The literalness of prophecy using Daniel

[TMSO]

But they are inferior as far as a bond goes. They had more and more human frailty issues . The kingdom of Gods would arrive, based on the resurrection, and not have those frailties.

So are you saying that God falls short in prophecy? I mean, the whole point to what I wrote is to say that God is over prophecy, speaks from His knowledge and from His power. All of the prophecies in Daniel are united, and they unite in other eschatological prophecies in the Old Testament, and in the New. It finds it's focus point in Revelation, with Daniel having also prophecied of the consummation which we see in Revelation 20 and 21. A lot of the interpreations people give sound good when looking at one prophecy, however, they fall flat if one starts piling all of the other propehcies on top.

So the question to answer is: Is God... inconcistent? Imprecise? Not actually sure how the future will unfold?

 

[Mr GLee]

The point of the thread is to show that prophecy (Daniel in this case) is literal, and that God is very direct in prophecy. It will include Daniel 9, but only to show how straight to the point, and exact God is in prophecy, even with symbols.

I would offer.

That seems to go against the law of faith (power to understanding God) . . Without parables the figurative, signified tongue of Christ using the temporal dying things seen to give us the invisible vision as a understanding hid from unconverted dying mankind ,

Without. . Christ in us speaks not .

I would suggest we must be careful how we hear who we say we do. Many false apostles (antichrists') today. I would suggest if you have not. put the armor of Christ in us, with the shield of His faithful labor "let there be God alone labor of love" .

The temporal historical, dying must be mixed with the invisible living things of God (faith as a labor of His " Let there be love" ) and "the bride of Christ was very, God alone good.

No sign was given to wonder after. The generation of natural unconverted mankind continues to seek the foundation of Paganism (out of sight out of mind ) In that way the fool has said. . . I see nothing. I know nothing. . Did you look for my bother Abel in the corn field or check the barn?

The historical temporal seen must be mixed with the unseen eternal faith (gospel). the mixing formula 2 Corinthians 4:18

The loving commandment is to study to show oneself approved to our invisible head Christ . (The husband of the bride or church.)

2 Timothy 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

He has not left us without the proper interpretation tools needed to interpret the figurative language of parables, which without Christ in us today speaks not

The valuable interpretation tool. . . the mixing recipe below

2 Corinthians 4:18King James Version18 While we look not at the things which are seen, (historical ) but at the things which are not seen: (eternal )for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.

No mix (temporal historical with the unseen eternal . . . no gospel rest

Hebrews 4:1-2 King James Version Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it. For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith (The unseen eternal) in them that heard it.

Matthew 13:34All these things spake Jesus unto the multitude in parables; and without (not once) a parable spake he not unto them:

Mark 4:11 And he said unto them, Unto you it is given to know the mystery (gospel understanding) of the kingdom of God: but unto them that are without, all these things are done in parables:. . . . . . . . (remains a mysteries of Christ's faith or labor of Immanuel love. )

Kings in Israel .The abomination of desolation

Matthew 13:13 Therefore speak I to them in parables: (the mix) because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.

In that way I beleive God is no longer bringing any new revelation as sign to seek after. Satan the king of lying signs to onder after (his only voice) are still followed by the work of Christ sending a strong delusion to those who refuse to walk after the invisible, eternal things of God

God is not a man as us.

 

[Josheb]

The point of the thread is to show that prophecy (Daniel in this case) is literal, and that God is very direct in prophecy. It will include Daniel 9, but only to show how straight to the point, and exact God is in prophecy, even with symbols.

