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Daniel 9

Why did you leave out verse 26?
"
“And after the sixty-two weeks
Messiah shall [j]be cut off, but not for Himself;
And the people of the prince who is to come
Shall destroy the city and the sanctuary.
The end of it shall be with a flood,
And till the end of the war desolations are determined.
27 Then he shall confirm a [k]covenant with many for one week;
But in the middle of the week
He shall bring an end to sacrifice and offering.
And on the wing of abominations shall be one who makes desolate,
Even until the consummation, which is determined,
Is poured out on the [l]desolate.”"

A straightforward reading makes "he" the "prince who is to come". His people destroy the city, and then he comes and confirms a covenant with many for one week. (A peace covenant). However, that falls apart after half a week.

The then of 27a is not strong in Hebrew. Many of these visions are layered. Compare Mt 24A. The various features coming are not in sequence but simultaneous.

An example right in this ch 9 is v24 listing all the things Messiah accomplishes.
 
The then of 27a is not strong in Hebrew. Many of these visions are layered. Compare Mt 24A. The various features coming are not in sequence but simultaneous.

An example right in this ch 9 is v24 listing all the things Messiah accomplishes.
That is so untrue. The entire point is the setting apart of time period for the rest of history. It is absolutely a sequence of events.
 
That is so untrue. The entire point is the setting apart of time period for the rest of history. It is absolutely a sequence of events.
All Dan 9 is specifically about Jewish history. The Seventy Sevens (itself a symbolic number) is strictly about what lies ahead for Daniel's people and the holy city (v.24). It's all been fulfilled in 70 A.D.
 
All Dan 9 is specifically about Jewish history. The Seventy Sevens (itself a symbolic number) is strictly about what lies ahead for Daniel's people and the holy city (v.24). It's all been fulfilled in 70 A.D.
Again. Untrue. The list given by Gabriel has not been completed. Has Messiah Jesus been made the official and reigning king of Israel? No. So prophecy has yet to be fulfilled.
 
Christ is currently king -- of all the universe, as he now reigns in heaven. He will one day rule here on earth over all his redeemed saints at the end of the age at the Parousia.
 
Readers are generally not dialed in to the history.
 
Christ is currently king -- of all the universe, as he now reigns in heaven. He will one day rule here on earth over all his redeemed saints at the end of the age at the Parousia.

I think his reign has more force to it: he is to be thought of as king now. ‘Honor the Son, lest…’. So I call it an imperative kingdom.
 
I think his reign has more force to it: he is to be thought of as king now. ‘Honor the Son, lest…’. So I call it an imperative kingdom.
Amen to that! HE IS THE KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS!
 
This is why any overview of the NT must state that the zealot movement is responsible for desolating the country. It's agenda was quite the opposite of the spread of the Gospel of Messiah seen in v24. In Luke, Jesus gave warning after warning to Israel about agitating Rome (chs 11, 13, 15, 17, 19!, 21).
Agreed. Zealotry and its role in first-century Israel's end times is often ignored or not even recognized.

It is Christ and the new covenant. In 27b is the one who makes desolate, the counter -messiah of the Jewish revolt.
Also agreed. Christ was the "messenger of the covenant" (Malachi 3:1) who confirmed that New covenant with many during His earthly ministry which took place in the 70th week.

The "people" of Christ the Messiah prince who was to come (Christ's fellow Israelites - the Zealot factions and their leaders in particular) were the ones destined to destroy the city Jerusalem and the sanctuary, according to God's plans revealed to Daniel.
 
Christ is currently king -- of all the universe, as he now reigns in heaven. He will one day rule here on earth over all his redeemed saints at the end of the age at the Parousia.
Obviously not at all what is being referred to by Gabriel in the prophecy. It's spiritualizing like this that keeps most people ignorant of what God is really doing throughout history.
 
Obviously not at all what is being referred to by Gabriel in the prophecy. It's spiritualizing like this that keeps most people ignorant of what God is really doing throughout history.
God has already done it since the prophecy pertains to Israel and Jerusalem and was fulfilled in 70 A.D.. And it's certainly not "spiritualizing" by stating the biblical fact that Jesus Christ is King right now and is ruling right now at the right hand of his Father in heaven in his inaugurated kingdom.
 
