The Millennium, Christ reign is in heaven for the 1000 years.

[TMSO]

actually, not it is not.

Thats a common misconception

We have a whole Old Testament of prophecies that have obviously not been fulfilled yet. Are you saying God got it all wrong?

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

Your own comment said it was 'those who do not obey Christ will be subject to droughts.'

Actually. God gave that warning

It is a common conception if you believe the church has been removed so that the two programs can take turns.

Again, your barking up the wrong tree.
I do not follow Ryrie or any man.

I follow the word of God.

Ryrie used to say that the church finds its fulfillment in heaven while Israel finds it on earth.

Maybe you would be more clear and less of a generalizer if we discussed Ryrie.

Well both will find their fulfillment here in earth and in heaven

dual covenant theology is a lie. and not founded in scriptura

 

[Eternally-Grateful]

We have a whole Old Testament of prophecies that have obviously not been fulfilled yet.

amen 100%

Are you saying God got it all wrong?

excuse me? Have you listened to what I have said, why would you think this?

 

[TMSO]

amen 100%

excuse me? Have you listened to what I have said, why would you think this?

The Old Testament prophecies speak of God on Earth, not a millennium in heaven. It is not in the fulfillment of two covenants. Yes there are two, the Mosaic, which has passed away though ethnic Israel is there, and the new covenant instituted in the blood of Christ. (Covenants are instituted through the shedding of blood of a sacrifice. God instituted this covenant with the blood of His own Son.) Before the Great Tribulation, there are two groups, the church, made up of saved Jews and Gentiles, and ethnic Israel, made up of non-believers who will never be saved, and the elect remnant who will be saved, and at the end, the only people who will be alive of Israel will be the remnant. (See Zechariah.) The reason for all that is happening with Israel are the promises God made with the forefathers, and the covenant made due to those promises. I believe it was Paul who said the promises remain.

Note the differences between Matthew 24 and Luke 21. There is a gap in the 70 week prophecy, and that gap is between the 69 named weeks, and this hanging which is introduced in this way "And he will make a firm covenant with the many for one week," This is a hanging week, and the start of the week is set by him making a firm covenant. It comes after the Messiah being cut off, and then the people of the one who is to come destroying the city and the sanctuary. That is, obviously, AD 70. Yet the end of the 69th week is towards the beginning of 30AD. (I don't remember the exact year.) The length of the week is established. 7 years. If 69 weeks is not enough to establish what is meant by a week, there is no hope. Consider a few timed prophecies we have. The cook and the wine taster with Joseph in Israel. The same kind of imagery is used, and both times equated to the same amount of time. The prophecy to Pharaoh about the famine. The imagery doesn't change when dealing to time, and length of time did not change. 7 fat cows, 7 thin cows. Each represent a set of 7 years. 7 fat stalks of grain, 7 sick and thin stalks of grain, again, each representing 7 years. And His prophecies are perfect. Why do the cows and grain look sickly, and after consuming the fat, why do they look the same. God even answered to that. The 7 years will be so terrible that everyone will completely forget the 7 years of abundance.

Even with this perfection of prophecy, people want to reinterpret them. Why? Luke speaks to AD 70 all the way through, while Daniel's 70th week is set up as different by Jesus Himself. It shows that Jesus is speaking of a completely different time when He mentions the Great Tribulation. In Luke, when you see the armies gathered, run. In Matthew, "“Therefore when you see the abomination of desolation which was spoken of through Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place (let the reader understand)," That would mean the armies are already inside, if you want to link it to Luke. They shouldn't be running then, they should already be gone. Follow the prophecy as given.

 

[Josheb]

The "thousand years" of Revelation 20 is not literal and there has never been a moment anywhere in creation when and where Jesus has not been reigning.

 

[EarlyActs]

Actually. God gave that warning

Again, your barking up the wrong tree.
I do not follow Ryrie or any man.

I follow the word of God.

Well both will find their fulfillment here in earth and in heaven

dual covenant theology is a lie. and not founded in scriptura

re 'God gave that warning'
I don't think you understand the details. If it is expressed in a Judaic way, and taken literally, then the Mill is Judaic. Others have done the same; the offering/worship system in a new temple will be operating with "Christ" there.

Never mind Hebrews.

 

[EarlyActs]

Actually. God gave that warning

Again, your barking up the wrong tree.
I do not follow Ryrie or any man.

I follow the word of God.

Well both will find their fulfillment here in earth and in heaven

dual covenant theology is a lie. and not founded in scriptura

the wrong tree
It would help if you articulated instead of dodge other views. Just tell me what you think then; I can't read your mind.

I offered to discuss Ryrie because Dallas Seminary featured his D'ist book for decades; it says there are two programs and two peoples and no intersection of them. He says he is following the Word too.

So when I read 2P3 and don't find that, I don't know what he means and I have learned that D'ism is a behind the scenes theory that 'explains' everything, usually on just a handful of verses, like the end of Mt 23, Rom 11:26 (their view) etc. But they are not very well versed.

 

[EarlyActs]

Actually. God gave that warning

Again, your barking up the wrong tree.
I do not follow Ryrie or any man.

I follow the word of God.

Well both will find their fulfillment here in earth and in heaven

dual covenant theology is a lie. and not founded in scriptura

'Both fulfilled'
Well that would be because they are one entity, not two. That's why Eph 2-3 has them both unified, using the technical terms of membership and commonwealth of Israel. But it is past tense. So either you actually do have two programs going or are using the wrong tense about your beliefs.

 

[EarlyActs]

Actually. God gave that warning

Again, your barking up the wrong tree.
I do not follow Ryrie or any man.

I follow the word of God.

Well both will find their fulfillment here in earth and in heaven

dual covenant theology is a lie. and not founded in scriptura

re Dual covenant
Do you mean that there are two peoples, two programs? Well that's good to hear. But believing there is just one, just one olive tree, means that there is not a leap-frog going on between the church and Israel. Right? And it doesn't have anything future to expect that is not already a reality here, though in mortal form.

 

[TMSO]

re Dual covenant
Do you mean that there are two peoples, two programs? Well that's good to hear. But believing there is just one, just one olive tree, means that there is not a leap-frog going on between the church and Israel. Right? And it doesn't have anything future to expect that is not already a reality here, though in mortal form.

There is a separation between church and Israel, just as their is a separation between believer and non-believer, heaven and hell. (Unless you believe that they are all one, and heaven is also hell. The church is full of Gentile and Jewish believers. Israel is full of non-believers, and not yet saved elect. The one's that God deals with at the end are the not yet saved elect, the remnant. At the very end, the only Jews still alive are the elect, and God deals with them altogether. Paul does to when he says, and thus all Israel will be saved. All Israel as Paul defined all Israel when he said, not all who are of Israel are Israel, except those whose circumcision is of the heart, and not just the flesh.

 

[Eleanor]

The one and only kingdom is here now (Mt 12:28, Lk 11:20).

We are seated in the heavenly realms ruling with Christ now, sharing in his exaltation and enthronement in heaven now (Eph 2:6).