The Roman centurion, the Samaritan woman at the well, the other Gentiles in the Gospels Jesus ministered to may have been there at Pentecost and the tongue-speaking event. But these Gentiles were converts to the Jewish religion and friends and allies to Israel. Even the certain lawyer/ruler who asked Jesus how he may inherit eternal life (Lk. 18:18) was saved.

I cannot see the Roman centurion & the Gentiles under his command as converts to the Jewish religion. God had to replay a vision three times to convince Peter to go there to speak to them because they were not Jewish coverts but Gentiles as Peter had considered them unclean for why the Lord was rebuking Peter.

Acts 10:11 And saw heaven opened, and a certain vessel descending upon him, as it had been a great sheet knit at the four corners, and let down to the earth: 12 Wherein were all manner of fourfooted beasts of the earth, and wild beasts, and creeping things, and fowls of the air. 13 And there came a voice to him, Rise, Peter; kill, and eat. 14 But Peter said, Not so, Lord; for I have never eaten any thing that is common or unclean.

15 And the voice spake unto him again the second time, What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common.

16 This was done thrice: and the vessel was received up again into heaven.

17 Now while Peter doubted in himself what this vision which he had seen should mean, behold, the men which were sent from Cornelius had made enquiry for Simon's house, and stood before the gate, 18 And called, and asked whether Simon, which was surnamed Peter, were lodged there. 19 While Peter thought on the vision, the Spirit said unto him, Behold, three men seek thee. 20 Arise therefore, and get thee down, and go with them, doubting nothing: for I have sent them. 21 Then Peter went down to the men which were sent unto him from Cornelius; and said, Behold, I am he whom ye seek: what is the cause wherefore ye are come? 22 And they said, Cornelius the centurion, a just man, and one that feareth God, and of good report among all the nation of the Jews, was warned from God by an holy angel to send for thee into his house, and to hear words of thee.

Gentiles were to be baptized "in the name of the Father, and in the Son, and in the Holy Spirit."

Since "name" is singular; that name is Jesus Christ.

Jews were to be baptized in the Name of Jesus.

Right. So in all of the Book of Acts, were they ever baptized in the manner that Matthew has it written as? No. Because the name of the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Ghost is Jesus Christ as in the name of God you call upon to be saved with the Father & the Holy Spirit as Witnesses for when Jesus saves us. By being water baptized in His name, you are being a witness of being a disciple of Jesus Christ, the Son of God, to the Church & the world.

 

[jeremiah1five]

Yes, but we were talking about altar calls as not being found in the Bible. What do you call that in asking them to come froward to be water baptized if you do not consider that as an altar call.

Before Finney when someone was water baptized a person would dip that person in water. Where's the altar? Think like a Biblical Christian, not christianly.

I cannot see the Roman centurion & the Gentiles under his command as converts to the Jewish religion. God had to replay a vision three times to convince Peter to go there to speak to them because they were not Jewish coverts but Gentiles as Peter had considered them unclean for why the Lord was rebuking Peter.

I only mentioned the Roman centurion as a "God fearer." It says he loved their nation, even built a synagogue for them. AND he went to Jesus, Israel's Messiah. It is very reasonable that the Jews told him about Messiah and that this Jesus claimed to be Messiah and healed people. This Roman centurion had faith for his slave and went to the right person. He understood the complexities o0f the Ministry and Authority of Messiah when he told Jesus he says to one, "Go," and he "Goes," to another "do this" and it gets done.

Since "name" is singular; that name is Jesus Christ.

Right. So in all of the Book of Acts, were they ever baptized in the manner that Matthew has it written as? No. Because the name of the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Ghost is Jesus Christ as in the name of God you call upon to be saved with the Father & the Holy Spirit as Witnesses for when Jesus saves us. By being water baptized in His name, you are being a witness of being a disciple of Jesus Christ, the Son of God, to the Church & the world.

