THE ERROR OF SUPERSESSIONISM

[jeremiah1five]

Supersessionism, also called replacement theology or fulfillment theology, is a Gentile Christian theological doctrine which describes the theological conviction that the Gentile Christian Church has superseded the nation of Israel assuming their role as God's covenanted people, thus asserting that the New Covenant through Jesus Christ has superseded or replaced the Mosaic covenant exclusive to Jews. Supersessionist theology also holds that the universal Gentile Christian Church has succeeded ancient Israel as God's true Israel and that Gentile Christians have succeeded the ancient Israelites as the people of God.

For most of Gentile Christian history, supersessionism has been the mainstream interpretation of the New Testament of all three major historical traditions within Christianity – Orthodox, Roman Catholic and Protestant. The text most often evident in favor of the supersessionist view is Hebrews 8:13: "In speaking of 'a new covenant' (Jer. 31.31–32) he has made the first one obsolete."

Paul's views on the Jews are complex, but he is generally regarded as the first person to make the claim that by not accepting claims of Jesus's divinity, Jews disqualified themselves from salvation. Paul himself was born a Jew, but after a conversion experience he came to accept Jesus's divinity later in his life.

Modern Protestants hold to a range of positions on supersessionism and the relationship between the Gentile Church and the Jewish people. These differences arise from dissimilar literal versus figurative approaches to understanding the relationships between the covenants of the Bible, particularly the relationship between the covenants of the Old Testament and the New Covenant.

After the establishment of the political state of Israel in the wake of the Holocaust, mainstream Christian theologians and denominations began to re-examine supersessionism and some communities came to outright reject the doctrine. The prominent Protestant alternatives to supersessionism are covenant theology, New Covenant theology, classical dispensationalism, progressive dispensationalism and covenant premillennialism. Another alternative, dual-covenant theology, contrasts with supersessionism by holding that the Mosaic covenant remains valid for Talmudic Jews.

Extensive discussion is found in Christian views on the Old Covenant and in the respective articles for each of these viewpoints: for example, there is a section within dispensationalism detailing that perspective's concept of Israel. Differing approaches influence how the land promise in Genesis 12, 15 and 17 is understood, whether it is interpreted literally or figuratively, both with regard to the land and the identity of people who inherit it.

 

[prism]

Supersessionism, also called replacement theology or fulfillment theology, is a Gentile Christian theological doctrine which describes the theological conviction that the Gentile Christian Church has superseded the nation of Israel assuming their role as God's covenanted people, thus asserting that the New Covenant through Jesus Christ has superseded or replaced the Mosaic covenant exclusive to Jews. Supersessionist theology also holds that the universal Gentile Christian Church has succeeded ancient Israel as God's true Israel and that Gentile Christians have succeeded the ancient Israelites as the people of God.

What if one holds that the Gentile plus the Jewish believers take the place (in terms of promises, but not the Land) of Ancient Israel? Is that 'supersessionist?

Ephesians 2:14-15 NKJV
For He Himself is our peace, who has made both one, and has broken down the middle wall of separation, [15] having abolished in His flesh the enmity, that is, the law of commandments contained in ordinances, so as to create in Himself one new man from the two, thus making peace,


Why even the Mosaic Covenant never superseded the Abrahamic Covenant. Gal 3:17

Galatians 3:17-18 NKJV
[17] And this I say, that the law, which was four hundred and thirty years later, cannot annul the covenant that was confirmed before by God in Christ, that it should make the promise of no effect. [18] For if the inheritance is of the law, it is no longer of promise; but God gave it to Abraham by promise.

 

[jeremiah1five]

What if one holds that the Gentile plus the Jewish believers take the place (in terms of promises, but not the Land) of Ancient Israel? Is that 'supersessionist?

Let me put it this way: I see nowhere in the Law, the Psalms, and the Prophets God making covenant with any Gentiles or seed of Gentiles.
Thus, everything concerning salvation, and salvation is of the Jews, belongs to the Jews/Hebrews/children of Israel.

4 Who are Israelites; to whom pertaineth the adoption, and the glory, and the covenants, and the giving of the law, and the service of God, and the promises;
5 Whose are the fathers, and of whom as concerning the flesh Christ came, who is over all, God blessed for ever. Amen.
Rom. 9:4–5.

