Matthew 6:14-15?

[Arial]

... is there a degree of forgiving? For example, I might basically get over a guy slapping my 4 year old but not to the degree that I let that guy babysit my kid ... ... I don't know

... my thesis bothers me

We are also called to wisdom, which comes from God. You can forgive the guy for slapping your child but it would not be wise to let him babysit him. The fact that you won't let him babysit does not mean you did not forgive.

 

[fastfredy0]

I cannot see myself offering a drink of water to a dying man who had raped murdered my daughter. I can see myself saying "Here, let me put you out of your misery." and putting a bullet through his heart.

 

[Mr GLee]

I don't think that follows. The Scripture being used is Matt 6:14-15 which follows the Lord's Prayer, and in truth, is pulled out of its context, which actually begins in chapter 5. Jesus is teaching His disciples principles in the Law and exposing hypocrisy in those entrusted with the Law. Matt 5:19-20 Therefore whoever relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever does them and teaches them will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. For I tell you, unless your righteousness exceeds that of the scribes and Pharisees, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven.

Then Jesus continues His teaching on righteousness (for that is what He is teaching) dealing with Anger, Retaliation, Love Your Enemies. And it is here I think we find the beginning of the solution to the paradox of 6:14-15.

I would offer the context seems to be two different teaching authorities as in no man can serve two good teaching master as one unseen Lord. The Lord declaring he came to establish sola scriptura (Law and the prophets) . they destroyed it with thier orals traditons of dying mankind. Teaching man looks on the outside. . . God looks on the heart of the matter . . . the unseen things of God.

They were buying and selling time off in purgatory to make thier sufferings lighter with indulgences .buying forgiveness

Mathew 6:17-20 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophetssola scriptura) I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

What is called righteousness of theirs own could never be greater than the righteousness of Christ unseen power

Believers will not be found with a righteousness of thier own self,

 

[fastfredy0]

You can forgive the guy for slapping your child but it would not be wise to let him babysit him. The fact that you won't let him babysit does not mean you did not forgive.

I don't know about the example not showing that I did not totally forgive. That being said, I agreed and wisdom should conquer forgiveness in this scenario. LOL I was just trying to explore what "forgiveness" might entail.
I'm still laughing about you putting a "bullet through his heart".

 

[Josheb]

Matthew 6:14 For if you forgive others their trespasses [their reckless and willful sins], your heavenly Father will also forgive you. 15 But if you do not forgive others [nurturing your hurt and anger with the result that it interferes with your relationship with God], then your Father will not forgive your trespasses. AMP

The Amplified Bible has not amplified well. Not forgiving others - from the biblical sense - has nothing to do with nurturing or not nurturing hurt. The word "aphete" simply means "send away," or "release." What's being sent away or released? Others' Greek here is trespasses, or false steps, or falling away. Send away another's falling away. Release their false steps.

It is very behavioral, not emotional, and not volitional.

Does that mean forgiveness or sending away trespasses should not be done with hope, goodwill, love, or done willingly, reluctantly, resentfully? No. It simply means that this verse is saying something fairly specific.

Premise 1: If God does not forgive you then you're going to hell (as you have sin that has not been imputed to Christ)

God has already forgiven us. In Matthew 6:14 Jesus was speaking at a time when there was no forgiveness for sins. That task had not then been accomplished. We now live in a world where every sin ever committed has been paid for and, therefore, discharged, ...........for those who believe and receive.

Premise 2: If you do not forgive someone then God will not forgive you (v.15)

As I alluded to previously, I'm inclined read that premise in the context of a Spirit indwelt and Spirit led life, not as a work of sinful flesh. Furthermore, relying on one half of a verse in neglect of all else that scripture says on a matter is not sound. God may well forgive and not forgive based on many conditions and I do not see the condition of His Son's shed blood being subordinate to or dependent upon the created saved or unsaved.

