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Is the Spirit in everything?

14 If he should set his heart to it
and gather to himself his spirit and his breath,

15 all flesh would perish together,
and man would return to dust.


Job 34:14-15

I believe the Spirit is in every form of life. In believers and un believers. Or it simply wouldnt exist.

Not to the same measure though. As it is a different measure from the saved, the unsaved and snimals.

Does this passaghes in Job teach ssomthing different?
I agree, though I don't think in terms of "measure" but in "kind" of in-ness. It is not that "A rock is mostly rock and partly God, while we are mostly God and partly dust". The very essence of what both rock and man and energy field are may be from God, but he does not consist of any of these things, as Pantheism would have it.

I had a debate once with a relative, who thought that there are good things, (the redeemed and good angels), and there are bad things, (sinners and demons/devil), but everything else is neutral. I disagree completely. There are indeed bad things, but everything else is good, and even the very existence of the bad things depends entirely on God's continued upholding. But as Rasta-man says, "It's all good", (in a sense). There is no neutral, with God.

The existence of rocks and galaxies and energy fields depends on God, but he does not dwell in them the way animism would have it. But he does dwell in his redeemed.
 
By what then? What does Scripture say all things are held up by? It says by the word of His power; Hebrews 1:2-3. It does not say by the Spirit indwelling all things.
But what does that mean?
Consider creation. The Father willed it, the Son spoke it and the Spirit did it.

So all things were created by God, in three persons. The Spirit is involved in creating and sustaining. Wouldn’t you agree?
 
But what does that mean?
Consider creation. The Father willed it, the Son spoke it and the Spirit did it.

So all things were created by God, in three persons. The Spirit is involved in creating and sustaining. Wouldn’t you agree?
You're simply dismissing the text as if it's not clear. That's not a good hermeneutic. The text demonstrates the universe is held up by the word of His power, not by Spirit indwelling.
 
Thanks for that @preacher4truth .

Hebrews 1:2-3

New International Version

2 but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom also he made the universe. 3 The Son is the radiance of God’s glory and the exact representation of his being, sustaining all things by his powerful word. After he had provided purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven.
 
You're simply dismissing the text as if it's not clear. That's not a good hermeneutic. The text demonstrates the universe is held up by the word of His power, not by Spirit indwelling.
So Christ speaks and the Spirit does nothing? No involvement?
 
14 If he should set his heart to it
and gather to himself his spirit and his breath,

15 all flesh would perish together,
and man would return to dust.


Job 34:14-15

I believe the Spirit is in every form of life. In believers and un believers. Or it simply wouldnt exist.

Not to the same measure though. As it is a different measure from the saved, the unsaved and animals.

Does this passages in Job teach something different?
Nope...I think you have it right, Carbon. Even the creatures that don't use oxygen to live. Remove that process and they are dead.

Animals do not need salvation. They obey God even under the curse of Adam.

Acts 17:
22 So Paul stood in the midst of the Areopagus and said, “Men of Athens, I see that you are very religious in all respects. 23 For while I was passing through and examining the objects of your worship, I also found an altar with this inscription, ‘TO AN UNKNOWN GOD.’ Therefore, what you worship in ignorance, this I proclaim to you. 24 The God who made the world and everything that is in it, since He is Lord of heaven and earth, does not dwell in temples made by hands; 25 nor is He served by human hands, as though He needed anything, since He Himself gives to all people life and breath and all things; 26 and He made from one man every nation of mankind to live on all the face of the earth, having determined their appointed times and the boundaries of their habitation, 27that they would seek God, if perhaps they might feel around for Him and find Him, though He is not far from each one of us; 28 for in Him we live and move and exist, as even some of your own poets have said, ‘For we also are His descendants.’ 29 Therefore, since we are the descendants of God, we ought not to think that the Divine Nature is like gold or silver or stone, an image formed by human skill and thought. 30 So having overlooked the times of ignorance, God is now proclaiming to mankind that all people everywhere are to repent, 31 because He has set a day on which He will judge [v]the world in righteousness through a Man whom He has appointed, having furnished proof to all people by raising Him from the dead.”

John 1:
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being. In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. And the Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not overtake it.
 
14 If he should set his heart to it
and gather to himself his spirit and his breath,

15 all flesh would perish together,
and man would return to dust.


