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Is anyone planning on...............

Rom. 3:20,28; Gal. 2:16,21; 3:2,5,10; Eph. 2:8-9 – many Protestants err in their understanding of what Paul means by “works of the law” in his teaching on justification. Paul’s teaching that we are not justified by “works of the law” refer to the law of Moses or to any legal system that makes God our debtor. They do not refer to good works done in grace with faith in Christ. This makes sense when we remember that Paul’s mission was to teach that salvation was also for the Gentiles who were not subject to the “works of the law.” Here is the proof:

James 2:24 – compare the verse “a man is justified by works and not by faith alone” to
Gal. 2:16 – “a man is not justified by works of the law,” and
Rom. 3:20,28 – “no human being will be justified in His sight by works of the law.”

James 2:24 appears to be inconsistent with Gal. 2:16 and Rom. 3:20,28 until one realizes that the Word of God cannot contradict itself. This means that the “works” in James 2:24 are different from the “works of the law in Gal. 2:16 and Rom. 3:20,28. James is referring to “good works” (e.g., clothing the naked; giving food to the poor) and Paul is referring to the “Mosaic law” (which included both the legal, moral and ceremonial law) or any works which oblige God to give us payment. Here is more proof:

Rom. 3:20,28; Gal. 2:16 – Paul’s phrase for “works of the law” in the Greek is “ergon nomou” which means the Mosaic law or Torah and refers to the teachings (legal, moral) and works (ceremonial) that gave the Jews the knowledge of sin, but not an escape from sin. We have further proof of this from the Dead Sea Scrolls which provide the Hebrew equivalent (“hrvt ysm”) meaning “deeds of the law,” or Mosaic law.

James in James 2 does not use “ergon nomou.” He uses “ergois agathois.” Therefore, Paul’s “works of the law” and James’ “works” are entirely different types of works. Again, they could never contradict each other because the Scriptures are the inspired word of God.

Rom. 3:29 – Paul confirms that works of the law in this case refer to the Mosaic law by rhetorically asking “Or is God the God of the Jews only?” It does not mean “good works.”

Rom. 4:9-17 – Paul provides further discussion that righteousness God seeks in us does not come from Mosaic law, but through faith. But notice that Paul also never says “faith alone.”

Rom. 9:31-32 – righteousness is pursued through faith, not works of the law. Again, “works of law” does not mean “good works.”

Using “ergon nomou” (works of the law) interchangeably as if it means the same thing as “ergois agathois” (good works) is an error that appears every day in forums, and twice on Sundays.
 
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.......................................... nailing the 95 theses onto the doors of a Roman Catholic Church?

I wonder what would happen if we did?
It would be far more impressive if you could back them up with scripture!
 
It would be far more impressive if you could back them up with scripture!
I have backed many things with scripture. Now the RCC will accept that? Did your pope give you permission to ask such a thing?
 
Who's faith are we talking about? The Roman Catholic Faith? Do you really believe the RC belief knows Christ?
It’s fair game to respond. Since you make such an attack.

We wouldn’t be able to respond with 85 theses. We need Many more than that!

Because Protestants believe in radically different things, other than one : the man made unbiblical tradition of sola scriptura
which is the the reason you all believe in different things. We would need 10000 different sets of theses to counter 10000 permutations of Protestant belief. And in many cases we would not know what door to pin them to, because local elders decide the doctrine, and some do not recognise a physical church!

So I will attach just one thesis. That you disregard and so disrespect what the first disciples of John says the eucharist is, as confirmed by Eucharistic miracles and Fatima. God says he is much offended by the outrages and sacrileges against the Eucharist


Do you think calvinists know Christ , the loving God?
Seems to me many calvinists conceive only of a sovereign God that picks some rejects others for no apparent reason and regardless of what you do to obey. It’s one of the mistakes that Islam makes. The sovereign unknowable God.



I think they've changed their mind to agree with salvation by faith alone, not by works.

At least in some quarters.

Until you decide what the words “faith” and ”salvation” mean , you can’t be sure whether you agree or not.
At least in most of your quarters. We do believe in salvation by grace!
 
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I have backed many things with scripture. Now the RCC will accept that? Did your pope give you permission to ask such a thing?
How absurd!

But you can try.
I have many more verses if you want them.

Scripture declares the five Protestant Solas are false doctrine!

Only one verse that contradicts a sola is required to prove it “false doctrine”.

Faith alone: Phil 1:29 For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake;


Christ alone: Christ alone: John 5:24
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.


Grace alone: Mk 16:16 He who believes and is baptized shall be saved.


Scripture alone: Matt 28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:


Glory to God alone: Romans 2:10
But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile:


All five sola’s are “false doctrine” and another Gospel having departed from the faith revealed by Jesus christ!

1 Timothy 4:1
Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;

Galatians 1:6
I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel:

Novelties:

2 Timothy 4:3
For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;

Thanks
 
Because Protestants believe in radically different things, other than one : the man made tradition of sola scriptura
which is the the reason you all believe in different things. We would need 10000 different sets of theses to counter 10000 permutations of Protestant belief. That’s 96000 theses. And in many cases we would not know what door to pin them to, because local elders decide the doctrine!
Are you fimular with all the disagreements between the popes? Probably not huh?

So I will attach just one thesis. That you disregard what the first disciples of John says the eucharist is, as confirmed by Eucharistic miracles and Fatima. God is much offended by the outrages and sacrileges og the eucharisy
You want to discuss Transubstantiation? Really?

