Salvation and sanctification is now complete in Christ: Consecration then follows

[Ghada]

The subject of this op - the subject specified in this op - is salvation and sanctification, not justification.

Since God has His washing, sanctification, and justification the same in one verse, then I'll keep preaching it as the same from that one verse.

Your 'rule' for titles and arguments notwithstanding...

It is inaccurate to conflate salvation and sanctification as identical or synonymous.

Only in your gospel of salvation with incomplete sanctification by unrepented sinning.

Jesus Christ's gospel is salvation, sanctification, and justification the same at once and complete, by repenting from all sinning today.

the distinctions between these three is not adequately understood.

So now you are saying there is a distinction between salvation and justification? Rather than just acknowledge the truth that salvation and sanctification are the same, since sanctification and justification are the same.

Consecration is not sanctification.

Correct. Ministerial consecration is not instant and complete like sanctfication from sinning.

However, consecrating oneself to obeying God, is by His sanctification from disobeying Him.

Are we discussing sanctification, or not?

God is proving His holy sanctification is not sinful man's lukewarm stuff.

He is also showing His holy salvation, justification, circumcision, and baptism is the same operation of His Spirit, at the same time of repentance from sinning against Him for Jesus' sake.

1 Peter 1:2 states nothing of the sort.

All that verse states is the election is according to the sanctification of the Spirit, and the election is unto obedience and sprinkling of Christ's blood. Nothing more.

And nothing less. We can now add election to being the same as sanctification.

And His sanctification is the elect obeying Christ, not the unsanctified and unelect disobeying Christ.

It's good that you chose this verse because it is a post-Calvary and post-Pentecost verse

True. It's given by God for the apsotle to write after Pentecost.

But being born again, saved, sanctified, justified, and elected began after the resurrection of Jesus Christ, when His disicples believed on Him as both Lord and God by His resurrection from the dead.

Mary Magdelene was the first to confess Him as resurrected Lord.

from a New Testament post-Calvary and post-Pentecost aftermath.

The NT post-calvary aftermath is Jesus rising from the dead, and building His church with born again believers in His resurrection.

Post-Pentecost aftermath is the preaching of Jesus's death, burial, and resurrection by His chosen prophets and preachers sent into all the world to do so...

Peter's own post-conversion life was imperfect,

No man's life on this earth is ever perfect, since even Jesus was tempted to sin like all men.

But men like Jesus are tempted without sinning.

Peter did sin by having respect of persons in the faith, but repented and was forgiven. But neither was Peter nor Paul sinful workers of iniquity, that remain hardened against repenting from all sinning unto the grave.

And they especially did not preach remaining hardened against God by unrepentance.

and he did not get kicked out of the Church. Peter's particular type of imperfection (sin) appears to have persisted his entire life, as evidenced by the fact scripture often details his problem and there's no report of it ever being fixed.

This of course is the same kind of degenerate lie, that unrepented sinners try to do with Paul as apostolic 'chiefest of sinners'. Peter was not an unrepented sinner to the grave. John says we shouldn't even waste our time praying for such hardened rebels against God.

Paul spoke of how he rebuked Peter, and we know Peter recieved the correction, because Peter later wrote of his beloved brother Paul.

Otherwise, he would have done like some others today refusing to be corrected, and have written badly of Paul and his writings, rather than acknowledged them as Scripture of God.

 

[Josheb]

Nothing can change the fact that a sinful believer is still a degenerate sinner.

Prove it.

And prove it to the exclusion of Peter's post-conversion hypocrisy.

Imperfection is not sin;

Oh my. You really do not have a very good grasp on hamartiology if you think that is true.

The words used for sin in the original languages (Hebrew and Greek) mean "miss the target." Our English word "sin" comes from the Old English word "sinn," or "synn." That word, "sinn," comes from the sport of archery. It is the score a person receives when the arrow entirely misses the target. The miss was scored as a sinn.

When it comes to sin, what then is the "target"?

Scripture offers a few diverse answers but they can all be subsetted under the one over-arching goal....

Matthew 5:48
Therefore, you are to be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect.

Perfection, not merely obedience is the target.


When God first made Adam and Eve, He made them good, unashamed, and sinless. At Genesis 3:6-7 they, and all the rest of humanity, became not-good, ashamed, and sinful. There was a purity existing in Adam and Eve that allowed them to recognize anything that was not-good simply because it was not good. That ability has been lost to humanity ever since Adam disobeyed God. There's not a single person born as a sinless in a sinless world since Genesis 3:6-7. Jesus was born sinless, but he was not born into a sinless world. EVERYTHING God made is now different than the way God originally made it. God made a perfect world (incomplete perhaps, but still perfect) and now none of it is perfect. It all misses the target.

Imperfection is, in fact, sin.

otherwise Jesus would have been the greatest sinner ever, since He was tempted in all points like all men.

Let's use James 1:14 as a measure of temptation. It's not the only means, but it is a good one, and a commonly used one.

James 1:14
But each one is tempted when he is carried away and enticed by his own lust.

Does Jesus possess any untoward lusts by which he might be carried away and enticed? If you think so then please list them. I'd like to know what specific carrying-away and enticing lusts you find scripture stating Jesus to possess. If not, then simply post a brief statement such as, "No, Jesus does not possess any lusts by which he might be carried away and enticed.

There is a fundamental difference between being exposed to an enticement, or being "baited," and possessing some lust within me by which I am vulnerable to and would then take the bait. Every fisherman has had bad days when all they did was drown worms. Under the surface of the water dozens of fish may have looked at the hooked worm and not felt baited by the bait. Perhaps they were not hungry. Perhaps the worm was rancid, or no longer appealing after sitting in water too long. Perhaps those individual fish do not like works; they prefer crickets or grubs instead.

The point is that being exposed to bait is different than feeling baited.

The word used in the episodes where Jesus is said to be tempted is the word for bait, or testing. Jesus was exposed to testing, but Jesus himself did not feel tested. You need to grasp this correctly because the moment you open the door for Jesus to possess any kind of lust by which he might actually be carried away and enticed then you must hold he had them all. If you are going to read Hebrews 4:15 to mean he possessed within him all the lusts common to sinful humans, then you have also disqualified him from being Lord and Savior.

Hebrews 4:15
For we do not have a high priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but one who has been tempted in all things just as we are, yet without sin.

