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A Case For Amillenialism

As for the Roman Empire...Christianity flourished during their time. In other words they couldn't prevent it from spreading.
You have inadvertently landed upon what I believe is the meaning behind restraints being lifted or Satan being released for a short time. He was bound from deceiving the nations. That is he was not allowed to stop the gospel going to the nations. That he will be allowed to do so for a short time I believe is saying that the persecution of the church and the preaching of the gospel will become a national and political norm worldwide. All of it will need to go underground and will be punishable by death or imprisonment.
 
You have inadvertently landed upon what I believe is the meaning behind restraints being lifted or Satan being released for a short time. He was bound from deceiving the nations. That is he was not allowed to stop the gospel going to the nations. That he will be allowed to do so for a short time I believe is saying that the persecution of the church and the preaching of the gospel will become a national and political norm worldwide. All of it will need to go underground and will be punishable by death or imprisonment.
The mystery of the lawlessness is already at work...and when the strainer is removed....then the anti-christ will have full reign, be revealed. We need to wait for the proper time.
 
I can go in several directions. One would be the restrainer is the Holy Spirit who is removed and with the removal of God the Holy Spirit the Christians go with Him seeing that the Holy Spirit is in them. This would not prevent the Holy Spirit for entering tribulation believers.
This makes no sense. If the Holy Spirit were no longer there, then, by definition, he could not enter what you call "tribulation believers".


The restrainer could also be the church....praying for "the world" so to speak...and when removed is no longer praying as they are no longer present.
This also makes no sense, since this is a warning to the believers, which would be entirely pointless, if their presence prevented the revealing of what they were being warned about!

As for the Roman Empire...Christianity flourished during their time. In other words they couldn't prevent it from spreading.
It was the appearing of the anti-Christ that was being restrained by the pagan Roman Empire (because he is the continuation of the pagan spiritual aspect of the Caesars, but in pseudo-Christian form).

The passage is not about restraining the gospel!
 
The mystery of the lawlessness is already at work...and when the strainer is removed....then the anti-christ will have full reign, be revealed. We need to wait for the proper time.
The anti-Christ was revealed shortly after the Roman Empire fell (it fell in 476 A.D.). The Roman Empire split into ten kingdoms and Daniel's "little horn" (the papacy, a.k.a. the man of sin, son of perdition and anti-Christ) grew up among them (in Rome, to be exact) but was different from them.
 
This makes no sense. If the Holy Spirit were no longer there, then, by definition, he could not enter what you call "tribulation believers".
Why not? The HS entered some OT believers.
This also makes no sense, since this is a warning to the believers, which would be entirely pointless, if their presence prevented the revealing of what they were being warned about!


It was the appearing of the anti-Christ that was being restrained by the pagan Roman Empire (because he is the continuation of the pagan spiritual aspect of the Caesars, but in pseudo-Christian form).

The passage is not about restraining the gospel!
If that's what you need to believe...have at it.
 
The anti-Christ was revealed shortly after the Roman Empire fell (it fell in 476 A.D.). The Roman Empire split into ten kingdoms and Daniel's "little horn" (the papacy, a.k.a. the man of sin, son of perdition and anti-Christ) grew up among them (in Rome, to be exact) but was different from them.
so, what's next? Are the christians going to take over the world for Christ to return and rule?
 
I don't see why that would matter.
If the Holy Spirit is not here, then he will not convict of sin, nor cause to be born again, nor reveal Jesus to anyone, nor empower anyone to live a godly life, nor guide, instruct or comfort anyone, etc., etc..
 
Thens what's next on the biblical timeline? I say rapture, what do you say?
I don't accept the premise of the Dispensationalists' timeline. Much (although not all) of Revelation covers what happens throughout church history.
 
I can go in several directions. One would be the restrainer is the Holy Spirit who is removed and with the removal of God the Holy Spirit the Christians go with Him seeing that the Holy Spirit is in them. This would not prevent the Holy Spirit for entering tribulation believers.

The restrainer could also be the church....praying for "the world" so to speak...and when removed is no longer praying as they are no longer present.

As for the Roman Empire...Christianity flourished during their time. In other words they couldn't prevent it from spreading.
The retainer .The law or gospel of Christ , signified by Moses the law giver and the prophets the testimony signified by Elijah. To the law and the prophets (sola scriptura)

Two the one witness Christ has spoken throughout the Bible

Matthew 23:31 Wherefore ye be witnesses unto yourselves, that ye are the children of them which killed the prophets.

Revelation 11:1_9 And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein. But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months. And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth. These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth. And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed. These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days (Elijah) of their prophecy: and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will. And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them .And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified .And they of the people and kindreds and tongues and nations shall see their dead bodies three days and an half, and shall not suffer their dead bodies to be put in graves.

Two dead bodies Moses and Elias (sola scriptura) A parable of God sending a famine for hearing of the living word. Thier prohecy, they .

Luke 16:31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

Two witness
 
If the Holy Spirit is not here, then he will not convict of sin, nor cause to be born again, nor reveal Jesus to anyone, nor empower anyone to live a godly life, nor guide, instruct or comfort anyone, etc., etc..
Then what is the restrainer?
 
Then what is the restrainer?
I told you previously - the "restrainer" was (not is) the pagan Roman Empire. The early Christians knew this, as did the Albigenses, the Vaudois, the Lollards and the Reformers.
 
I told you previously - the "restrainer" was (not is) the pagan Roman Empire. The early Christians knew this, as did the Albigenses, the Vaudois, the Lollards and the Reformers.
@David1701 am I following you. The Roman Empire restrained the emergence of the Roman papacy?
 
I told you previously - the "restrainer" was (not is) the pagan Roman Empire. The early Christians knew this, as did the Albigenses, the Vaudois, the Lollards and the Reformers.
That's your belief. Am I not allowed to disagree?
 
@David1701 am I following you. The Roman Empire restrained the emergence of the Roman papacy?
Yes, exactly. The pagan Roman Empire, as long as it existed, was restraining the revealing of the man of sin/son of perdition/anti-Christ/"little horn" (all one and the same office - Pope of Rome).

The papacy took over from the pagan Caesars, in the office of Pontifex Maximus (a pagan title given to latter Caesars by pagan priests). This could not happen while the Caesars were in that office. The Roman Catholicism is the continuation of the Roman Empire, in "mystery" form.

It's impossible to go through the huge amount of evidence in a forum post, but the book I recommended previously (Romanism and the Reformation From the Standpoint of Prophecy, by H. Grattan Guinness) does an excellent job of covering a lot of it.
 
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That's your belief. Am I not allowed to disagree?
What are you talking about? You asked who the "restrainer" was (a question to which I had previously given you the answer), so I told you again.

Of course you can disagree. You're wrong, but it's your prerogative to be wrong.

Dispensationalism developed from teaching by a Roman Catholic (Futurism, which was designed to take the heat off the papacy and Roman Catholicism). The Reformation had really begun to take off, when it was realised that the office of Pope is the anti-Christ and that Roman Catholicism is the Whore of Babylon, Mother of Harlots and Abominations of the Earth.

P.S. Protestantism is in what appears to be terminal decline, partly due to the erosion of the truths that the papacy is the anti-Christ and that Roman Catholicism is the Whore of Babylon (there are many other factors as well).
 
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