Do you think calvinists know Christ , the loving God?
Yes, Calvinists, Arminians, and some Catholics also.
Seems to me calvinists conceive only of a sovereign God that picks some rejects others for no apparent reason and regardless of what you do. It’s one of the mistakes that Islam makes.
If you knew and understood scripture you wouldn't make such a silly statement.
Until you decide what the words faith and salvation mean , you can’t be sure whether you agree or not.
At least in most of your quarters.
Pay attention when Elenor replies, you may learn something.
 
Are you fimular with all the disagreements between the popes? Probably not huh?


You want to discuss Transubstantiation? Really?


Yes, Calvinists, Arminians, and some Catholics also.

If you knew and understood scripture you wouldn't make such a silly statement.

Pay attention when Elenor replies, you may learn something.
Popes personally do not set doctrine. They are sinners. your first wrong assumption.
We are not like calivinists who can all have a different opinion on Calvinism, quoting favourite author.
that said on the unknowable - like thomist vs molinist we allow different views.

Study the john3:36 you may learn something about faith.

And as for trans substantiation. Your explanation of the science of eucharistic miracles is??
 
How absurd!
:cool:
But you can try.
I have many more verses if you want them.
Give as many as you like.
Scripture declares the five Protestant Solas are false doctrine!
Huh. Wrong not at all.
Only one verse that contradicts a sola is required to prove it “false doctrine”.
Okay.
Faith alone: Phil 1:29 For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake;
This verse denies faith alone.
Oh wow.
Christ alone: Christ alone: John 5:24
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.


Grace alone: Mk 16:16 He who believes and is baptized shall be saved.


Scripture alone: Matt 28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:


Glory to God alone: Romans 2:10
But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile:


All five sola’s are “false doctrine” and another Gospel having departed from the faith revealed by Jesus christ!

1 Timothy 4:1
Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;

Galatians 1:6
I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel:

Novelties:

2 Timothy 4:3
For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;

Thanks
I'm not sure what you are trying to do here. If you would like to look over a verse that you would like to use for a prooftext to prove someting, then by all means, pick one, one at a time. Let's go through them.
 
@donadams @Mikeuk

Would either of you show me scripture proof that we are not saved by faith alone?

Also, would you explain how work is involved, in which way? I would like to see how well you know your own religion.


Thanks
 
@donadams @Mikeuk

Would either of you show me scripture proof that we are not saved by faith alone?

Also, would you explain how work is involved, in which way? I would like to see how well you know your own religion.


Thanks
Read salvation controversy akin.
You will see our views explained.

The problem with faith alone, it presumes a definition of faith, what is yours?
 
Read salvation controversy akin.
You will see our views explained.
I'm asking you for an explanation. If you cannot, just say so.

Thanks.
 
Until you decide what the words “faith” and ”salvation” mean , you can’t be sure whether you agree or not.
At least in most of your quarters. We do believe in salvation by grace!
Saving faith is simply believing in and trusting on the person and atoning work (blood, Ro 3;25) of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of one's sin and right standing with God.

That faith lived out in the Christian life means obedience in the Holy Spirit which leads to righteousness, leading to holiness (Ro 6:16, 19, 22).

Salvation is from the wrath of God (Ro 5:9) on sin through saving faith in Jesus Christ.
 
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I'm asking you for an explanation. If you cannot, just say so.

Thanks.
I just did.
Start with your definition of “ saved” and your definition of “ faith”
If you want to state saved by faith alone, start with a definitions.

And you still havent answered why you ignore the disciples of John on the eucharist,
 
I just did.
Start with your definition of “ saved” and your definition of “ faith”
If you want to state saved by faith alone, start with a definitions.

And you still havent answered why you ignore the disciples of John on the eucharist,
Okay then, i will take it as you really aren't sure of your own religious beliefs.

So we can stay here until you answer.

What was your question about the eucharist?
 
:cool:

Give as many as you like.

Huh. Wrong not at all.

Okay.

This verse denies faith alone.
Oh wow.

I'm not sure what you are trying to do here. If you would like to look over a verse that you would like to use for a prooftext to prove someting, then by all means, pick one, one at a time. Let's go through them.
Ok we will start with “faith alone” and that really means alone, nothing added!

Phil 1:29 says not “faith alone” but faith and suffering

Go for it.
 
@donadams @Mikeuk

Would either of you show me scripture proof that we are not saved by faith alone?

Also, would you explain how work is involved, in which way? I would like to see how well you know your own religion.


Thanks
Short version Mk 16:16 he who believes and is baptized shall be saved
 
Popes personally do not set doctrine.
According to your religion, when speaking from his chair, the pope speaks infallibly in matters of faith and morals.
They are sinners. your first wrong assumption.
Sinner, they are indeed. Probably more so then you want to admit or know.
We are not like calivinists who can all have a different opinion on Calvinism, quoting favourite author.
Huh? :unsure:
that said on the unknowable - like thomist vs molinist we allow different views.

Huh?
Study the john3:36 you may learn something about faith.
Just what am I supposed to learn there? He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him. John 3:36.

Point out what you want me to learn. I think it's pretty straightforward.
And as for trans substantiation. Your explanation of the science of eucharistic miracles is??
Transubstantiation is a false doctrine.
 
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