Was the Spirit of God Indwelling the Redeemed before Pentecost?

[Mr GLee]

@Eleanor @Arial @ReverendRV @Reformedguy @Josheb @fastfredy0 @atpollard @His clay @Carbon @Ladodgers6 @Red Baker @Manfred @TMSO @Dave_Regenerated @CrazyCalvinistUncle @severalothers,nodoubt​

​

Please note: What I am saying below is what seems to me necessary to believe, but I don't stand behind it as though I am necessarily right, nor that I have even described the notion well. In fact, even what may be taken for defense of the notion is more intended to describe my point-of-view in the matter, and not to defend it.​

Seems a lot of Calvinists/Reformed think the Holy Spirit wasn't a fixture until after Pentecost. That is, (if I understand those to whom I have spoken about it), that perhaps the Holy Spirit regenerated people, before Pentecost, but that he didn't indwell them until after Pentecost.

But I don't see how anything we do, neither faith nor obedience, is done apart from his continuous work in us. To me, it is endemic to the gospel —though not at all to say that one must understand this as part of the gospel— that Salvation, to include everything from creation and election to regeneration to glorification, is wholly the work of God. As most of you probably know, I reject the notion of synergism completely —even after sanctification— in that it suggests a work of God is made valid or complete only if we cooperate.

It is true that the Holy Spirit does as it will, and cannot be restrained. (John 3) But I don't think that what I say here posits restraint upon it.

However, (to my mind, at least), not only Regeneration, but also Sanctification (of the Old Testament believers as well as those from the New) IS from the continuing work of the Holy Spirit in us. Sanctification is not only after it came and left. It remains in the believer. Faith is endemic throughout, and that IS the work of the Spirit of God.

As I understand it, and, from my POV/ experience (not that personal experience is any basis for doctrine), the indwelling of the Spirit of God is the ONLY way any of us are of any Christian integrity. Regeneration does not change a person to make them suddenly of integrity in their thinking and their decisions, but the Spirit of God in us is what causes this "ability" continuously.

It is not endemic of regenerated unglorified humans to know or understand (in the common sense) to any effective degree what they are doing or what they believe. Only God knows these things, and that, in their entirety. And I think it can be argued that even in Heaven, our very glorification does not enable us to do anything separately from God, but that it is the completed unity with (into?) God that glorifies us, and not a work done upon us in the common temporal notion.

Apart from him we can do nothing. And I think the case can be made that apart from him, we ARE nothing.

Abel the first member as the bride of Christ sent as apostle(sent messenger ) first listed martyr . Many say the beginning of the church age as if there was such a age rather than the first century reformation restoring the government of God to before there were Kings in Israel the abomination of desolation .

 

[jeremiah1five]

Abel the first member as the bride of Christ sent as apostle(sent messenger ) first listed martyr . Many say the beginning of the church age as if there was such a age rather than the first century reformation restoring the government of God to before there were Kings in Israel the abomination of desolation .

Abel? There were only two sons of Adam. To WHOM is this "messenger" (Abel) giving message to? The trees? The animals?

There was no "abomination of desolation in Israel. The fact that 3000 Jews were born again shows Jesus was building His Church and building the Church upon Him cannot have an "abomination" nor a "desolation." Methinks thou hast many holes in thy theology.
Better patch it up or your ship will sink. You're already in deep water without a rudder. Let's not increase speed in an area of theological icebergs. Because when your ship collides with one of these icebergs there will be damage.

 

[Mr GLee]

Abel? There were only two sons of Adam. To WHOM is this "messenger" (Abel) giving message to? The trees? The animals?

There was no "abomination of desolation in Israel. The fact that 3000 Jews were born again shows Jesus was building His Church and building the Church upon Him cannot have an "abomination" nor a "desolation." Methinks thou hast many holes in thy theology.
Better patch it up or your ship will sink. You're already in deep water without a rudder. Let's not increase speed in an area of theological icebergs. Because when your ship collides with one of these icebergs there will be damage.

His brother Cain the same brother that murdered Abel the martyr .

