The four horsemen of the apocalypse

[TMSO]

It might be that the rider of the white horse who is a crowned king and warrior with his bow, conquers by FEAR. Peace through fear is another way of saying peace through strength.
I believe this rider king will be greatly feared. Even by his own people.
I believe he’s also the Antichrist.

It is still peace. Possible rider is greatly feared. I mean, the bow and crown are symbols of power. Not sure about Antichrist though. Neither for nor against.

 

[CrowCross]

I understand you believe in the rapture. Me too.

I believe in the pre-tribulation rapture. Several of the reasons can be seen in this thread.

I believe the raptured saints go to heaven where God is seated on His throne.
Do you agree?

I agree...also,
....John 14 tells us.... 2 In my Father’s house are many rooms. If it were not so, would I have told you that I go to prepare a place for you? 3And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and will take you to myself, (rapture) that where I am you may be also.
Emphasis mine.

I also believe that Jesus and his raptured saints are to be the executors of all the judgments we read of in Revelation. Psa 149:5-9

From a quick reading it looks like that is so.

In order for these judgements to come, there must be a period of time between the rapture and the judgments

I agree.

because there will be mortal believers on earth who go through the tribulation of the judgments. There must be a development of believers on Christ in Jerusalem. I believe they are the 144,000.

To be honest I've never dived into the 144,000.

I also believe the raptured saints are symbolize by the 4 living creatures in heaven.

I have not heard that as of yet. Might I ask why?

Are you with me?

Pretty much.

 

[CrowCross]

I don't see the first horseman as Christ, though I haven't given it much thought. However, I do see it as preparation for the Antichrist, if not the Antichrist. Some believe this can be Donald Trump, who, against all the people saying he wants to blow up the planet, was basically conquering through peace his first time in. Yes, he used drone strikes a couple of times, but this is next to Obama, who received a nobel peace prize, and then went indiscrminately drone striking everyone.

OK, lets have some fun...speculate...

You said.....Some believe this can be Donald Trump.....Currently the Biden administration, actually the string pullers seem to want to send long range missiles into Russia...which will start WW3. Probably nuclear. The OK to do so was just given.

BUT....Trump is president elect...He has a bow but no arrows. No arrows until he is in office. Trump as of this post is trying to have a sit-down with Putin and Zelenskyy and talk peace. Am I wrong? Probably.

Here's more strange speculation...Rev 17;11 .As for the beast that was and is not, it is an eighth but it belongs to the seven, and it goes to destruction.

As for the beast that was.....Trump was president.
and is not....Currently Trump is not.
Then the verse speaks of the future....Trump will be president again. Once again am I wrong? Probably. But just speculating.

 

[TMSO]

OK, lets have some fun...speculate...

You said.....Some believe this can be Donald Trump.....Currently the Biden administration, actually the string pullers seem to want to send long range missiles into Russia...which will start WW3. Probably nuclear. The OK to do so was just given.

BUT....Trump is president elect...He has a bow but no arrows. No arrows until he is in office. Trump as of this post is trying to have a sit-down with Putin and Zelenskyy and talk peace. Am I wrong? Probably.

That isn't it. By having no arrows it shows that he is conquering by peace. It makes sense considering this isn't the horseman of war, which comes next. And that next horse has the power to strip peace from the Earth, which isn't possible if there isn't peace.

Here's more strange speculation...Rev 17;11 .As for the beast that was and is not, it is an eighth but it belongs to the seven, and it goes to destruction.

As for the beast that was.....Trump was president.
and is not....Currently Trump is not.
Then the verse speaks of the future....Trump will be president again. Once again am I wrong? Probably. But just speculating.

To be honest, that is too much speculation for me. I stick to the outside, just watching and seeing what happens. If Trump goes right back into the Abraham Accords and strengthens this treaty/covenant with the many, I will pay closer attention. If he somehow ends the war, and as part of that, Israel gets the right to rebuild their temple, I will pay closer attention.

 

[Carbon]

@CrowCross

Notice, that the first horseman is unique. White is a symbol of goodness in John's writings. (whereas red, black, and certainly ashen, are viewed negatively in the Bible), Only the white horseman has a crown, only he is announced with thunder, and only he has no negative thing directly attached to him.

 

[Carbon]

@CrowCross

Notice, that the first horseman is unique. White is a symbol of goodness in John's writings. (whereas red, black, and certainly ashen, are viewed negatively in the Bible), Only the white horseman has a crown, only he is announced with thunder, and only he has no negative thing directly attached to him.

Then I saw when the Lamb broke one of the seven seals, and I heard one of the four living creatures saying as with a voice of thunder, “Come!” 2 I looked, and behold, a white horse, and the one who sat on it had a bow; and a crown was given to him, and he went out conquering and to conquer. Revelation 6.

