What are our implications by "unresurrected flesh", as concerning the fallen / 'old man'?

[Hazelelponi]

It was added to the law later.

Next...

Circumcision was given 430 years prior to the Decalogue.

The laws in the Decalogue were in force prior to the giving of the 10 commandments, like thou shalt not murder has been known since at least Cain and Abel, and was clearly enforceable as a requirement of God's LAW, a law that was unwritten, was enforceable.

Also for funsies, Why was the 10 commandments being written for?

Oh that's right, they weren't being given for sin, but because God wanted the people to know that (1) Moses was God's prophet and (2) a fuller revelation of God Himself and an actual Covenant relationship with the people.

Please read Scripture:

There Israel encamped before the mountain, 3 while Moses went up to God. The Lord called to him out of the mountain, saying, “Thus you shall say to the house of Jacob, and tell the people of Israel: 4 ‘You yourselves have seen what I did to the Egyptians, and how I bore you on eagles' wings and brought you to myself. 5 Now therefore, if you will indeed obey my voice and keep my covenant, you shall be my treasured possession among all peoples, for all the earth is mine; 6 and you shall be to me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation.’ These are the words that you shall speak to the people of Israel.”

^^^ not one thing to do with sin!!!! Please read Exodus 19 and 20 from a translation that actually translates what is written like the ESV...

The Mosaic law consists of 613 commandments.

The Mosaic law does...The Decalogue does not. It's the 10 commandments. I am under the New Covenant in Christs blood not the Mosaic.

Law is to do with legal obligation. We are no longer under that. The New Covenant commands are on a different basis, like a father tellling his children to tidy their rooms, not like a judge issuing statutes that will meet legal penalties, if disobeyed.

Yes, and under the New Covenant we have a legally binding obligation to God, which we affirm when we are baptized.

We are entering a covenant, a legal contract with God.

Do you think God is the only one who has certain obligations to it? He did all the work it's all good?

In Baptism we are baptized into Christs death and resurrection, meaning God can require our very lives of us and we can't say boo...

If we are under no obligation to keep the covenant from our end why did the married couple in Acts receive the death penalty for bearing false witness - After the death and resurrection of Christ?

For fun? Because these laws are meaningless to us?

Everytime the understanding of some sin pricks your heart that's God telling you He can rightly kill you instantly where you stand for such a sin...

So yeah, God's like a father, but He is still a God, definitely something that is not a man.

His Yoke might be easy and His burden light, but make no mistake it's still a yoke. The law of the Spirit is still a law... It's just far easier and created in love with Christ as our mediator.

We are not our own. While our Father in Heaven is lovely indeed, and loving and infinitely merciful, He is also infinity Holy, and before Him we live, in Him we live and move and have our being.

 

[David1701]

Surely not. God command circumcision to Abraham, long before the Ten Commandments.

The Bible says that the law came in 400 years after God's covenant with Abraham; so, no, circumcision was not law, until it was added to the law, more than 400 years later.

Gal. 3:15-25 (KJV)
15 Brethren, I speak after the manner of men; Though it be but a man's covenant, yet if it be confirmed, no man disannulleth, or addeth thereto.
16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.
17 And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.
18 For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.
19 Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.
20 Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, but God is one.
21 Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.
22 But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.
23 But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

 

[Josheb]

There are many reasons (but you already know this...); and you should know that I know.


Gal. 3:9-13 (WEB)
9 So then, those who are of faith are blessed with the faithful Abraham.
10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under a curse. For it is written, “Cursed is everyone who doesn’t continue in all things that are written in the book of the law, to do them.”
11 Now that no man is justified by the law before God is evident, for, “The righteous will live by faith.”
12 The law is not of faith, but, “The man who does them will live by them.”
13 Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us. For it is written, “Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree,”

We've been redeemed from the curse of the law, so why would you want to be under it? The righteous live by faith, not by law.


Trying to please God by law-keeping and seeking to please him by being led by the Holy Spirit certainly are mutually exclusive!