Genesis 4: 7 If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him. And Cain talked with Abel his brother: and it came to pass, when they were in the field, that Cain rose up against Abel his brother, and slew him.

Buried him under the corn out of sight out of mind the pagan foundation as in who believes in a God no one can see. ( Fools no god in thier heart atheism.

It angered Cain who was deceived by the father of lies working in him . Satan the father of lies according to John 8:44 performed his first murder

John 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

Kings a pagan foundation. Mankind worshiping the things seen rather than our unseen God who is not a Jewish man. The out of sight out of mind as in. . . who believes in a God not seen ?

Kings in Israel an abomination of desolation.

1 Samuel 8:65 And said unto him, Behold, thou art old, and thy sons walk not in thy ways: now make us a king to judge us like all the nations. But the thing displeased Samuel, when they said, Give us a king to judge us. And Samuel prayed unto the Lord. And the Lord said unto Samuel, Hearken unto the voice of the people in all that they say unto thee: for they have not rejected thee, but they have rejected me, that I should not reign over them.

The pagan foundation of Kings in Israel until the first century reformation

Hebrew 9:8 The Holy Ghost this signifying, that the way into the holiest of all was not yet made manifest, while as the first tabernacle was yet standing:Which was a figure (shadow)for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience; Which stood only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances,(shadows) imposed on them until the time of reformation.

Again Kings in Israel until the time of the first century reformation .

.Satan could not longer deceive the whole world that God is a Jewish man as King of kings and Lord of lords . He fell and cannot deceive all the nations in that way that God is a Jewish man. Satan will be loosed for a short while to again build another abomination of desolation temples built with the dying hands of sinful mankind

Revelation 20:3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season

 

[Josheb]

Abel? There were only two sons of Adam. To WHOM is this "messenger" (Abel) giving message to? The trees? The animals?

There was no "abomination of desolation in Israel. The fact that 3000 Jews were born again shows Jesus was building His Church and building the Church upon Him cannot have an "abomination" nor a "desolation." Me thinks thou hast many holes in thy theology.
Better patch it up or your ship will sink. You're already in deep water without a rudder. Let's not increase speed in an area of theological icebergs. Because when your ship collides with one of these icebergs there will be damage.

I'm putting this in my top ten list of foolish internet forum posts.

Jesus declared the house of Israel desolate in Matthew 23. Desolation is abominable! Abomination comes in many forms, but the abomination of desolation is especially egregious to God.

There was no "abomination of desolation in Israel.

Scripture says otherwise.

 

[jeremiah1five]

I'm putting this in my top ten list of foolish internet forum posts.

Jesus declared the house of Israel desolate in Matthew 23. Desolation is abominable! Abomination comes in many forms, but the abomination of desolation is especially egregious to God.

Scripture says otherwise.

The House of God is only desolate when Christ is not in it.
But Jesus makes distinction between their house, which was a den of thieves, and the true House of God in which the seven Spirits of God dwells.

35 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate: and verily I say unto you, Ye shall not see me, until the time come when ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord. Lk 13:34–35.

And a day or three later what do the people cry?

37 And when he was come nigh, even now at the descent of the mount of Olives, the whole multitude of the disciples began to rejoice and praise God with a loud voice for all the mighty works that they had seen;
38 Saying, Blessed be the King that cometh in the name of the Lord: peace in heaven, and glory in the highest.
Lk 19:37–38.

Methinks thou hast unrighteously judged before the time.
Again.

 

[Mr GLee]

The House of God is only desolate when Christ is not in it.
But Jesus makes distinction between their house, which was a den of thieves, and the true House of God in which the seven Spirits of God dwells.

35 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate: and verily I say unto you, Ye shall not see me, until the time come when ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord. Lk 13:34–35.

And a day or three later what do the people cry?

37 And when he was come nigh, even now at the descent of the mount of Olives, the whole multitude of the disciples began to rejoice and praise God with a loud voice for all the mighty works that they had seen;
38 Saying, Blessed be the King that cometh in the name of the Lord: peace in heaven, and glory in the highest.
Lk 19:37–38.