DANIEL 2
"25 Then Arioch hurriedly brought Daniel [x]into the king’s presence and spoke to him as follows: “I have found a man among the [y]exiles from Judah who can make the interpretation known to the king!” 26 The king said to Daniel, whose name was Belteshazzar, “Are you able to make known to me the dream which I have seen and its interpretation?” 27 Daniel answered before the king and said, “As for the secret about which the king has inquired, neither wise men, sorcerers, soothsayer priests, nor diviners are able to declare it to the king. 28 However, there is a God in heaven who reveals secrets, and He has made known to King Nebuchadnezzar what will take place in the [z]latter days. This was your dream and the visions [aa]in your mind while on your bed. 29 As for you, O king, while on your bed your thoughts [ab]turned to what would take place [ac]in the future; and He who reveals secrets has made known to you what will take place. 30 But as for me, this secret has not been revealed to me [ad]for any wisdom [ae]residing in me more than in any other living person, but for the purpose of making the interpretation known to the king, and that you may understand the thoughts of your [af]mind.

Do you think there is any correlation between the Old Testament's "latter days," and the New Testament's "last days," or "last times"?

If so, what is that correlation?

 

[EarlyActs]

So are you saying that God falls short in prophecy? I mean, the whole point to what I wrote is to say that God is over prophecy, speaks from His knowledge and from His power. All of the prophecies in Daniel are united, and they unite in other eschatological prophecies in the Old Testament, and in the New. It finds it's focus point in Revelation, with Daniel having also prophecied of the consummation which we see in Revelation 20 and 21. A lot of the interpreations people give sound good when looking at one prophecy, however, they fall flat if one starts piling all of the other propehcies on top.

So the question to answer is: Is God... inconcistent? Imprecise? Not actually sure how the future will unfold?

You are talking about predicting all world events. That is not the attention of NT eschatology. Rather, it is concerned that people see that Christ was enthroned in the resurrection, so that people honor the Son now, Ps 2 and 110, bc God will smash those who fail to. The kingdom arrived on the Son as an imperative kingdom; it is what should happen. It is not about matching today’s news with Bible verses and crying ‘see! Proof!’

After you read my books COVENANT WAR and ENTHRONED KING, you will feel like you have never been taught NT theology.

 

[Mr GLee]

You are talking about predicting all world events. That is not the attention of NT eschatology. Rather, it is concerned that people see that Christ was enthroned in the resurrection, so that people honor the Son now, Ps 2 and 110, bc God will smash those who fail to. The kingdom arrived on the Son as an imperative kingdom; it is what should happen. It is not about matching today’s news with Bible verses and crying ‘see! Proof!’

After you read my books COVENANT WAR and ENTHRONED KING, you will feel like you have never been taught NT theology.

Could a person say the "Re Enthroned King"?

 

[TMSO]

I would offer.

That seems to go against the law of faith (power to understanding God) . . Without parables the figurative, signified tongue of Christ using the temporal dying things seen to give us the invisible vision as a understanding hid from unconverted dying mankind ,

In what way is God being God going against the law of faith. Parables are not prophecy, they are parables.

Without. . Christ in us speaks not .

I would suggest we must be careful how we hear who we say we do. Many false apostles (antichrists') today. I would suggest if you have not. put the armor of Christ in us, with the shield of His faithful labor "let there be God alone labor of love" .

The temporal historical, dying must be mixed with the invisible living things of God (faith as a labor of His " Let there be love" ) and "the bride of Christ was very, God alone good.

No sign was given to wonder after. The generation of natural unconverted mankind continues to seek the foundation of Paganism (out of sight out of mind ) In that way the fool has said. . . I see nothing. I know nothing. . Did you look for my bother Abel in the corn field or check the barn?

The historical temporal seen must be mixed with the unseen eternal faith (gospel). the mixing formula 2 Corinthians 4:18

The loving commandment is to study to show oneself approved to our invisible head Christ . (The husband of the bride or church.)

2 Timothy 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

He has not left us without the proper interpretation tools needed to interpret the figurative language of parables, which without Christ in us today speaks not

Which is why Paul tells us the Bible is not complete, right? Or did Paul say the Bible is complete, and perfect, good for teaching, etc.

The valuable interpretation tool. . . the mixing recipe below

2 Corinthians 4:18King James Version18 While we look not at the things which are seen, (historical ) but at the things which are not seen: (eternal )for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.