The Holy Spirit does not lead you back under the yoke of legal bondage!


Paul's comments about the Law are NOT limited to being a means of justification; and you should know this by now.

2 Cor. 3:6-9 (WEB)
6 who also made us sufficient as servants of a new covenant; not of the letter, but of the Spirit. For the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.
7 But if the service of death, written engraved on stones, came with glory, so that the children of Israel could not look steadfastly on the face of Moses for the glory of his face; which was passing away:
8 won’t service of the Spirit be with much more glory?
9 For if the service of condemnation has glory, the service of righteousness exceeds much more in glory.

The ten commandments are "the service of death, written engraved on stones". They are the letter that kills. If you want to live your life by the service of death, well, what can I say?

Gal. 3:2,3 (WEB)
2 I just want to learn this from you. Did you receive the Spirit by the works of the law, or by hearing of faith?
3 Are you so foolish? Having begun in the Spirit, are you now completed in the flesh?

Do you believe it is important to consider ALL that the NT states about the Law..... relevant to this op?

If so, then a sampling of what the epistolary states will inform the matter. We know from the gospels the Law testified about Jesus and in Acts Luke reiterated the usefulness of the Law for teaching the gospel.

Acts 28:23
When they had set a day for Paul, they came to him at his lodging in large numbers; and he was explaining to them by solemnly testifying about the kingdom of God and trying to persuade them concerning Jesus, from both the Law of Moses and from the Prophets, from morning until evening.

Paul also reported the Law was useful for measuring sin and judging sinners.

Romans 2:12-13ff
For all who have sinned without the Law will also perish without the Law, and all who have sinned under the Law will be judged by the Law; for it is not the hearers of the Law who are just before God, but the doers of the Law will be justified....

And even though Paul spoke explicitly about the relevance of the Law to those living under the Law (Rom. 3:19) but he also applied the Law to Gentiles, noting the Law of God is written on the human heart. Paul also stated the Law brings wrath and he did not nullify it (Rom. 4:15 and 3:31, respectively).

Romans 3:28-31
For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from works of the Law. Or is God the God of Jews only? Is He not the God of Gentiles also? Yes, of Gentiles also, since indeed God who will justify the circumcised by faith and the uncircumcised through faith is one. Do we then nullify the Law through faith? May it never be! On the contrary, we establish the Law.

Paul also reported the Law was good for making sin known by the sinner.

Romans 7:7
What shall we say then? Is the Law sin? May it never be! On the contrary, I would not have come to know sin except through the Law; for I would not have known about coveting if the Law had not said, "You shall not covet."

...and the Law is holy, righteous, good and spiritual,

Romans 7:12, 14
So then, the Law is holy, and the commandment is holy and righteous and good...... For we know that the Law is spiritual, but I am of flesh, sold into bondage to sin.

The Law is fulfilled in those in whom Christ and the Law of the Spirit is at work.

Romans 8:1-4
Therefore there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has set you free from the law of sin and of death. For what the Law could not do, weak as it was through the flesh, God did: sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and as an offering for sin, He condemned sin in the flesh, so that the requirement of the Law might be fulfilled in us, who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.

After all, love is the fulfillment of the Law . I'll stop here for the sake of space but much more could be said about the many good and functional aspects of the Law. My original point was that Paul's (and James') discarding of the Law occurred in two specified domains: righteousness and justification. The Law could never do either apart from Christ. The Law could and did serve many positive functions in the life of the convert to Christ, but not as the Law was taught in Judaism. In fact, in the earliest days of The Way the following of the Law was seen as evidence of conversion. The receipt of the gospel made folks more zealous the Law!



zeal for the Law
Acts 21:17-24
After we arrived in Jerusalem, the brethren received us gladly. And the following day Paul went in with us to James, and all the elders were present. After he had greeted them, he began to relate one by one the things which God had done among the Gentiles through his ministry. And when they heard it they began glorifying God; and they said to him, "You see, brother, how many thousands there are among the Jews of those who have believed, and they are all zealous for the Law; and they have been told about you, that you are teaching all the Jews who are among the Gentiles to forsake Moses, telling them not to circumcise their children nor to walk according to the customs. What, then, is to be done? They will certainly hear that you have come. Therefore, do this that we tell you. We have four men who are under a vow; take them and purify yourself along with them and pay their expenses so that they may shave their heads; and all will know that there is nothing to the things which they have been told about you, but that you yourself also walk orderly, keeping the Law."