Methinks thou hast unrighteously judged before the time.
Again.

God is not a Jewish man (dying mankind ).

It was Christ working in his prophet apostle Jesus that declared it desolate not the word of the Son of man,Jesus He has no power of his own to rebuke or raise the dead

He declared the abomination of desolation desolate .It was not his idea that mankind build a temple made with human hands as a will. That is pagan foundation.

The Spirit of Christ that dwelt in the Jesus Son of man never entered it again. . not a day or three later. There was no reason to enter it in the first place .

We walk by faith the unseen things of God .not after the temporal historical ,things seen.

Acts 17:24 God that made the world and all things therein, seeing that he is Lord of heaven and earth, dwelleth not in temples made with hands;

Isaiah 40:22 It is he that sitteth upon the circle of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers; that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in:

 

[Josheb]

There was no "abomination of desolation in Israel.

Jesus declared the house of Israel desolate in Matthew 23. Desolation is abominable! Abomination comes in many forms, but the abomination of desolation is especially egregious to God.

The House of God is only desolate when Christ is not in it.

Nice move of the goalposts. Israel is not the house of God. No one has even remotely insinuated the house of God was/is desolate. The bait and switch that is desolate.

Jesus unequivocally told the Pharisee's their house was desolate.

Matthew 23:37-38
"Jerusalem, Jerusalem, who kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to her! How often I wanted to gather your children together, the way a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were unwilling. Behold, your house is being left to you desolate!"

He used the word "is," not "was" or "will be".

Those verses are part of a five chapter narrative covering a single day in the life of Jesus and the apostles. It begins the day after Jesus entered Jerusalem, the day after he cleaned out the temple, ridding it of the money changers and profiteers running the temple. Less than a day later the infestation of corrupt Jewish leaders had returned to challenge the Messiah... repeatedly. By the end of that day they were plotting and conspiring his murder.

Deuteronomy 7:24-26
"He will deliver their kings into your hand so that you will make their name perish from under heaven; no man will be able to stand before you until you have destroyed them. The graven images of their gods you are to burn with fire; you shall not covet the silver or the gold that is on them, nor take it for yourselves, or you will be snared by it, for it is an abomination to the LORD your God. You shall not bring an abomination into your house, and like it come under the ban; you shall utterly detest it and you shall utterly abhor it, for it is something banned."

They'd been judged and the blood of the profits was to fall on them.

Matthew 27:24-25
When Pilate saw that he was accomplishing nothing, but rather that a riot was starting, he took water and washed his hands in front of the crowd, saying, "I am innocent of this Man's blood; see to that yourselves." And all the people said, "His blood shall be on us and on our children!"

The Jews did not simply say they were culpable, and they were accountable. They declared Jesus' blood would be on them and their children.

Their desolation was abominable. Leave the house of God out of it.

 

[Carbon]

​

Seems a lot of Calvinists/Reformed think the Holy Spirit wasn't a fixture until after Pentecost. That is, (if I understand those to whom I have spoken about it), that perhaps the Holy Spirit regenerated people, before Pentecost, but that he didn't indwell them until after Pentecost.

I believe it is both.

 

[makesends]

I believe it is both.

Not sure I understand. Both what? Indwelling and regenerating before Pentecost?

 

[Carbon]

Not sure I understand. Both what? Indwelling and regenerating before Pentecost?

Yes. There has only been one way of salvation since the beginning. Regeneration is first obviously. Indwelling is a must be, no one could remain with Christ if it wasn't for the Spirit.

 

[makesends]

Yes. There has only been one way of salvation since the beginning. Regeneration is first obviously. Indwelling is a must be, no one could remain with Christ if it wasn't for the Spirit.

Completely agreed.

 

[Mr GLee]

Not sure I understand. Both what? Indwelling and regenerating before Pentecost?

I would think the indwelling is the power of the Holy Spirit of regeneration. All together one labor of his love or called a work of his powerful faith. . the Faithful Creator.