If Hebrews 4:15 is measured by James 1:14 then Hebrews 4:15 means, "For we do not have a high priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but one who has been [carried away and enticed by his lusts] in all things just as we are, yet without sin, and that is irreconcilable with the whole of scripture. If Jesus has all the lusts known to humanity then he gave thought to, and genuinely considered all the lusts, not just the "small" ones. If he was tempted (carried away by his lusts) in all ways but didn't sin then we must concede he lusted after women, he lusted to thieve, he lusted to murder. If enticed by his lusts in all ways common to humanity the he had a lust within him where he considered cutting little boys up and eating them after he sodomized them. If he has all the lusts of man - as you say - then he had the lusts of Jeff Dahmer and Bill Gacy.

Whether he ever acted on those lusts or not, their existence makes him imperfect.

Sin is a lust...

Show me scripture states Jesus had any of the lusts by which he might be carried away and enticed.

Imperfection is being tempted to sin.

Prove it.

Perfect obedience is being tempted like Jesus, yet without sinning.

Yes, but we're not talking about perfect obedience. We're talking about perfection. Perfection is not limited to sin. Perfection is not limited to one's conduct. An old junker of a car can get me from point A to point B perfectly, but that does not mean the car itself is perfect. Jesus was a sinless person being tempted by sin. Prior to Genesis 3:6-7 Adam and Eve were sinless people being exposed to the opportunity to disobey God. It is not correct to say they were exposed to sin because sin had not entered the world prior to Genesis 3:6-7. They were good and sinless people exposed to opportunity, not sin. Theirs was the last time those circumstances ever existed. The word good and sinless people living in a good and sinless world. Jesus was a good and sinless person living in a sinful world. Everyone else lacks inherent sinlessness and they are all born into a sinful world.

If perfection were a solely a matter of conduct, then you would have to explain how the world - the planet, the earth, the ecosystem, the creatures - acted in disobedience. If you are going to limit the means of sin to temptation as described in James 1 then you are going to have to explain how the earth has lusts and was carried away and enticed by its lusts.

Like Christ's sanctification, complete obedience is only by complete repentance from all dead works for Jesus' sake.

That is incorrect. Sanctification comes first from the work of Christ, the cleansing effects of his blood, and the washing and renewal of the Holy Spirit. Only after that happens can anyone be obedient in a sanctifying manner. The works of sinful flesh are filthy rags to God. If two sinners stood side by side before God and one was covered in sin alone and the other was covered in the blood of Christ, it's the blood-covered guy that gets in.

1 Corinthians 3:12-15
Now if any man builds on the foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, straw, each man's work will become evident; for the day will show it because it is to be revealed with fire, and the fire itself will test the quality of each man's work. If any man's work which he has built on it remains, he will receive a reward. If any man's work is burned up, he will suffer loss; but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire.

Those not building on the foundation of Christ do not get saved. Those building on the foundation of Christ may have built frivolously or fruitlessly. They may well emerge from God's testing charred, covered with soot, reeking of smoke and loss but they will be saved! They are not perfect, but they will be perfected. God's testing removes all the dross.


There are few bad definitions on which this op is built. I am, however, pleased you are able to focus on sanctification and not digress. Do a little investigation into the doctrines of Impeccability and Hamartiology.

 

[Josheb]

Since God has His washing, sanctification, and justification the same in one verse, then I'll keep preaching it as the same from that one verse.

The problem is you are NOT preaching it as that verse does. You conflate the differences where scripture does not. You can posture an appeal to purity but that doesn't change the facts of scripture.

 

[Ghada]

Sure it is. Just because one verse in the whole chapter states, "Such were some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God," does not mean the two cannot be separated.

Simple grammar and sentence structure won't all them to be separated in time of operation, nor in completeness.

Were washed, sanctified, and justified is past complete, not presently incomplete.

I'm not here to educate on reading comprehension, but only quote Scripture to prove doctrine of Christ.

And only players of intellectual games, would ever suggest the verse must be broken apart, so as to speak of sanctification 'alone'.

"Since your title only contains salvation and sanctification, then justification is off limits to the argument!" is ridiculous. Especially when the argument is made from the one and same verse for the argument.

One might as well forbid faith from the argument of salvation and sanctification, afterall it's not in the title.

However, I will defy that one too:

Heb 6
Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection ; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,

Sanctification from dead works, is by repentance from dead works, and so sanctification and faith toward God are the same gift and operation of the Spirit. As well as repentance from dead works granted by God.

We see the doctrine of Christ preaches one and the same operation of the Spirit for faith, sanctification, and justification. Now we must add faith toward God to justificaton of God, as being separated from salvation, in order to separate salvation from santification.

Why why? Just to believe in being saved by faith alone, with incomplete half-hearted repentance and lukewarm sanctification following unto the grave.

People can play the argument game with the Bible, and make up silly rules to forbid other Scripture from being applied to any other Scripture. They can even try to separate words from the same verse. But all such sporting with the words of God end in the grave.

Christ's salvation and sanctification are the same in time and completeness, because His sanctification and justification are the same. It's also the same one operation of the Spirit for circumcision, baptism, election, and newborn creature.

The playgame doctrinal cards to the contrary, end in the grave. God will go righgt ahead and do His own word, and judge all of us and our faith, by the works we do at the end.

Only them that repent for the faith of Jesus, do the justified works of God. Them that repent nor, or only in part, by their own faith alone, do not the justified works of God, but works of their own righteousness, goodness, and self-satisfaction of their own personal religious living.

 

[Josheb]

Simple grammar and sentence structure won't all them to be separated in time of operation, nor in completeness.

That is incorrect. Words have meaning and just because a group of words occur in a sentence does not make them synonymous, much less inherently related. I could write, "God has given me the gift to attend to tigers, goldfish, apple trees, and internal combustion engines," and doing so I would NOT be claiming goldfish and engines are identical, overlapping, or in any way related beyond the God-given gift of care I possess. Were I to leave engines out of that list we could correctly say one thing the remaining three have in common is they are creations of God. Tigers, goldfish, and apple trees being creations of the Creator does not make the related beyond their created aspects.

Were washed, sanctified, and justified is past complete, not presently incomplete.

Perhaps, but this op is on sanctification, not justification and when you conflate the latter as synonymous with the latter that is wrong. Making one dependent upon the other is also wrong. God can justify a person without sanctifying the person. God can also sanctify a person and not make it complete or permanent. In other words, you are arguing a series of fallacies such as false equivalences, false causes, and what's known as a composition error, or construction error (taking one part of something and assuming it is true of the whole, or taking something true of a whole and assuming all the constituent parts possess the same quality. The result is both bad scripture and bad logic.