NONE of the above belong to Gentiles. None.
Christ was Promised to Israel and to Israel He came.
He even says so Himself: "I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel Mt 15:24.
He wasn't sent to Gentiles. Nowhere in Scripture in the Law, the Psalms, and the Prophets will you find any such statement.

Ephesians 2:14-15 NKJV
For He Himself is our peace, who has made both one, and has broken down the middle wall of separation, [15] having abolished in His flesh the enmity, that is, the law of commandments contained in ordinances, so as to create in Himself one new man from the two, thus making peace,


Why even the Mosaic Covenant never superseded the Abrahamic Covenant. Gal 3:17

Galatians 3:17-18 NKJV
[17] And this I say, that the law, which was four hundred and thirty years later, cannot annul the covenant that was confirmed before by God in Christ, that it should make the promise of no effect. [18] For if the inheritance is of the law, it is no longer of promise; but God gave it to Abraham by promise.

I had asked you before: Does God keep His Promises?
And I ask you now, Is there anything that would prevent God from keeping His Promises?
Anything?

 

[3 Resurrections]

I had asked you before: Does God keep His Promises?
And I ask you now, Is there anything that would prevent God from keeping His Promises?
Anything?

God keeps both His promises of blessings...and also His curses. Don't forget there was also a Mount Ebal as well as a Mount Gerizim. Disobedience to the terms of this covenant brought eventual ruin for Israel.

The Song of Moses that Israel was to memorize before they entered the land of Canaan as found in Deuteronomy 32:1-43 details just what evils were going to happen to the nation of Israel in their "latter days" when God would heap His vengeance upon them until their power was gone. When God's vengeance was to be exacted on the nation of Israel under the Lord's judgment, the Song of Moses tells the Gentiles, "Rejoice, O ye Gentiles, with His people..." Paul quotes this directive to the Gentiles in Romans 15:10.

In this New Covenant Age we are in, Christ promised that there would be only "one fold and one Shepherd" - not two separate folds. In this New Covenant, there are no ethnic distinctions, gender distinctions, or social strata distinctions in God's consideration of us as His children - the revelation of the mystery which had been hidden in past ages. Anyone who continues to emphasize the past separation of Jew / Gentile as relevant and applicable for today is not focusing on the terms of the New Covenant with our deathless Great High Priest and the change in the law..

 

[prism]

Let me put it this way: I see nowhere in the Law, the Psalms, and the Prophets God making covenant with any Gentiles or seed of Gentiles.
Thus, everything concerning salvation, and salvation is of the Jews, belongs to the Jews/Hebrews/children of Israel.

4 Who are Israelites; to whom pertaineth the adoption, and the glory, and the covenants, and the giving of the law, and the service of God, and the promises;
5 Whose are the fathers, and of whom as concerning the flesh Christ came, who is over all, God blessed for ever. Amen.
Rom. 9:4–5.

NONE of the above belong to Gentiles. None.
Christ was Promised to Israel and to Israel He came.
He even says so Himself: "I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel Mt 15:24.
He wasn't sent to Gentiles. Nowhere in Scripture in the Law, the Psalms, and the Prophets will you find any such statement.

I had asked you before: Does God keep His Promises?
And I ask you now, Is there anything that would prevent God from keeping His Promises?
Anything?

Paul was sent to the Gentiles by Christ (Acts 9), then...

1 Corinthians 3:21-23 NKJV
Therefore let no one boast in men. For all things are yours: [22] whether Paul or Apollos or Cephas, or the world or life or death, or things present or things to come-all are yours. [23] And you are Christ's, and Christ is God's.

Yes, the Promise of the Gospel is to the Jew First, but it doesn't preclude the Gentiles.

Does God keep His Promises? Yes. Here was a promise wrapped in a mystery now revealed..

Ephesians 3:4-7 NKJV
by which, when you read, you may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ), [5] which in other ages was not made known to the sons of men, as it has now been revealed by the Spirit to His holy apostles and prophets: [6] that the Gentiles should be fellow heirs, of the same body, and partakers of His promise in Christ through the gospel, [7] of which I became a minister according to the gift of the grace of God given to me by the effective working of His power.

 

[CrowCross]

Let me put it this way: I see nowhere in the Law, the Psalms, and the Prophets God making covenant with any Gentiles or seed of Gentiles.
Thus, everything concerning salvation, and salvation is of the Jews, belongs to the Jews/Hebrews/children of Israel.

