Flesh Versus The Spirit.

[Behold]

1 John 1:8-10

What creates this false doctrinal idea that we are to confess sin that is already dealt with 2000 yrs ago by Christ on the Cross is simply bad theological teaching that is universally applied to the Church.
Christians, from border to border and around the world are taught, based on 2 verses... that their Christianity is... "Sin, Confess, Repeat".

What happened is.....Some really bad teachers/theologians, (Legalists) took these 2 verses and ruined the faith of most Believers.

1.) "that which i would do i can't and that which hate i Do".

So, that is from Paul. and that is just the very beginning of what Paul continues to teach, and these horrible bible teachers didn't read farther.
They stopped there, Paul didnt.

And then, next.... they jammed that verse into this one.. and came up with a way to keep a believer deceived and confessing sin and repeating, their entire life, after they are born again, just as the Devil would have them doing it., vs, living in VICTORY, "made free from sin", as Paul teaches.

Here is part 2 of the cult teaching that keeps most believers tied down as "sin, confess, repeat".

2.) 1 John 1:9.., that talks about "if we say we have no sin" = that is not talking to the Christian.

Reader, read 1 John 3:9, as that one is for YOU... Do that one.

So, those 2 verses are combined to create this horrible cult theology of..."sin, confess, repeat" is "Christianity.
ALL it is........ is BONDAGE and Deception.

 

[Ritajanice]

And what about this scripture @Behold ..addressing a Born Again?

◄ 1 John 3:9 ►

Audio Crossref Comment Greek Verse (Click for Chapter) New International Version No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God’s seed remains in them; they cannot go on sinning, because they have been born of God. New Living Translation Those who have been born into God’s family do not make a practice of sinning, because God’s life is in them. So they can’t keep on sinning, because they are children of God. English Standard Version No one born of God makes a practice of sinning, for God’s seed abides in him; and he cannot keep on sinning, because he has been born of God. Berean Standard Bible Anyone born of God refuses to practice sin, because God’s seed abides in him; he cannot go on sinning, because he has been born of God. Berean Literal Bible Anyone having been born of God does not practice sin, because His seed abides in him, and he is not able to continue sinning, because he has been born of God.

 

[Behold]

And what about this scripture @Behold ..addressing a Born Again?

​

◄ 1 John 3:9 ►

​

No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God’s seed remains in them; they cannot go on sinning, because they have been born of God.

All scripture is given to the Christian, but not all scripture is aimed at the believer as doctrine.

So, when we read the NT, we have to be careful that we dont wrong apply a verse to ourselves as DOCTRINE, that isn't for the born again Believer.
As if you do that your Christianity is going to be wrecked, theologically, and your walk of faith is going to be ruined.

1 John 3:9, is doctrinal, for the Believer, as this verse is in alignment with the imputed righteousness that God has delivered to the believer that recreates them , not as a sinner, but as as "new Creation in Christ" where there is no sin.

See, God can't join Himself to a sinner.
He can only join Himself to RIGHTEOUSNESS, that He has cause the born again to become as "the righteousness of GOD... in Christ".

So, when we read verses that DEFINE you as a SINNER< or as having sin, then this verse is not talking to the born again Christian who is "made righteous" having received "the gift of Righteousness".

 

[Ritajanice]

All scripture is given to the Christian, but not all scripture is aimed at the believer as doctrine.

So, when we read the NT, we have to be careful that we dont wrong appl, a verse to ourselves as DOCTRINE, that isn't for the born again Believer.
As if you do that your Christianity is going to be wrecked, theologically, and your walk of faith is going to be ruined.

1 John 3:9, is doctrinal, for the Believer, as this verse is in alignment with the imputed righteousness that God has delivered to the believer that recreates them , not as a sinner, but as as "new Creation in Christ" where there is no sin.

See, God can't join Himself to a sinner.
He can only join Himself to RIGHTEOUSNESS, that He has cause the born again to become as "the righteousness of GOD... in Christ".

So, when we read verses that DEFINE you as a SINNER< or as having sin, then this verse is not talking to the born again Christian.

That’s exactly what I was thinking ....not all of the Bible is speaking to his child...is that what you are saying? @Behold

 

[Behold]

That’s exactly what I was thinking ....not all of the Bible is speaking to his child...is that what you are saying? @Behold

The word of God has to be :

1.) Spiritually Discerned. (not read like a phone book)

2.) "" Study to show yourself approved"", (not read like a novel)

3.) "Rightly divide the word of God'


Notice the word tells you to "rightly divide" it..

That means you can "wrongly divide" it and that is why there are thousands of denominations and thousands of "christian cults".

This is why you find Christians who believe they can lose their Salvation, and they believe they have to sin and confess and repeat.

= "wrongly divided" the word of God.

Q.) How do you rightly divided the word. ???

