Questioning the reformation!

[donadams]

1 Timothy 4:1
Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;

Questioning the reformation:

Reformed truth? (theology)

Truth is divine! God is truth!

I am the way, the truth, and the life!
Jn 14:6

Truth is eternal, Unchangeable, immutable and Ir-reformable.

No new doctrine or public revelation:


The Church is of divine origin and is eternal!

Truth and the Church cannot be reformed! There is no error in God or his church! Jn 14:6 Jn 16:13

Christ revealed the truth and Christ teaches the truth to all men thru His church! Matt 28:19

Reformation?
Where does the Bible say have a reformation? “Bible only authority” therefore the so-called reforms had “no” authority!

What was reformed?
Truth and the church are of divine origin, they come from God and cannot be reformed!

Not even honest; nothing was reformed, they rejected the one true church Jn 10:16 founded and established by Christ on Peter matt 16:18 and the apostles matt 18:18 eph 2:20 His witnesses acts 1:8 lead into all truth Jn 16:13 and then teaching and sanctifying all men unto salvation. Matt 28:19 and started new ones when only Christ has authority Matt 28:18 to found the church. Matt 16:18


Where did Christ err in establishing the church
To accept the so-called “reformation” is to reject Christ and scripture Matt 16:18-19 shall not prevail
Is Christ powerless to defend his bride
And the purity of her doctrine

Church not dependent on scripture

The church was established before the New Testament scripture!

The church came first:
Existed first:
exercised authority and taught before there was a New Testament:
The church was taught by Christ in person for three years and wrote the New Testament!

Not a reformation but a revolt, protest, accusations and rebellion against Christ and His one true church!

Thanks

 

[ReverendRV]

1 Timothy 4:1
Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;

Questioning the reformation:

Reformed truth? (theology)

Truth is divine! God is truth!

I am the way, the truth, and the life!
Jn 14:6

Truth is eternal, Unchangeable, immutable and Ir-reformable.

No new doctrine or public revelation:


The Church is of divine origin and is eternal!

Truth and the Church cannot be reformed! There is no error in God or his church! Jn 14:6 Jn 16:13

Christ revealed the truth and Christ teaches the truth to all men thru His church! Matt 28:19

Reformation?
Where does the Bible say have a reformation? “Bible only authority” therefore the so-called reforms had “no” authority!

What was reformed?
Truth and the church are of divine origin, they come from God and cannot be reformed!

Not even honest; nothing was reformed, they rejected the one true church Jn 10:16 founded and established by Christ on Peter matt 16:18 and the apostles matt 18:18 eph 2:20 His witnesses acts 1:8 lead into all truth Jn 16:13 and then teaching and sanctifying all men unto salvation. Matt 28:19 and started new ones when only Christ has authority Matt 28:18 to found the church. Matt 16:18


Where did Christ err in establishing the church
To accept the so-called “reformation” is to reject Christ and scripture Matt 16:18-19 shall not prevail
Is Christ powerless to defend his bride
And the purity of her doctrine

Church not dependent on scripture

The church was established before the New Testament scripture!

The church came first:
Existed first:
exercised authority and taught before there was a New Testament:
The church was taught by Christ in person for three years and wrote the New Testament!

Not a reformation but a revolt, protest, accusations and rebellion against Christ and His one true church!

Thanks

This is a big Post Don, and I would like to participate; but one point at a time please...

Reformation?
Where does the Bible say have a reformation? “Bible only authority” therefore the so-called reforms had “no” authority!

Can we talk about the Jerusalem Council to start? It is a Biblical example of Reformation, practically from the beginning. The Church wanted to include Circumcision into the Salvation of the Gentiles, but Saint Peter declared the Gentiles are Saved "as he was"; through Faith...

The primary example of Reformation in the Bible, sets the standard for the Church for All time; IE the Reduction of Justification through Faith Alone, every time the Church wants to expand the requirement to be Justified...

 

[CrowCross]

1 Timothy 4:1
Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;

Questioning the reformation:

Reformed truth? (theology)

Truth is divine! God is truth!

I am the way, the truth, and the life!
Jn 14:6

Truth is eternal, Unchangeable, immutable and Ir-reformable.