4 Who are Israelites; to whom pertaineth the adoption, and the glory, and the covenants, and the giving of the law, and the service of God, and the promises;
5 Whose are the fathers, and of whom as concerning the flesh Christ came, who is over all, God blessed for ever. Amen.
Rom. 9:4–5.

NONE of the above belong to Gentiles. None.
Christ was Promised to Israel and to Israel He came.
He even says so Himself: "I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel Mt 15:24.
He wasn't sent to Gentiles. Nowhere in Scripture in the Law, the Psalms, and the Prophets will you find any such statement.

I had asked you before: Does God keep His Promises?
And I ask you now, Is there anything that would prevent God from keeping His Promises?
Anything?

Tell me if I'm reading you correctly...only Jews can be saved?

 

[Josheb]

Supersessionism, also called replacement theology or fulfillment theology, is a Gentile Christian theological doctrine which describes the theological conviction that the Gentile Christian Church has superseded the nation of Israel assuming their role as God's covenanted people, thus asserting that the New Covenant through Jesus Christ has superseded or replaced the Mosaic covenant exclusive to Jews. Supersessionist theology also holds that the universal Gentile Christian Church has succeeded ancient Israel as God's true Israel and that Gentile Christians have succeeded the ancient Israelites as the people of God.

For most of Gentile Christian history, supersessionism has been the mainstream interpretation of the New Testament of all three major historical traditions within Christianity – Orthodox, Roman Catholic and Protestant. The text most often evident in favor of the supersessionist view is Hebrews 8:13: "In speaking of 'a new covenant' (Jer. 31.31–32) he has made the first one obsolete."

Paul's views on the Jews are complex, but he is generally regarded as the first person to make the claim that by not accepting claims of Jesus's divinity, Jews disqualified themselves from salvation. Paul himself was born a Jew, but after a conversion experience he came to accept Jesus's divinity later in his life.

Modern Protestants hold to a range of positions on supersessionism and the relationship between the Gentile Church and the Jewish people. These differences arise from dissimilar literal versus figurative approaches to understanding the relationships between the covenants of the Bible, particularly the relationship between the covenants of the Old Testament and the New Covenant.

This is an easily resolved matter. Romans 11 makes it clear the Gentile was grafted into an already existing "tree" that includes Israel (the Israel that is Israel, not te Israel that is not Israel). The Church does not replace Israel. When the Jews translated Tanakh into Greek they used the word, "ecclesia" to replace "qahal" (assembly). In the New Testament the ecclesia and the qahal are grafted into Christ; those called out join the assembly; they do not replace it.

After the establishment of the political state of Israel in the wake of the Holocaust, mainstream Christian theologians and denominations began to re-examine supersessionism and some communities came to outright reject the doctrine. The prominent Protestant alternatives to supersessionism are covenant theology, New Covenant theology, classical dispensationalism, progressive dispensationalism and covenant premillennialism. Another alternative, dual-covenant theology, contrasts with supersessionism by holding that the Mosaic covenant remains valid for Talmudic Jews.

Very astute to label the currently existing country "the political state," and likewise astute to use "establishment," because it is not covenant Israel restored. It is not in any way a fulfillment of prophecy. Not yet, at any rate.

Extensive discussion is found in Christian views on the Old Covenant and in the respective articles for each of these viewpoints: for example, there is a section within dispensationalism detailing that perspective's concept of Israel. Differing approaches influence how the land promise in Genesis 12, 15 and 17 is understood, whether it is interpreted literally or figuratively, both with regard to the land and the identity of people who inherit it.

I recommend Peter Gentry's and Stephen Wellum's "Kingdom Through Covenant," and Michael Williams' "Far as the Curse is Found." Both articulate a continuity perspective of covenant from old to new fulfilled in Christ that is not supersessionist.

 

[Josheb]

What if one holds that the Gentile plus the Jewish believers take the place (in terms of promises, but not the Land) of Ancient Israel? Is that 'supersessionist?

Ephesians 2:14-15 NKJV
For He Himself is our peace, who has made both one, and has broken down the middle wall of separation, [15] having abolished in His flesh the enmity, that is, the law of commandments contained in ordinances, so as to create in Himself one new man from the two, thus making peace,


Why even the Mosaic Covenant never superseded the Abrahamic Covenant. Gal 3:17

Galatians 3:17-18 NKJV
[17] And this I say, that the law, which was four hundred and thirty years later, cannot annul the covenant that was confirmed before by God in Christ, that it should make the promise of no effect. [18] For if the inheritance is of the law, it is no longer of promise; but God gave it to Abraham by promise.