God has already done it since the prophecy pertains to Israel and Jerusalem and was fulfilled in 70 A.D.. And it's certainly not "spiritualizing" by stating the biblical fact that Jesus Christ is King right now and is ruling right now at the right hand of his Father in heaven in his inaugurated kingdom.
The prophecy was NOT fulfilled in 70 AD. Far from it. There are 3 groups of weeks AND 2 gaps. Those 2 gaps are also groups of 7 weeks of years long. It is a pattern; a blueprint; a mathematical formula for the specific time carved out dealing with Jerusalem and the temple. That is what Gabriel specifically states is what the prophecy is about.
 
The prophecy was NOT fulfilled in 70 AD.
The six terms of Daniel 9:24 took place by the time Christ's crucifixion death and resurrection had taken place.

But you are incorrect on the concept of "gaps" in this 70 week prophecy of Daniel's. These so-called "gaps" are a contrived invention that scripture never mentions. The 70 weeks prophecy was an intact period of time that began and ended without any "stopped clock" (454 BC through AD 37 to be exact). The prophesied desolations determined for Jerusalem and its temple were part of the visions and prophecies given and "sealed up" within the 70 weeks period. These reserved prophecies and visions were poured out later on in the AD 66-70 period, just as they had been predicted earlier.
 
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The six terms of Daniel 9:24 took place by the time Christ's crucifixion death and resurrection had taken place.

But you are incorrect on the concept of "gaps" in this 70 week prophecy of Daniel's. These so-called "gaps" are a contrived invention that scripture never mentions. The 70 weeks prophecy was an intact period of time that began and ended without any "stopped clock" (454 BC through AD 37 to be exact). The prophesied desolations determined for Jerusalem and its temple were part of the visions and prophecies given and "sealed up" within the 70 weeks period, to be poured out later on in the AD 66-70 period, just as they had been predicted earlier.
This view is not according to a proper understanding of the Hebrew text. You can NOT get an accurate interpretation by reading English translations. Translators always include their personal biases. As to "gaps". Usually only a single gap is recognized. The true interpretation that was discovered only recently recognizes that there are actually 2 gaps - both gaps being groups of 7 weeks of years. That is finally the proper interpretation that has been made known.
 
This view is not according to a proper understanding of the Hebrew text. You can NOT get an accurate interpretation by reading English translations.
I read multiple translations, and favor the literal translations such as the YLT. And I use the Septuagint most often, and try as far as possible to defer to the original languages' intent. And nowhere is a gap referred to in scripture for this 70-week period. Gaps are a convenient tool for anybody to insert their own private interpretations into the events this 70-week prophecy predicted for ethnic Israel's latter days as a people and the end of the physical temple's existence in AD 70. "Gaps" are not a "proper interpretation" if scripture does not say anything about them.
 
I read multiple translations, and favor the literal translations such as the YLT. And I use the Septuagint most often, and try as far as possible to defer to the original languages' intent. And nowhere is a gap referred to in scripture for this 70-week period. Gaps are a convenient tool for anybody to insert their own private interpretations into the events this 70-week prophecy predicted for ethnic Israel's latter days as a people and the end of the physical temple's existence in AD 70. "Gaps" are not a "proper interpretation" if scripture does not say anything about them.
It's exactly like the parables of Jesus. Only the seekers of truth will understand them.
[Pro 25:2 LSB] 2 It is the glory of God to conceal a matter, But the glory of kings is to search out a matter.

And yes, both gaps are implied in the Hebrew grammatical structure. Something no English translation has recognized.
 
And yes, both gaps are implied in the Hebrew grammatical structure.
This "implication" is imaginary. A prophesied 70 week time period with "implied" time gaps in between is a useless tool to measure time with. It turns the 70-week prophecy into an elastic yardstick which becomes a pointless exercise with no practical benefit. Anybody can make the prophecy mean anything whatever by this means. Not a good procedure.
 
This "implication" is imaginary. A prophesied 70 week time period with "implied" time gaps in between is a useless tool to measure time with. It turns the 70-week prophecy into an elastic yardstick which becomes a pointless exercise with no practical benefit. Anybody can make the prophecy mean anything whatever by this means. Not a good procedure.
That would be true IF...the gaps were arbitrary. But the way God planned it out, the 3 specific groups of years are groups of 7 years (weeks). AND the 2 gaps in between are ALSO groups of 7 years (weeks). This is exact. A pattern. A blue print. It can not be faked. It works out EXACTLY. It is historically accurate. It is proof that this is the proper interpretation.
 
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