Perfect is perfect in Scripture, so be ye perfect

[HIM]

Perfect work, perfect gift, perfect law, perfect man.

Jas 1:4 But let patience have her perfect work, that ye may be perfect and entire, wanting nothing.
Jas 1:17 Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning.
Jas 1:25 But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed.
Jas 3:2 For in many things we offend all. If any man offend not in word, the same is a perfect man, and able also to bridle the whole body.

 

[makesends]

Perfect work, perfect gift, perfect law, perfect man.

Jas 1:4 But let patience have her perfect work, that ye may be perfect and entire, wanting nothing.
Jas 1:17 Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning.
Jas 1:25 But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed.
Jas 3:2 For in many things we offend all. If any man offend not in word, the same is a perfect man, and able also to bridle the whole body.

Does "perfect" here, mean "complete", or, "without fault"?

 

[ChristB4us]

Perfect work, perfect gift, perfect law, perfect man.

Jas 1:4 But let patience have her perfect work, that ye may be perfect and entire, wanting nothing.
Jas 1:17 Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning.
Jas 1:25 But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed.
Jas 3:2 For in many things we offend all. If any man offend not in word, the same is a perfect man, and able also to bridle the whole body.

And

Does "perfect" here, mean "complete", or, "without fault"?

Hebrews 6:1 Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; .....

1 Corinthians 15:33 Be not deceived: evil communications corrupt good manners. 34 Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame.

Ephesians 4:29 Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth, but that which is good to the use of edifying, that it may minister grace unto the hearers. 30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

Hebrews 12:1Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us, 2 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

Philippians 3:12 Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus. 13 Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before, 14 I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus. 15 Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you. 16 Nevertheless, whereto we have already attained, let us walk by the same rule, let us mind the same thing. 17 Brethren, be followers together of me, and mark them which walk so as ye have us for an ensample. 18 (For many walk, of whom I have told you often, and now tell you even weeping, that they are the enemies of the cross of Christ: 19 Whose end is destruction, whose God is their belly, and whose glory is in their shame, who mind earthly things.) 20 For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ: 21 Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself.

 

[HIM]

And


Hebrews 6:1 Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; .....

1 Corinthians 15:33 Be not deceived: evil communications corrupt good manners. 34 Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak this to your shame.

Ephesians 4:29 Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth, but that which is good to the use of edifying, that it may minister grace unto the hearers. 30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

Hebrews 12:1Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us, 2 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

Philippians 3:12 Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus. 13 Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before, 14 I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus. 15 Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you. 16 Nevertheless, whereto we have already attained, let us walk by the same rule, let us mind the same thing. 17 Brethren, be followers together of me, and mark them which walk so as ye have us for an ensample. 18 (For many walk, of whom I have told you often, and now tell you even weeping, that they are the enemies of the cross of Christ: 19 Whose end is destruction, whose God is their belly, and whose glory is in their shame, who mind earthly things.) 20 For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ: 21 Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself.

Nice. Philippians Shows us that Paul followed after perfection that he might apprehend it. This tells us he had the faith that it was achievable. Then states in humility that we who strive or in this state to be in the same mine that he is in. One of humility in Christ Jesus.

 

[HIM]

Does "perfect" here, mean "complete", or, "without fault"?

Is there a difference. And is that difference subjective.
But in respect to the thread if we look at the verses shared with the common word in the same letter, what does that tell us?

 

[ReverendRV]

Does "perfect" here, mean "complete", or, "without fault"?

Perfection ~ by ReverendRV * August 8

Hebrews 5:9 KJV; And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;

Even though Jesus was God's Son, he learned obedience from the things he suffered. This is something that is pretty hard to swallow; unless you consider this as speaking of Christ’s Humanity. You ask, “Why would a perfect man need to be made perfect??” Your question is bogged down with a Presupposition; when the Bible says that he needed to be made Perfect, why would you say he was already Perfect? ~ I know someone who is troubled by a relative who comes to their house and always judges how clean it is. This relative is the type who spring-cleans their home daily. The judging is harsh, but the truth of the matter is that the house is cleaned ‘Good’; although it may not be ‘Perfect’. I told this person not to worry, even ‘Good’ was good enough for God; let me explain. ~ When God created the world he saw that it was ‘Good’. We have a tendency to define this as ‘Perfect’ because there was no Sin in the world; yet. Just like Jesus, the first Man Adam needed to be Perfected. Keeping the Law of God comes with a Promise; ‘it will be our Righteousness’. But the problem is that only Adam and Jesus could be made Perfect by God’s Law; It makes us Imperfect…