"16 Therefore we do not lose heart, but though our outer person is decaying, yet our inner person is being renewed day by day. 17 For our momentary, light affliction is producing for us an eternal weight of glory far beyond all comparison, 18 while we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen; for the things which are seen are temporal, but the things which are not seen are eternal."

There is A LOT that you are missing simply because you ignore the context of what is written. Paul is saying that our temporary suffering, which is but a moment, has nothing comparable to the eternal weight of glory, to the eternal joy, the eternal life to come.

No mix (temporal historical with the unseen eternal . . . no gospel rest

Hebrews 4:1-2 King James Version Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it. For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith (The unseen eternal) in them that heard it.

Matthew 13:34All these things spake Jesus unto the multitude in parables; and without (not once) a parable spake he not unto them:

Okay........ parables are not prophecy. Parables are allegory, while prophecy IS NOT. If prophecy is allegory, could you please give me the interpretation of "Out of Egypt I have called My Son"? I mean, it must be REALLY deep, being allegorical and all.

Mark 4:11 And he said unto them, Unto you it is given to know the mystery (gospel understanding) of the kingdom of God: but unto them that are without, all these things are done in parables:. . . . . . . . (remains a mysteries of Christ's faith or labor of Immanuel love. )

Again, that is NOT prophecy.

Kings in Israel .The abomination of desolation

Matthew 13:13 Therefore speak I to them in parables: (the mix) because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.

In that way I beleive God is no longer bringing any new revelation as sign to seek after. Satan the king of lying signs to onder after (his only voice) are still followed by the work of Christ sending a strong delusion to those who refuse to walk after the invisible, eternal things of God

There is no new Revelation, for the Bible is perfect in all things, which includes prophecy. There is no need for new prophecy. We have all we need.

God is not a man as us.

Jesus is. Hence Jesus is the perfect mediator between God and man... being both. The Word become flesh, that which was in the beginning. That which was both with God, and WAS GOD.

 

[Mr GLee]

In what way is God being God going against the law of faith. Parables are not prophecy, they are parables.

The law of Christ's faith is two-fold. "Let there be" and the temporal things seen "God alone good".

I am learning I believe from my experiences more and more the refusal of parables.. . . the figurative or signified language of prophecy .

Putting more into signs and wonders today, like they fear parables. causing confusion. Knowing without parable the figurative tongue Christ spoke not. Hiding the mysteries of faith from the non-converted

The temporal historic must be mixed with the invisible things of God . . .His powerful faithfulness a labor of His eternal love. . . many examples in the showing the work of parables.

Satan the king of lying signs to wonder after would have mankind believe parables good bedtime stories for toddlers

 

[TMSO]

The law of Christ's faith is two-fold. "Let there be" and the temporal things seen "God alone good".

I am learning I believe from my experiences more and more the refusal of parables.. . . the figurative or signified language of prophecy .

Putting more into signs and wonders today, like they fear parables. causing confusion. Knowing without parable the figurative tongue Christ spoke not. Hiding the mysteries of faith from the non-converted

The temporal historic must be mixed with the invisible things of God . . .His powerful faithfulness a labor of His eternal love. . . many examples in the showing the work of parables.

Satan the king of lying signs to wonder after would have mankind believe parables good bedtime stories for toddlers

Parables are not prophecy. They are allegorical stories that hide a spiritual truth from the eyes of the undiscerning. As used by Jesus, it was both a punishment and mercy. Punishment in that they would never understand the truth Jesus was speaking, and a mercy, because, by not knowing this spiritual truth, their punishment will be less severe then for those who know the spiritual truth, and still reject. Hence the proclamations of Jesus that for Capernum and others, their judgment will be worse then Sodom and Gomorrah (for instance). Why? If they had heard and seen what those in Capernum had heard and seen, they would have repented in sackloth and ashes. Yet Capernum had seen and heard, and rejected. So Sodom and Gomorrah will find judgment day to be less severe. The torment one faces and discerns in death will be based on the amount of knowledge one had and rejected.