Notice also Paul said the promises made to Abraham were also made to Jesus.

Galatians 3:16
Now the promises were spoken to Abraham and to his seed. He does not say, “And to seeds,” as referring to many, but rather to one, “And to your seed,” that is, Christ.

The promises were made to Abraham and Christ..... long before Israel ever came into existence (by several hundred years).

 

[jeremiah1five]

Paul was sent to the Gentiles by Christ (Acts 9), then...

After 17 years considering the New Covenant in light of the Law, the Psalms, and the Prophets it was Saul's habit when he traveled to visit the synagogues in that city or town first.

20 And straightway he preached Christ in the synagogues, that he is the Son of God.
Acts 9:20.

15 But the Lord said unto him, Go thy way: for he is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles, and kings, and the children of Israel: Acts 9:15–16.

1 Corinthians 3:21-23 NKJV
Therefore let no one boast in men. For all things are yours: [22] whether Paul or Apollos or Cephas, or the world or life or death, or things present or things to come-all are yours. [23] And you are Christ's, and Christ is God's.

Saul wrote to Jewish Christians in Corinth. That's the context of everything he said.

Yes, the Promise of the Gospel is to the Jew First, but it doesn't preclude the Gentiles.

God made no covenant with Gentiles of the seed of Gentiles in the Law, the Psalms, and the Prophets. None. Gentiles are precluded from the covenants God made with Abraham (Hebrew), the children of Israel (Mosaic) or the House of Israel (New Covenant.)
The writings of the New Covenant such as Saul, Peter, James, Jude, etc., have them talking about things contained in the Law, the Psalms, and the Prophets. There are no new covenants in their writings. The discussion in their letters concerns the Law, the Psalms, and the Prophets and everything having to do with Israel, their history, their culture, their Messiah, their religion and their practices.

Does God keep His Promises? Yes. Here was a promise wrapped in a mystery now revealed..

So, it matters not whether Israel is obedient or not. God's promises are God's promises and this is the reason why Saul says "and all Israel shall be saved" in Romans:

26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: 27 For this is my covenant [my promises] unto them, when I shall take away their sins. Rom. 11:26–27.

And this He did in sending their Redeemer to the lost sheep of the House of Israel.
Saul understood what you have agreed and that is, that God keeps His covenant [promises] regardless of their behavior. He doesn't say they will come to accept their Messiah, or become Christians, but "all Israel shall be saved."

Ephesians 3:4-7 NKJV
by which, when you read, you may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ), [5] which in other ages was not made known to the sons of men, as it has now been revealed by the Spirit to His holy apostles and prophets: [6] that the Gentiles should be fellow heirs, of the same body, and partakers of His promise in Christ through the gospel, [7] of which I became a minister according to the gift of the grace of God given to me by the effective working of His power.

This doesn't speak of a covenant. The word "promise" merely means "announcement." I can only surmise what announcement he is talking about. But it directs me to consider "good news."
"partakers of His announcement in Christ through the good message."

 

[jeremiah1five]

Tell me if I'm reading you correctly...only Jews can be saved?

No. The Hebrew/Jews/children of Israel are saved through Covenant.
God saves Gentiles without covenant.
There is no covenant in the Law, the Psalms, and the Prophets anywhere of God making covenant with Gentiles or the seed of Gentiles.

4 Who are Israelites; to whom pertaineth the adoption, and the glory, and the covenants, and the giving of the law, and the service of God, and the promises;
5 Whose are the fathers, and of whom as concerning the flesh Christ came, who is over all, God blessed for ever. Amen.
Rom. 9:4–5.

Jesus Christ did say, "I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel" Mt 15:24.

That's because Christ is the Personal fulfillment of all the covenants and promises God made with the House of Israel, especially the New Covenant in Jeremiah 31:31-34.

Obviously, if you are Gentile and are saved, born again, then Jews are not the only people God is saving. But God saves Gentiles without a Covenant.
Israel is the apple of God's eye.
Israel is the Church of God.
Israel in the Bride of Christ and God betrothed in the First Covenant Scriptures.
Israel proper possesses all the covenants and promises of God (Rom. 9:4-5.)
At the Marriage Supper Israel is there by Covenant.
Gentiles are there by invitation (Matt. 22.)

