No person can come to Christ by their own freewill !

[Foghorn]

@brightfame52
No person can come to Christ by their own free will!

If that is the case, how does anyone come? Are we all forced? Do we come against our will?

 

[brightfame52]

@Foghorn

If that is the case, how does anyone come?

Jn 6:44,65

44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

65 And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.

 

[Eleanor]

God is neither asking nor commanding the impossible.

He is presenting the remedy for the condemned state of mankind, which remedy is accessible only to those with the gift of saving faith.

I noted that you posted no verse in support of the third part.
Let me ask the obvious question … are there “those” to whom the remedy was NEVER “accessible”?
(Which makes God responsible for their reprobation, does it not?)

In justice God owes nothing to his recalitrant (Eph 2:1) enemies (Ro 5:10).
Adam is responsible for our fallen condemned nature and reprobation, just as mama snake is responsible for baby snake's poisonousness and its rattlers.
Forgiveness for Adam's fallen nature is owed to no one, just as forgiveness for the poisonous snake's bite is owed to no one.
Forgiveness being owed to no one, God is not unjust in not forgiving anyone, or in forgiving only some.

This is not an “unthinkable” possibility and I would never whine “God is not fair!”, however, before I accept such a statement as “salvation was never accessible to some” (because God withheld the gift) then I would be more comfortable with some SCRIPTURE that stated that.

Salvation is only by faith (Eph 2:8-9).
Faith is a gift of the Holy Spirit (Php 1:29, 2 Pe 1:1, Ac 13:48, 18:27, Ro 12:3), a disposition toward God.
Those without the Spirit do not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him and he cannot understand them.
The gift of faith is not given to all.

 

[Carbon]

@Foghorn



Jn 6:44,65

44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

65 And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.

Well, if it is given by the Father, we can freely come to Christ, right?

 

[brightfame52]

Well, if it is given by the Father, we can freely come to Christ, right?

As new spiritually alive saved persons, well yeah. In case you dont realize it, Jn 6:44 is speaking about men by nature. The saved can freely come because they have been set free from spiritual death and sins dominion. Not so with the natural man.

 

[Foghorn]

As new spiritually alive saved persons, well yeah.

Well, there you go. So you do believe a man can come to Christ by their own free will once their will has been freed because they are made alive.

 

[Carbon]

As new spiritually alive saved persons, well yeah.

I'm glad you agree.

In case you dont realize it, Jn 6:44 is speaking about men by nature. The saved can freely come because they have been set free from spiritual death and sins dominion. Not so with the natural man.

I realize that, but thanks.

 

[brightfame52]

Well, there you go. So you do believe a man can come to Christ by their own free will once their will has been freed because they are made alive.

Yes because they have been given a new Heart which means a new will as well, one that desires the spiritual things of God now.

 

[brightfame52]

I'm glad you agree.

I realize that, but thanks.

okay