Sanctification

[ReverendRV]

There is a Formula in the Bible; Grace + Faith - Works = Works we were created for. The Formula means neither Grace nor Faith can belong to the Category of [- Works], lest we boast. We all agree that Grace cannot belong to the Category of [- Works], because Grace is the Gift of God. But when you also believe that Faith is the Gift of God, even when Faith is the result of our Love; Faith cannot belong to the Category of [- Works]...

Biblical, God given Faith which is expressed by a Born Again Christian; cannot be a Work of Merit. Provisionism's Faith is Meritorious because it is not the Gift of God in any Sense...

 

[Carbon]

There is a Formula in the Bible; Grace + Faith - Works = Works we were created for. The Formula means neither Grace nor Faith can belong to the Category of [- Works], lest we boast. We all agree that Grace cannot belong to the Category of [- Works], because Grace is the Gift of God. But when you also believe that Faith is the Gift of God, even when Faith is the result of our Love; Faith cannot belong to the Category of [- Works]...

Biblical, God given Faith which is expressed by a Born Again Christian; cannot be a Work of Merit. Provisionism's Faith is Meritorious because it is not the Gift of God in any Sense...

With my last few posts, are you understanding what I am saying? Why I believe sanctification is monergistic? The reason why I press this subject is I believe God gets all the glory.

EDIT} I believe this is the same way R C Sproul understands it.

 

[Carbon]

Yet it is God who works within us to do these things.

Amen brother! And by grace, we go.

As God works in us, and we remain faithful, out of love we want to live by the Spirit. As we are being sanctified, we realize more of our sin, we mortify the flesh, etc...All because of the Spirit working in us. The just shall live by faith. - sanctification.

 

[ReverendRV]

With my last few posts, are you understanding what I am saying? Why I believe sanctification is monergistic? The reason why I press this subject is I believe God gets all the glory.

EDIT} I believe this is the same way R C Sproul understands it.

I understand and agree...

I just think there are two perspectives on Sanctification; instant Imputation of a complete Sanctification in God's Perspective, and a growth toward Sanctification in our Perspective. Without Holiness, no one will see the LORD...

 

[Carbon]

I understand and agree...

I just think there are two perspectives on Sanctification; instant Imputation of a complete Sanctification in God's Perspective, and a growth toward Sanctification in our Perspective. Without Holiness, no one will see the LORD...

I agree with what you just said. Amen!

 

[ReverendRV]

I agree with what you just said. Amen!

I just looked at John Gill on the, "without Holiness, no one will God" Verse. He thinks we need to try to be Holy too...

 

[Carbon]

I just looked at John Gill on the, "without Holiness, no one will God" Verse. He thinks we need to try to be Holy too...

Well, don't you have a desire to be holy? I know I do. Therefore, we try.

 

[ReverendRV]

Well, don't you have a desire to be holy? I know I do. Therefore, we try.

At the end of the day, it's the 'All God' perspective that causes some people to deny anything that looks like Synergism. You can be a Monergist like Sproul, and still say parts of the Christian Life are synergistic; like personal Sanctification...

Christians are closer than they think; and closer than some will allow...


Ooopps; I finally said it here

 

[Carbon]

At the end of the day, it's the 'All Grace' perspective that causes some people to deny anything that looks like Synergism. You can be a Monergist like Sproul, and still say parts of the Christian Life are synergistic; like personal Sanctification...

Christians are closer than they think; and closer than some will allow...


Ooopps; I finally said it here

I still say you are wrong about Sproul. But, on to bigger things.

 

[ReverendRV]

I still say you are wrong about Sproul. But, on to bigger things.

Not to argue, but to show where he said it...

https://www.ligonier.org/learn/articles/no-shortcuts-growth

Sanctification, however, includes our efforts. We say it is synergistic because both God and we are doing something. Yet, we aren’t equal partners.

 

[Carbon]

Not to argue, but to show where he said it...

https://www.ligonier.org/learn/articles/no-shortcuts-growth

Sanctification, however, includes our efforts. We say it is synergistic because both God and we are doing something. Yet, we aren’t equal partners.

Not to argue? Oh man. You’re no fun.

 

[makesends]

I'm glad we have a good crowd of reformed here. And if not reformed, also very knowledgeable.

My question is, is Sanctification Monergoistic or Synergistic?
Can you support your view with scripture?

I'm not presenting this as a debate. Just looking to learn and get sharpened.
Proverbs 27:17 As iron sharpens iron,
So one person sharpens another.


Personally, I believe Sanctification is Monergistic. For now, I'll just give John 17:15, 17 I am not asking You to take them out of the world, but to keep them away from the evil one. Sanctify them in the truth; Your word is truth.

This for a long time has been a kind of a peeve of mine. To me, the Gospel is the whole business, from God speaking the facts into existence to the completed product, when we see him as he is, and even the very nature of our 'subsequent' heavenly existence. I have asked this question many times, but the usual answer is only the obvious one —it's not that sanctification is not monergistic, but that there is a special, or more obvious, monergism, to regeneration, in that we were not consulted nor asked for our permission, nor in any other way involved causally. In sanctification, what we do makes a difference as to result, though, granted, what we do there is also entirely by the grace of God. I characterize it as being along for the ride, delighted by the very fact of God letting me watch him do what he set out from the beginning to do, and THAT, for HIS sake —for his own pleasure and joy.

