I do not accept that John or Thomas are equating "the Son of God" with "God" o
When the expression "my God" is used by a believer in the Bible it always refers to the Almighty.
I do not accept that John or Thomas are equating "the Son of God" with "God" o
Greetings Fred,
I appreciate the opportunity to post on this forum despite my differences in Bible understanding to the Administrators and Moderators and Fred. I have been banned from three forums because I do not advocate the Trinity. I have been tolerated on another forum but I have mainly posted in a sub-forum labeled Christadelphianism and this is placed in a Cult category. This had been my favourite forum since 2004, but an episode of spam wiped out all the threads in our sub-forum. More recently my old computer, or browser or their faulty program does not allow me to participate except that the only thread that I succeeded in adding is labeled "A few thoughts on Psalm 1". I consider my main reason for participating in forums is that I like to participate in interesting and sometimes challenging subjects.
I do not consider that this is at all polite and I am disappointed that you have suggested this. No other member has added such a symbol on either of my two threads so far. I am not worried if you disparage me personally, but I am concerned if you disparage some of what I have stated, especially if what I have stated is Biblical truth. I notice that you have not responded to either of the two posts that I added.
Where in the universe is anything begotten that is not of its own kind?A few brief statements concerning two aspects raised. I believe in the conception, not the incarnation. I believe that God the Father was the father of the human, Jesus, and as such Jesus is the Son of God. The character of Jesus, full of grace and truth, is attributable to the fact that the human Jesus was begotten by God his father, and also to the care and education of Jesus by God his father until the time of his ministry when John beheld his moral glory.
Kind regards
Trevor
I am not sure why you quoted this rule.
I am not stating that Jesus is merely a good man or prophet, ...
Where in the universe is anything begotten that is not of its own kind?
Animals beget the same kind of animals.
Humans beget humans.
And divinity (Godhood) begets divinity.
The divine Father begat a Son in a human female.
The Son is necessarily both human and divine, or he was not begotten by divinity as the Scriptures state.
A donkey and a horse produce a hybrid, a mule.Where in the universe is anything begotten that is not of its own kind?
Was the result a hybrid, a baby god and a baby human? I thought you considered the followingThe divine Father begat a Son in a human female.
The Son is necessarily both human and divine, or he was not begotten by divinity as the Scriptures state.
Does this agree with the word "begat"? Did Jesus have two minds? One as a child, a human, that needed development. Was his other mind, as God the Son, fully developed as a child? How do you account for the following?The conception of divine Spirit (God) in human flesh is incarnation; i.e., enfleshment of the divine Spirit.
Yes and I hold to that position. I also consider that the following is relevant to my claim:I am aware of what you were stating—obviously, because I quoted you. You said Jesus is the Son of God by character.
I suggest that John 1:14 does substantiate the connection between the fact that Jesus' moral glory was intimately connected with the fact that he was the only begotten of the Father, and I continue to maintain that the narratives of Matthew 1:20-21 and Luke 1:34-35 substantiate this.Your reference to John 1:14 thus fails the requirement, for it is not relevant, meaningful, or thorough. Yes, Jesus is the locus of God's covenantal presence (plērēs charitos kai alētheias), but citing this passage does not demonstrate or even support your claim that this is why he was the Son.
It requires you to substantively engage with rebuttals (rather than merely repeat assertions) and defend what you stated. It is not optional but mandatory—and you have not done so. I am giving you one more chance.
I am not sure if this satisfies the requirement concerning the phrase "grace and truth" in John 1:14. If you ban me I may consider this as Providential, as I sometimes spend too much time on this and two other forums that I am presently active with. I would like to spend more time with my main interests The Psalms and Isaiah. How do you understand Psalm 8 and Isaiah 6, which are also quoted extensively in the New Testament?Again, you have one more chance to substantively engage my rebuttal
A donkey and a horse are of the same kind, the same family---Equidae. The family of horses and related animals that includes asses and zebras. Not of the same kind would be a cross between a donkey and a bovine.A donkey and a horse produce a hybrid, a mule.
Since God and man are not the same kind, in Jesus we have two distinct never mixed natures. That of his Father, God. And that of his mother, human.A donkey and a horse are of the same kind, the same family---Equidae. The family of horses and related animals that includes asses and zebras. Not of the same kind would be a cross between a donkey and a bovine.
God and man are not of the same kind.
Indeed, it is. . .It ain't the same.
Matthew 1:20
But while he thought about these things, behold, an angel of the Lord appeared to him in a dream, saying, “Joseph, son of David, do not be afraid to take to you Mary your wife, for that which is conceived in her is of the Holy Spirit.
Which has a combination of horse nature and mule nature.Greetings Eleanor,
A donkey and a horse produce a hybrid, a mule.
While God is one God in three persons (Mt 28:19),Was the result a hybrid, a baby god and a baby human? I thought you considered the following
Does this agree with the word "begat"? Did Jesus have two minds? One as a child, a human, that needed development. Was his other mind, as God the Son, fully developed as a child? How do you account for the following?
The same way I account for: God has no beginning, he has always been.How do you account for the following?
Luke 2:40,52 (KJV): 40 And the child grew, and waxed strong in spirit, filled with wisdom: and the grace of God was upon him.
52 And Jesus increased in wisdom and stature, and in favour with God and man.
Kind regards
Trevor
Not fathered as humans are. Jesus was and is eternal. He is as eternal as the Father and the Holy Spirit.Indeed, it is. . .
Jesus was fathered by God.
The Trinity is not human. Jesus, the man, was still fathered by God.Not fathered as humans are. Jesus was and is eternal. He is as eternal as the Father and the Holy Spirit.
Yep. The natures are mixed and so so are the phenotypes (visible evidence of the particular mixture). A mule looks sort of like a great big donkey and sort of like a horse. In a Netflix show I saw a zebra/horse mix. It was creepy. It had some stripes on haunches and shoulders and the rest solid white. Had a zebra looking head, minus the stripes, and ears. The creepiest of all was the sounds it made. It sometimes made what I guess is a zebra noise that sounds like laughing (kind of like a hyena) followed by the whinny of a horse. It astounds me that anyone would do that to an animal. It didn't fit with the zebras or the horses. An outcast. (Of course, in the show, since it was geared towards young adults, and was not the central to the ongoing saga and drama of the 16 season program, it found a friend in a horse.) But it was a real horse/zebra cross.Which has a combination of horse nature and mule nature.
I also consider that the following is relevant to my claim [that Jesus is the Son of God by character]:
Romans 1:1-4 (KJV), "Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God—which he had promised afore by his prophets in the holy scriptures—concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh; and declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead."
I suggest that John 1:14 does substantiate the connection between the fact that Jesus' moral glory was intimately connected with the fact that he was the only begotten of the Father, and I continue to maintain that the narratives of Matthew 1:20-21 and Luke 1:34-35 substantiate this.
How Jesus attained to this position of "grace and truth" is firstly revealed in the two references that I quoted in my post above, Luke 2:40,52.
I am not sure if this satisfies the requirement concerning the phrase "grace and truth" in John 1:14.
If you ban me ...
My time has been limited and you may not hear from me tomorrow. I have other interests and responsibilities and I have been distracted and have not had the disposition of mind to settle down at the moment and concentrate more on this thread. My eldest sister fell asleep on Friday and will be buried tomorrow. She was a great help to me in my teenage years and helped to guide me in spiritual ways. She sacrificed her own welfare to look after me and my other older sister.
Define: "fathered." The Father did not impregnate Mary as Mormons claim.The Trinity is not human. Jesus, the man, was still fathered by God.
The divine nature of Jesus is eternal (without beginning).
The human nature of Jesus was not eternal, as I am not eternal.
We are both immortal.
Define: "fathered." The Father did not impregnate Mary as Mormons claim.
God sired Jesus in the womb of Mary.Define: "fathered." The Father did not impregnate Mary as Mormons claim.
That word "sired" means he impregnated Mary.God sired Jesus in the womb of Mary.
Mary's son was sired by God.