A Question for the Calvinist

[prism]

(and I know there are plenty here)

Why can't a person facing Judgment say, "The reason I am being judged to eternal destruction is because you did not ordain/predestine me to eternal life?

 

[John Bauer]

Why can't a person facing Judgment say, "The reason I am being judged to eternal destruction is because you did not ordain/predestine me to eternal life?

Because God does not damn the reprobate for not being elect. They are not judged because they were not chosen, but because they are sinners.

 

[prism]

Because God does not damn the reprobate for not being elect. They are not judged because they were not chosen, but because they are sinners.

So which of the elect, were not at one time sinners?

 

[John Bauer]

So which of the elect, were not at one time sinners?

None.

 

[David Lamb]

None.

None of the elect were once sinners? Sorry, I usually find myself in agreement with you, but surely the bible teaches that we are all by nature sinners. Those who are elect, God will bring to repentance. Paul wrote to the Christians at Ephesus:

“And you He made alive, who were dead in trespasses and sins, in which you once walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit who now works in the sons of disobedience, among whom also we all once conducted ourselves in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, just as the others.” (Eph 2:1-3 NKJV)

I would say that all the elect were once sinners. When God saves them, they become saved sinners.

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

So someone thinks an elect was never a sinner?

Why do they need saved then? They Met Gods standard. and earned their salvation

 

[Ladodgers6]

(and I know there are plenty here)

Why can't a person facing Judgment say, "The reason I am being judged to eternal destruction is because you did not ordain/predestine me to eternal life?

Do you sin willingly or is somebody forcing you to sin? I have a question for you. If Jesus died for everybody's sins, which includes unbelief. Why are people still going to hell?

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

Do you sin willingly or is somebody forcing you to sin? I have a question for you. If Jesus died for everybody's sins, which includes unbelief. Why are people still going to hell?

I think Jesus answers

He who believes is not condemned

He who does not believe is condemned already

They go to hell because they commit the sin Jesus did not die for The sin of unbelief

Ie they did not respond to the call of the gospel. To repent

 

[makesends]

None of the elect were once sinners? Sorry, I usually find myself in agreement with you, but surely the bible teaches that we are all by nature sinners. Those who are elect, God will bring to repentance. Paul wrote to the Christians at Ephesus:

“And you He made alive, who were dead in trespasses and sins, in which you once walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit who now works in the sons of disobedience, among whom also we all once conducted ourselves in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, just as the others.” (Eph 2:1-3 NKJV)

I would say that all the elect were once sinners. When God saves them, they become saved sinners.

What you asked is, which of the elect were NOT at one time sinners. Your whole point here is a strawman. @John Bauer agrees with you that all the elect were once sinners.

 

[makesends]

So someone thinks an elect was never a sinner?

Why do they need saved then? They Met Gods standard. and earned their salvation

Don't jump on that bandwagon too quickly. That is not what @John Bauer said.

 

[makesends]

(and I know there are plenty here)

Why can't a person facing Judgment say, "The reason I am being judged to eternal destruction is because you did not ordain/predestine me to eternal life?

A person facing judgement will try to weasel his way out if he can, even to include blaming GOD, but in the end, there is no excuse and he will know it. He deserves absolutely what he gets, as would all of us, but for the Grace of God.

 

[John Bauer]

None of the elect were once sinners? Sorry, I usually find myself in agreement with you, but surely the bible teaches that we are all by nature sinners.

The question was asked, "Out of all the elect, which of them were not at one time sinners?"

None. Every single one of the elect was a sinner.

 

[fastfredy0]

Don't jump on that bandwagon too quickly. That is not what @John Bauer said.

I think @John Bauer needs to clarify.

... ooops, looks like he did moments ago

 

[fastfredy0]

Why can't a person facing Judgment say, "The reason I am being judged to eternal destruction is because you did not ordain/predestine me to eternal life?

The statement rings true to me.... I would change it slightly to: "A" reason instead of "THE" reason.

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

Don't jump on that bandwagon too quickly. That is not what @John Bauer said.

thank you. Would not want to falsely accuse..

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

The question was asked, "Out of all the elect, which of them were not at one time sinners?"

None. Every single one of the elect was a sinner.

which one was not a sinner? Just asking?

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

The statement rings true to me.... I would change it slightly to: "A" reason instead of "THE" reason.

if it is even A reason.

How can God claim to be a God of love? I ask this seriously.

 

[Carbon]

(and I know there are plenty here)

Why can't a person facing Judgment say, "The reason I am being judged to eternal destruction is because you did not ordain/predestine me to eternal life?

Okay, I give up, why?

 

[makesends]

which one was not a sinner? Just asking?

Does not what @John Bauer said answer that? "None. Every single one of the elect was a sinner."

 

[makesends]

if it is even A reason.

How can God claim to be a God of love? I ask this seriously.

An example of this principle:
11 Yet, before the twins were born or had done anything good or bad—in order that God’s purpose in election might stand: 12 not by works but by him who calls—she was told, “The older will serve the younger.”[d] 13 Just as it is written: “Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated.”[e]

14 What then shall we say? Is God unjust? Not at all! 15 For he says to Moses,

“I will have mercy on whom I have mercy,
and I will have compassion on whom I have compassion.”[f]

16 It does not, therefore, depend on human desire or effort, but on God’s mercy."

How do you see God's love in that passage?

Maybe God's love is something that we learn slowly and can't explain well, something beyond our own comprehension, full of purpose and purity, of intimacy of existence, of infinite mercy —and particular, not general.