Premise 3: You are judged according to your relationship with God at the point of time that you die

Everyone dies with unrepentant sin and unforgiven sin on their ledger. Forgiveness would qualify as a work, and no one is saved by works. It's helpful to remember all the OT sacrifice rituals foreshadowed the sacrifice of God's anointed one. That would include the sacrifice for the unknown sin(s) and the scapegoat sacrifice for the community's sins.

They are ALL covered.

Conclusion: You are going to hell if you die and have not forgiven someone

You maybe, but not me . I'm already a member of God's holy (separate and sacred) nation, a royal priest in His kingdom serving in His temple.

To make matters more complex
Premise 1: We are not saved by works (many verses)

Yep. Prior premises 1-3 should/must be understood accordingly.

Conclusion: Assuming the above is true is seems that one must do the work of "forgiving other" in order to be saved which contradicts premise 1.

How about we modify that to say, "One (those among the already-saved) will do the work of forgiving others and thereby evidence their salvation"? and the corollary being those who do not forgive and are not forgiving either lack a certain maturity to their salvation or perhaps are not saved.

 

[makesends]

I always value you insights. You and @atpollard are my favorite posters.


maybe

• Mark 11:25 Whenever you stand praying, if you have anything against anyone, forgive him [drop the issue, let it go], so that your Father who is in heaven will also forgive you your transgressions and wrongdoings [against Him and others].
• Matt 6:12 And forgive us our debts, as we also have forgiven our debtors.
• Luke 6:23 “Judge not, and you will not be judged; condemn not, and you will not be condemned; forgive, and you will be forgiven;
• Matt 18:32 Then his master summoned him and said to him, ‘You wicked servant! I forgave you all that debt because you pleaded with me. 33 And should not you have had mercy on your fellow servant, as I had mercy on you?’ 34 And in anger his master delivered him to the jailers,[e] until he should pay all his debt. 35 So also my heavenly Father will do to every one of you, if you do not forgive your brother from your heart.”

There seems to several other verses saying the same thing. Are they also "out of context"?


Agreed ... it is based on what God does and if by the leading of the Holy Spirit He does not grant us the ability to forgive, could that not be a sign we are not one of His sheep for from the verses listed above He apparently does not forgive those who do not forgive others and per my premises: one that is not forgiven does not enter heaven.


hmmm ... maybe ... I'm not sure I understand the statement


... is there a degree of forgiving? For example, I might basically get over a guy slapping my 4 year old but not to the degree that I let that guy babysit my kid ... ... I don't know

... my thesis bothers me

Thx for your input

​

Sorry. I guess I wasn't clear. To my mind, at least, the quandary as presented does not stand by itself as quite a valid presentation —there is an awful lot more to the matter than just that.

By context, I meant no criticism, but just to point out that the rest of scripture must agree with any one part, and should be brought to bear to understanding any difficult part. Calvinism's/Reformer's rough perspectives already change the way you presented it, as though the verse really does present some valid temporal incongruity. We know that from God's POV there is no temporal incongruity, so begin there. Scripture (the context) shows God's point of view.

Many places in scripture, as I said, sound somewhat the same: For example, "Everyone who has been born of God does not sin, because his seed remains in him; he is not able to sin, because he has been born of God." (1 John 3:9) These things are not difficult to justify —specially when the Greek tense has to do with continuing action, and when the context, (in this case the immediate context 1 John 1:8 and 10) says, "8 If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we claim we have not sinned, we make him out to be a liar and his word is not in us." Another version renders 1 John 3:9 quite nicely: "No one who has God as his Father keeps on sinning, because the seed planted by God remains in him. That is, he cannot continue sinning, because he has God as his Father."

If these other places have such an easy escape from the human surface reading —and the temporal human viewpoint, instead of looking at it from the POV of God causing all things— we already know that if God has chosen someone, they will not fail to be his, and they will display evidences of it? They are the forgiving sort.

And like in those other places, this question is judged by God, and not according even to conscience of the person considering the question. God may well be dealing with that son of God by convicting him, but if he belongs to God, he is the forgiving sort.