Paul complied. The zeal for the Law among the Jewish converts is the reason Paul had to expound on the fact the Law does not make anyone righteous or justified...... despite its being holy, righteous, good, spiritual, and useful for understanding sin and the human failing when it comes to knowing God, being known by Him, and living life in Christ. God cannot be reached by works, especially not the finite works of a dead and enslaved sinner.


I know I'm preaching to the choir, but there are some who misread Romans 2-3 and Gal. 3 to mean the Law was completely discarded when the facts of the rest of the NT show that was definitely not the case.

 

[David1701]

Circumcision was given 430 years prior to the Decalogue.

Exactly! It was not part of the law, until it was added, more than 430 years later (after the ten commandments).

The laws in the Decalogue were in force prior to the giving of the 10 commandments, like thou shalt not murder has been known since at least Cain and Abel, and was clearly enforceable as a requirement of God's LAW, a law that was unwritten, was enforceable.

Perhaps you don't understand that there was no God's law, until the ten commandments were given. There were commands to certain people and groups, but no God's law.

Also for funsies, Why was the 10 commandments being written for?

Oh that's right, they weren't being given for sin, but because God wanted the people to know that (1) Moses was God's prophet and (2) a fuller revelation of God Himself and an actual Covenant relationship with the people.

This comment is idiotic, in the extreme! Are you trolling, because I find it hard to believe that anyone would honestly believe such nonsense (the part I've made bold is the nonsense, in case you really don't know)?

The Bible states that the law was given ... because of transgressions (sin). Surely you know that?

Gal. 3:16-19 (WEB)
16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises spoken. He does not say, "And to seeds," referring to many, but referring to one, "And to your seed," who is Christ.
17 And this I say, that the law, which was four hundred and thirty years later, does not annul the covenant previously confirmed to Christ by God, so that it make the promise of no effect.
18 For if the inheritance comes by the law, it is no longer of promise; but God has given it to Abraham by promise.
19 Why then the law? It was added on account of transgressions, until the seed should come to whom it had been promised; and it was commanded through angels by the hand of a mediator.

Please read Scripture:

There Israel encamped before the mountain, 3 while Moses went up to God. The Lord called to him out of the mountain, saying, “Thus you shall say to the house of Jacob, and tell the people of Israel: 4 ‘You yourselves have seen what I did to the Egyptians, and how I bore you on eagles' wings and brought you to myself. 5 Now therefore, if you will indeed obey my voice and keep my covenant, you shall be my treasured possession among all peoples, for all the earth is mine; 6 and you shall be to me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation.’ These are the words that you shall speak to the people of Israel.”

^^^ not one thing to do with sin!!!! Please read Exodus 19 and 20 from a translation that actually translates what is written like the ESV...

See Gal. 3:19. As well as what you have stated, the law was given because of transgressions.

The Mosaic law does...The Decalogue does not. It's the 10 commandments. I am under the New Covenant in Christs blood not the Mosaic.

In that case, do not allow yourself to come back under the yoke of bondage to the law.

Yes, and under the New Covenant we have a legally binding obligation to God, which we affirm when we are baptized.

No; the law has been fulfilled. Our relationship with the Lord is on a wholly different (and better) basis, as I've been explaining to you.

We are entering a covenant, a legal contract with God.

The New Covenant is between God the Father and God the Son. Our inclusion is because, as part of that covenant, the Father gave certain people to the Son, for whom he died and who will be raised up in the resurrection.

Do you think God is the only one who has certain obligations to it? He did all the work it's all good?