I'm not here to educate on reading comprehension, but only quote Scripture to prove doctrine of Christ.

Not only is that a red herring, but that's just dishonest. You come into this forum every day and try to tell people how and what to believe AND you often misuse and abuse scripture (like you're doing now with sanctification and justification).

I do not mind.

Discussion boards are supposed to be about learning and learning does not occur without education. Every member here asserts their position(s), makes the case for what they believe to be true, defends it or amends it as the discussions prompt and hopefully some consensus with well-rendered scripture is gained so that all benefit.

And only players of intellectual games...

red herring

...would ever suggest the verse must be broken apart, so as to speak of sanctification 'alone'.

Straw man (I never said the verse must be broken apart).

"Since your title only contains salvation and sanctification, then justification is off limits to the argument!" is ridiculous. Especially when the argument is made from the one and same verse for the argument.

Except the verse does not state what you say about the verse and it turns out you're the one needing an education on reading comprehension!

One might as well forbid faith........

Attempt to change the subject.

However, I will defy that one too:

How about you try a good-willed collaborative conversation instead of a "defy" one? God Himself invites us to reason with Him. You've employed a series of devices objectively proving a lack of reason. The irony of these last few exchanges is that you're sinning all over the thread (apparently unaware you're doing so) and undermining your own op. The Holy Spirit does not lead God's people to use fallacies. The HS does NOT lead God's people to employ red herrings, straw men, false equivalences, false dichotomies, false causes, appeals to purity, construction errors, or misuse scripture. All of those practices are works of the flesh, not works of the Spirit. Even I were wrong identifying half of the fallacies employed in defense of this op, one fallacy is all it takes to prove your sanctification is not complete.

So stop posturing. I'm not your enemy. You're not perfect and, as a consequence, the op has a few mistakes that could easily be corrected if you give God a chance, if you give yourself a chance to learn, if you give the words I've posted due diligence.

Heb 6
Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection ; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,

LOL! Have you bothered to ;look up the Greek word translated as "perfection"? The Greek term is "teleiotēta," which is accurately translaed as "maturity" or "completion" (G5047). It is NOT the Greek word for "absence of defect." Teleioteta is the tern used to describe the end result of things like the fermentation process whereby grape juice matures and becomes wine.

You've built you position on a mistranslation.

The KJV got it wrong. Basing doctrine on bad translations is wrong (imperfect, sinful). The matter is easily (and readily) corrected. I just provided the means for verifying the error and, with a little more investigation on your part, you could fairly easily find the Greek word for "perfection" that does mean "absence of any and all defect" and willingly adjust your case accordingly. This is a test. It's a test to see 1) if you really are interested in the facts and truths of scripture as asserted by scripture itself, 2) if you are willing and able to not just acknowledge mistakes but correct them when evidence proves a clear necessity to do so, and 3) if you'll accept the opportunity to further sanctify and consecrate you, or whether or not you'll persist in this incompleteness, this lack of teleioteta.

I remind you I am not the enemy.

 

[Josheb]

Sanctification from dead works, is by repentance from dead works, and so sanctification and faith toward God are the same gift and operation of the Spirit. As well as repentance from dead works granted by God.

Yes. I agree. The problem is there would be no need for the author of Hebrews to write that if salvation instantly completed the work of sanctification. Those people to whom he was writing would have no dead works. The author is writing to a group of converts to Christ! It is converts to Christ who have dead works! It is those dead works from which they need sanctification. They are not perfect.

We see the doctrine of Christ preaches one and the same operation of the Spirit for faith, sanctification, and justification. Now we must add faith toward God to justificaton of God, as being separated from salvation, in order to separate salvation from santification.

I, again, agree, but that does not prove sanctification is complete. The existence of something does not prove the completeness of that thing.

People can play the argument game..........

Non sequitur.

Focus. If I understand your position correctly, then salvation and sanctification are now complete (and therefore the latter cannot be considered and ongoing process umbrella'd underneath the former) and consecration then follows. That is partly correct, but it is not wholly correct. That is the irony.

 

[Ghada]

The point made was this op is about how consecration follows sanctification (which is supposedly complete).

True. The error of faith aloners is to never complete their sanctification due to half-hearted repentance.

Jesus' saving, sanctifying, and justifying faith is not the faith of lukewarm believers. It is the faith and power of God to always do those things pleasing to the Father.

Christ's call to ministry however is gradually following His salvation, sanctification, and justification of His own saints.

Sanctification that faith aloners call porgressive, is not the sanctification of Christ. Chjrist's calling of His sanctified saints into His ministry, is progressive.

 

[Ghada]

You haven't even defined your terms.

Scripture defines God's terms. Being washed, sanctified, and justified are defined by Christ, as being at the same time and complete..

The word for "sanctify" in the NT is "hagiazo." It means to separate, but to separate and purify. The word "holy" ("hagio") means separate, too, but more specifically it is to separate specifically for sacred purpose. Sanctify and holy are not interchangeable words. Sanctify is to separate and make holy..... having purified that which is being separated. One early mention of "sanctify" in the NT occurs in John 17:17, where Jesus asks God to sanctify his disciples with the truth.

What sanctification of Christ is, does not change that it is at the same time complete as being washed and justified.

 

[Ghada]

John 10:36 says Jesus was sanctified by the Father when sent into the world. Neither of those examples is post-Calvary, post=Pentecost, post-conversion, post-salvation.

Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God?

The Father does not sanctify the Word and Son from sinning, which is only for repented saints.

Sanctification of repented saints is from sinful works to good works, by commandment of the Son.

Sanctfication of the Word is from heaven to earth, by the commandment of the Father.

The Father commanded the Word to become flesh on earth, and sanctified Him by the same commandment to do His will at all times, give Himself unto death on a cross as the Lamb of God, and rise again from the grave.

The Son's sanctification was from heaven to earth, and unto being the Lamb of God. No other man is sanctified by the Father nor the Son, to be the Lamb of God.

 

[Josheb]

True. The error of faith aloners is to never complete their sanctification due to half-hearted repentance.

Yeah.... don't be attacking others. It's a meaningless argument and it's petty. Just say, "True," and let your "true" be true and build from that consensus.

Scripture defines God's terms.

Yep.

Being washed, sanctified, and justified are defined by Christ, as being at the same time and complete.