These two men were brought forth Sinless and are the only two people that God chose to be Federal Heads for Humanity; you are either with one or the other. Since everyone else is born in Adam’s jurisdiction, the Law of God cannot help you at all. Have you ever told a Lie? What do you call someone that tells Lies? Not so Perfect; are you? Have you ever Stolen anything? What do you call someone who Steals? Have you ever used God as a filthy cuss word? Just how many of the Ten Commandments can we break and still be Good; no less still be Perfect?? These are only a few of the Ten; if God judged you by them would you be guilty or innocent? God sends guilty Sinners to Hell forever. ~ You object, “You said earlier that ‘Good’ is good enough for God?!” This is true for someone who is like Switzerland and Neutral; but you are not an Unfallen Adam or a Jesus Christ…

You need to be made Perfect, there is still time! Adam ate the apple and broke the Law of God, becoming imperfect. But Jesus kept the Ten Commandments and this made him Perfect. As God, he Loves the world so much that he shares his Perfect Record with all who will believe in him as their LORD and Savior. Jesus died on a Cross, was buried for three days but rose from the dead; you can’t keep a Perfect Man down! We are Saved by the Grace of God through Faith in Christ our Lord, without our trying to Perfect ourselves. If we try to earn perfection, then Grace is no longer Grace. ~ Find a Church and start reading the Bible; Repent of your Sins and Confess Jesus as Lord. Though God sees the Church as Perfect because of his Perfect Son, we will not be Perfected until he returns to Judge the world. He has left us his Perfect Holy Spirit and the Perfect Bible, to help us along the Way…

Psalm 18:13 NIV; As for God, his way is perfect: The LORD's word is flawless; he shields all who take refuge in him.

 

[ChristB4us]

Perfection ~ by ReverendRV * August 8

Hebrews 5:9 KJV; And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;

Even though Jesus was God's Son, he learned obedience from the things he suffered. This is something that is pretty hard to swallow; unless you consider this as speaking of Christ’s Humanity. You ask, “Why would a perfect man need to be made perfect??” Your question is bogged down with a Presupposition; when the Bible says that he needed to be made Perfect, why would you say he was already Perfect? ~ I know someone who is troubled by a relative who comes to their house and always judges how clean it is. This relative is the type who spring-cleans their home daily. The judging is harsh, but the truth of the matter is that the house is cleaned ‘Good’; although it may not be ‘Perfect’. I told this person not to worry, even ‘Good’ was good enough for God; let me explain. ~ When God created the world he saw that it was ‘Good’. We have a tendency to define this as ‘Perfect’ because there was no Sin in the world; yet. Just like Jesus, the first Man Adam needed to be Perfected. Keeping the Law of God comes with a Promise; ‘it will be our Righteousness’. But the problem is that only Adam and Jesus could be made Perfect by God’s Law; It makes us Imperfect…

@makesends

Jesus coming as the prophesied Son of Man had fears that He was suffering from about going ahead in being crucified for the sins of the world, knowing the full ramifications that would entail.

Hebrews 5:6 As he saith also in another place, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec. 7 Who in the days of his flesh, when he had offered up prayers and supplications with strong crying and tears unto him that was able to save him from death, and was heard in that he feared; 8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; 9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;

How do we obey Him? How do we do any work of God? By believing Him that He will do that work of God for us.

John 6:28 Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God? 29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent. Jesus set the example for how we are to suffer as He did as we can turn to Him for help to go through our sufferings.

Hebrews 2:18 For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.

Hebrews 4:12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. 13 Neither is there any creature that is not manifest in his sight: but all things are naked and opened unto the eyes of him with whom we have to do. 14 Seeing then that we have a great high priest, that is passed into the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our profession. 15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin. 16 Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need.
And so He will finish His work in us to His glory as we trust Him to perfect that which concerns us.

Philippians 1:6 Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:...11 Being filled with the fruits of righteousness, which are by Jesus Christ, unto the glory and praise of God.