And, not that you don't know this, too, but "the forgiving sort" is not by comparison to anyone else, but to God, which is an impossible reach! —thus, once again, we have to rely on God's mercy.


A small note: There is a tendency I've noticed in Christendom, ever since I first heard the notion that if one forgives, one must forget, "just like God", to pretend that when someone forgives someone else, let's say, for lashing out in anger, that they must forget that other person is a habitually angry person. —Well, not quite: The burned child may forgive the fire for burning him, but he won't soon forget that the fire is hot. God is not fooled either.

 

[fastfredy0]

Scripture (the context) shows God's point of view.

Agreed, though God can only dumb things dumb so far such that we might have a clue what He's talking about.

And, not that you don't know this, too, but "the forgiving sort" is not by comparison to anyone else, but to God, which is an impossible reach! —thus, once again, we have to rely on God's mercy.

Another interesting point; though the statement says we can't totally understand God as we are so far below His level so to some degree we are always confused.

Thanks for your commentary. You write at such an elevated (intelligent) level.. it makes me want to say, "I'm not sure on the subject but because Makesends says "X" it is probably correct."

 

[Arial]

I don't know about the example not showing that I did not totally forgive. That being said, I agreed and wisdom should conquer forgiveness in this scenario. LOL I was just trying to explore what "forgiveness" might entail.
I'm still laughing about you putting a "bullet through his heart".

I didn't mean to imply that is what you were saying. I was just making a comment because I have come across people who can't separate the two.

If you thought the bullet thing was funny, you should see me on forums where discussion was about was it Christian to use violence to protect ourselves, families, others!

 

[fastfredy0]

If you thought the bullet thing was funny, you should see me on forums where discussion was about was it Christian to use violence to protect ourselves, families, others!

I'm probably on your side when it comes to such things. I'd up capital punishment by a factor of 1000 for instance. (1000 being wild guess). hmmm, another slant regarding "not forgiving people" being acceptable as God is for capital punishment IMO.

 

[Arial]

I would offer the context seems to be two different teaching authorities as in no man can serve two good teaching master as one unseen Lord. The Lord declaring he came to establish sola scriptura (Law and the prophets) . they destroyed it with thier orals traditons of dying mankind. Teaching man looks on the outside. . . God looks on the heart of the matter . . . the unseen things of God.

They were buying and selling time off in purgatory to make thier sufferings lighter with indulgences .buying forgiveness

Mathew 6:17-20 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophetssola scriptura) I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

What is called righteousness of theirs own could never be greater than the righteousness of Christ unseen power

Believers will not be found with a righteousness of thier own self,

I started going through the Psalms again today. I try to read them from the viewpoint of the writer, particularly in the Psalms of David who truly knew God, with a trust in Him so strong I pray at times to know God as David did. And it is there that I too learn who He is. They require pondering and in the light of the NT.

In the very first verse of Psalm 4, David says a curious thing, something often overlooked as to what David is actually saying, that I think is applicable to this OP, though it has been touched on in the responses. What is curious about it is that David knew something about God long before the advent of Christ, that we learn after it.

"Answer me when I call, O God of my righteousness!" I took a bit to think about exactly what David was saying and what He knew about God. And I confess, I can only glimpse it and not fully grasp it, but that glimpse is enough to take my breath away. To say that Christ's righteousness is imputed to us is common knowledge in traditional Christianity. And that is wonderful. But pondering this scripture drove the point even deeper in its application. God is righteous and righteousness. Unless He gives it, we have none. Sure we can do righteous things, even without being redeemed from our unrighteousness. But we do not have righteousness or godliness in ourselves, unless He gives it to us. And this He does in Christ and only in Him. And this comes about through faith. It came about through faith for Abraham and David, just as it does for us. Faith in Christ. (So, that becomes another announcement of Jesus' deity, also. Sidebar, not an invitation to derail.)