A.) See above 1-3

AA.) Study Paul's epistles as they are the KEY to the NT.

 

[Behold]

1 John 1:8-10 (and the epistle in its entirety) is written to believers

First of all, John the Apostle does not have any Sin.

See Jesus on the Cross as the reason why.

So, right way, even common sense tells us that this verse is not directed at a born again believer.
It would be foolish to teach that John the Apostle "has sin", while he's preaching to a group of unbelievers.

And also, if you read all of Paul's epistles, he never once confesses sin, or tells you to do it, reader.
Not once.
Did he forget?
Not quite.

What a lot of students of the word have not comprehended, is that these Apostles, were PREACHERS, and they often preached to a group of unbelievers right there in your bible.
Yeah, really.

That is 1 John 1:9.
If you are an unbeliever who needs to have your sin forgiven, then DO IT.
That verse is for you, unbeliever., never born again.

When John is talking to the Born again, in a similar verse, that would be 1 John 3:9

 

[Behold]

You really ought to stop teaching, you're digging yourself into a deeper hole of condemnation.

[edit by mod: Insulting language. This is what gets you on the outside looking in]

Also,
Just remember that the verses in the NT, have to be "rightly divided" by a born again Christian.
This means that if you are only water baptized and religious, then the bible is "under lock and key"., and will remain so.

So, lets understand some basic principles, regarding Salvation.

Salvation accomplishes many things, regarding the believer.

1.) sin is gone

2.) you dont confess sin, when all your sin has been dealt with by Jesus,

"Jesus is the one time eternal sacrifice for sin".

Notice that word "eternal"... and then "sacrifice'.

Now, when you have time..

Read :

2 Corinthians 5:19

And then we can talk about why God does not charge sin to the born again, which explains why the born again are not to be confessing what isn't charged to them..
See that?

Then read Romans 4:8, and again you'll find Paul teaching you that sin is not charged to the born again.

 

[Ritajanice]

@preacher4truth can you address this scripture please Brother?

◄ 1 John 3:9 ►

Audio Crossref Comment Greek Verse (Click for Chapter) New International Version No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God’s seed remains in them; they cannot go on sinning, because they have been born of God. New Living Translation Those who have been born into God’s family do not make a practice of sinning, because God’s life is in them. So they can’t keep on sinning, because they are children of God. English Standard Version No one born of God makes a practice of sinning, for God’s seed abides in him; and he cannot keep on sinning, because he has been born of God. Berean Standard Bible Anyone born of God refuses to practice sin, because God’s seed abides in him; he cannot go on sinning, because he has been born of God.

 

[Ritajanice]

Then read Romans 4:8, and again you'll find Paul teaching you that sin is not charged to the born again.

At the moment, I’m with you on this one, there is no sin in a Born Again..as scripture above says......but, we still have that old sin nature the flesh / mind..to contend with?

We have a new nature in Christ.....do we not?

My sin was lifted and forgiven the evening I was birthed in the Spirit

 

[Ritajanice]

I'll tell you this, it isn't teaching sinless perfection. This is the heresy Behold is leading you astray on. He doesn't know what he is talking about.

I know Brother...I’m not in sinless perfection...I still have that old man to deal with...the old Rita....?

Anyway I will leave it there and study more scripture...on the subject...God knows where I’m at....i wait on him.

 

[jeremiah1five]

This is the real living word of God.....it’s something we experience when we become Born Again....that’s my understanding of it.

Can we discuss it and what it means please?

If Admin allows...I don’t mind if we discuss what sanctification means as well?

[9] But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his. [10] And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.

Hello Rj.
Just to be sure, we live in the flesh before our conversion.
After our conversion the Holy Spirit enters the picture, and they battle it out the rest of our lives.
But let's not blame our flesh when we give in to it.
How much victory we give Him is dependent upon our obedience to the Word of God in all things Christ and Christian.

 

[Bob Carabbio]

Thanks for posting @civic ......how do we forgive in our own strength...

It's a simple decision of your will. Doesn't matter how you FEEL about it. You just tear up the I.O.U. you're holding against them, and walk away free.

 

[Ritajanice]

Hello Rj.
Just to be sure, we live in the flesh before our conversion.
After our conversion the Holy Spirit enters the picture, and they battle it out the rest of our lives.
But let's not blame our flesh when we give in to it.
How much victory we give Him is dependent upon our obedience to the Word of God in all things Christ and Christian.

Brilliant!....completely agree with this.

Amen!!....thank you, I needed to hear this!......in fact I so needed to hear this..to get what I believe the right understanding of the flesh...Hallelujah and Praise God.

Don’t you just Love it when God breaks through!!!!

 

[David1701]

That’s exactly what I was thinking ....not all of the Bible is speaking to his child...is that what you are saying? @Behold

Be VERY wary of any "Christian" who tells you that you don't need to confess (i.e. agree with God about) your sin. These so-called "Christians" who claim that they never sin are hypocrites and liars (every single one of them).