No new doctrine or public revelation:


The Church is of divine origin and is eternal!

Truth and the Church cannot be reformed! There is no error in God or his church! Jn 14:6 Jn 16:13

Christ revealed the truth and Christ teaches the truth to all men thru His church! Matt 28:19

Reformation?
Where does the Bible say have a reformation? “Bible only authority” therefore the so-called reforms had “no” authority!

What was reformed?
Truth and the church are of divine origin, they come from God and cannot be reformed!

Not even honest; nothing was reformed, they rejected the one true church Jn 10:16 founded and established by Christ on Peter matt 16:18 and the apostles matt 18:18 eph 2:20 His witnesses acts 1:8 lead into all truth Jn 16:13 and then teaching and sanctifying all men unto salvation. Matt 28:19 and started new ones when only Christ has authority Matt 28:18 to found the church. Matt 16:18


Where did Christ err in establishing the church
To accept the so-called “reformation” is to reject Christ and scripture Matt 16:18-19 shall not prevail
Is Christ powerless to defend his bride
And the purity of her doctrine

Church not dependent on scripture

The church was established before the New Testament scripture!

The church came first:
Existed first:
exercised authority and taught before there was a New Testament:
The church was taught by Christ in person for three years and wrote the New Testament!

Not a reformation but a revolt, protest, accusations and rebellion against Christ and His one true church!

Thanks

Doesn't the bible speak about false theology being around when the church was being formed?

 

[donadams]

This is a big Post Don, and I would like to participate; but one point at a time please...

Can we talk about the Jerusalem Council to start? It is a Biblical example of Reformation, practically from the beginning. The Church wanted to include Circumcision into the Salvation of the Gentiles, but Saint Peter declared the Gentiles are Saved "as he was"; through Faith...

The primary example of Reformation in the Bible, sets the standard for the Church for All time; IE the Reduction of Justification through Faith Alone, every time the Church wants to expand the requirement to be Justified...

Sure

No councils do not change the nature of the church much less reject the church and start new ones without any authority
Only apostles have authority none of the so-called reformers were apostles
Thanks

 

[donadams]

Doesn't the bible speak about false theology being around when the church was being formed?

There is always error but not taught by the church founded by Christ on Peter and the apostles Jn 8:32 Jn 16:13
Thanks

 

[jeremiah1five]

1 Timothy 4:1
Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;

Questioning the reformation:

Reformed truth? (theology)

Truth is divine! God is truth!

I am the way, the truth, and the life!
Jn 14:6

Truth is eternal, Unchangeable, immutable and Ir-reformable.

No new doctrine or public revelation:


The Church is of divine origin and is eternal!

Truth and the Church cannot be reformed! There is no error in God or his church! Jn 14:6 Jn 16:13

Christ revealed the truth and Christ teaches the truth to all men thru His church! Matt 28:19

Reformation?
Where does the Bible say have a reformation? “Bible only authority” therefore the so-called reforms had “no” authority!

What was reformed?
Truth and the church are of divine origin, they come from God and cannot be reformed!

Not even honest; nothing was reformed, they rejected the one true church Jn 10:16 founded and established by Christ on Peter matt 16:18 and the apostles matt 18:18 eph 2:20 His witnesses acts 1:8 lead into all truth Jn 16:13 and then teaching and sanctifying all men unto salvation. Matt 28:19 and started new ones when only Christ has authority Matt 28:18 to found the church. Matt 16:18


Where did Christ err in establishing the church
To accept the so-called “reformation” is to reject Christ and scripture Matt 16:18-19 shall not prevail
Is Christ powerless to defend his bride
And the purity of her doctrine

Church not dependent on scripture

The church was established before the New Testament scripture!

The church came first:
Existed first:
exercised authority and taught before there was a New Testament:
The church was taught by Christ in person for three years and wrote the New Testament!

Not a reformation but a revolt, protest, accusations and rebellion against Christ and His one true church!

Thanks

His one true church He died for is not in the Vatican. That false church is going to have a lot to answer for on the last day.

 

[jeremiah1five]

There is always error but not taught by the church founded by Christ on Peter and the apostles Jn 8:32 Jn 16:13
Thanks

The True Church is founded on Christ Sola.