 

[prism]

Saul wrote to Jewish Christians in Corinth. That's the context of everything he said.

Corinth was the center of Gentile/heathen idolatry. Many Gentiles came to faith out of that idolatry. Paul writes of it in his letters to the Corinthians:
1 Corinthians 6:9-11 NKJV
Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites, [10] nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God. [11] And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God.

God made no covenant with Gentiles of the seed of Gentiles in the Law, the Psalms, and the Prophets. None. Gentiles are precluded from the covenants God made with Abraham (Hebrew), the children of Israel (Mosaic) or the House of Israel (New Covenant.)
The writings of the New Covenant such as Saul, Peter, James, Jude, etc., have them talking about things contained in the Law, the Psalms, and the Prophets. There are no new covenants in their writings. The discussion in their letters concerns the Law, the Psalms, and the Prophets and everything having to do with Israel, their history, their culture, their Messiah, their religion and their practices.

I never said God made a covenant to the Gentiles int the Law etc. (although I don't recall Adam or Noah being Jewish), but the Gentiles are beneficiaries and partakers of those Covenants/Promises as well as non believing Jews when they come to faith in their Messiah.

So, it matters not whether Israel is obedient or not. God's promises are God's promises and this is the reason why Saul says "and all Israel shall be saved" in Romans:

26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: 27 For this is my covenant [my promises] unto them, when I shall take away their sins. Rom. 11:26–27.

And this He did in sending their Redeemer to the lost sheep of the House of Israel.
Saul understood what you have agreed and that is, that God keeps His covenant [promises] regardless of their behavior. He doesn't say they will come to accept their Messiah, or become Christians, but "all Israel shall be saved."

I don't believe there will be a universal salvation among the Jews. In Rom 11 Paul is referring to the Body of Christ made of both believing Jews and Gentiles as 'all Israel'. Didn't Jesus tell opposing Jews, "You are of your father the devil"?

 

[Mr GLee]

Supersessionism, also called replacement theology or fulfillment theology, is a Gentile Christian theological doctrine which describes the theological conviction that the Gentile Christian Church has superseded the nation of Israel assuming their role as God's covenanted people, thus asserting that the New Covenant through Jesus Christ has superseded or replaced the Mosaic covenant exclusive to Jews. Supersessionist theology also holds that the universal Gentile Christian Church has succeeded ancient Israel as God's true Israel and that Gentile Christians have succeeded the ancient Israelites as the people of God.

It's not replacement theology its God saying I have decided to rename the bride. promised in Isaiah 62 renamed in Acts.

A more befitting name to name the bride of every nation under heaven . . .Christian a demonym. . . people know by place of residence.

Christian literally meaning. "Residents of the unseen Holy City of Christ " Prepared for his eternal bride the church. Named after her founder and husband Christ. Again, a more befitting name than born again Israel one nation

 

[jeremiah1five]

Corinth was the center of Gentile/heathen idolatry. Many Gentiles came to faith out of that idolatry. Paul writes of it in his letters to the Corinthians:

Jews that became Christian at the Feast of Harvests (Pentecost) returned to their homes in the Gentile lands they came from. Corinth was one of those places. They took with them a sketchy outline of what Peter preached, took with them their experiences of the Holy Spirit and returned to their synagogues in Corinth. When the Jews in their synagogue could not reconcile how their Messiah died on a tree there was a split and the Jewish Christians in Corinth began to gather and fellowship in their homes. The first home churches.
Yes, they were surrounded by heathen idolatry and all kinds of immorality, but they were Jewish Christian and what today would be called "holey rollers" and "Hallelujas" and "Jesus Freaks." They were participating in the New Covenant God promised to the House of Israel. It seems highly unlikely that God would spend 4000 years through prophecy and covenants with a Hebrew named Abraham and give him a covenant that spread to his descendants and finally to deliver the children of Israel from their bondage, build them a Tabernacle, give them His Law, make them a nation, destroy His enemies, give them a promised land, raise up king's and send them prophets, promise them a New Covenant and the first words He speaks through Jewish writers is to the Gentiles? HIGHLY UNLIKELY.

1 Corinthians 6:9-11 NKJV
Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites, [10] nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God. [11] And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God.