 

[Josheb]

Not sure I understand. Both what? Indwelling and regenerating before Pentecost?

WCF 7.5

This covenant was differently administered in the time of the law, and in the time of the gospel: under the law it was administered by promises, prophecies, sacrifices, circumcision, the paschal lamb, and other types and ordinances delivered to the people of the Jews, all fore-signifying Christ to come, which were for that time sufficient and efficacious, through the operation of the Spirit, to instruct and build up the elect in faith in the promised Messiah, by whom they had full remission of sins, and eternal salvation, and is called the Old Testament.​

11.6

The justification of believers under the Old Testament was, in all these respects, one and the same with the justification of believers under the New Testament.​

27.5

The sacraments of the Old Testament, in regard of the spiritual things thereby signified and exhibited, were, for substance, the same with those of the New.​

That is classic Reformed theology. The WCF uses the word "regeneration" only once, and that is in reference to the sacrament of baptism. The WCF specifies the New Testament but baptism was a whole-scripture practice and, therefore the above applies. Personally, I think Hebrews 11:39-40 sums it up nicely.

Hebrews 11:39-40
And all these, having gained approval through their faith, did not receive what was promised, because God had provided something better for us, so that apart from us they would not be made perfect.


They found approval through their faith. Salvation by grace through faith = a gift of God.

 

[makesends]

I would think the indwelling is the power of the Holy Spirit of regeneration. All together one labor of his love or called a work of his powerful faith. . the Faithful Creator.

So, if I understand you correctly, you would agree with @Carbon and me: Those saved, during Old Testament times, were saved the same way as we are —one gospel only: chosen, regenerated by the indwelling Spirit of God, Salvific faith generated by the Spirit of God, through which we are saved.

 

[Mr GLee]

The sacraments of the Old Testament, in regard of the spiritual things thereby signified and exhibited, were, for substance, the same with those of the New.

I would offer. . I would agree the shadows as ceremonial laws are parables. Using the temporal signified, the things seen the "historical". in order to give us the unseen gospel understanding. He has not left us without the tools needed to rightly divide can according to the prescription needed to rightly divide the parables as shadows below .

The number 1 tool that seems to get neglected therefore no gospel understanding it get literalized limited to the historical no dging fro golden measure of saving faith. Christ in us .

2 Corinthians 4:18King James Version18 While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.

I would not use the word sacraments the shadows they did nothing to those who did demonstrate. no sign gifts as in I did it it proved it .

Spiritual unsen gifts of the Spirit of Christ . . yes!!! The ceremonies, were a sign to the whole unbelieving world carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation.

They spoke of the suffering of Christ and the glory of the cross beforehand .

LIke us today receiving the end of our new born again faith our Emanuel The salvation of our new soul having it salvation from the first hearing and believing of the gospel .

They looked ahead by the shadows of the cerimoninil laws we can today looke back by the same Spirit of Faith. Christ in us yoked with his labor of love making our daily burden lighter

Beautiful gospel parable below

1 Peter 1:9-12 Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you:Searching what, or what manner of time (reformation) the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify,(shadow) when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.Unto whom it was revealed, that not unto themselves, but unto us they did minister the things, which are now reported unto you by them that have preached the gospel unto you with the Holy Ghost sent down from heaven; which things the angels desire to look into.

 

[jeremiah1five]

Nice move of the goalposts. Israel is not the house of God. No one has even remotely insinuated the house of God was/is desolate. The bait and switch that is desolate.

Jesus unequivocally told the Pharisee's their house was desolate.

Matthew 23:37-38
"Jerusalem, Jerusalem, who kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to her! How often I wanted to gather your children together, the way a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were unwilling. Behold, your house is being left to you desolate!"

He used the word "is," not "was" or "will be".

Those verses are part of a five chapter narrative covering a single day in the life of Jesus and the apostles. It begins the day after Jesus entered Jerusalem, the day after he cleaned out the temple, ridding it of the money changers and profiteers running the temple. Less than a day later the infestation of corrupt Jewish leaders had returned to challenge the Messiah... repeatedly. By the end of that day they were plotting and conspiring his murder.