Yep.

the problem still remains: sanctification and justification are not identical and you keep posting as if that is not the case, and as if the latter has anything to do with this op. Until you actually practice what you preach (scripture defines its own terms) you'll be undermining your own op on every occasion where that occurs. It's unnecessary and does not help prove the op.

What sanctification of Christ is, does not change that it is at the same time complete as being washed and justified.

You have yet to prove that point and you've taken up half of two pages of posts in the effort. Your case must be better than this. It has not been able to overcome the little I've broached so far.

I respectfully suggest you start over before we get further and further afield of the op with these and other digressions. Restate your thesis. It's something like....


Sanctification is complete at conversion. Consecration then becomes the ongoing process.


If I have that correct, then let me know. If I do not, then correct it. Either way, define your terms and dos so with scripture. When doing so try to keep in mind at least some of what I've already posted because scripture does NOT define sanctification synonymously or always assert the two as always occurring together and never apart. Don't give me a reason to repeat already posted protests. Speak about sanctification and consecration without muddying the water with justification. Those being consecrated, after all, are already justified in multiple ways .

 

[Ghada]

sanctification and justification are not identical

Not in man's sinful religion.

1Co 6:11
And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

In God's pure religion of Jesus Christ on earth, being washed, sanctified, and justified are the same in time and completeness.

I've repeated this enough to the same person.

You have yet to prove that point and you've taken up half of two pages of posts in the effort. Your case must be better than this. It has not been able to overcome the little I've broached so far.

I don't make cases and arguments, that depend on others agreeing.

If someone can show any error in the argument I make from the Scriptures I give, then I will be well corrected. Otherwise, the truth of the doctrine is not dependent on agreement of others.

Gal 1
For do I now persuade men, or God? or do I seek to please men? for if I yet pleased men, I should not be the servant of Christ.

Sanctification is complete at conversion. Consecration then becomes the ongoing process.

Exactly. So, I don't see why there is an argument against salvation and sanctification and justification are complete as is conversion...

because scripture does NOT define sanctification synonymously or always assert the two as always occurring together and never apart.

I've never seen any Scripture saying otherwise, since that would be a conradiction of the Scripture given, that they are at the same time and completeness with being now washed....

Speak about sanctification and consecration without muddying the water with justification.

I don't go by any rule to separate one Scripture from another, for people who want to separate doctrine of Christ from itself.

Especially not when the doctrine is in the same verse of Scripture.

Those being consecrated, after all, are already justified in multiple ways .

In only one way of the Lord is His sanctification and consecration the same: Sanctification from sins and trespasses with consecration to only doing His will. This pure religion of Jesus's justifying faith and grace is only given to them that do repent now from all their transgressions for His sake.

Consecration to ministry as a sanctified saint of the Lord, is progressive with God's call to do so...(Scriptures already given)

I don't argue with the religion of salvation and justification by faith alone apart from works. Many religions of man teach it in one form or another. They believe they will wake up in a heaven at death, while having conmtinued sinning and trespassing against the righteous Lord on earth.

I just argue against that vain faith of religion.

Some even preach they have already woken up in a heaven of their own, while remaining sinners on earth. Some forms of Buddhism, New Agism, and Christian soul-separationism preach that...

 

[Josheb]

Not in man's sinful religion.

Not in God's word, either. God sanctifies AND God justifies. God does both and the two are not synonymous or identical.

1 Corinthians 1 6:11 proves it.

1Co 6:11
And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

In God's pure religion of Jesus Christ on earth, being washed, sanctified, and justified are the same in time and completeness.

Their being done at the same time does not make them the same condition. God washes AND God sanctifies AND God justifies. The three are not identical. The three completely different actions may occur at the same time, but they are not one identical action. To make them so would mean Paul was redundant and unnecessarily so.

1 Corinthians 6:11
And such were some of you: but ye are washed/sanctified/justified, but ye are washed/sanctified/justified, but ye are washed/sanctified/justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

That is NOT what the scripture states.


1 Corinthians 6:11
Such were some of you; but you were washed [apelousasthe], but you were sanctified [hegiasthete], but you were justified [edikaiothete] in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.


The three are not identical. They are different.

I've repeated this enough to the same person.

Perhaps, but repetition of error is still error. The three are not identical. Argumentum ad nauseam is logically falacious. Merely repating something does not make it true, no matter how many times a thing is repeated.

I don't make cases and arguments, that depend on others agreeing.

LOL!

Think how that reads. "I don't make cases and arguments, that depend on others agreeing [with God's word]."

If someone can show any error in the argument I make from the Scriptures I give, then I will be well corrected.

Well, I just did that so I expect you to say, "Yes, Josh, apelousasthe, hegiasthete, and edikaiothete are not the same thing. Thank you for pointing that out," and I expect to read that in the very next post. If I do not read it in the very next post then I will post, "You do not keep your own word," and probably move on because it is impossible to have an intelligent conversation with anyone who ignores and then denies the facts of scripture AND does not keep his word or abide by his own standards.

And let me encourage and exhort you to keep the posts about the posts and not the posters because the rest of Post #31 i all about you and if you want me to comment further on you based on the comment you posted about you then we're not going to be addressing the op.




Scripture speaks of salvation in three tenses, the past tense of an already accomplished task, the present tense of an ongoing process, and the future tense of something completed when we are raised incorruptible and immortal. That's not an opinion. That's not a matter up for debate. The proof has been posted. Likewise, sanctification is also spoken of in scripture as something both accomplished and something ongoing, something that is both monergistic and synergistic. The contexts of the various verses elaborate and illuminate which is which, and that matter has been discussed in the three ops listed HERE. That leaves consecration. The word consecration is nt the same as sanctification and neither is it the same as justification. The word "consecration" ordinarily means "to make sacred." Nothing more. According to scripture, consecration is also something finished and something ongoing, and the two conditions are not mutually exclusive of one another. The proof of that has already been posted.

I, for my part, generally agree with the basic premise asserted in the op: We ARE saved BUT God continues to work in us to clean us up, "consecrate," and make us holy all the way up until that last moment when we draw or last breath and then see Him face to face. However, none us will arrive pure and perfect, apart from Christ. It is only in resurrection that we become incorruptible and immortal, and on the other side of the grave...

1 Corinthians 3:11-15
For no man can lay a foundation other than the one which is laid, which is Jesus Christ. Now if any man builds on the foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, straw, each man's work will become evident; for the day will show it because it is to be revealed with fire, and the fire itself will test the quality of each man's work. If any man's work which he has built on it remains, he will receive a reward. If any man's work is burned up, he will suffer loss; but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire.