Psalm 138:7 Though I walk in the midst of trouble, thou wilt revive me: thou shalt stretch forth thine hand against the wrath of mine enemies, and thy right hand shall save me. 8 The Lord will perfect that which concerneth me: thy mercy, O Lord, endureth for ever: forsake not the works of thine own hands.

So in that He was perfected by facing His fears and going through that suffering by obedience is how we can lean on Him for that same kind of perfection but by our faith in Him to help us to do that.

These two men were brought forth Sinless and are the only two people that God chose to be Federal Heads for Humanity; you are either with one or the other. Since everyone else is born in Adam’s jurisdiction, the Law of God cannot help you at all. Have you ever told a Lie? What do you call someone that tells Lies? Not so Perfect; are you? Have you ever Stolen anything? What do you call someone who Steals? Have you ever used God as a filthy cuss word? Just how many of the Ten Commandments can we break and still be Good; no less still be Perfect?? These are only a few of the Ten; if God judged you by them would you be guilty or innocent? God sends guilty Sinners to Hell forever. ~ You object, “You said earlier that ‘Good’ is good enough for God?!” This is true for someone who is like Switzerland and Neutral; but you are not an Unfallen Adam or a Jesus Christ…

Matthew 19:16 And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life? 17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

I believe Jesus was lifting that inquirer's sight higher as he was approaching Him as if He was an exceptionally good man.

You need to be made Perfect, there is still time! Adam ate the apple and broke the Law of God, becoming imperfect. But Jesus kept the Ten Commandments and this made him Perfect. As God, he Loves the world so much that he shares his Perfect Record with all who will believe in him as their LORD and Savior. Jesus died on a Cross, was buried for three days but rose from the dead; you can’t keep a Perfect Man down! We are Saved by the Grace of God through Faith in Christ our Lord, without our trying to Perfect ourselves. If we try to earn perfection, then Grace is no longer Grace. ~ Find a Church and start reading the Bible; Repent of your Sins and Confess Jesus as Lord. Though God sees the Church as Perfect because of his Perfect Son, we will not be Perfected until he returns to Judge the world. He has left us his Perfect Holy Spirit and the Perfect Bible, to help us along the Way…

Psalm 18:13 NIV; As for God, his way is perfect: The LORD's word is flawless; he shields all who take refuge in him.

And when we are suffering, we can take refuge in the Lord in making us perfect through our trials.

 

[makesends]

Nice. Philippians Shows us that Paul followed after perfection that he might apprehend it. This tells us he had the faith that it was achievable. Then states in humility that we who strive or in this state to be in the same mine that he is in. One of humility in Christ Jesus.

It may be relevant that the Greek often denotes "maturity" or "completion" rather than "absolute purity (faithfulness, etc)".

 

[HIM]

It may be relevant that the Greek often denotes "maturity" or "completion" rather than "absolute purity (faithfulness, etc)".

You would need to prove that. But then again the context in James is the subject.

 

[Arial]

It may be relevant that the Greek often denotes "maturity" or "completion" rather than "absolute purity (faithfulness, etc)".

Perfect means perfectly righteous in the context of the OP as I understand it.

That is impossible for even a redeemed person who still has their fallen nature to obtain. It is already flawed.

It is Christ's perfect righteousness counted as our own because we have been placed in Him by grace through faith. It is His perfect righteousness that is imputed to us by His having paid the just penalty for our sins, that provides the assurance "There is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus."

What follows our being placed in Christ, and having this imputed righteousness is continuous sanctification by the Holy Spirit which will not be complete as to our actual perfection in righteousness this side of the consummation, when our old nature is put to death.

The book of James is primarily wisdom literature and addresses what this looks like and how to apply it to our lives.

 

[makesends]

@makesends

Jesus coming as the prophesied Son of Man had fears that He was suffering from about going ahead in being crucified for the sins of the world, knowing the full ramifications that would entail.

Hebrews 5:6 As he saith also in another place, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec. 7 Who in the days of his flesh, when he had offered up prayers and supplications with strong crying and tears unto him that was able to save him from death, and was heard in that he feared; 8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; 9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;

How do we obey Him? How do we do any work of God? By believing Him that He will do that work of God for us.

