Argument against the Doctrine of the Trinity. (And keep it clean, please.)

[Josheb]

If anybody says that they are sinless, they must mean that they keep God's commands perfectly every moment of every day, including the summary Jesus gave of the Ten Commandments:

“30 ‘And you shall love the LORD your God with all your heart, with all your soul, with all your mind, and with all your strength.’ This is the first commandment. 31 “And the second, like it, is this: ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ There is no other commandment greater than these.”” (Mr 12:30-31 NKJV)

.....and they must always be perfect, righteous and act in faith (and never doubt) and all the extra-legal ways 100% of the time. The Law is not the sole measure of sinlessness. Thinking it is would be sinful .

 

[Paul]

I understand what you're trying to say....but as we all know christians can sin from time to time.

Your problem arises when you seem to say that you never sin.

As a christians will your sins be counted against you? Of course not, Jesus took them. Because our sins will not be counted against us that doesn't mean a christian can't sin.

We do theology by the behavior of some or scripture?

I stated in Christ is no sin and took pain to post the commandments kept. Apart from those commands I decline to go down that rabbit hole.

The saints are defined as those who hold to the testmony of Jesus and keep God commands.

A good tree doesn't bear bad fruit.

A christain as you state that sins from time to time if they remain in Christ they have no sin. In Him is no sin.

Whoever has the Son has life; whoever does not have God’s Son does not have life.

 

[CrowCross]

We do theology by the behavior of some or scripture?

Yes, we try but often fail.

I stated in Christ is no sin and took pain to post the commandments kept. Apart from those commands I decline to go down that rabbit hole.

Of course you don't want to go down that "rabbit hole"
Jesus gave us commandments to "enhance" our walk with Him.
Do we break those commandments? Of course we do. despite being saved we still have a sin nature which won't be fully removed until our sanctification is fully completed.

The saints are defined as those who hold to the testmony of Jesus and keep God commands.

A good tree doesn't bear bad fruit.

True...but of all the apples on a tree not all the apples are selected for the apple pie.

A christain as you state that sins from time to time if they remain in Christ they have no sin. In Him is no sin.

Yes, Jesus has no sin. On the cross Jesus became our sin.

Whoever has the Son has life; whoever does not have God’s Son does not have life.

Because one sins...it doesn't mean they don't have eternal life.
Through the power of Christ Jesus, repentance, we can sin less. The bible tells us God always gives us a way out of sin and we often choose to reject the way out. Sometimes out of ignorance while some times choosing the false instant gratification of sin.

All Christians sin. All. To that I might add if after your confession in Christ you still sin they way you use to sin you might want to re-look at your confession and determine if you really believed and are saved.

Thankfully Jesus died on the cross and ALL of our sins, past, present and future have been imputed to Christ Jesus.
Because of that in a sense "we don't sin"...or have those sins presented to the Lord as they were nailed to the cross and washed away (forgiven) by the blood of Christ Jesus.

 

[JesusFan]

I keep the commandments.
Its not my theology.

You don't know me so what commandments am I violating?

I have the Spirit of Christ in me and according to these forums God chose me to be saved and that's that,

You do not have the Holy Spirit indwelling you though, as you have a false Jesus, who cannot save you from your sins

 

[Paul]

You do not have the Holy Spirit indwelling you though, as you have a false Jesus, who cannot save you from your sins

Since this is questioning my salvation and has nothing to do with the trinity I'll just let you know again I have the Spirit of Christ in me.

Interesting you have set yourself up as the judge of the living. You are mistaken in this as well.

 

[JesusFan]

Since this is questioning my salvation and has nothing to do with the trinity I'll just let you know again I have the Spirit of Christ in me.

Interesting you have set yourself up as the judge of the living. You are mistaken in this as well.

Is the Holy Spirit a Person, is he God Himself?

 

[Paul]

Is the Holy Spirit a Person, is he God Himself?

The Father as Jesus clearly states is the only true God. The Spirit of God then is the Fathers own Spirit always. The Fathers own Spirit is Deity.
The Father poured out His Spirit in Jesus's name. Hence I have the Spirit of Christ in me and my body is the temple of the Holy Spirit who Jesus also spoke of as another advocate, the Spirit of truth.

So the person of the Father.
Jesus-those who listen and learn from the Father come to me.
Jesus does not refer the the Spirit as His Father or God even though Mary conceived by the Spirit.

Its One God our Father and one Christ our Lord. No other.

 

[JesusFan]

The Father as Jesus clearly states is the only true God. The Spirit of God then is the Fathers own Spirit always. The Fathers own Spirit is Deity.
The Father poured out His Spirit in Jesus's name. Hence I have the Spirit of Christ in me and my body is the temple of the Holy Spirit who Jesus also spoke of as another advocate, the Spirit of truth.

So the person of the Father.
Jesus-those who listen and learn from the Father come to me.
Jesus does not refer the the Spirit as His Father or God even though Mary conceived by the Spirit.

Its One God our Father and one Christ our Lord. No other.

Jesus said the the Holy Spirit is a person, and peter called the Holy Spirt as being very God

 

[Paul]

Jesus said the the Holy Spirit is a person, and peter called the Holy Spirt as being very God

He stated another advocate the Spirit of truth. That He and His Father would make their home with us. So who is this 3rd person?

The Fathers promise=>"In these kast days I will por out MY Spirit......"

On one occasion, while he was eating with them, he gave them this command: “Do not leave Jerusalem, but wait for the gift my Father promised, which you have heard me speak about. 5For John baptized with water, but in a few days you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.”

and in acts 2 Peter stated the Spirit Jesus sent He received from the Father.

 

[Arial]

He stated another advocate the Spirit of truth. That He and His Father would make their home with us. So who is this 3rd person?

The Fathers promise=>"In these kast days I will por out MY Spirit......"

On one occasion, while he was eating with them, he gave them this command: “Do not leave Jerusalem, but wait for the gift my Father promised, which you have heard me speak about. 5For John baptized with water, but in a few days you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.”

and in acts 2 Peter stated the Spirit Jesus sent He received from the Father.

Three distinct personal beings were present at creation. The Spirit hovering, God (the very one Jesus called Father) was speaking, ("Let there be light") and the one hovering over the darkness brought light. Later passages tell us that Jesus created. Were there two creators?

 

[Paul]

Three distinct personal beings were present at creation. The Spirit hovering, God (the very one Jesus called Father) was speaking, ("Let there be light") and the one hovering over the darkness brought light. Later passages tell us that Jesus created. Were there two creators?

The Spirit OF God was present. There is no 3rd mind. The Spirit acts according to the will of the mind of God. God our Father as its His Spirit and Christ our Lord as the Father gifted Him the glory of oneness and fullness with soverign authority. The Spirt does not speak on His own but only what He hears. In us the same "one" Spirit conveys the will and presence of Christ but it is the Fathers Spirit always. Hence Jesus and His Father make their home with us.

By His will, Spirit and command all things were brough into existance. The one who sits on the throne who Jesus calls His God and Father.
The Deity in Christ that creates is the Fathers. The Deity in Christ that spoke to us in these last days is the Fathers. God spoke to us by His Son ; God created by His Son.

“You are worthy, our Lord and God, to receive glory and honor and power, for you created all things, and by your will they were created and have their being.”

 

[JesusFan]

The Spirit OF God was present. There is no 3rd mind. The Spirit acts according to the will of the mind of God. God our Father as its His Spirit and Christ our Lord as the Father gifted Him the glory of oneness and fullness with soverign authority. The Spirt does not speak on His own but only what He hears. In us the same "one" Spirit conveys the will and presence of Christ but it is the Fathers Spirit always. Hence Jesus and His Father make their home with us.

By His will, Spirit and command all things were brough into existance. The one who sits on the throne who Jesus calls His God and Father.
The Deity in Christ that creates is the Fathers. The Deity in Christ that spoke to us in these last days is the Fathers. God spoke to us by His Son ; God created by His Son.

“You are worthy, our Lord and God, to receive glory and honor and power, for you created all things, and by your will they were created and have their being.”

The Holy Spirit is a Person, is very God, not just the force of the father

 

[Paul]

The Holy Spirit is a Person, is very God, not just the force of the father

Yes, the person of the Father who is the true God.

 

[Arial]

The Spirit OF God was present. There is no 3rd mind. The Spirit acts according to the will of the mind of God. God our Father as its His Spirit and Christ our Lord as the Father gifted Him the glory of oneness and fullness with soverign authority. The Spirt does not speak on His own but only what He hears. In us the same "one" Spirit conveys the will and presence of Christ but it is the Fathers Spirit always. Hence Jesus and His Father make their home with us.

By His will, Spirit and command all things were brough into existance. The one who sits on the throne who Jesus calls His God and Father.
The Deity in Christ that creates is the Fathers. The Deity in Christ that spoke to us in these last days is the Fathers. God spoke to us by His Son ; God created by His Son.

“You are worthy, our Lord and God, to receive glory and honor and power, for you created all things, and by your will they were created and have their being.”

You keep presenting the same nonsense argument. Jesus is not God, but he is God.

The Spirit acts according to the will of the mind of God.

He has to be a personal being to know the mind of God and to act.

God our Father as its His Spirit and Christ our Lord as the Father gifted Him the glory of oneness and fullness with soverign authority.

