Imputed Righteousness or Imparted Righteousness, what did the Thief on the Cross get?

[brightfame52]

Imputation

If the Righteousness of Christ doth come upon all the Elect unto Justification, in the same manner as Adams sin came upon all men to condemnation, as the Apostle shows it doth, Rom.5; then it must follow, that the Righteousness of Christ was reckoned or imputed to the Elect, before they had a Being, and then much more before they do believe in Him; for it is evident that Adams sin came upon all men to condemnation, before they had a Being; for by that first transgression {says the Apostle, vers.12,} sin entered into the world; and more plainly, “death passed upon all men;” the Reason follows, because in him, or in his loins, all have sinned. Now as in Adam, the non-elect; that is, all that shall perish, were constituted sinners, before they had a Being, by reason of the imputation of his disobedience to them; so in Christ the elect; that is, all that shall be saved, were constituted righteous; his obedience being imputed unto them by God, before they had any Being, otherwise than in him as their Head and common Person. - Now the Apostle hath observed, That God in justifying, and imputing Righteousness, calleth things that are not, as if they were, {Rom.4:17,} as the Righteousness of Christ was actually imputed to the Patriarchs before it was wrought; and our sins were actually imputed to Christ before they were committed; so I see no inconvenience in saying, that Christ’s Righteousness is by God imputed to the Elect, before they have a Being. William Eyre {Justification without Conditions – 1654} William_Eyre

 

[Hobie]

I see a contrast here between servants. There are only two kinds of servants in this world, in the spiritual sense: servants of sin unto death or servants of obedience unto righteousness. When we place our faith exclusively in Jesus Christ for salvation (Ephesians 2:8,9) believe the gospel by trusting in His finished work of redemption as the ALL-sufficient means of our salvation, (Romans 1:16; 1 Corinthians 15:1-4) we then become "servants of obedience unto righteousness."

Being slaves of sin is put in the past tense. Paul goes on in Romans 6:18 - "You have been set free from sin and have become slaves to righteousness."

Notice in Romans 10:10 - For with the heart one believes unto righteousness..

Notice in Romans 4:5 - But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness.

And yet if we continue to sin, what then?

 

[brightfame52]

And yet if we continue to sin, what then?

Sin isnt imputed to the Justified, that's one of the blessings of Christ Righteousness being imputed and sins forgiven by His death Rom 4:5-8

5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

6 Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works,

7 Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.

8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.

And the Justified are to continue to sin due to their union with sinful flesh the rest of their days Rom 7,

But God will not impute or charge them with it, not ever

 

[Hobie]

Sin isnt imputed to the Justified, that's one of the blessings of Christ Righteousness being imputed and sins forgiven by His death Rom 4:5-8

5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

6 Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works,

7 Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.

8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.

And the Justified are to continue to sin due to their union with sinful flesh the rest of their days Rom 7,

But God will not impute or charge them with it, not ever

Peter was justified and yet he denied the Lord, have to continue into sanctification..

 

[brightfame52]

Peter was justified and yet he denied the Lord, have to continue into sanctification..

I dont know what in the world you talking about. Did you understand my post ?

 

[Eleanor]

Sin isnt imputed to the Justified, that's one of the blessings of Christ Righteousness being imputed and sins forgiven by His death Rom 4:5-8

Sin is imputed to all mankind (Ro 5:17-19, 12-16)--it was
the imputed sin of Adam that caused all to die between Adam and Moses when there was no transgression of the law (Ro 4:13) to cause their deaths,
which imputation of Adam's sin to all those of Adam was the pattern (Ro 5:14) for the imputation of Christs righteousness to all those of Christ (Ro 5:18-19)--and
which sin is remitted when one comes to saving faith and is justified (declaration of "not guilty," sentence of acquittal, pronouncement of sin's remittal) by God. (Ro 3:28)

 

[brightfame52]

@Eleanor

Sin is imputed to all mankind (Ro 5:17-19, 12-16)-

That sin which the elect incurred was imputed to Christ 2 Cor 5:21

21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

Thats Gospel Truth, the sin of the elect that they incurred Rom 5:18 was charged to Christ their Surety, and His Suretyship Righteousness was imputed to them, and so God will not impute sin to them Rom 4:6-8

6 Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works,

7 Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.

8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.

For God to charge/impute the elects sins to them, and to have imputed them to Christ also, is a miscarriage of Justice.

 

[makesends]

And yet if we continue to sin, what then?

We --that is, the elect, those upon whom God has chosen to show mercy-- once born again don't continue to sin, having become slaves to righteousness. The Bible says so. 1 John

 

[makesends]

Sin is imputed to all mankind (Ro 5:17-19, 12-16)--it was
the imputed sin of Adam that caused all to die between Adam and Moses when there was no transgression of the law (Ro 4:13) to cause their deaths,
which imputation of Adam's sin to all those of Adam was the pattern (Ro 5:14) for the imputation of Christs righteousness to all those of Christ (Ro 5:18-19)--and
which sin is remitted when one comes to saving faith and is justified (declaration of "not guilty," sentence of acquittal, pronouncement of sin's remittal) by God. (Ro 3:28)

Romans 8:7, I've often wondered why Paul speaks of the mind governed by the flesh being at enmity with God, is unable to submit to God's Law. I've even wished it said unable to submit to God, in my arguing with those insisting on self-determinism, so that they couldn't argue the difference.

Well, for the first time it occurs to me today, that the Romans 8 reference to the law is tied to the reference to the law in Romans 4:13 and the implication that those before Moses had no sin accounted to them. Lol, kinda reminds me of @Arial 's "tapestry".