Deuteronomy 7:24-26
"He will deliver their kings into your hand so that you will make their name perish from under heaven; no man will be able to stand before you until you have destroyed them. The graven images of their gods you are to burn with fire; you shall not covet the silver or the gold that is on them, nor take it for yourselves, or you will be snared by it, for it is an abomination to the LORD your God. You shall not bring an abomination into your house, and like it come under the ban; you shall utterly detest it and you shall utterly abhor it, for it is something banned."

They'd been judged and the blood of the profits was to fall on them.

Matthew 27:24-25
When Pilate saw that he was accomplishing nothing, but rather that a riot was starting, he took water and washed his hands in front of the crowd, saying, "I am innocent of this Man's blood; see to that yourselves." And all the people said, "His blood shall be on us and on our children!"

The Jews did not simply say they were culpable, and they were accountable. They declared Jesus' blood would be on them and their children.

Their desolation was abominable. Leave the house of God out of it.

Hebrews populate the House of God.

 

[Josheb]

Hebrews populate the House of God.

ROTFLMBO!!!!!

Hebrews, but not Jews . LOL

Genesis 28:10-17
Then Jacob departed from Beersheba and went toward Haran. He came to a certain place and spent the night there, because the sun had set; and he took one of the stones of the place and put it under his head and lay down in that place. He had a dream............ Then Jacob awoke from his sleep and said, "Surely the LORD is in this place, and I did not know it." He was afraid and said, "How awesome is this place! This is none other than the house of God, and this is the gate of heaven."

Throughout the Old Testament the Jews talked as if artifices they built was the house of God but God does not dwell in houses built by human hands so every single verse in Tanakh about the "house of God" that references a stone building is a verse demonstrating Judaism's misguided theology. God put it in His work for all to see and reading it often they ignored the truth set before them - just as they did when the Messiah stood in front of them preaching truth, healing the sick, casting out demons, and commanding the elements of creation.

Isaiah 6:9-10
He said, "Go, and tell this people: 'Keep on listening, but do not perceive; Keep on looking, but do not understand.' Render the hearts of this people insensitive, their ears dull, and their eyes dim, otherwise they might see with their eyes, hear with their ears, understand with their hearts, and return and be healed."

Matthew 13:13-15
This is why I speak to them in parables, because seeing they do not see, and hearing they do not hear, nor do they understand. Indeed, in their case the prophecy of Isaiah is fulfilled that says: “You will indeed hear but never understand, and you will indeed see but never perceive.” For this people’s heart has grown dull, and with their ears they can barely hear, and their eyes they have closed, lest they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears and understand with their heart and turn, and I would heal them.

Mark 4:10-12
And when he was alone, those around him with the twelve asked him about the parables. And he said to them, “To you has been given the secret of the kingdom of God, but for those outside everything is in parables, so that 'they may indeed see but not perceive, and may indeed hear but not understand, lest they should turn and be forgiven.'”

John 12:40
He has blinded their eyes and hardened their heart, lest they see with their eyes, and understand with their heart, and turn, and I would heal them.

God, not Satan, blinded them and hardened their hearts. They incorrectly thought God lived in a building made by human hands. Abraham, on the other hand, looked for a city - an entire city, not just one building - whose foundations were designed and built by God, not man (Heb. 11:10).

Matthew 23's house is NOT the house of God. The Pharisee's house was desolate, and desolation is an abomination. Stop avoiding those facts.

Acts 7:46-48
David found favor in God's sight, and asked that he might find a dwelling place for the God of Jacob. But it was Solomon who built a house for Him. However, the Most High does not dwell in houses made by human hands....

John 14:1-6
"Do not let your heart be troubled; believe in God, believe also in me. In My Father's house are many dwelling places; if it were not so, I would have told you; for I go to prepare a place for you. If I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to myself, that where I am, there you may be also. And you know the way where I am going." Thomas said to Him, "Lord, we do not know where You are going, how do we know the way?" Jesus said to him, "I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father but through me."