1 John 1:6-9 (WEB)
6 If we say that we have fellowship with him and walk in the darkness, we lie, and don’t tell the truth.
7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ, his Son, cleanses us from all sin.
8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and righteous to forgive us the sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

Follow the pronouns: John is referring to himself and all Christians. Anyone who claims otherwise is either completely ignorant, incapable of basic understanding, or a deceiver.

 

[TibiasDad]

@civic ...I’m trying to understand our new nature...is it the thinking of our old nature..is that called the flesh?

We have that new nature....yet we battle with the old nature that is the mind?...is that correct ?

In scripture, the flesh, especially in situations where we are told to resist or not follow it, is the sinful nature.

The sinful nature is the authority of sin over us, which has been destroyed. (Rom 6:6) We are now set free from sin’s authority, (Rom 6:7, 22, 8:1-4) and no longer have to obey its desires or compulsions (Rom 6:1, 8:12-13).

We are to count ourselves “free from sin” because we have died with Christ and are now free to have another Master. (Rom 6:18, 7:1-3)

Only the power of the blood can break the bond of sin, and only the Spirit within the believer holds the power to overcome, but the believer is given the freedom to choose whom he will listen to and obey. For “we have an obligation—but it is not to the flesh, to live according to it…” But this is not a decision without consequence, “For if you live according to the flesh, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live.” (Rom 8:12-13)

Doug

 

[Ritajanice]

Be VERY wary of any "Christian" who tells you that you don't need to confess (i.e. agree with God about) your sin. These so-called "Christians" who claim that they never sin are hypocrites and liars (every single one of them).

1 John 1:6-9 (WEB)
6 If we say that we have fellowship with him and walk in the darkness, we lie, and don’t tell the truth.
7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ, his Son, cleanses us from all sin.
8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and righteous to forgive us the sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

Follow the pronouns: John is referring to himself and all Christians. Anyone who claims otherwise is either completely ignorant, incapable of basic understanding, or a deceiver.

Ok, thanks for that @David1701 ...

 

[jeremiah1five]

Brilliant!....completely agree with this.

Amen!!....thank you, I needed to hear this!......in fact I so needed to hear this..to get what I believe the right understanding of the flesh...Hallelujah and Praise God.

Don’t you just Love it when God breaks through!!!!

You're in Galatians 5.
Spend some time there every other day for a week or so and see what jumps out at you each time you read it.

 

[Carbon]

Amen brother!

 

[fastfredy0]

Re: Flesh vs. Spirit

This is the real living word of God.....it’s something we experience when we become Born Again....that’s my understanding of it.

Can we discuss it and what it means please?

Sorry, I am not sure what you are talking about.

If Admin allows...I don’t mind if we discuss what sanctification means as well?

Sanctification – to be “set apart” from that which is unholy to that which is holy. Sanctification is that continuous operation of the Holy Spirit [and Christ] in the process of salvation, by which the holy disposition imparted in regeneration is maintained and strengthened. God does not share with us the work of sanctification, any more than he shares with us the work of justification. He must do all (1 Thessalonians 5:23; 1 Peter 1:2). Author Unknown

 

[jeremiah1five]

All scripture is given to the Christian, but not all scripture is aimed at the believer as doctrine.

So, when we read the NT, we have to be careful that we dont wrong apply a verse to ourselves as DOCTRINE, that isn't for the born again Believer.
As if you do that your Christianity is going to be wrecked, theologically, and your walk of faith is going to be ruined.

1 John 3:9, is doctrinal, for the Believer, as this verse is in alignment with the imputed righteousness that God has delivered to the believer that recreates them , not as a sinner, but as as "new Creation in Christ" where there is no sin.

See, God can't join Himself to a sinner.
He can only join Himself to RIGHTEOUSNESS, that He has cause the born again to become as "the righteousness of GOD... in Christ".

So, when we read verses that DEFINE you as a SINNER< or as having sin, then this verse is not talking to the born again Christian who is "made righteous" having received "the gift of Righteousness".

Vehemently disagree.

16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works. 2 Ti 3:16–17.

Although Paul is speaking about the Law, The Psalms, and The Prophets, ALL Scripture of the New testament is inspired by God as well.

It is profitable first and foremost for DOCTRINE, secondly, for REPROOF, thirdly for CORRECTION, and lastly for INSTRUCTION IN RIGHTEOUSNESS and that righteousness is found in the whole of the Word of God Old and New Testament, or as the Scripture is known, The Book of the Covenant.

Scripture also says:

8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us. 1 Jn 1:8–10.

And if you take a closer look at WHO John is writing to he is speaking to BELIEVERS.

The Word of God is TO and FOR believers ONLY. ALL of it. Every jot and tittle.