 

[Mr GLee]

Parables are not prophecy. They are allegorical stories that hide a spiritual truth from the eyes of the undiscerning. As used by Jesus, it was both a punishment and mercy. Punishment in that they would never understand the truth Jesus was speaking, and a mercy, because, by not knowing this spiritual truth, their punishment will be less severe then for those who know the spiritual truth, and still reject. Hence the proclamations of Jesus that for Capernum and others, their judgment will be worse then Sodom and Gomorrah (for instance). Why? If they had heard and seen what those in Capernum had heard and seen, they would have repented in sackloth and ashes. Yet Capernum had seen and heard, and rejected. So Sodom and Gomorrah will find judgment day to be less severe. The torment one faces and discerns in death will be based on the amount of knowledge one had and rejected.

I would offer the bible does not use fictional figures and actions of truths as a Allegorical .

Not good bedtime stories for little ones but are clearly prophecy

And allegory is not a parable. In the way that the bible defines a parable as the figuration poetic tongue of God using the temporal historical to give un the unseen spiritual (invisible undestanding called faith (Christ's the husband not of our own selves )

The temporal dying historical must be mixed the gospel to uncover the the mysteries of Christ faithfulness. Hid from the unbelieving world

No mixing of the two. . no gospel rest (help in understanding the mysteries)

 

[Mr GLee]

Okay........ parables are not prophecy. Parables are allegory, while prophecy IS NOT. If prophecy is allegory, could you please give me the interpretation of "Out of Egypt I have called My Son"? I mean, it must be REALLY deep, being allegorical and all.

Hi thanks

I world offer.

Not a salvation issue more of how can we hear God not seen as it is written . How does he instruct and teach us his invisible wisdom ?

Not allegorical as fiction. Good children's bedtime stories.

Parable, prophecy the figurative language by which with he prophecies not .

Then a little digging or raking the leaves . Temporal historical must be mixed with the unseen eternal power (faith).

I would think .First he gives us eyes to see the of salvation Then having the tools a little digging or raking the leaves .

Temporal historical must be mixed with the unseen eternal power (faith).

Matthew 13:45-46King James Version Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto a merchant man, seeking goodly pearls:
Who, when he had found one pearl of great price, (salvation) went and sold all that he had, and bought it.


"Out of Egypt I have called My Son"

My interpretation. . "I the husband Christ called my Son. . born again Israel the bride or church out of the world" (Egypt) No longer under the god of this corrupted ,dying world Satan

Exodus 4:22 And thou shalt say unto Pharaoh, Thus saith the Lord, Israel is my son, even my firstborn:. . . .(the eternal bride or wife )

 

[TMSO]

I would offer the bible does not use fictional figures and actions of truths as a Allegorical .

Not good bedtime stories for little ones but are clearly prophecy

And allegory is not a parable. In the way that the bible defines a parable as the figuration poetic tongue of God using the temporal historical to give un the unseen spiritual (invisible undestanding called faith (Christ's the husband not of our own selves )

The temporal dying historical must be mixed the gospel to uncover the the mysteries of Christ faithfulness. Hid from the unbelieving world

No mixing of the two. . no gospel rest (help in understanding the mysteries)

You can look it up in a dictionary. Allegory is one of the synonyms for parable. Like the Pilgrim's Progress. A story that reflects a spiritual truth. The Pilgrim's progress runs alongside the spiritual truth being expounded upon. Just like a parable. A farmer throwing seeds in a field is allegorical to a missionary/preacher preaching the word of God, and the character of those hearing/receiving that word. The story is "cast out", and is not the point. The spiritual truth conveyed is the point.

 

[TMSO]

Hi thanks

I world offer.

Not a salvation issue more of how can we hear God not seen as it is written . How does he instruct and teach us his invisible wisdom ?

Not allegorical as fiction. Good children's bedtime stories.

Parable, prophecy the figurative language by which with he prophecies not .

Then a little digging or raking the leaves . Temporal historical must be mixed with the unseen eternal power (faith).

I would think .First he gives us eyes to see the of salvation Then having the tools a little digging or raking the leaves .

Temporal historical must be mixed with the unseen eternal power (faith).