The Kingdom of God is a Person. Christ (Matt. 12:28.)
And the Kingdom of God is as He says, an inheritance based on covenant. The rich young ruler asked Jesus what he should do to INHERIT the kingdom and Christ directed him to the Law of Moses. Along with that commanded him to "follow me." In time he did.
The Kingdom of God is Christ. Christ is the anointing (Heb. Messias) pointing to the Holy Spirit.
In the New Birth the Kingdom of God, Christ, comes not with observation but is within you. Right?
This is the New Covenant. This is THAT Law God promised to put in the inward parts of His covenant people.

I never said God made a covenant to the Gentiles int the Law etc. (although I don't recall Adam or Noah being Jewish), but the Gentiles are beneficiaries and partakers of those Covenants/Promises as well as non believing Jews when they come to faith in their Messiah.

Adam and Noah make up a family line that coursed its way to Judah and then to Christ. The Noahic Covenant had nothing to do with salvation. Christ's family line is listed in Matthew and Luke.

I don't believe there will be a universal salvation among the Jews. In Rom 11 Paul is referring to the Body of Christ made of both believing Jews and Gentiles as 'all Israel'. Didn't Jesus tell opposing Jews, "You are of your father the devil"?

If there's a body of Christ it is first populated with God's covenant people, and while the Temple still stood, everything about the New Covenant was "Jewish."

 

[prism]

Jews that became Christian at the Feast of Harvests (Pentecost) returned to their homes in the Gentile lands they came from. Corinth was one of those places. They took with them a sketchy outline of what Peter preached, took with them their experiences of the Holy Spirit and returned to their synagogues in Corinth. When the Jews in their synagogue could not reconcile how their Messiah died on a tree there was a split and the Jewish Christians in Corinth began to gather and fellowship in their homes. The first home churches.
Yes, they were surrounded by heathen idolatry and all kinds of immorality, but they were Jewish Christian and what today would be called "holey rollers" and "Hallelujas" and "Jesus Freaks." They were participating in the New Covenant God promised to the House of Israel. It seems highly unlikely that God would spend 4000 years through prophecy and covenants with a Hebrew named Abraham and give him a covenant that spread to his descendants and finally to deliver the children of Israel from their bondage, build them a Tabernacle, give them His Law, make them a nation, destroy His enemies, give them a promised land, raise up king's and send them prophets, promise them a New Covenant and the first words He speaks through Jewish writers is to the Gentiles? HIGHLY UNLIKELY.

All the sources I checked said the Corinth Church was comprised mainly of Gentile converts. What are your sources that say predominately Jewish?

The Kingdom of God is a Person. Christ (Matt. 12:28.)
And the Kingdom of God is as He says, an inheritance based on covenant. The rich young ruler asked Jesus what he should do to INHERIT the kingdom and Christ directed him to the Law of Moses. Along with that commanded him to "follow me." In time he did.
The Kingdom of God is Christ. Christ is the anointing (Heb. Messias) pointing to the Holy Spirit.
In the New Birth the Kingdom of God, Christ, comes not with observation but is within you. Right?
This is the New Covenant. This is THAT Law God promised to put in the inward parts of His covenant people.

I'm not sure what your point is here, but concerning the Rich Young Ruler, the real point wasn't so much as 'follow me' , but rather ..
"Mark 10:27 BSB
Jesus looked at them and said, “With man this is impossible, but not with God. For all things are possible with God.” That includes 'following Jesus'.

Adam and Noah make up a family line that coursed its way to Judah and then to Christ. The Noahic Covenant had nothing to do with salvation. Christ's family line is listed in Matthew and Luke.

I only mentioned Adam and Noah because, as Gentiles, they received a covenant. Gen 3:16. and Gen 9:1-17

If there's a body of Christ it is first populated with God's covenant people, and while the Temple still stood, everything about the New Covenant was "Jewish."

Paul defined the body of Christ long before the Temple was destroyed in 70AD.

1 Corinthians 12:27 NKJV
Now you are the body of Christ, and members individually.

Ephesians 2:16 NIrV
He planned to bring both Jews and Gentiles back to God as one body. He planned to do this through the cross. On that cross, Christ put to death their hatred toward one another.

 

[jeremiah1five]

All the sources I checked said the Corinth Church was comprised mainly of Gentile converts. What are your sources that say predominately Jewish?

Scripture and reason.