Salvation is of the Lord, not our works. It's all of grace (unmerited favour). Yes, we are entirely responsible for what we do, but not in the sense of having to measure up to a legal standard, in order to be (or stay) saved.

In Baptism we are baptized into Christs death and resurrection, meaning God can require our very lives of us and we can't say boo...

We could say, "Boo...", but it's not a good idea.

If we are under no obligation to keep the covenant from our end why did the married couple in Acts receive the death penalty for bearing false witness - After the death and resurrection of Christ?

They were punished publicly, for lying to the Holy Spirit. This brought the fear of God onto the churches and showed the seriousness of sin, in God's eyes.

For fun? Because these laws are meaningless to us?

It was nothing to do with the law; and there's no need for your sarcasm.

Everytime the understanding of some sin pricks your heart that's God telling you He can rightly kill you instantly where you stand for such a sin...

Hmm....

Do you see God as a Judge, ready to come down on you, like a ton of bricks, or as a loving Father, who will discipline you, when you go wrong, for your good?

So yeah, God's like a father, but He is still a God, definitely something that is not a man.

Of course, except that the Lord Jesus Christ is God and man...

His Yoke might be easy and His burden light, but make no mistake it's still a yoke. The law of the Spirit is still a law... It's just far easier and created in love with Christ as our mediator.

The law of the Spirit is not the same kind of law. It's a different usage of the word. It doesn't mean a list of legal statutes. It means the principle of life and all that accords with that.

We are not our own. While our Father in Heaven is lovely indeed, and loving and infinitely merciful, He is also infinity Holy, and before Him we live, in Him we live and move and have our being.

Amen.

 

[David1701]

Do you believe it is important to consider ALL that the NT states about the Law..... relevant to this op?

Yes, of course.

If so, then a sampling of what the epistolary states will inform the matter. We know from the gospels the Law testified about Jesus and in Acts Luke reiterated the usefulness of the Law for teaching the gospel.

Acts 28:23
When they had set a day for Paul, they came to him at his lodging in large numbers; and he was explaining to them by solemnly testifying about the kingdom of God and trying to persuade them concerning Jesus, from both the Law of Moses and from the Prophets, from morning until evening.

Yes

Paul also reported the Law was useful for measuring sin and judging sinners.

Romans 2:12-13ff
For all who have sinned without the Law will also perish without the Law, and all who have sinned under the Law will be judged by the Law; for it is not the hearers of the Law who are just before God, but the doers of the Law will be justified....

Yes

And even though Paul spoke explicitly about the relevance of the Law to those living under the Law (Rom. 3:19) but he also applied the Law to Gentiles, noting the Law of God is written on the human heart. Paul also stated the Law brings wrath and he did not nullify it (Rom. 4:15 and 3:31, respectively).

Romans 3:28-31
For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from works of the Law. Or is God the God of Jews only? Is He not the God of Gentiles also? Yes, of Gentiles also, since indeed God who will justify the circumcised by faith and the uncircumcised through faith is one. Do we then nullify the Law through faith? May it never be! On the contrary, we establish the Law.

Yes

Paul also reported the Law was good for making sin known by the sinner.

Romans 7:7
What shall we say then? Is the Law sin? May it never be! On the contrary, I would not have come to know sin except through the Law; for I would not have known about coveting if the Law had not said, "You shall not covet."

Yes

...and the Law is holy, righteous, good and spiritual,

Romans 7:12, 14
So then, the Law is holy, and the commandment is holy and righteous and good...... For we know that the Law is spiritual, but I am of flesh, sold into bondage to sin.

Yes

The Law is fulfilled in those in whom Christ and the Law of the Spirit is at work.

Romans 8:1-4
Therefore there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has set you free from the law of sin and of death. For what the Law could not do, weak as it was through the flesh, God did: sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and as an offering for sin, He condemned sin in the flesh, so that the requirement of the Law might be fulfilled in us, who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.