 

[CrowCross]

There is always error but not taught by the church founded by Christ on Peter and the apostles Jn 8:32 Jn 16:13
Thanks

Can you give me an example of a church that doesn't have error in its doctrine?

 

[jeremiah1five]

Sure

No councils do not change the nature of the church much less reject the church and start new ones without any authority
Only apostles have authority none of the so-called reformers were apostles
Thanks

How do you know? There were over 2000 Reformers who were chased out of England in 1662 called the Great Ejection.
Rome uprooted over 2000 Christians at that time. What a great shame.

 

[ReverendRV]

Sure

No councils do not change the nature of the church much less reject the church and start new ones without any authority
Only apostles have authority none of the so-called reformers were apostles
Thanks

Thanks for responding. But if you don't Mind, I want to talk about the Jerusalem Council; not the Reformers. I agree that only an Apostle has the Authority in the matters of the Church; consider this our first agreement. Our second agreement is that Saint Peter was an Apostle. Shouldn't our third agreement be, that the Apostle Peter established the Church's Doctrine of Salvation as a Double Imperative?

You can. see why I like to keep to one point at a time...

I'll be gone for a while, going to the doctor..

 

[donadams]

His one true church He died for is not in the Vatican. That false church is going to have a lot to answer for on the last day.

The Vatican is a country a city state
St. Peter’s is a basilica where Peter died and is buried
The church is found in the presence of her faithful bishops

 

[ReverendRV]

Thanks for responding. But if you don't Mind, I want to talk about the Jerusalem Council; not the Reformers. I agree that only an Apostle has the Authority in the matters of the Church; consider this our first agreement. Our second agreement is that Saint Peter was an Apostle. Shouldn't our third agreement be, that the Apostle Peter established the Church's Doctrine of Salvation as a Double Imperative?

You can. see why I like to keep to one point at a time...

I'll be gone for a while, going to the doctor..

Judaizers ~ by ReverendRV * June 13

Acts 15:5 NIV; Then some of the believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees stood up and said, “The Gentiles must be circumcised and required to keep the law of Moses.”

The Law of Moses is near the heart of the Christian Faith. John Gill said the Torah is the Law; the first five books in the Old Testament. Reading it was accomplished by dividing those books into portions, which in turn, were read through the year; otherwise it would take all day Saturday to read the whole Law. The Ten Commandments are found in these books; and they also give hundreds of other Ordinances, which are also called the Law. One of these Ordinances was that of Circumcision. ~ Some of the members of the newborn Church came from a sect of Jews who were infamous for believing that the Law of Moses had to be kept, in order for anyone to be a Christian. History would go on to call these types of people Judaizers; those who believe you’re not a child of God if you do not keep God’s Laws. ~ This is known as a Works Righteousness…

Saint Paul was sent from the Church in Jerusalem, to the Gentiles. He believed exactly the same as the Church’s leaders; the Law of God was important to him too. Paul taught the Gentiles that the Law says we are not to make carved images of what we think God is like. This was making a God to suit ourselves; it is Idolatry. This also breaks the first Commandment, which is to have no other gods before the LORD; how could Idolatry not break it? The Christian Pharisees worshiped a god that suited themselves; one who expects God’s children to keep the Law of Moses. They believed this before they joined the Church, and after they joined; both perspectives are Sinful. The Bible says that the Law was meant to show us we are Sinners. If a Law could Save, no other way would have been sought; God's Laws are called killing letters. Have you Idolized anyone? Jesus said that in the Bible, men are called gods; you are Idolizing a god and the letter of this Law of Moses has killed you! The wages of Sin is death; an eternal death in the Lake of Fire…

The Judaizers had to be found out; their influence was the cause of the first convening in history of a Church Council; the Council of Jerusalem. Saint Peter advised those who were gathered, of the Council’s conclusion. “Brothers, you know God made a choice among you that the Gentiles might hear from me the message of the Gospel and believe. God, who knows the heart, showed that he accepted them by giving them the Holy Spirit, just as he did to us. He didn’t discriminate between us and them, for he purified their hearts by faith. Why do you test God by putting on the necks of Gentiles, a yoke that neither we nor our ancestors have been able to bear? No! We believe it is through the Grace of our Lord Jesus that we are Saved, just as they are.” ~ Peter says that if you will put your Faith in the risen LORD and Savior Jesus Christ, you will be Saved from Sin and Hell by Grace; just as he was! If you ever try to Work your way into Heaven, or if you are a ‘Judaizing Pharisee’ in the Church; you are testing God! Repent of your Sins; follow Jesus Christ…

Matthew 4:7 NIV; Jesus answered him, "It is also written: 'Do not put the Lord your God to the test.'"