Job 34:14-15

I believe the Spirit is in every form of life. In believers and un believers. Or it simply wouldnt exist.

Not to the same measure though. As it is a different measure from the saved, the unsaved and snimals.

Does this passaghes in Job teach ssomthing different?
We got to be careful here as pantheism is God is in everything.
 
We got to be careful here as pantheism is God is in everything.
I agree we must be careful. I do not agree God is everything and everything is God. That’s not what I’m saying at all.

I believe this is something that many, including myself have never considered before. It’s deep and we must be careful
 
We got to be careful here as pantheism is God is in everything.
Eh...sorta. God in everything is no big deal. God *is* everything is a problem.

Salvation by mere regional association isn't a thing either. I dare you to find somewhere God isn't.

And "Upheld by the word of His power" is...breath. Unless he was mumbling. Well...no. Theology Dork.
 
I think he is making a distinction in the roles of the Son and the spirit to which I agree.
There is a distinction between the Father, Son and Holy Spirit.
Though the distinction still only one God. So if all are upheld by the word, it’s also the Spirit. Can you separate?
 
There is a distinction between the Father, Son and Holy Spirit.
Though the distinction still only one God. So if all are upheld by the word, it’s also the Spirit. Can you separate?
Just like within a marriage, a family, the church there are different roles/functions. That has nothing to do with nature. Both the Father/ Son send the Spirit. The Spirit does not send Himself. The Spirit glorifies the Son, the Spirit does not glorify Himself. The Son glorifies the Father. The Spirit hears what the Son asks Him to do and performs those tasks. Jesus in John 14-16 goes into great detail on those roles within the Godhead. They have different functions they do for the believer.
 
Just like within a marriage, a family, the church there are different roles/functions. That has nothing to do with nature. Both the Father/ Son send the Spirit. The Spirit does not send Himself. The Spirit glorifies the Son, the Spirit does not glorify Himself. The Son glorifies the Father. The Spirit hears what the Son asks Him to do and performs those tasks. Jesus in John 14-16 goes into great detail on those roles within the Godhead. They have different functions they do for the believer.
I can agree with that.
 
So Christ speaks and the Spirit does nothing? No involvement?


I'm still waiting for you to deal with the text. In addition, you know I believe the Spirit is involved in the creation, but that doesn't necessitate that He indwells all things, nor does it assert anything of the sort.

Romans 8 is clear that the natural man is devoid of the Spirit. So does Jude. Those texts are a refutation of the teaching the Spirit of God is in everything which would include every man. The latter is pretty much Pantheism.
 
We got to be careful here as pantheism is God is in everything.
Exactly. I'm not seeing the texts in Job supporting their theory, clearly the context is man in said text. I've read zero commentaries that support that as the meaning of the text either.
 
I'm still waiting for you to deal with the text. In addition, you know I believe the Spirit is involved in the creation, but that doesn't necessitate that He indwells all things, nor does it assert anything of the sort.

Romans 8 is clear that the natural man is devoid of the Spirit. So does Jude. Those texts are a refutation of the teaching the Spirit of God is in everything which would include every man. The latter is pretty much Pantheism.
I thought I dealt with the text? Any part in particular?
 
I'm still waiting for you to deal with the text. In addition, you know I believe the Spirit is involved in the creation, but that doesn't necessitate that He indwells all things, nor does it assert anything of the sort.

I think the sticking point here ( and I understand it ) is the word "indwells". You are thinking in a salvific sense and I'm thinking in an "empowering" sense. In a basic "alive" sense.

So how do we work through this? The Scripture says Spirit and breath. The removal of which would literally cause the death of all things. I can distinguish between the salvific empowering of the Spirit and the spiritual deadness of unregenerate man.
 
I thought I dealt with the text?
No, you brushed it off, and said something like so what, what does it mean?
Any part in particular?
The Hebrews text.

But brethren if you all want to believe the Spirit indwells the lost, rocks, leaves, grasshoppers, be my guest. Apparently, you believe He has to indwell them for them to exist, yet Hebrews 1:2-3 shows that isn't the case, that all things are held up by the word of His power, not by the indwelling Spirit.

So, if you all want to believe that, that's fine with me. Hopefully, if I don't, that can be fine with you as well.

Other than that it seems to not be a profitable engagement. No harm, no foul, no worries. :)
 
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