It is not a Hebrews-only thing. ANYONE who believes in the name of Jesus the Messiah. Those who try to tear that down 1) aren't the house of God and 2) bring destruction upon themselves.

1 Corinthians 3:16-17
Do you not know that you are a temple of God and that the Spirit of God dwells in you? If any man destroys the temple of God, God will destroy him, for the temple of God is holy, and that is what you are.

Not every Christian in Corinth (one of the most pagan cities in the ancient world) was Hebrew.






So stop dancing around the fact Jesus told the Pharisees their house was desolate, and desolation is an abomination.

 

[jeremiah1five]

ROTFLMBO!!!!!

Hebrews, but not Jews . LOL

Genesis 28:10-17
Then Jacob departed from Beersheba and went toward Haran. He came to a certain place and spent the night there, because the sun had set; and he took one of the stones of the place and put it under his head and lay down in that place. He had a dream............ Then Jacob awoke from his sleep and said, "Surely the LORD is in this place, and I did not know it." He was afraid and said, "How awesome is this place! This is none other than the house of God, and this is the gate of heaven."

Throughout the Old Testament the Jews talked as if artifices they built was the house of God but God does not dwell in houses built by human hands so every single verse in Tanakh about the "house of God" that references a stone building is a verse demonstrating Judaism's misguided theology. God put it in His work for all to see and reading it often they ignored the truth set before them - just as they did when the Messiah stood in front of them preaching truth, healing the sick, casting out demons, and commanding the elements of creation.

Isaiah 6:9-10
He said, "Go, and tell this people: 'Keep on listening, but do not perceive; Keep on looking, but do not understand.' Render the hearts of this people insensitive, their ears dull, and their eyes dim, otherwise they might see with their eyes, hear with their ears, understand with their hearts, and return and be healed."

Matthew 13:13-15
This is why I speak to them in parables, because seeing they do not see, and hearing they do not hear, nor do they understand. Indeed, in their case the prophecy of Isaiah is fulfilled that says: “You will indeed hear but never understand, and you will indeed see but never perceive.” For this people’s heart has grown dull, and with their ears they can barely hear, and their eyes they have closed, lest they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears and understand with their heart and turn, and I would heal them.

Mark 4:10-12
And when he was alone, those around him with the twelve asked him about the parables. And he said to them, “To you has been given the secret of the kingdom of God, but for those outside everything is in parables, so that 'they may indeed see but not perceive, and may indeed hear but not understand, lest they should turn and be forgiven.'”

John 12:40
He has blinded their eyes and hardened their heart, lest they see with their eyes, and understand with their heart, and turn, and I would heal them.

God, not Satan, blinded them and hardened their hearts. They incorrectly thought God lived in a building made by human hands. Abraham, on the other hand, looked for a city - an entire city, not just one building - whose foundations were designed and built by God, not man (Heb. 11:10).

Matthew 23's house is NOT the house of God. The Pharisee's house was desolate, and desolation is an abomination. Stop avoiding those facts.

Acts 7:46-48
David found favor in God's sight, and asked that he might find a dwelling place for the God of Jacob. But it was Solomon who built a house for Him. However, the Most High does not dwell in houses made by human hands....

John 14:1-6
"Do not let your heart be troubled; believe in God, believe also in me. In My Father's house are many dwelling places; if it were not so, I would have told you; for I go to prepare a place for you. If I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to myself, that where I am, there you may be also. And you know the way where I am going." Thomas said to Him, "Lord, we do not know where You are going, how do we know the way?" Jesus said to him, "I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father but through me."

It is not a Hebrews-only thing. ANYONE who believes in the name of Jesus the Messiah. Those who try to tear that down 1) aren't the house of God and 2) bring destruction upon themselves.

1 Corinthians 3:16-17
Do you not know that you are a temple of God and that the Spirit of God dwells in you? If any man destroys the temple of God, God will destroy him, for the temple of God is holy, and that is what you are.