 

[jeremiah1five]

The Vatican is a country a city state
St. Peter’s is a basilica where Peter died and is buried
The church is found in the presence of her faithful bishops

That’s not Peter in that tomb just as the shroud of Turin is not the actual burial cloth of Christ.

 

[donadams]

The True Church is founded on Christ Sola.

How can Christ found the church on christ
Why do you suppose that Peter is mentioned?
Why say Peter is blessed?
Why change Peter’s name?
Thanks

 

[jeremiah1five]

How can Christ found the church on christ
Why do you suppose that Peter is mentioned?
Why say Peter is blessed?
Why change Peter’s name?
Thanks

The True Church is founded on Christ alone.
Not Peter.
All Christians are blessed.
Change Peter’s name to Herbert.
Christ was saying thou art Peter “little stone” to differentiate between little stone and Christ the Rock.

 

[donadams]

Can you give me an example of a church that doesn't have error in its doctrine?

There is only one church!

Christ founded the church for the salvation of all men! (Jn 1:16-17) Christ is the truth! (Jn 14:6) Christ and his church are one!
(Acts 9;4 eph 5:32)
The church is the pillar of truth
(1 Tim 3:15) that must teach all men (Matt 28:19) without error guided by the Holy Spirit
(Jn 16:13) Thru the grace of God in the sanctification of souls applied in the seven sacraments!

Christ and His church are one! Acts 9:4 eph 5:32

Matt 28:19 teach and sanctify all men unto salvation

Lk 10:16 if the church teaches error then christ is guilty of teaching error!
Jn 14:6 Jesus is the truth!

What hath light to do with darkness?

Christ and His church are truth and the light of the world!
Thanks

 

[donadams]

That’s not Peter in that tomb just as the shroud of Turin is not the actual burial cloth of Christ.

Where does the Bible say this?

 

[CrowCross]

There is only one church!

Christ founded the church for the salvation of all men! (Jn 1:16-17) Christ is the truth! (Jn 14:6) Christ and his church are one!
(Acts 9;4 eph 5:32)
The church is the pillar of truth
(1 Tim 3:15) that must teach all men (Matt 28:19) without error guided by the Holy Spirit
(Jn 16:13) Thru the grace of God in the sanctification of souls applied in the seven sacraments!

Christ and His church are one! Acts 9:4 eph 5:32

Matt 28:19 teach and sanctify all men unto salvation

Lk 10:16 if the church teaches error then christ is guilty of teaching error!
Jn 14:6 Jesus is the truth!

What hath light to do with darkness?

Christ and His church are truth and the light of the world!
Thanks

Did you ever read the opening chapters of the book of Revelations? There's seven church's....I believe all had a problem but one.

Now let me ask you again, can you give an example if a church that doesn't have error in its doctrine? I know it's not the Baptist or the Roman Catholic Church.

 

[jeremiah1five]

Changing a name indicates an office
Notice even Judas had an office
Part of the ministry acts 1:15-20

Peter was little stone.
Christ is the Rock.
The Church of Christ is founded on Christ and is a continuation of the Abrahamic Covenant.
[edit by mod - off-topic digression]

 

[ReverendRV]

Thanks for responding. But if you don't Mind, I want to talk about the Jerusalem Council; not the Reformers. I agree that only an Apostle has the Authority in the matters of the Church; consider this our first agreement. Our second agreement is that Saint Peter was an Apostle. Shouldn't our third agreement be, that the Apostle Peter established the Church's Doctrine of Salvation as a Double Imperative?

You can. see why I like to keep to one point at a time...

I'll be gone for a while, going to the doctor..

[edit by Mod]

Would you care to pick up where we left off?