John 6:28 Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God? 29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent. Jesus set the example for how we are to suffer as He did as we can turn to Him for help to go through our sufferings.

Hebrews 2:18 For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.

Hebrews 4:12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. 13 Neither is there any creature that is not manifest in his sight: but all things are naked and opened unto the eyes of him with whom we have to do. 14 Seeing then that we have a great high priest, that is passed into the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our profession. 15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin. 16 Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need.
And so He will finish His work in us to His glory as we trust Him to perfect that which concerns us.

Philippians 1:6 Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:...11 Being filled with the fruits of righteousness, which are by Jesus Christ, unto the glory and praise of God.

Psalm 138:7 Though I walk in the midst of trouble, thou wilt revive me: thou shalt stretch forth thine hand against the wrath of mine enemies, and thy right hand shall save me. 8 The Lord will perfect that which concerneth me: thy mercy, O Lord, endureth for ever: forsake not the works of thine own hands.

So in that He was perfected by facing His fears and going through that suffering by obedience is how we can lean on Him for that same kind of perfection but by our faith in Him to help us to do that.

Matthew 19:16 And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life? 17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

I believe Jesus was lifting that inquirer's sight higher as he was approaching Him as if He was an exceptionally good man.

And when we are suffering, we can take refuge in the Lord in making us perfect through our trials.

You went to some trouble to write here, apparently for my sake, since you referenced my handle. But I don't know what you are trying to say, or at least, what you are trying to say that should set me straight.

 

[ChristB4us]

You went to some trouble to write here, apparently for my sake, since you referenced my handle. But I don't know what you are trying to say, or at least, what you are trying to say that should set me straight.

@ReverendRV has replied to you for why I was adding you to my reply to him in your exchanges with each other for his response to your inquiry.

Does "perfect" here, mean "complete", or, "without fault"?

Anyway, that was the reason for tagging you with my reply to him thinking you may be interested in regards to your inquiry.

 

[HIM]

Perfect means perfectly righteous in the context of the OP as I understand it.

That is impossible for even a redeemed person who still has their fallen nature to obtain. It is already flawed.

What is not of faith is of sin. Shall we continue in sin that grace abound? No, in no way! How shall we who are dead to sin live any longer there in? For We are dead but we live. Yet not us but Christ lives in us. And the life we now live we live by the faith of the Son of God. For We that have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ. Us in Him, He in us that the world might believe. It is He that works in us both to will and do His good pleasure. We are a new creature. Begotten by the word of truth.. Behold old things have passed away and all things are new and of God. We are all one in Christ. Not us but Christ

It is Christ's perfect righteousness counted as our own because we have been placed in Him by grace through faith. It is His perfect righteousness that is imputed to us by His having paid the just penalty for our sins, that provides the assurance "There is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus."

Who walk after the spirit and not after the flesh. For the spirit of life has set us free from the law of sin and death. That the righteousness of the law be fulfilled in us who walk after the spirit and not after the flesh.

What follows our being placed in Christ, and having this imputed righteousness is continuous sanctification by the Holy Spirit which will not be complete as to our actual perfection in righteousness this side of the consummation, when our old nature is put to death.

Little children be not deceived he that does righteousness is righteous, EVEN As He is righteous

 

[makesends]

Perfect means perfectly righteous in the context of the OP as I understand it.

That is impossible for even a redeemed person who still has their fallen nature to obtain. It is already flawed.

It is Christ's perfect righteousness counted as our own because we have been placed in Him by grace through faith. It is His perfect righteousness that is imputed to us by His having paid the just penalty for our sins, that provides the assurance "There is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus."

What follows our being placed in Christ, and having this imputed righteousness is continuous sanctification by the Holy Spirit which will not be complete as to our actual perfection in righteousness this side of the consummation, when our old nature is put to death.

The book of James is primarily wisdom literature and addresses what this looks like and how to apply it to our lives.

Agreed, except perhaps the last sentence. Not so sure about that, though it is a consideration.

 

[makesends]

@ReverendRV has replied to you for why I was adding you to my reply to him in your exchanges with each other for his response to your inquiry.


Anyway, that was the reason for tagging you with my reply to him thinking you may be interested in regards to your inquiry.

Ok, thanks