Not every Christian in Corinth (one of the most pagan cities in the ancient world) was Hebrew.






So stop dancing around the fact Jesus told the Pharisees their house was desolate, and desolation is an abomination.

Yes, He said THEIR house is desolate. But the House of God in which is populated by Hebrews of both kingdoms is a blessed place to be because Yahweh is there.


1 I was glad when they said unto me,
Let us go into the house of the LORD.
2 Our feet shall stand
Within thy gates, O Jerusalem.
3 Jerusalem is builded
As a city that is compact together:
4 Whither the tribes go up, the tribes of the LORD,
Unto the testimony of Israel,
To give thanks unto the name of the LORD.
5 For there are set thrones of judgment,
The thrones of the house of David.

6 Pray for the peace of Jerusalem:
They shall prosper that love thee.
7 Peace be within thy walls,
And prosperity within thy palaces.
8 For my brethren and companions’ sakes,
I will now say, Peace be within thee.
9 Because of the house of the LORD our God
I will seek thy good.
Ps 122:1–9.

Israel and Judah are the true Church of the Living God.
Israel and Judah are betrothed to Adonai and are the true Bride of God.


1 The LORD is my shepherd; I shall not want.
2 He maketh me to lie down in green pastures:
He leadeth me beside the still waters.
3 He restoreth my soul:
He leadeth me in the paths of righteousness for his name’s sake.
4 Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death,
I will fear no evil: for thou art with me;
Thy rod and thy staff they comfort me.
5 Thou preparest a table before me in the presence of mine enemies:
Thou lanointest my head with oil; my cup runneth over.
6 Surely goodness and mercy shall follow me all the days of my life:
And I will dwell in the house of the LORD for ever.
Ps 23:1–6.

 

[Mr GLee]

Hebrews populate the House of God.

God does not live in house made of dead stones (the abomination of desolation Kings in Israel a Pagan foundation pout of sight out of mind as in who would belive in a eternal God not seen

God's chosen people. Chosen to represent the gospel . God working in the affairs of dying mankind all the nations and families of the world

God is not a Jewish man as King of kings thats the goal of the father .

Yes, He said THEIR house is desolate. But the House of God in which is populated by Hebrews of both kingdoms is a blessed place to be because Yahweh is there.

Christ in us yoked with him (Emanuel)

He lives in living temples apostle that bring prophecy not dead bricks and stone made by the dying hands as a will of mankind .Its that temple that he made desolate.

The rime of the first reformation had come the wall that separated the Jew from the gentiles came tumbling down and also the high wall that separated the Jewish women from participating in the ceremonies came tumbling down.. The men's only club came to a end.

It would seem reopened to the Catholics with the Eastern orthodox all male priesthood

Peter still under the influence of a law of the fathers as in "what you see you get", no invisible head. Peter therefore not understanding the parable in that vision using Moses to represent the written law of God and Elias represent the prophets. . the testimony of sola scriptura

The Father in that parable saying" hear his word" not that of dying mankind Peter thought a literal object bricks and stone could hold a spirit of a vision The Pagan foundation "out of sight out of mind" no belief coming from Holy God not seen.

Matthew 17:3-5King James Version3 And, behold, there appeared unto them Moses and Elias talking with him. Then answered Peter, and said unto Jesus, Lord, it is good for us to be here: if thou wilt, let us make here three tabernacles; one for thee, and one for Moses, and one for Elias. While he yet spake, behold, a bright cloud overshadowed them: and behold a voice out of the cloud, which said, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased; hear ye him.

Satan king of lying sgn to wonder after as the deceiver would look to a vision of Christ and make it all about the flesh the temporal dying things seen just like Peter,

The faith of Christ's labor of love worked in Job to both reveal the will of the Father and the Father empowered Job to do it to His good pleasure. Yoked with Christ the daily burden is lighter . We can pray "give us that bread" as hidden manna and strengthen to eat it to your honor.

Job 2:4 And Satan answered the Lord, and said, Skin for skin, yea, all that a man hath will he give for his life.