 

[makesends]

Not to argue, but to show where he said it...

https://www.ligonier.org/learn/articles/no-shortcuts-growth

Sanctification, however, includes our efforts. We say it is synergistic because both God and we are doing something. Yet, we aren’t equal partners.

One interesting thing to me is when I hear otherwise Arminianistic believers admit that whenever they do what is right, they in retrospect realize it wasn't really them, but Christ in them, doing it. That they couldn't even characterize it as a work, in its own right.

 

[ReverendRV]

One interesting thing to me is when I hear otherwise Arminianistic believers admit that whenever they do what is right, they in retrospect realize it wasn't really them, but Christ in them, doing it. That they couldn't even characterize it as a work, in its own right.

Yes!

I always say Arminians and Calvinists are closer than they think they are; and closer than some people will allow them to be. .

 

[makesends]

Yes!

I always say Arminians and Calvinists are closer than they think they are; and closer than some people will allow them to be. .

I grew up among semi-Arminian, Wesleyan leaning, Fundamentalist, Dispensationalist, Christian missionaries at a foreign Bible Institute. I remember realizing, (after I grew to believe what I subsequently found out was essentially Reformed tenets), how their prayers often sounded positively Calvinistic.

 

[CrazyCalvinistUncle]

"Holy," "sanctify" mean "to set apart," in this case, from sin, and to God.

That's sanctification, a daily walk.

Yeah? Sinned much today?

 

[CrazyCalvinistUncle]

If there is a work required from man, it is faith. XXIV of the Belgic Confession of Faith likewise stresses the importance of faith in connection with sanctification.
If you want to read it:


@Sereni-tea
@carl
@Ismael

Thoughts?

I have my quibbles with the Belgic. This might be another one. The Dutch ( understandably but to their detriment ) had a bone to pick with Israel. I've had a few epic conversations with my pastor, in fact, about replacement theology and antisemitism.

I'm going to take a different tack now...why is everyone seemingly adverse too the word and concept of Mortification?

Romans 8:
12 Therefore, brothers and sisters, we have an obligation—but it is not to the flesh, to live according to it. 13 For if you live according to the flesh, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live.

The Doctrine of Mortification | Monergism

by A. W. Pink It is the studied judgment of this writer, and he is by no means alone therein, that doctrinal preaching is the most pressing need of the

www.monergism.com

 

[Sereni-tea]

Sanctification is just as essential to salvation as justification. It's not enough that a sinner be acquitted of the guilt of sin and declared just. The sinner must also be freed from the penal consequence of sin, that is from the power and corruption of sin.

Or, in other words. The acquittal of God pronounced in justification must be actualized in the believer's life.
And that's exactly what God does in sanctification. When He progressively makes the justified sinner righteous by renewing his nature and removing the uncleanness of sin.

And though justification and sanctification are to be distinguished, they are never to be separated.

@Sereni-tea

Thoughts?

I agree that the two cannot be separated.

The Bible tells us that God works in us to conform us to the image of His Son:
For those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the firstborn among many brothers. And those whom he predestined he also called, and those whom he called he also justified, and those whom he justified he also glorified. Romans 8:29-30
And I am sure of this, that he who began a good work in you will bring it to completion at the day of Jesus Christ. Phil 1:6

However, I also do not think that we are to be passive in this process. The NT often tells us to flee temptation, to use our spiritual gifts, not to quench the Spirit, etc. and of course pray. God uses these things to make us grow in our faith. Does that make sanctification synergistic? I guess it may depend on how you look at it. Personally, I think, whatever part I may have in it, anything I do to increase in godliness is first and foremost a result of His work in me - drawing me to walk more closely with him, encouraging me to put into action the gifts He has given me, calling me to know Him more and more.

 

[Eleanor]

I have my quibbles with the Belgic. This might be another one. The Dutch ( understandably but to their detriment ) had a bone to pick with Israel. I've had a few epic conversations with my pastor, in fact, about replacement theology and antisemitism.

It's not replacement theology, it's fulfillment theology.
And it's not anti-semitism, it's the destiny of Israel to be grafted back into the one olive tree of God's people going all the way back to Abraham (Heb 11:16), the church, of both OT and NT saints (Heb 11:40, 12:22-23), IF they do not persist in unbelief (Ro 11:23) as they have for 2,000 years now.

I'm going to take a different tack now...why is everyone seemingly adverse too the word and concept of Mortification?

Romans 8:
12 Therefore, brothers and sisters, we have an obligation—but it is not to the flesh, to live according to it. 13 For if you live according to the flesh, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live.

The Doctrine of Mortification | Monergism

by A. W. Pink It is the studied judgment of this writer, and he is by no means alone therein, that doctrinal preaching is the most pressing need of the

www.monergism.com

 

[Eleanor]

Yeah? Sinned much today?

I'm not sinless, that's for sure. That won't be fixed until the resurrection and my physical spiritual (sinless) body.