I'm not sure what your point is here, but concerning the Rich Young Ruler, the real point wasn't so much as 'follow me' , but rather ..
"Mark 10:27 BSB
Jesus looked at them and said, “With man this is impossible, but not with God. For all things are possible with God.” That includes 'following Jesus'.

I only mentioned Adam and Noah because, as Gentiles, they received a covenant. Gen 3:16. and Gen 9:1-17

There were no Gentiles until Ham and Japheth and then Abraham separating the two races because of Covenant and the sign of Covenant: circumcision.

Paul defined the body of Christ long before the Temple was destroyed in 70AD.

Saul understood the New Covenant was with the House of Israel and for forty years before the Temple was destroyed and maybe soon after, everything in the Jewish phenomenon called the Holy Spirit Christ was building His Church and it was populated with Covenant Jews who became saved and touched/filled with the Holy Spirit of Promise.
Makes no sense for God to make Covenant with the House of Israel and send the Holy Spirit to the House of Israel and then begin the New Covenant Church made with Israel and fill it with Gentiles.
Can we please let Israel have her Covenant without trying to elbow in or steal it from them?

1 Corinthians 12:27 NKJV
Now you are the body of Christ, and members individually.
Ephesians 2:16 NIrV
He planned to bring both Jews and Gentiles back to God as one body. He planned to do this through the cross. On that cross, Christ put to death their hatred toward one another.

Show me in the First Covenant (Old Testament) these things.
Because, I have found Saul/Paul in his letter to Jewish Christians in Rome changed a word of the Old Testament prophecy. And if Saul changed a word so that it may now read differently then something is wrong in Denmark!
I recall some of the church fathers had their own choices of what "books" to put in the canon. I have trouble now believing the Roman letter was inspired and Saul changing a word to make the OT prophecy read something else entirely in the NT. That's being dishonest with Scripture, and I accuse Saul/Paul of doing this until he or it can be explained to my satisfaction as a born-again Christian that must rely on Scripture for all I am to think and believe.

 

[Mr GLee]

Jews that became Christian at the Feast of Harvests (Pentecost) returned to their homes in the Gentile lands they came from. Corinth was one of those places. They took with them cof what Peter preached, sketchy outline took with them their experiences of the Holy Spirit and returned to their synagogues in Corinth. When the Jews in their synagogue could not reconcile how their Messiah died on a tree there was a split and the Jewish Christians in Corinth began to gather and fellowship in their homes. The first home churche

They took with them a sketchy outline of what Peter preached,) rather than the living word that works from within?????????????

Sounds sketchy at the most to me.

Prophets speak the words coming from the mind of God .Not there own experiences. Not of themselves lest any man boast in empty pride .

You as it seems are puffing up venerating the apostles "above" (sola scriptura ) all things written in the law and prophets (the Bible) We are warned using two apostles (two is the witness God has spoken ).

Why puff them up above it as it is written . Did some not receive what they do have freely from God .From whom did you receive what you do have . Will you boast as if you did not receive it

1 Corinthians 4:6-7King James Version. And these things, brethren, I have in a figure (parable) transferred to myself and to Apollos for your sakes; that ye might learn in us not to think of men above that which is written, that no one of you be puffed up for one against another.
For who maketh thee to differ from another? and what hast thou that thou didst not receive? now if thou didst receive it, why dost thou glory, as if thou hadst not received it?

 

[prism]

Scripture and reason.

Which Scripture? (I hold to Scripture over reason).

There were no Gentiles until Ham and Japheth and then Abraham separating the two races because of Covenant and the sign of Covenant: circumcision.

So, Adam and Noah were Jews?

Saul understood the New Covenant was with the House of Israel and for forty years before the Temple was destroyed and maybe soon after, everything in the Jewish phenomenon called the Holy Spirit Christ was building His Church and it was populated with Covenant Jews who became saved and touched/filled with the Holy Spirit of Promise.
Makes no sense for God to make Covenant with the House of Israel and send the Holy Spirit to the House of Israel and then begin the New Covenant Church made with Israel and fill it with Gentiles.
Can we please let Israel have her Covenant without trying to elbow in or steal it from them?

Many Gentiles including yourself over look this fact...

Romans 11:25 NKJV
For I do not desire, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own opinion, that blindness in part has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in.

'Blindness has happened in part to Israel' was God's doing who 'made Covenant with His people' etc. and filled His church with Gentiles. But during the Great Tribulation (Jacob's Trouble), many of His people will turn back to their Messiah.