Matthew 13:45-46King James Version Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto a merchant man, seeking goodly pearls:
Who, when he had found one pearl of great price, (salvation) went and sold all that he had, and bought it.


"Out of Egypt I have called My Son"

My interpretation. . "I the husband Christ called my Son. . born again Israel the bride or church out of the world" (Egypt) No longer under the god of this corrupted ,dying world Satan

The actual interpretation is that Jesus came to Joseph and Mary in a dream and told them they could leave Egypt and go back to Israel. Even the Bible is clear in that interpretation. Don't make it an allegory. Every time Jesus mentions a prophecy, or the gospel writers mention a prophecy, it is literally connected to what they are saying. John used Zechariah when speaking of Jesus crucified, where, in Zechariah it mentions Israel recognizing Him as the One they had pierced. I mean, it is quite literal, and John was using it to show that the Messiah in the Old Testament is actually Jesus. The reason you are interpreting is you want to make the prophecy an allegory. This was a multiple fulfillment in that Israel was called out of Egypt, and God considered Israel as a son in that prophecy. However, it linked the Messiah directly to Israel, as His Son is the Messiah, and He also called His Son out of Egypt... literally. Jesus read prophecy from Isaiah or Jeremiah (I don't remember off the top of my head) and stopped reading, and anyone who knows what is going on can see why He said that that prophecy was being fulfilled in their midst. Why did Jesus stop reading when He did? The rest of that prophecy wasn't being fulfilled yet.

Exodus 4:22 And thou shalt say unto Pharaoh, Thus saith the Lord, Israel is my son, even my firstborn:. . . .(the eternal bride or wife )

 

[Mr GLee]

The actual interpretation is that Jesus came to Joseph and Mary in a dream and told them they could leave Egypt and go back to Israel. Even the Bible is clear in that interpretation. Don't make it an allegory. Every time Jesus mentions a prophecy, or the gospel writers mention a prophecy, it is literally connected to what they are saying. John used Zechariah when speaking of Jesus crucified, where, in Zechariah it mentions Israel recognizing Him as the One they had pierced. I mean, it is quite literal, and John was using it to show that the Messiah in the Old Testament is actually Jesus. The reason you are interpreting is you want to make the prophecy an allegory. This was a multiple fulfillment in that Israel was called out of Egypt, and God considered Israel as a son in that prophecy. However, it linked the Messiah directly to Israel, as His Son is the Messiah, and He also called His Son out of Egypt... literally. Jesus read prophecy from Isaiah or Jeremiah (I don't remember off the top of my head) and stopped reading, and anyone who knows what is going on can see why He said that that prophecy was being fulfilled in their midst. Why did Jesus stop reading when He did? The rest of that prophecy wasn't being fulfilled yet.

God is not a Jewish man as King of kings That is clearly the goal of the father of lies, legion in order to seduce mankind to believe that eternal God is a man dying mankind .

The Messiah is the Son of man Jesus. Anointed by the Father, Christ the husband . Christ, the Holy Spirit of God he anoints teaches all of the sons of God (Christians) The one invisible good teaching Master.

A message from the Father in a dream Not a message from the Son of man Jesus the prophet / apostle.

Without parable the the figurative, signified tongue of prophecy, Christ the husband of the church spoke not.

The whole time period when there were kings in Israel. A pagan foundation Out of sight out of mind . . . fools that say there is no God in there hearts an abomination of desolation .

God in 1 Samuel 8 having given over the atheist Jews to do that they should not of .Until the time of the first century reformation the shaows of the ceremonial laws (shadows)became sight

Words have meaning attached ..

Signify. . to make signs, show by signs, point out, express; mean, signify

Figure . . figure of speech; symbol, allegory, parable "

Parable . . . using the things seen (signified) the temporal historical to give us the invisible gospel understanding hid for the lost

Hebrew 9:8 The Holy Ghost this signifying, that the way into the holiest of all was not yet made manifest, while as the first tabernacle was yet standing: Which was a figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience; Which stood only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation.