What Is The Provisionist “Point Of No Return”?

[CCShorts]

"Predestination" CONTROLS. "Foreknowledge" only knows. God's "Foreknowledge" depends on what we DO in our own free will.

Let’s examine the implication of your statements:

1. Bob's statement: "Then it's not 'Foreknowledge' at all."

Bob seems to argue that if God's knowledge is based on what He has already planned and determined to occur, then it cannot be considered "Foreknowledge." This implies that Bob views "Foreknowledge" as a passive awareness or observation of events without any involvement in their unfolding. In other words, Bob assumes that God's knowledge is not based on His active planning but rather on simply observing what will happen due to human will.

2. Bob's statement: "God's 'Foreknowledge' depends on what we DO in our own free will."

This statement reinforces Bob's view that God's knowledge is contingent on human will and the choices they make. He suggests that God's knowledge of future events is limited to what humans decide to do, indicating that God's knowledge is not grounded in His own divine plan but rather in the actions of His creations.

Now, let's demonstrate that Bob is grounding God's knowledge in creation, which implies that God is learning information from a source external to Himself:

1. Bob's statement: "God's 'Foreknowledge' depends on what we DO in our own free will."

By stating that God's foreknowledge depends on human actions and will, Bob implies that God is reliant on His creation (humans) to determine the future. This view suggests that God learns about future events as they unfold in the created world, which would mean that God's knowledge is derived from an external source (i.e., the actions of humans) rather than being inherently omniscient.

2. Bob's statement: "Foreknowledge only knows."

Bob seems to separate "Foreknowledge" from any active role in shaping events. By doing so, he suggests that God's knowledge is purely observational, and God's foreknowledge of what he planned o purposed to occur doesn't influence or determine the course of events. This notion undermines the concept of God's sovereignty and omnipotence, as it portrays God as a passive spectator rather than an active creator and sustainer of all things.

Bob's statements indicate that he assumes God's knowledge is not grounded in God in eternity past when only God existed. Instead, Bob suggests that God's knowledge is contingent on human actions and will, and God's foreknowledge is merely a passive awareness. This perspective implies that God's omniscience is limited and that He acquires knowledge from an external source (i.e., His creation), which goes against the traditional understanding of God's attributes.

…

 

[makesends]

"Predestination" CONTROLS. "Foreknowledge" only knows. God's "Foreknowledge" depends on what we DO in our own free will.

That's circular reasoning. Basing definition on what you define because you define it that way. You've proved nothing.

Meanwhile, you reject multiple experts who read the original languages as determinative. Even the word "knowledge" in the biblical examples is often a term of intimate involvement, and not only intellectual comprehension.

A proper understanding of the necessary God, including his Aseity and Simplicity, also implies that for him to know something, is to cause it to be. Things do not simply 'happen to God', as though he is merely a resident within fact larger than himself.

 

[Bob Carabbio]

You've proved nothing.

I agree completely!!!! NOBODY EVER "PROVES" ANYTHING here. After all, it's just "Theology" that we're tossing around here. All God's chilluns gots "theologies" (and "Experts" to "prove" it).

 

[Reformedguy]

Then it's not "Foreknowledge" at all.

It's not? Why not? If I have determined something to occur for certain how is that not foreknowledge?

 

[Reformedguy]

"Predestination" CONTROLS. "Foreknowledge" only knows. God's "Foreknowledge" depends on what we DO in our own free will.

Foreknowledge only knows? Who says?

 

[Bob Carabbio]

Foreknowledge only knows? Who says?

The word itself, of course it's "KNOWLEDGE of future events". Nothing indicated that there any "CONTROL" aspects. only awareness.

 

[CCShorts]

The word itself, of course it's "KNOWLEDGE of future events". Nothing indicated that there any "CONTROL" aspects. only awareness.

The assumption of mere awareness cannot be applied to the biblical creator and sustainer of all things because it contradicts the fundamental attributes and beliefs about God's nature in the biblical context. Instead, the biblical God's foreknowledge is seen as an active, purposeful understanding of future events, which is intricately connected to His role as the all-powerful creator and sustainer of the universe.

…