In regards to Matt 6:14-15, Jesus is our righteousness. That righteousness is given by God. Even our unforgivness does not condemn us for we are Christ's. We are counted as perfect because we are in Him and He is perfect. The whole point of His death and resurrection. If one is depending on their own righteousness, unforgiveness is yet another sin that is not forgiven. But we can no more perfectly obey while we are in the flesh than those under the Law could. It is the Holy Spirit at work in us to do the will of God, progressive sanctification, that teaches us that we should show mercy because we have been shown such great mercy, and we know that unforgiveness is wrong---in part from those very scriptures. So no matter how many times we struggle with forgiving, in our hearts we hate not forgiving, and acknowledge whatever struggle we are having with it to God and ask for His help. Even ask that He would show us what that means in whatever the situation is, and what it would look like.

 

[Arial]

I'm probably on your side when it comes to such things. I'd up capital punishment by a factor of 1000 for instance. (1000 being wild guess). hmmm, another slant regarding "not forgiving people" being acceptable as God is for capital punishment IMO.

Forgiveness does not remove justice. is how I see that. The Mosaic Law itself is a penal code. Which Jesus took for us btw, even though He was without sin. Substitutional redemption.

 

[makesends]

Agreed, though God can only dumb things dumb so far such that we might have a clue what He's talking about.


Another interesting point; though the statement says we can't totally understand God as we are so far below His level so to some degree we are always confused.

Thanks for your commentary. You write at such an elevated (intelligent) level.. it makes me want to say, "I'm not sure on the subject but because Makesends says "X" it is probably correct."

Comfort yourself in that the next morning, Makesends can read it and doesn't understand what he said the night before!

 

[makesends]

@fastfredy0 said:
I'm probably on your side when it comes to such things. I'd up capital punishment by a factor of 1000 for instance. (1000 being wild guess). hmmm, another slant regarding "not forgiving people" being acceptable as God is for capital punishment IMO.
Forgiveness does not remove justice. is how I see that. The Mosaic Law itself is a penal code. Which Jesus took for us btw, even though He was without sin. Substitutional redemption.

While the principle applies that what we forgive on earth is forgiven in heaven (John 20:23), sin against those we forgive is not primarily against us, but against God. Therefore, it is a bit of sloppy thinking to say that what we forgive has the authority of it no longer being a sin against God. God may no longer hold it against them for what they did to us, if we forgive them, but does that imply that they are no longer guilty of what they did to God?

Paul doesn't seem to think so, because though Christ says, "Father forgive them", Paul is still holding them responsible (Acts 2:23) for what they did.

 

[Mr GLee]

While the principle applies that what we forgive on earth is forgiven in heaven (John 20:23), sin against those we forgive is not primarily against us, but against God. Therefore, it is a bit of sloppy thinking to say that what we forgive has the authority of it no longer being a sin against God. God may no longer hold it against them for what they did to us, if we forgive them, but does that imply that they are no longer guilty of what they did to God?

Paul doesn't seem to think so, because though Christ says, "Father forgive them", Paul is still holding them responsible (Acts 2:23) for what they did.

Dying mankind has neither the power to forgive sin in a eternal way, just as no power to rebuke the spirit of error, legion . God the Faithful and True Creator is not a man.

John 20 like Mathew 16 and John 20. . the binding and loosening law. It was made to no effect or desolate by the oral traditons of the dying fathers . turning inspiration upside down. . . earthly inspired by the devil as if the Potter had no understanding of his own

James 3:14-16Young's Literal Translation and if bitter zeal ye have, and rivalry in your heart, glory not, nor lie against the truth; this wisdom is not descending from above, but earthly, physical, demon-like, for where zeal and rivalry [are], there is insurrection and every evil matter;


Youngs literal denies it is loosed from earth (inspired of the devil) in Mathew 16 and Mathew 18 But again in John 20 earthly inspired government of dying mankind working there best to turn things upside down .Making room for the selling of indulgences $$$$$$ (suffering less in limbo- purgatory )

Mathew 16: 19 and I will give to thee the keys of the reign of the heavens, and whatever thou mayest bind upon the earth shall be having been bound in the heavens, and whatever thou mayest loose upon the earth shall be having been loosed in the heavens.