The primary purpose was to show the Lord's death to yourself. It has nothing to do with showing yourself as Christian to the world.
That comes as you begin to live the Christian life which is a new life for old things have passed away. And this takes time.

 

[ChristB4us]

Before Finney when someone was water baptized a person would dip that person in water. Where's the altar? Think like a Biblical Christian, not christianly.

I think altar call do not really have an altar. I think it is just a metaphor for coming forward.

I only mentioned the Roman centurion as a "God fearer." It says he loved their nation, even built a synagogue for them. AND he went to Jesus, Israel's Messiah. It is very reasonable that the Jews told him about Messiah and that this Jesus claimed to be Messiah and healed people. This Roman centurion had faith for his slave and went to the right person. He understood the complexities o0f the Ministry and Authority of Messiah when he told Jesus he says to one, "Go," and he "Goes," to another "do this" and it gets done.

Thanks for sharing.

The primary purpose was to show the Lord's death to yourself. It has nothing to do with showing yourself as Christian to the world.
That comes as you begin to live the Christian life which is a new life for old things have passed away. And this takes time.

I am sure many believers & seekers have a different reasons for coming forward.

If you do not like the term altar call, what would you call it then for coming forward to be water baptized?

 

[fastfredy0]

I'll take a shot ... always liked this question ... don't think most people get it right (maybe me too0

Love Defined: God’s love is an passionless, immutable, holy (separated from evil, ethical) disposition to favor (goodwill, benevolence, and willful delight, Habakkuk 1:13b You cannot look on wickedness with favor, 1 Corinthians 13:6 Love rejoices not in iniquity, but rejoices in the truth) according to the ethical loveliness and divine likeness of the object which is a bond of unity – Colossians 3:14 for everything is bound together in agreement when each one seeks the best for others); God himself and those “in Christ” being bonded in agreement. (“The love of God which is in Christ Jesus” (Romans 8:39) marks a limitation, both in the sphere and objects of His love).

 

[jeremiah1five]

I think altar call do not really have an altar. I think it is just a metaphor for coming forward.

Thanks for sharing.

I am sure many believers & seekers have a different reasons for coming forward.

If you do not like the term altar call, what would you call it then for coming forward to be water baptized?

Simple. If there's no altar for a sacrifice there is no need to call it an altar.

 

[civic]

Simple. If there's no altar for a sacrifice there is no need to call it an altar.

Our bodies are a living sacrifice. We present them before the Lord ( figuratively before the alter ). Romans 12:1.

 

[jeremiah1five]

Our bodies are a living sacrifice. We present them before the Lord ( figuratively before the altar ). Romans 12:1.

Baptism. It is an outward expression, not an altar.

 

[civic]

Baptism. It is an outward expression, not an altar.

sorry Romans 12:1 is not baptism. Nice try

A sacrifice requires an alter in Scripture.

Bible Basics 101.

next

 

[jeremiah1five]

Our bodies are a living sacrifice. We present them before the Lord ( figuratively before the altar ). Romans 12:1.

Baptism. It is an outward expression, not an altar.

 

[civic]

Baptism. It is an outward expression, not an altar.

Where is "baptism" in Romans 12:1 ?

next

 

[Predestined]

This fits right in...

Love Looks Like Something

By this everyone will know that you are My disciples, if you have love and unselfish concern for one another.”
John 13:35

Jesus didn’t say, “Somebody might be able to figure it out,” but “Everyone will know.” Love is obvious to anyone with eyes because it looks like something.

Disciples don’t just study and think, they do stuff. They don’t just learn a lesson from their teacher, they imitate their master day after day. The more you become a disciple of Jesus, the more you will love your brothers and sisters in His family like He did. And the watching world will see it and be attracted to you, and to Him.

 

[jeremiah1five]

Where is "baptism" in Romans 12:1 ?

next

The position of the poster to whom I responded is that he holds to the "altar call" that was instituted by Finney.
Do you also hold to the practice of an "altar call" in the Church of Christ?