Well, the righteous requirement (singular - i.e. love) of the Law is fulfilled in us.

After all, love is the fulfillment of the Law . I'll stop here for the sake of space but much more could be said about the many good and functional aspects of the Law. My original point was that Paul's (and James') discarding of the Law occurred in two specified domains: righteousness and justification. The Law could never do either apart from Christ. The Law could and did serve many positive functions in the life of the convert to Christ, but not as the Law was taught in Judaism. In fact, in the earliest days of The Way the following of the Law was seen as evidence of conversion. The receipt of the gospel made folks more zealous the Law!

The law is not only discarded for obtaining righteousness or justification, but also for how to live our lives. It is in contrast to being led by the Holy Spirit, as was clearly stated in one of the Scriptures I quoted.

zeal for the Law
Acts 21:17-24
After we arrived in Jerusalem, the brethren received us gladly. And the following day Paul went in with us to James, and all the elders were present. After he had greeted them, he began to relate one by one the things which God had done among the Gentiles through his ministry. And when they heard it they began glorifying God; and they said to him, "You see, brother, how many thousands there are among the Jews of those who have believed, and they are all zealous for the Law; and they have been told about you, that you are teaching all the Jews who are among the Gentiles to forsake Moses, telling them not to circumcise their children nor to walk according to the customs. What, then, is to be done? They will certainly hear that you have come. Therefore, do this that we tell you. We have four men who are under a vow; take them and purify yourself along with them and pay their expenses so that they may shave their heads; and all will know that there is nothing to the things which they have been told about you, but that you yourself also walk orderly, keeping the Law."

Paul complied. The zeal for the Law among the Jewish converts is the reason Paul had to expound on the fact the Law does not make anyone righteous or justified...... despite its being holy, righteous, good, spiritual, and useful for understanding sin and the human failing when it comes to knowing God, being known by Him, and living life in Christ. God cannot be reached by works, especially not the finite works of a dead and enslaved sinner.

As I'm sure you know, the Old and New Covenants co-existed until A.D. 70. That situation no longer pertains.

I know I'm preaching to the choir, but there are some who misread Romans 2-3 and Gal. 3 to mean the Law was completely discarded when the facts of the rest of the NT show that was definitely not the case.

I've used the law sometimes myself (it's very useful in witnessing, to show people their sin, guilt and helplessness); but, it is not a way of living for a Christian.

 

[Josheb]

The law is not only discarded for obtaining righteousness or justification, but also for how to live our lives.

That contradicts the facts of the New Testament. Paul and ALL of the other NT writers repeatedly quoted the Law, referenced the Law, and alluded to the Law indirectly AND they did so with both Jewish and Gentile converts to Christs AND in a manner that directed them how they should be living their lives.


But not as a means of attaining righteousness and justification.

It is in contrast to being led by the Holy Spirit, as was clearly stated in one of the Scriptures I quoted.

Which is not mutually exclusive of the Law. When the Law, its function and limits, are correctly understood then the two are never in opposition.

As I'm sure you know, the Old and New Covenants co-existed until A.D. 70. That situation no longer pertains.

I do know and do agree. That "situation" is not the end of the Law.

I've used the law sometimes myself (it's very useful in witnessing, to show people their sin, guilt and helplessness); but, it is not a way of living for a Christian.

Even after 70 AD?

 

[Hazelelponi]

17 And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.

Exploring the best translation is clearly important.

The law which came 430 years after the covenant was ratified (through circumcision) and doesn't annul the promise. .

Which - if you recall - I never once said it did.

The New Covenant in Christs blood is the promise. The law written on our hearts is the promise. The Holy Spirit empowering us to want and to do God's will is the promise. The curse being removed from the law is the promise.

But don't think for a minute this is some little game we are playing.

God wholly owns us. And while the law cannot condemn us, God most certainly can if He so chooses.

We owe a debt utterly impossible to repay, and the God of all creation deserves worship. And worship starts with at least some obedience.

It's not obedience to go out and commit murder, It is obedience to die to sin, and become what He created us to be in Him.