Mathew 18:18 YLT` Verily I say to you, Whatever things ye may bind upon the earth shall be having been bound in the heavens, and whatever things ye may loose on the earth shall be having been loosed in the heavens.

Again in John 20 YLT repeats the same error promoting earthly inspired of the devils' like most translations

James 3:14-16 Young's Literal Translation and if bitter zeal ye have, and rivalry in your heart, glory not, nor lie against the truth; this wisdom is not descending from above, but earthly, physical, demon-like, for where zeal and rivalry [are], there is insurrection and every evil matter;

John 20:22-23 YLT And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost: Whose soever sins ye remit, they are remitted unto them; and whose soever sins ye retain, they are retained.

As always God must do the first works as a labor of His love in each individual working mutually in all born again from above as sons of God.

Sin can never be forgiven by the hands (will) of dying mankind. His gospel as it is writen .It has the power to bind and loosen giving us eternal life freely with no cost on our behalf. Yoked with him our daily labors can be lighter .

 

[fastfredy0]

I don't the ChatAPT is a smart as @makesends or @Arial but I thought I'd try it out ...

Question: give a commentary on Matthew 6:14-15

ChatAPT:
Matthew 6:14-15 is part of the Sermon on the Mount, where Jesus delivers teachings on various aspects of righteous living, prayer, and discipleship. Let's explore these verses:
Matthew 6:14-15 (NIV):"For if you forgive other people when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. But if you do not forgive others their sins, your Father will not forgive your sins."
In these verses, Jesus emphasizes the importance of forgiveness within the context of prayer and relationship with God. He sets a clear condition: if we forgive others, then God will forgive us. However, if we withhold forgiveness from others, then we hinder our own forgiveness from God.
Here are some key points to consider:

1. Reciprocal Nature of Forgiveness: Jesus underscores the reciprocal nature of forgiveness. Just as we seek forgiveness from God for our sins, we are called to extend forgiveness to those who wrong us. This reflects the principle of the Golden Rule (Matthew 7:12), where we are encouraged to treat others as we would like to be treated.
2. Forgiveness as a Condition for Receiving Forgiveness: Jesus makes forgiveness a condition for receiving forgiveness from God. This highlights the importance of a forgiving attitude in the Christian life. It's not merely about saying the words of prayer but also about embodying the spirit of forgiveness in our interactions with others.
3. The Seriousness of Unforgiveness: The consequences of withholding forgiveness are significant. Jesus warns that if we refuse to forgive others, God will not forgive us. This underscores the seriousness of harboring resentment and refusing to let go of grudges. Unforgiveness hinders our relationship with God and disrupts the flow of His grace in our lives.
4. A Challenge to Radical Forgiveness: Jesus' teaching challenges us to embrace radical forgiveness, extending grace even to those who may not deserve it. This aligns with Jesus' own example on the cross, where He prayed for the forgiveness of His enemies (Luke 23:34). By forgiving others, we reflect the character of God and participate in His redemptive work in the world.

In summary, Matthew 6:14-15 underscores the importance of forgiveness in the Christian life, emphasizing its reciprocal nature and the consequences of withholding it. It challenges us to embody the spirit of forgiveness as we seek reconciliation with others and deepen our relationship with God.

... to be continued ...

 

[fastfredy0]

Question: Given Matthew 6:14-15 for context ... will I go to hell if I don't forgive someone?