Which is it? An "it" is His? The Father gifted Jesus with His (God's) glory and made Jesus one with God and the fullness of God, and Jesus has sovereign authority? If the Son was not always God, then what you say there is God taking something other than himself and making another God out of it. If you say (which I have never seen you answer clearly and directly) that Jesus is a created human, then you have God doing the very thing he is sending idolaters to hell for. Making an idol out of a creature.

The Spirt does not speak on His own but only what He hears.

There is no record of the Spirit speaking at all. Jesus and the Spirit are the same in essence but they are distinct in personage. Jesus had the Spirit, but he was not the Spirit.

In us the same "one" Spirit conveys the will and presence of Christ but it is the Fathers Spirit always. Hence Jesus and His Father make their home with us.

Only those who believe that Jesus is who he says he is and did what he said he did have the Spirit. Most of the Jews didn't believe he was God either, even though from the prophet's mouth came these words: Isa 9


6For to us a child is born,
to us a son is given;
and the government shall be upon his shoulder,
and his name shall be called
Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.
7Of the increase of his government and of peace
there will be no end,
on the throne of David and over his kingdom,
to establish it and to uphold it
with justice and with righteousness
from this time forth and forevermore.
The zeal of the Lord of hosts will do this.

 

[Paul]

You keep presenting the same nonsense argument. Jesus is not God, but he is God.

Yes, He is all that the Father is,
No, He has always been the Son.

He has to be a personal being to know the mind of God and to act.

My spirit acts on my mind.

Which is it? An "it" is His? The Father gifted Jesus with His (God's) glory and made Jesus one with God and the fullness of God, and Jesus has sovereign authority? If the Son was not always God, then what you say there is God taking something other than himself and making another God out of it. If you say (which I have never seen you answer clearly and directly) that Jesus is a created human, then you have God doing the very thing he is sending idolaters to hell for. Making an idol out of a creature.

Oh brother never mind.

There is no record of the Spirit speaking at all. Jesus and the Spirit are the same in essence but they are distinct in personage. Jesus had the Spirit, but he was not the Spirit.

The Father was living in Jesus.
Therefore, just as the Holy Spirit says:
“Today if you should hear His voice,
8do not harden your hearts,

Only those who believe that Jesus is who he says he is and did what he said he did have the Spirit. Most of the Jews didn't believe he was God either, even though from the prophet's mouth came these words: Isa 9

I believe He is Gods Son. I believe He and the Father are one.

6For to us a child is born,
to us a son is given;
and the government shall be upon his shoulder,
and his name shall be called
Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.
7Of the increase of his government and of peace
there will be no end,
on the throne of David and over his kingdom,
to establish it and to uphold it
with justice and with righteousness
from this time forth and forevermore.
The zeal of the Lord of hosts will do this.

I believe in a promised Son who is called God.
I believe His God has set Him above His companions.

I don't believe He is coeternal.

 

[Arial]

Yes, He is all that the Father is,
No, He has always been the Son.

My spirit acts on my mind.

Oh brother never mind.

The Father was living in Jesus.
Therefore, just as the Holy Spirit says:
“Today if you should hear His voice,
8do not harden your hearts,

I believe He is Gods Son. I believe He and the Father are one.

I believe in a promised Son who is called God.
I believe His God has set Him above His companions.

I don't believe He is coeternal.

Then you worship an idol of your own making.

 

[Paul]

Then you worship an idol of your own making.

I have the Spirit of Christ in me. I'm not aware of any other Son.

 

[ElectedbyHim]

I have the Spirit of Christ in me. I'm not aware of any other Son.

1 John says that if you do not believe that Jesus Christ came in the flesh (that He is God), than you have the spirit of Antichrist.

1 Jn 4:1 Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world.
1 Jn 4:2 By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God,
1 Jn 4:3 and every spirit that does not confess Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, of which you have heard that it is coming, and now it is already in the world.

 

[Paul]

1 John says that if you do not believe that Jesus Christ came in the flesh (that He is God), than you have the spirit of Antichrist.

1 Jn 4:1 Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world.
1 Jn 4:2 By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God,
1 Jn 4:3 and every spirit that does not confess Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, of which you have heard that it is coming, and now it is already in the world.

I would be very careful if I was you not to refer the Spirit of Christ in me as the AC. There is one sin that is never forgiven.

1 John 5:1
Everyone who believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God, and everyone who loves the father loves his child as well

If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

 

[ElectedbyHim]

I would be very careful if I was you not to refer the Spirit of Christ in me as the AC. There is one sin that is never forgiven.

1 John 5:1
Everyone who believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God, and everyone who loves the father loves his child as well

If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

The Lord and God are the same thing.

Nothing to be careful about.

Friend, I have been down this path many times.

If I start a thread on sinless perfection, would you participate?