 

[civic]

Simple. If there's no altar for a sacrifice there is no need to call it an altar.

Wrong as I have pointed out from Romans 12:1- our bodies are a living sacrifice on the alter before God. A living sacrifice - the sacrifices of old testament were presented alive to God and their blood was shed at the feet of the altar. Exodus 22:31 Leviticus 22:8. God will have us offer up ourselves as we read from Paul in Romans 12:1.

hope this helps !!!

 

[ChristB4us]

Simple. If there's no altar for a sacrifice there is no need to call it an altar.

1 Corinthians 10:18 Behold Israel after the flesh: are not they which eat of the sacrifices partakers of the altar?

James 2:21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?

I understand your application for why you apply altar to mean that but the Bible provides other uses for what that altar is meant & used for.

Matthew 5:22 But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire. 23 Therefore if thou bring thy gift to the altar, and there rememberest that thy brother hath ought against thee; 24 Leave there thy gift before the altar, and go thy way; first be reconciled to thy brother, and then come and offer thy gift.
Matthew 23:17 Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gold, or the temple that sanctifieth the gold? 18 And, Whosoever shall swear by the altar, it is nothing; but whosoever sweareth by the gift that is upon it, he is guilty. 19 Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gift, or the altar that sanctifieth the gift?

That seems to apply the altar as a place where one gives gifts to God.

Luke 1:8 And it came to pass, that while he executed the priest's office before God in the order of his course, 9 According to the custom of the priest's office, his lot was to burn incense when he went into the temple of the Lord. 10 And the whole multitude of the people were praying without at the time of incense. 11 And there appeared unto him an angel of the Lord standing on the right side of the altar of incense. 12 And when Zacharias saw him, he was troubled, and fear fell upon him.

That seems to apply altar of incense as when people can offer their prayers.

In the eyes of sinners, altar can be a place where they worship; just as the Jews do.

Acts 17:22 Then Paul stood in the midst of Mars' hill, and said, Ye men of Athens, I perceive that in all things ye are too superstitious. 23 For as I passed by, and beheld your devotions, I found an altar with this inscription, To The Unknown God. Whom therefore ye ignorantly worship, him declare I unto you. 24 God that made the world and all things therein, seeing that he is Lord of heaven and earth, dwelleth not in temples made with hands;

Something to reconsider as altar can be a place where saved believers go to like being water baptized in Jesus's name, making a spiritual sacrifice, in showing their devotion/desire to Jesus Christ as a public witness by His grace & by His help in being disciples of Jesus Christ.

 

[jeremiah1five]

Wrong as I have pointed out from Romans 12:1- our bodies are a living sacrifice on the altar before God. A living sacrifice - the sacrifices of old testament were presented alive to God and their blood was shed at the feet of the altar. Exodus 22:31 Leviticus 22:8. God will have us offer up ourselves as we read from Paul in Romans 12:1.

hope this helps !!!

Where do the Apostles [capital "A"] say along with baptism there is an altar?
Baptism is not an offering of a sacrifice.
It's an offering of obedience.

 

[civic]

Where do the Apostles [capital "A"] say along with baptism there is an altar?
Baptism is not an offering of a sacrifice.
It's an offering of obedience.

There is no baptism in Romans 12:1. You are arguing a strawman

 

[jeremiah1five]

There is no baptism in Romans 12:1. You are arguing a strawman

You're the one that quoted Rom. 12 and implied that baptism is a sacrifice.

The subject of discussion was "altar-call" and there is no "altar-call" in water baptism for there is no altar.

 

[civic]

You're the one that quoted Rom. 12 and implied that baptism is a sacrifice.

The subject of discussion was "altar-call" and there is no "altar-call" in water baptism for there is no altar.

No I did not I addressed your view on the alter proving your assumptions wrong

 

[jeremiah1five]

No I did not I addressed your view on the altar proving your assumptions wrong

So you agree with the poster that water baptism is an altar-call?