I recall some of the church fathers had their own choices of what "books" to put in the canon. I have trouble now believing the Roman letter was inspired and Saul changing a word to make the OT prophecy read something else entirely in the NT. That's being dishonest with Scripture, and I accuse Saul/Paul of doing this until he or it can be explained to my satisfaction as a born-again Christian that must rely on Scripture for all I am to think and believe.

Now you are treading on heretical grounds.
Jesus put His stamp of approval on Peter (Mt 16), and Peter put his stamp of approval on Saul/Paul..

2 Peter 3:15-16 NKJV
and consider that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation-as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you, [16] as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.

So Peter called what Paul wrote...Scripture, and so do I.

 

[jeremiah1five]

Which Scripture? (I hold to Scripture over reason).

The LORD requires us to use both:

18 Come now, and let us reason together, saith the LORD:
Though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow;
Though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool.
Isaiah 1:18.

So, Adam and Noah were Jews?

Prism, you know the designation "Jews" comes from "Judah."
They were not Jews nor were they Gentile.
They were Adam:

2 Male and female created he them; and blessed them, and called their name Adam, in the day when they were created. Gen. 5:1–2.

Many Gentiles including yourself over look this fact...

I'm not Gentile.

Romans 11:25 NKJV
For I do not desire, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own opinion, that blindness in part has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in.

'Blindness has happened in part to Israel' was God's doing who 'made Covenant with His people' etc. and filled His church with Gentiles. But during the Great Tribulation (Jacob's Trouble), many of His people will turn back to their Messiah.

The New Covenant Church is populated with Jews.
Always has been, always will be.
Gentiles are "another flock." God saves them without covenant.

Now you are treading on heretical grounds.
Jesus put His stamp of approval on Peter (Mt 16), and Peter put his stamp of approval on Saul/Paul..

The original prophecy is in Isaiah 10:22.
When Saul quotes it he changes a word to make the prophecy say something else entirely. That's not being honest with the Scripture.
So, it's either a translator error or Saul misused the Scripture and that is troubling.
Those are the facts.

2 Peter 3:15-16 NKJV
and consider that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation-as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you, [16] as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.

So Peter called what Paul wrote...Scripture, and so do I.

The fact remains. Saul changed a word in the original prophecy in Isaiah to make it say something else entirely.
I'd call that manipulation.
It's in the bible so don't say I'm treading on heretical grounds. That's what HE DEID. I'm just pointing it out.
I am, after all, the pointing finger in the hand of God.

 

[prism]

The LORD requires us to use both:

18 Come now, and let us reason together, saith the LORD:
Though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow;
Though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool.
Isaiah 1:18.

Of course when the Lord ‘reasons with us together’ it’s as good as Scripture…it is God’s words/thoughts, but when we ‘reason’, it’s a different story.

They were not Jews nor were they Gentile.
They were Adam:

2 Male and female created he them; and blessed them, and called their name Adam, in the day when they were created. Gen. 5:1–

…and the covenant God made with Noah?

I'm not Gentile.

I figured I’d get a confession out of you, though others tried.

The New Covenant Church is populated with Jews.
Always has been, always will be.
Gentiles are "another flock." God saves them without covenant.

I guess Paul was wrong when he spoke of a partial blindness over Israel?
Again, God is melding the two flocks into ONE.

John 10:16 CSB
But I have other sheep that are not from this sheep pen; I must bring them also, and they will listen to my voice. Then there will be one flock, one shepherd.

 

[prism]

The original prophecy is in Isaiah 10:22.
When Saul quotes it he changes a word to make the prophecy say something else entirely. That's not being honest with the Scripture.
So, it's either a translator error or Saul misused the Scripture and that is troubling.
Those are the facts.

Isaiah 10:22 NKJV
For though your people, O Israel, be as the sand of the sea, A remnant of them will return; The destruction decreed shall overflow with righteousness.

Are you a Hebrew scholar, or is that what others have told you? Which word? What facts?

The fact remains. Saul changed a word in the original prophecy in Isaiah to make it say something else entirely.
I'd call that manipulation.
It's in the bible so don't say I'm treading on heretical grounds. That's what HE DEID. I'm just pointing it out.
I am, after all, the pointing finger in the hand of God.

Are you qualified to work on an Old Testament translation committee? If so, why are you hanging out around Christian Forums?