Those building on the foundation of Christ will emerge charred, covered in soot, but saved, sanctified, and consecrated, nonetheless.


I ignored Posts 27, 28, and 29 because I should not have to repeat myself. I don't do ad nauseam. Waaaaay back in Post 17 I observed the problem of conflation. Sanctification and justification are not identical. They may occur at the same time, but they are not identical. They are not the same.

If someone can show any error in the argument I make from the Scriptures I give, then I will be well corrected.

Posts 18 through 32 prove otherwise. If you lived by what you just posted then Post 18 would say, "Yes, you are correct, Josh, sanctification and justification are not identical, they are not the same, but I believe they occur at the same time," and the fact in evidence so far is that has not happened. It is a simple mistake, and because it is a simple mistake it is also one easily and readily corrected.

So do so now.

Otherwise, you'll be posting only to yourself. There's no one else here (currently), and I'm not interest in ad nauseam.

Isaiah 1:18 KJV
"Come now, and let us reason together,” Says the LORD, “Though your sins are like scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they are red like crimson, they shall be as wool."

​

Sanctification and justification are not identical. To be sanctified means to be purified or made pure, and to be justified means to have legal standing in order to plead one's case. The two are NOT the same. To be consecrated means to be made sacred. ALL THREE are aspects of holiness. To be made holy simply means to be made separate or separated for sacred purpose.


Say it.

Then we can get on with the rest of the conversation, discussing this op.

 

[Ghada]

Oh my. You really do not have a very good grasp on hamartiology if you think that is true.

Hamarwhati? Obviously harmartiology is the scientific term for changing Scripture, by Greek means.

Jas 1:13
Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:

The perfection of God in heaven is not to be tempted at all.

Heb 4:15
For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.

The perfection of God on earth includes being tempted, yet without sinning by temptation. Jesus Christ was the first and only man to do so all His life on earth, and His repented brethren have been doing so since His resurrection on earth.

When it comes to sin, what then is the "target"?

The target of God's glory on earth, is to obey His word and not sin and trespass against Him.

God's glorious target from the beginning is creating man in His own image with spiritual purity, and live in godly and holy obedience to His commandment.

As the song goes, It's still the same...

Hebrews
{13:8} Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever. {13:8} Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.

God's glory and target in man on earth is the virtue of Jesus Christ, that all men are now called to repent and do as He.

2Pe 1:2
Grace and peace be multiplied unto you through the knowledge of God, and of Jesus our Lord,

2Pe 1:3
According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:

Those sinning and falling short of God's glory on earth, have not repented to live virtuously as the Son.

Scripture offers a few diverse answers but they can all be subsetted under the one over-arching goal....

Matthew 5:48
Therefore, you are to be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect.

Perfection, not merely obedience is the target.

Jesus was speaking of many things, including loving enemies, and not just friends.

Jesus was not speaking of not being tempted at all on earth, as God in heaven is not tempted.

Yes, but we're not talking about perfect obedience.

You're talking about imperfect obedience by your own faith alone on earth.

I'm preaching perfect obedience by Jesus' own faith on earth.

We're talking about perfection.

You're talking about God's perfection on the throne, and confuse it with being perfected in Christ on earth.

Many unrepented sinners do so on purpose, in order to justify their lukewarm imperfect obedience as just more unavoidable 'imperfections' of sinful man on earth.

2 Tim
{2:15} Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. {2:16} But shun profane [and] vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness.

Perfection is not limited to sin.

Perfection of God in heaven is limited to no temptation.

Perfection of His sons on earth is limited to no sinning by temptation.

Perfection is not limited to one's conduct.

Correct, because it only begins with a perfect heart toward God by repentance unto Jesus' delieverance from lust and sin.

Matth 23:26
Thou blind Pharisee, cleanse first that which is within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also.

2Pe 1:2
Grace and peace be multiplied unto you through the knowledge of God, and of Jesus our Lord,

2Pe 1:3
According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:

Carnal natural man only believes works are committed with the flesh. God judges our thoughts and intents of heart as works committed in the spirit:

Mat 5:28
But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.

If perfection were a solely a matter of conduct, then you would have to explain how the world - the planet, the earth, the ecosystem, the creatures - acted in disobedience.

Perfection of good or evil is solely a matter of God, angels, and men.

And so, we see how mixing godly perfection with nature, results in a form of pagan spiritism, where rivers, trees, earth, moon, and stars have spirits to worship as good or evil.

The Scamander was a river god, that helped the Trojans against the Achaeans. It was disobeying Zeus' judgment that Illium would fall...

Amo 5:26
But ye have borne the tabernacle of your Moloch and Chiun your images, the star of your god, which ye made to yourselves.

Rom 1:22
Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.

And the mixing of God's perfection in heaven to not be tempted, with His sons' perfecting sinning not by temptation, is used to jsutify ungodly sinning as just more unavoidable 'imperfections' of ungodly sinners on earth.

 

[Josheb]

Hamarwhati? Obviously harmartiology is the scientific term for changing Scripture, by Greek means.

That is all anyone needs to know about your ability to speak to this subject.

It takes 9.46 seconds to Google the word (Ijust timed it) to discover its meaning. It took me 27 seconds to typ, "Hamarwhati? Obviously harmartiology is the scientific term for changing Scripture, by Greek means," which means there was no interest in learning, and the longer route was taken for the sake of mockery. I'll be moving on now.

 

[Ghada]

When God first made Adam and Eve, He made them good, unashamed, and sinless.

Correct. Christ still creates all souls in His image good, unashamed, and without sin.

At Genesis 3:6-7 they, and all the rest of humanity, became not-good, ashamed, and sinful.

Correct. By sinning like Adam and Eve.

Rom 5:12
Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

Even as sin only entered into heaven by angels sinning, so sin only enters into the world by men and women sinning.

The death of the soul by sinning only passes upon the soul that is sinning. And since all men have sinned, then all men on earth have died to God.

Except Jesus Christ, and now also them in Him doing His good and sinning not, are alive to God on earth.

After His resurrection, all men and women still sinning today against the Lord and His Christ, are dead and crucifying Christ unto themselves afresh.

Jesus was born sinless, but he was not born into a sinless world.

True. As all men and women are created by Christ in His own pure and holy image, all men and women have sinned, so that sin enters into the world by sinning.