 

[Eleanor]

@Eleanor


That sin which the elect incurred was imputed to Christ 2 Cor 5:21

One's sin is not imputed to Christ in time until one comes to saving faith in time.

Just as all those ordained to be born in time do not exist until they actually are born in time.

 

[brightfame52]

One's sin is not imputed to Christ in time until one comes to saving faith in time.

Just as all those ordained to be born in time do not exist until they actually are born in time.

Thats a foolish statement. Then a person cant believe Jesus died for their sins before they believe, which is contrary to the Gospel 1 Cor 15:3-4

And if He died for their sins on Calvary tree 1 Pet 2:24

24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

Then their sins had to be charged to Him when He bare them on the tree.

Your comment is anti Gospel

 

[Eleanor]

Thats a foolish statement. Then a person cant believe Jesus died for their sins before they believe, which is contrary to the Gospel 1 Cor 15:3-4

How can they believe before they can believe?

Being spiritually dead in trespasses and sins (Eph 2:1), one can make no spiritual response of any kind (including belief) until one is born again (Jn 3:3-5) into spiritual eternal life by the sovereign (as unaccountable as the wind, Jn 3:6-8) choice of the Holy Spirit.

 

[brightfame52]

@makesends

Romans 8:7, I've often wondered why Paul speaks of the mind governed by the flesh being at enmity with God, is unable to submit to God's Law. I've even wished it said unable to submit to God, in my arguing with those insisting on self-determinism, so that they couldn't argue the difference.

Its the same, unable to submit to Gods Law is unable to submit to God period. Also the word law there nomos :

anything established, anything received by usage, a custom, a law, a command

1. of any law whatsoever

1. 1. a law or rule producing a state approved of God
      
      1. by the observance of which is approved of God
   2. a precept or injunction
   3. the rule of action prescribed by reason
2. of the Mosaic law, and referring, acc. to the context. either to the volume of the law or to its contents
3. the Christian religion: the law demanding faith, the moral instruction given by Christ, esp. the precept concerning love

Faith or believing in Christ are commanded by God 1 Jn 3 23

23 And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment.

Acts 17:30

30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:

And the fact still remains the Carnal Mind is enmity against God, that doesnt change until a new heart is given

 

[makesends]

@makesends


Its the same, unable to submit to Gods Law is unable to submit to God period. Also the word law there nomos :

anything established, anything received by usage, a custom, a law, a command

1. of any law whatsoever
2. 1. a law or rule producing a state approved of God
      1. by the observance of which is approved of God
   2. a precept or injunction
   3. the rule of action prescribed by reason
3. of the Mosaic law, and referring, acc. to the context. either to the volume of the law or to its contents
4. the Christian religion: the law demanding faith, the moral instruction given by Christ, esp. the precept concerning love

Faith or believing in Christ are commanded by God 1 Jn 3 23

23 And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment.

Acts 17:30

30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:

And the fact still remains the Carnal Mind is enmity against God, that doesnt change until a new heart is given

Of course it still shows that the unredeemed are unable to submit to God! I didn't imply otherwise.

What I said was that I had wished it didn't say "law" so that they wouldn't be able to call up that sidetrack, i.e. to, in their minds, consider an escape from the truth that the unregenerated is unable to submit to God. I had wished that I could cut that poor argument off at the knees.

 

[brightfame52]

Of course it still shows that the unredeemed are unable to submit to God! I didn't imply otherwise.

What I said was that I had wished it didn't say "law" so that they wouldn't be able to call up that sidetrack, i.e. to, in their minds, consider an escape from the truth that the unregenerated is unable to submit to God. I had wished that I could cut that poor argument off at the knees.

I understand, yet the word law can still be advantageous from a argument standpoint because of its wide range of meaning.

 

[Eleanor]

Thats a foolish statement. Then a person cant believe Jesus died for their sins before they believe,

They can believe Christ died for the sin of those who believe, and to partake in that remittanec of sin one must believe.

 

[EarlyActs]

We can start with describing both so we have a starting point of the core doctrine. Imputed righteousness is the concept that the "righteousness of Christ ... is imputed to true believers that is, treated as if it were theirs through faith. This acceptance is also referred to as justification. Thus this doctrine is practically synonymous with justification by faith. So thus, those who accept Christ have their sins covered by His righteousness and are justified.

Now in the process of sanctification, the heart and mind of the true believers are changed by the Holy Spirit. This is where 'Imparted Righteousness' comes in. Imparted righteousness, is that gracious gift of God given at the moment of the 'new birth' when one accepts Christ, which enables a Christian disciple to strive for holiness and sanctification.

From the Wesleyan Arminianian view, we get the belief that imparted righteousness works in tandem with imputed righteousness. Imputed righteousness is the righteousness of Jesus credited to the Christian, enabling the Christian to be justified; imparted righteousness is what God does in Christ by the power of the Holy Spirit after justification, working in the Christian to enable and empower the process of sanctification and, in Wesleyan thought, Christian perfection.

So my question is, which one did the thief on the cross get (and by extension what is there for us), or could it have been both, and if so, how?

Imparted is better defined as 'what God does in the believer through the Spirit'--the 'in Christ' part being a done deal.

He had virtually no human life left, so there would be very little imparted. Your question is false.

 

[mailmandan]

And yet if we continue to sin, what then?

1 John 1:8-10; 2:1; 1 John 3:9.