Christ, and His gospel, have been going forth since the first Pentecost, two thousand years ago, conquering and to conquer.

 

[Carbon]

Then I saw when the Lamb broke one of the seven seals, and I heard one of the four living creatures saying as with a voice of thunder, “Come!” 2 I looked, and behold, a white horse, and the one who sat on it had a bow; and a crown was given to him, and he went out conquering and to conquer. Revelation 6.

Christ, and His gospel, have been going forth since the first Pentecost, two thousand years ago, conquering and to conquer.

You see, Christ and his gospel have been going forth through all the ages, gathering all the elect throughout this age. He has been sealing the saints with the Holy Spirit, covering us with the blood of Christ, and giving us perfect peace with God the Father.

 

[Carbon]

You see, Christ and his gospel have been going forth through all the ages, gathering all the elect throughout this age. He has been sealing the saints with the Holy Spirit, covering us with the blood of Christ, and giving us perfect peace with God the Father.

@CrowCross

Me being Amilennial I understand the reading of Revelation to argue good and evil will go back and forth throughout this age.

There will be times of both blessing and peace in this age. And there will be times of degeneracy, war, and/or social or economic collapse in this age. They will go back and forth, and there will always be a mixture as this earthly city based on sin, clashes with the City of God based on Christ. (Have you read the city of God by, Agustine?)

This mixture continues until the very end, when after a short period of great evil (called the great tribulation), the Lord Jesus returns to judge and to bring in the new heavens and new earth.

 

[CrowCross]

@CrowCross

Notice, that the first horseman is unique. White is a symbol of goodness in John's writings. (whereas red, black, and certainly ashen, are viewed negatively in the Bible), Only the white horseman has a crown, only he is announced with thunder, and only he has no negative thing directly attached to him.

I'd reply, but I'd only be repeating myself.

I'm not going to repeat myself because you ignored my response the first time around.

 

[CrowCross]

@CrowCross

Me being Amilennial I understand the reading of Revelation to argue good and evil will go back and forth throughout this age.

There will be times of both blessing and peace in this age. And there will be times of degeneracy, war, and/or social or economic collapse in this age. They will go back and forth, and there will always be a mixture as this earthly city based on sin, clashes with the City of God based on Christ. (Have you read the city of God by, Agustine?)

This mixture continues until the very end, when after a short period of great evil (called the great tribulation), the Lord Jesus returns to judge and to bring in the new heavens and new earth.

When you decide to discuss the return of Jesus the way He left...and it wasn't on a white hole....
The days of Noah and the weddings...
Not destined for wrath...
and several others, get back to me.

i don't see Amilennial point of view as correct.

 

[Carbon]

i don't see Amilennial point of view as correct.

I know you don't. And you know I do not see dispensationalism as a biblical view.

 

[TMSO]

@CrowCross

Notice, that the first horseman is unique. White is a symbol of goodness in John's writings. (whereas red, black, and certainly ashen, are viewed negatively in the Bible), Only the white horseman has a crown, only he is announced with thunder, and only he has no negative thing directly attached to him.

Must be unique considering the other three horses are all plagues of some sort. Consider that if Jesus was King while on Earth, hence Him saying that the Kingdom was already here, then He can't be the first horseman, for the crown wasn't given to Him until Christ Himself opens the first seal. Was Christ presenting Himself? A ruler will exist who will go around conquering the world with peace, which will be broken by War, the second horseman.

So, is your horseman one who receives a crown from Christ? Is His rule only temporary? [Rationally, this prophecy does not say that he has the crown forever, just for the time of the first seal.] Is Christ to be overcome by War? Is the second horseman truly strong enough to overcome Christ's peace?

 

[Mr GLee]

Must be unique considering the other three horses are all plagues of some sort. Consider that if Jesus was King while on Earth, hence Him saying that the Kingdom was already here, then He can't be the first horseman, for the crown wasn't given to Him until Christ Himself opens the first seal. Was Christ presenting Himself? A ruler will exist who will go around conquering the world with peace, which will be broken by War, the second horseman.

So, is your horseman one who receives a crown from Christ? Is His rule only temporary? [Rationally, this prophecy does not say that he has the crown forever, just for the time of the first seal.] Is Christ to be overcome by War? Is the second horseman truly strong enough to overcome Christ's peace?

I would offer. .

Christ the one good teaching authority of the Holy Spirit is represented outwardly by dying flesh the Son of man, Jesus.

Jesus said his dying flesh it profits for nothing .

Its spiritual life we do need .His words are spiritual. . . . . life giving as it is written

Christ not seen is King of kings, Lord of lords ,Father of fathers