Jesus was born sinless, but he was not born into a sinless world.

The standard lie about Jesus coming in the flesh sinless, unlike all men coming in the world sinful, is either by souls being now created sinful, or the flesh has sin in it.

In either case, there is nothing sinful created by Christ. Christ is not the Creator nor Maker of anything sinful, whether spirit or flesh.

Is 40:6
The voice said, Cry. And he said, What shall I cry? All flesh is grass, and all the goodliness thereof is as the flower of the field:

There is no such thing as 'sinful' vs sinless' flesh, since all flesh on earth as grass is made naturally mortal by Christ. There is nothing 'moral' about mortal flesh, blood, and bone.

It's also form of antichrist heresy, that Jesus Christ did not come in the same flesh of man, but in some other kind of flesh than all men and women.

2Jo 1:7
For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

Nor did He come in the flesh of angels visiting the earth for a season:

Rom 1:3
Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh;

Heb 2:16
For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham. Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.

Jesus came in the same flesh of Abraham made of the seed of David. The same flesh and blood of Mary and His brothers and sisters by Mary and Joseph.

Only the pagans believed in the myths and legends of demigods and heroes born of the gods with 'super' flesh bodies...

Neither is Jesus Christ the Author and Tempter of men to sin, by 'making us that way' with sin. James 1 rebukes that false accusation against God the Creator.

Jas 1:13
Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:

EVERYTHING God made is now different than the way God originally made it.

I reject any other christ, that is not the same Christ and Creator, who creates all things good yesterday, today, and forever...

Rev 4:11
Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created.

As we see in Scripture, even as Christ has created, so He is creating today all things for His pleasure.

God made a perfect world (incomplete perhaps, but still perfect) and now none of it is perfect.

The heaven and earth and all creatures created therein, was and are perfectly made by Christ. There is nothing sinful nor righteous about any natural terrestrial and celestial made by Christ.

The world of man on earth in the beginning was good and sinlessly obedient to God's commandment, With the first transgression of man, sin enters into our world, and with men and women continuing to sin, we now are born into and live in a world in iniquity.

Both David and Jesus were born into awhole world lying in wickedness, yet Jesus lived without sin with the world of sinful men.

And the repented living in Christ Jesus, are no more sinning with the world as enemies of God, but now live holy in all manners as sons, brothers, and friends.

Preaching a doctrine of God's throneroom perfection on earth, as well as the lie of Christ now making men and women sinful children of darkness from the womb, only serve to justify sinning unto the grave.

The former reduces enmity with God as just more unavoidable 'imperfections' of sinful man. The latter makes sinning as only a natural bodily function, filthy but inevitable...

Christ still makes all souls good and clean today as yesterday, with natural flesh as grass of the earth. And His glory and virtue on earth, is to perfect repented obedience saints and sons in the fear and holiness of the Lord.

We all are still tempted as the Son was, yet as the Son, obedient brethren in Christ are tempted without lusting and sinning against the Father.

 

[Ghada]

James 1:14
But each one is tempted when he is carried away and enticed by his own lust.

True. And so being enticed by one's own lust, is how man created in the image of God makes himself an enemy of God on earth, even as Lucifer first made himself an enemy of the Lord in heaven.

Isa 14:12
How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!

Isa 14:13
For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:

Does Jesus possess any untoward lusts by which he might be carried away and enticed?

No. And now neither do they that repent of their own lust and sin for His sake.

2Pe 1:3
According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:

2Pe 1:4
Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.

Jesus was exposed to testing,

True. All angels and men and women are tested by the Lord for obedience. Angels in heaven, and men and women on earth.

but Jesus himself did not feel tested.

This is a new one. Thanks.

For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.

Jesus did feel the infirmity of His own flesh, even as all men and women of flesh and blood that are tried and tempted on earth.

The great High Priest and man Christ Jesus on the throne can now have personal empathy, having suffered with the same feeling of infirmity

Not only is the philosophic statement false, that Jesus did not 'feel' His own temptations in the flesh, but it also can lead to the antichrist heresy that Jesus Christ did not come in the same natural flesh and blood of man, and so did not having any feeling of the flesh, like all men and women.

It's a kind of 'Superman' docetism...

 

[Ghada]

If Hebrews 4:15 is measured by James 1:14 then Hebrews 4:15 means, "For we do not have a high priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but one who has been [carried away and enticed by his lusts] in all things just as we are, yet without sin, and that is irreconcilable with the whole of scripture.

Of course it's not reconciled to any Scripture, because it's not Scripture. It's rewritten to appear to say something else.

Heb 4:15
For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.
The Scripture is saying that Jesus was tempted the same as we are. We, being the righteous apostles and saints in Christ Jesus, who are now without lust like He was.

The rewriting appears to say that Jesus was tempted, but not like we are. We, being now as all men with lust and enticement to sin.

"For we do not have a high priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but one who has been tempted in all things, just [not] as we are [carried away and enticed by his lusts], yet without sin,"

That is indeed reconciliable to the whole twisting of Scripture, that justifies one's own continued sinning in the world, because 'everyone's doing it...'

And it is indeed a uniquely crafty way of saying we are all still lusting sinners on earth, unlike Jesus. It does so by making Scripture say we are all tempted the same with lust, unlike Jesus.

The craftiness of it, is that it shows a certain knowledge of truth in Scripture, that Jesus was not tempted the same as lusting sinners, not just in result, but in the nature of the temptation.

As the rewritten verse shows, Jesus could not have been tempted like sinners of the world are, because He did not have the same lust of the world to be tempted and drawn away with. The difference is between those tempted without lust of the world, and those being tempted by their own lust of the world.

The lie made out of Heb 4:15, is to make it appear to say we, that we the righteous apostles and saints in Christ Jesus, are also all tempted like all lusting sinners on earth, unlike Jesus whose own temptations were not by having lust of the world:

"For we do not have a high priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but one who has been tempted in all things, just [not] as we are [carried away and enticed by his lusts], yet without sin,"

If this is the purpose of the rewriting, then it is to lie and say Jesus is the only man ever on earth not to be tempted and drawn away by His own lust.

Being carried away and enticed by lusts, is inserted into Heb 4:15, not just to reveal the truth that the temptations of Christ are different in nature from that of sinful man, but also purposely attaches the ungodly nature of temptation carried away and enticed by lusts, to we, the apostles and saints in Christ Jesus.

I.e. We on earth are all ungodly sinners being tempted at times by our own lusts and enticed to sin against God, unilke Jesus.

In the rewriting, the truth is rightly made known about the different nature of temptation between the man Jesus and sinners of the world. However, it is rewritten subtley to make the lie that Jesus' own temptations were His alone, and not the same as we His apostles and saints and the rest of the world tempted by our own lust to sin against Him.

I.e. we are all ungodly sinners sinning against God at times, unlike the man Jesus.

It is uniquely crafty indeed, because it is also the first time I have personally seen a truth of Scripture, that is not at all well known, and purposely made into a lie that is commonmly preached by lusting sinners, who want to justify themselves by believing and saying unlike Jesus 'everybody's doing it...'

In this case, Everybody's being tempted the same way, unlike Jesus. The subtlety is making the results the same, the one yet without sin and all others and with sin, by making the nature of temptations the same, the one without lust to sin and all others with lust to sin.

"For we do not have a high priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but one who has been tempted in all things, just [not] as we are [carried away and enticed by his lusts, and with sin},"

 

[Ghada]

Prove it.

Prove a sinner is ungodly?

Psa 1:5
Therefore the ungodly shall not stand in the judgment, nor sinners in the congregation of the righteous. For the LORD knoweth the way of the righteous: but the way of the ungodly shall perish.

With God there is no other kind of sinner.

We see now how some ungodly sinners make themselves godly sinners, even as by their own faith alone they make themselves righteous doers of unrighteousness.

And prove it to the exclusion of Peter's post-conversion hypocrisy.

While sinning, all men are ungodly sinners. Peter was being an ungodly sinner in need of repentance. With Paul's rebuke, Peter repented.

The gospel is not that we have never sinned like Jesus, but that we can repent of our own ungodly sinning for His sake, and become like Him without ungdoly sinning.

Those who do not repent and remain ungodly sinners unto death, are judged by their own works as ungodly sinners forever.

Oh my. You really do not have a very good grasp on hamartiology if you think that is true.

My lack of grasping at science to justify sinning, is on purpose.

That's also why I like to mock and make fun of it. You have your harmatizoology for ungodly sinners, and I have my gospel for repented godly sons.

The words used for sin in the original languages (Hebrew and Greek) mean "miss the target." Our English word "sin" comes from the Old English word "sinn," or "synn." That word, "sinn," comes from the sport of archery. It is the score a person receives when the arrow entirely misses the target. The miss was scored as a sinn.

Now you have your dictionariology.

God's Bible is His dictionary that says sin is ungodly and unrighteous and transgression of His law.

Do a little investigation into the doctrines of Impeccability and Hamartiology.

I've already investigated that man's science applied to the doctrine of Christ, only results in more ungodly sinning.

2 Tim
{2:15} Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. {2:16} But shun profane [and] vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness.

The gospel of Jesus Christ is not a biological study of blood.

 

[Ladodgers6]

In Jesus' Christ's kingdom and body on earth, there is no separation bewteen His salvation and sanctification, even as there is none between His faith and works. However, there is a growing consecration to His service and ministry, that is after being saved and sanctified by His new birth of the Spirit.

1 Cor
{6:9} Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind... {6:11} And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

Romans
{2:28} For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither [is that] circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: {2:29} But he [is] a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision [is that] of the heart, in the spirit, [and] not in the letter; whose praise [is] not of men, but of God.

God's sanctification from the lust and sins of the world, is at once even as by circumcision of the Spirit of Christ.

Hebrews
{4:12} For the word of God [is] quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and [is] a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

The sanctification of Christ from the old life without God, is the circumcision of Christ and instant operation of the Spirit, made for them that repent of all their sins and trespasses for Jesus' sake.

2 Cor
{5:17} Therefore if any man [be] in Christ, [he is] a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new. {5:18} And all things [are] of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ.

When any man obeys the commandment of God to all men everywhere, to repent of all our sins and trespasses for Jesus's sake, then His NT promise of being created a new creature in Christ Jesus, is immediately kept by the Spirit with a whole new heart and life, that is now all of God, and none of the devil.

The progressive sanctification of sinful man's faith, with only half hearted gradual repentance at one's own will of convenience, is not the pure religion of Jesus' righteous faith, that is freely given to them that repent by commandment with a whole heart.

Jerem
{3:9} And it came to pass through the lightness of her whoredom, that she defiled the land, and committed adultery with stones and with stocks. {3:10} And yet for all this her treacherous sister Judah hath not turned unto me with her whole heart, but feignedly, saith the LORD.

Ezek
{18:30} Therefore I will judge you, O house of Israel, every one according to his ways, saith the Lord GOD. Repent, and turn [yourselves] from all your transgressions; so iniquity shall not be your ruin.

And so, while there is no progressively diminishing 'gap' between being wholly converted, circumcised, and sanctified in Christ Jesus, there is an increasing call to consecration in His service.

1 Tim
{4:13} Till I come, give attendance to reading, to exhortation, to doctrine. {4:14} Neglect not the gift that is in thee, which was given thee by prophecy, with the laying on of the hands of the presbytery. {4:15} Meditate upon these things; give thyself wholly to them; that thy profiting may appear to all.

2 Tim
{2:15} Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

1 Cor
{16:15} I beseech you, brethren, (ye know the house of Stephanas, that it is the firstfruits of Achaia, and [that] they have addicted themselves to the ministry of the saints,)

Thanks for sharing Ghada, I like Romans 6. Because before that Paul preaches the true Gospel. Which is God justifying the ungodly through Faith Alone apart from any works including the Law. This means that God doesn't save us form the Law; the Law is good and holy. What He saves us from the curse of the Law, meaning condemnation, death and punishment due to sin. Also Paul in Romans 7 where Paul calls the Law good.

Now knowing that we are justified before a Holy God who demands perfect obedience, holiness, that can only be found in Christ and be imputed/credited to the ungodly through Faith Alone. Because Christ has fulfilled the Law demands for perfect holiness, he has sanctified himself for us.

John 17:19 And for their sake I consecrate myself, that they also may be sanctified in truth.

1 Cor. 1:30 And because of him you are in Christ Jesus, who became to us wisdom from God, righteousness and sanctification and redemption, 31 so that, as it is written, “Let the one who boasts, boast in the Lord.”

It's only in Christ that we receive all the heavenly blessings through Faith Alone. This is where must stand and have faith in the One who accomplish for us what we never could. Knowing it's truth and Christ is who he said he is.