If there was nothing to be obedient to, there would be no sin to die to.

Do you think Paul, or Stephen, or any other martyr would have stood and died for the faith had not God Himself stood them for it?

Our very lives our His. Pretending there's not a law to which we are beholden is ridiculous to me on it's face. God is God, and if we can't recognize that we won't be counting the blessings we actually have.

 

[Hazelelponi]

Perhaps you don't understand that there was no God's law, until the ten commandments were given. There were commands to certain people and groups, but no God's law.

Anything that can be punished is based on a law. God drowned all but one family on the face of the earth because of sin that was unwritten.

Our very existence revolves around laws of physics, laws of nature, laws of time and space etc.

We are nothing if not surrounded by laws upon which everything is based. God is a law unto Himself and introduces Himself to people through laws. .

He even calls the law of the Spirit laws because it's based on God's economy, which is always based in law...

He created a whole complicated set of civil laws to enter into the world by,, and through which to save it, to show His Glory to mankind in Jesus Christ.

Being released from the curse doesn't release us from the content of God's moral law, to live in accordance with it as best as we are able in Christ Jesus.

But don't think for a minute God's some push over. He's not. He's actually Holy. This is no game.

 

[David1701]

That contradicts the facts of the New Testament. Paul and ALL of the other NT writers repeatedly quoted the Law, referenced the Law, and alluded to the Law indirectly AND they did so with both Jewish and Gentile converts to Christs AND in a manner that directed them how they should be living their lives.

The moral principles underlying the laws are still true, of course; but, the principle upon which we are to live our lives is not legal obligations (law) but grace-through-faith; not legal statutes but being led by the Holy Spirit, God working in us to will and to do of his good pleasure.

 

[David1701]

Exploring the best translation is clearly important.

The law which came 430 years after the covenant was ratified (through circumcision) and doesn't annul the promise. .

Which - if you recall - I never once said it did.

The New Covenant in Christs blood is the promise. The law written on our hearts is the promise. The Holy Spirit empowering us to want and to do God's will is the promise. The curse being removed from the law is the promise.

But don't think for a minute this is some little game we are playing.

God wholly owns us. And while the law cannot condemn us, God most certainly can if He so chooses.

We owe a debt utterly impossible to repay, and the God of all creation deserves worship. And worship starts with at least some obedience.

It's not obedience to go out and commit murder, It is obedience to die to sin, and become what He created us to be in Him.

If there was nothing to be obedient to, there would be no sin to die to.

Do you think Paul, or Stephen, or any other martyr would have stood and died for the faith had not God Himself stood them for it?

Our very lives our His. Pretending there's not a law to which we are beholden is ridiculous to me on it's face. God is God, and if we can't recognize that we won't be counting the blessings we actually have.

Hazel, it's not that everything you're posting is wrong (some of it is fine); but it's an incoherent jumble of truth and error, so I'm going to leave this conversation now, and hope that you're not really going to put yourself back under law.

 

[Hazelelponi]

Hazel, it's not that everything you're posting is wrong (some of it is fine); but it's an incoherent jumble of truth and error, so I'm going to leave this conversation now, and hope that you're not really going to put yourself back under law.

Has not God made us, created us, and hung us, in the sky?

How then can you call it evil to teach men God's law?

This is how we know God. We are to teach it, not run from it and teach men sin is fine now.

When you teach someone there's no mandate not to murder, not to lie, not to love God,, no mandate upon the man to do their best to follow Christ after salvation, you're not teaching Godx word anymore.

We have a new covenant entrance into the New Covenant, we have a new Mediator between ourselves and God, we have a Messiah who took the curse of the law upon himself so that we might be justified, and sanctified, and ultimately glorified.

But we owe everything to Christ. And sometimes that does mean simple obedience.

It's the one thing missing from the church writ large, no one has the slightest comprehension of obedience because they keep getting taught the law is dead instead of fulfilled.

Yes. I got upset over it. Have a good day.

 

[Eleanor]

Has not God made us, created us, and hung us, in the sky?
How then can you call it evil to teach men God's law?
This is how we know God. We are to teach it, not run from it and teach men sin is fine now.
When you teach someone there's no mandate not to murder, not to lie, not to love God,, no mandate upon the man to do their best to follow Christ after salvation, you're not teaching Godx word anymore.
We have a new covenant entrance into the New Covenant, we have a new Mediator between ourselves and God, we have a Messiah who took the curse of the law upon himself so that we might be justified, and sanctified, and ultimately glorified.

Do we have a new commandment/law. . .Jn 13:34, Ro 13:8, 10?

But we owe everything to Christ. And sometimes that does mean simple obedience.
It's the one thing missing from the church writ large, no one has the slightest comprehension of obedience because they keep getting taught the law is dead instead of fulfilled.
Yes. I got upset over it. Have a good day.

 

[Hazelelponi]

Do we have a new commandment/law. . .Jn 13:34?

Yes.

 

[Eleanor]

Yes.

Is it a summary of the old commandments (Ro 13:9), whereby keeping that one law is the fulfillment of all the Decalogue (Ro 13:8, 10)?

The born again will not be living lawless lives.
And if one is not born again, keeping God's laws is of no avail eternally.

 

[Hazelelponi]

Is it a summary of the old commandments (Ro 13:9), whereby keeping that one law is the fulfillment of all the Decalogue (Ro 13:8, 10)?

was Paul just reiterating what Jesus said about the greatest commandment and the second like unto it,?

It expresses all 10 commandments, not 1, and it's still binding on God's people, in that, this is how we are supposed to behave and the morality God requires us to live by.

We can't teach people not to do these things or that it's not required of us... The Bible itself speaks on it from one end to the other.

This is God's very morality - we do not teach against it. Jesus Christ fulfilled the law so that we would be empowered to it, not for us to hate the very mention.

I will not teach the morality of GOD is a sin.. it's not a sin to love God with all your heart and mind and soul. To teach it would take a person completely outside Christianity to follow is not right.

 

[Eleanor]

Are we supposing we can just play mushy mushy and ignore altogether?

Perhaps a definition of love would help here. . .

Love is commitment to another's well being as one is committed to one's own well-being.
It doesn't require "warm feelings," or we wouldn't be able to love our enemies.

And such a commitment will necessarily be in obedience to the commandments.

was Paul just reiterating what Jesus said about the greatest commandment and the second like unto it,?

It expresses all 10 commandments, not 1, and it's still binding on God's people, in that, this is how we are supposed to behave and the morality God requires us to live by.

We can't teach people not to do these things or that it's not required of us... The Bible itself speaks on it from one end to the other.

This is God's very morality - we do not teach against it. Jesus Christ fulfilled the law so that we would be empowered to it, not for us to hate the very mention.

I will not teach the morality of GOD is a sin.. it's not a sin to love God with all your heart and mind and soul. To teach it would take a person completely outside Christianity to follow is not right.

Are we not now under the royal law (Jas 2:8) of Christ (Gal 6:2), commitment to our neighbor's well being as to our own?

 

[Hazelelponi]

Are we not now under the royal law (Jas 2:8) of Christ (Gal 6:2), commitment to our neighbor's well being as to our own?

Yes . It's the law, from one end of Scripture to the other.

I wasn't the one who started throwing people out of Christianity, all I did was assume the issue was with the use of the word law and not with the law itself. The law is beautiful and holy and of God.

 

[Eleanor]

Yes . It's the law, from one end of Scripture to the other.

I wasn't the one who started throwing people out of Christianity.

They'll have to run over me to do that to you. . .

 

[Hazelelponi]

They'll have to run over me to do that to you. . .

I don't recommend the offer.. just no fun getting run over ..

 

[Hazelelponi]

And @Eleanor is right, I shouldn't have been upset and I'm sorry @David1701 for speaking when I was upset. I shouldn't have.