Now, that we are free from the curse of the Law. We hear, obey and follow Christ. Here let's look at what Paul says in Romans 6:
​

Dead to Sin, Alive to God​

1 What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin that grace may abound? 2 By no means! How can we who died to sin still live in it? 3 Do you not know that all of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into his death? 4 We were buried therefore with him by baptism into death, in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, we too might walk in newness of life.

5 For if we have been united with him in a death like his, we shall certainly be united with him in a resurrection like his. 6 We know that our old self was crucified with him in order that the body of sin might be brought to nothing, so that we would no longer be enslaved to sin. 7 For one who has died has been set free from sin. 8 Now if we have died with Christ, we believe that we will also live with him. 9 We know that Christ, being raised from the dead, will never die again; death no longer has dominion over him. 10 For the death he died he died to sin, once for all, but the life he lives he lives to God. 11 So you also must consider yourselves dead to sin and alive to God in Christ Jesus.

12 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, to make you obey its passions. 13 Do not present your members to sin as instruments for unrighteousness, but present yourselves to God as those who have been brought from death to life, and your members to God as instruments for righteousness. 14 For sin will have no dominion over you, since you are not under law but under grace.​

So, now being baptist into the death of Christ we are new creatures able to walk in holiness due to what Christ has done for us; this is the crux of the believer, not trusting in what you do here after but in Christ has already done for us. So, go out perform good works and do not grow weary if it takes a while, Paul, says in Galatians,

6 Let the one who is taught the word share all good things with the one who teaches. 7 Do not be deceived: God is not mocked, for whatever one sows, that will he also reap. 8 For the one who sows to his own flesh will from the flesh reap corruption, but the one who sows to the Spirit will from the Spirit reap eternal life. 9 And let us not grow weary of doing good, for in due season we will reap, if we do not give up. 10 So then, as we have opportunity, let us do good to everyone, and especially to those who are of the household of faith.
​

So, help your neighbor, show them love and compassion as our Father is heaven has shown us. Don't judge or be critical, be patient.

Galatians 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness, self-control; against such things there is no law. 24 And those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires.

25 If we live by the Spirit, let us also keep in step with the Spirit. 26 Let us not become conceited, provoking one another, envying one another.​

By Grace Alone in Christ Alone through Faith Alone!

 

[Ghada]

Not in God's word, either. God sanctifies AND God justifies.

True.

God does both and the two are not synonymous or identical.

In the righteous Lord's gospel of whole repentance unto salvation, yes.

In unrighteous man's gospel of salvation unto unholy repentance, no.

The three completely different actions may occur at the same time, but they are not one identical action.

And so, now we see agreement, that being saved and sanctified must be at the same time, in order for salvation and justification to be at the same time.

The gospels being preached are different, in the matter of completeness.

The one preaches complete salvation, justification, and sanctification beginning and ending at the same time.

The other preaches complete salvation and justification, with sanctification beginning at the same time incomplete, as well as ending incomplete.

The former is the gospel of Jesus Christ, and the latter is not the beginning and ending of sinful man, not of Jesus Christ.

Rev 1:8
I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.

Hebrews
{13:8} Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.

Even as Jesus Christ is the same in the beginning and end, so is His gospel of salvation, sanctification, and justification the same from beginning to end.

It's the gospel of whole repentance unto complete salvation, sanctification, and justification by Jesus Christ.

The other gospel is plainly not the same as Jesus Christ, since the santification is not the same as the salvation and justification. And that is of course because it's the gospel of unwhole repentance unto unholy sanctification...

Jerem 3:10
And yet for all this her treacherous sister Judah hath not turned unto me with her whole heart, but feignedly, saith the LORD.

1 Corinthians 6:11
And such were some of you: but ye are washed/sanctified/justified, but ye are washed/sanctified/justified, but ye are washed/sanctified/justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

That is NOT what the scripture states.

No, but it is what Scripture is saying.

Neh 8:8
So they read in the book in the law of God distinctly, and gave the sense, and caused them to understand the reading.

And it still confirms what Scripture does state: washed, sanctified, and justified are in the same tense and sense complete.

To say otherwise, is to depart from sense of grammar, as well as of Scripture.

We can also say of Scripture:

And such were some of you: but ye are washed/sanctified/justified/circumcised/baptised/redeemed, but ye are washed/sanctified/justified/redeemed/baptised/circumcised, but ye are washed/sanctified/justified/redeemed/baptised/circumcised in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

Like the Spirit's justification and salvation are the same by justification in 1 Cor 6, so is redemption and salvation the same by the Spirit's sanctification in 1 Cor 1:30:

But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:

And like salvation, justification, and redemption are the same by the same Spirit, so is the Spirit's baptism and salvation the same by sanctification sanctification from old sins:

Rom 6:4
Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

And finally, Christ's circumcision is also the same with salvation, sanctification, justification, and redemption by the Spirit's baptism:

Col 2:10
And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:
Col 2:11
In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:
Col 2:12
Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.

And of course, the Scripture confirms the completeness of all these things is the same, by the same operation of the quick and sharp Spirit of Christ at the same time.

And so the gospel of Jesus Christ's pure religion on earth, is at the beginning and the ending by whole repentance from dead works unto faith and salvation of God.

2 Cor 7:10
For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.

Heb 6:1
Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,

Acts
{3:19} Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;

At any time sinning is unrepented of by sinning against God and His Christ, there is no faith toward God unto the one Spirit's conversion, salvation, sanctification, jsutification, redemption, circumcision, and baptism of Jesus Christ...

The other gospel is for unrepented and lukewarm trespassers seeking complete salvation and justification by one's own faith alone, with incomplete repentance and sanctification sinning unto the end.

It's simply the religion of man's own endlessly incomplete circumcison of the heart's foreskin of lust, with sinful hands of flesh:

Deu 10:16
Circumcise therefore the foreskin of your heart, and be no more stiffnecked. For the LORD your God is God of gods, and Lord of lords, a great God, a mighty, and a terrible, which regardeth not persons, nor taketh reward:

Col 2:11
In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:

1 Corinthians 6:11
Such were some of you; but you were washed [apelousasthe], but you were sanctified [hegiasthete], but you were justified [edikaiothete] in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.


The three are not identical. They are different.

This is a senseless satement about different verbs with indentical tenses.

The Scripture makes the different verbs the same in sense, by having the same tense.

Once again, it's foolish to argue with the effort to redefine grammar, in order to deny the sense thereof.