ChatAPT:
Interpreting biblical passages, especially those concerning salvation and judgment, requires careful consideration of the broader context of scripture and theological principles. While Matthew 6:14-15 emphasizes the importance of forgiveness and its reciprocal nature, it's crucial to avoid oversimplification and legalistic interpretations.
Here are a few points to consider:

1. Contextual Understanding: Matthew 6:14-15 is part of Jesus' teachings within the Sermon on the Mount, where He addresses various aspects of righteous living and discipleship. This passage underscores the significance of forgiveness in the Christian life but should not be isolated from the broader themes of grace, repentance, and God's mercy.
2. God's Grace and Judgment: The Bible teaches that salvation is by grace through faith in Jesus Christ (Ephesians 2:8-9). While forgiveness is important and reflective of a transformed heart, it is not the sole determinant of one's salvation. God's judgment is based on His mercy, justice, and the condition of one's heart, not solely on individual actions.
3. Parables and Context: Jesus often uses parables and figurative language to convey spiritual truths. While the consequences of unforgiveness are serious (Matthew 18:21-35), it's essential to interpret these teachings in light of Jesus' overall message of redemption, reconciliation, and the boundless love of God.
4. Repentance and Growth: The call to forgive others is accompanied by the call to repentance and transformation. While harboring unforgiveness can hinder one's relationship with God, genuine repentance and a desire to grow in grace are central to the Christian journey.

Ultimately, the question of salvation and judgment is complex and rests in the hands of a merciful and just God. While forgiveness is an integral aspect of the Christian life, it's essential to approach biblical teachings with humility, seeking to understand God's character and His redemptive plan for humanity. It's also important to seek pastoral guidance and engage in ongoing study and reflection on scripture to deepen one's understanding of these profound theological truths.

Hmmm ... I wonder if @makesends and/or @Arial are writing ChatAPT code

 

[donadams]

Matthew 6:14 For if you forgive others their trespasses [their reckless and willful sins], your heavenly Father will also forgive you. 15 But if you do not forgive others [nurturing your hurt and anger with the result that it interferes with your relationship with God], then your Father will not forgive your trespasses. AMP

Premise 1: If God does not forgive you then you're going to hell (as you have sin that has not been imputed to Christ)
Premise 2: If you do not forgive someone then God will not forgive you (v.15)
Premise 3: You are judged according to your relationship with God at the point of time that you die
Conclusion: You are going to hell if you die and have not forgiven someone

To make matters more complex
Premise 1: We are not saved by works (many verses)
Conclusion: Assuming the above is true is seems that one must do the work of "forgiving other" in order to be saved which contradicts premise 1.

@Arial @Carbon ....I'm interested in your opinion as we tend to have a common theological foundation

Then premise 1) is wrong and false doctrine
Matt 5:7
7 Blessed are the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy.

Thks

Live & walk by the spirit!

Romans 8:13
For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.

Romans 8:14
For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

Gal 5:25 If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.

A big “if”?

Matthew 10:38
And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me.

Matthew 16:24
Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.

Matthew 16:25
For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it.

John 12:24
Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit.

25
He that loveth his life shall lose it; and he that hateth his life in this world shall keep it unto life eternal.

Romans 5:3
And not only so, but we glory in tribulations also: knowing that tribulation worketh patience; 4)
And patience, experience; and experience, hope:

Romans 8:17
And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

2 Corinthians 12:9
And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.

2 Thessalonians 1:5
Which is a manifest token of the righteous judgment of God, that ye may be counted worthy of the kingdom of God, for which ye also suffer:

Colossians 1:11
Strengthened with all might, according to his glorious power, unto all patience and longsuffering with joyfulness;

2 Tim 2:3 Thou therefore endure hardness, as a good soldier of Jesus Christ.

Ex 20 obey the Ten Commandments
Deut. 6:4 obey the two greatest commandments
Matt 28:20 obey christ’s commandments
Acts 1:2 obey christ’s commandments
Jn 15:4 abide in Christ
Mk 13:13 endure to the end
Matt 24:14 endure to the end
1 Jn 2:24-25 abide and continue in Christ
Rom 8:17 suffer with Christ
Rom 11:22 continue or be cut off
Col 1:21-23 if you continue
Col 2-5 steadfast
2 Tim 2:11-13 suffer
Phil 1:29 suffer for Christ’s sake
Heb 3:4-6 if we hold fast
Heb 6:4-9 fall away
Heb 12:22-25 lost if we turn away

We still have free will and can choose (volition) to reject Christ and the faith and renounce our baptism

2 Timothy 2:12
If we suffer, we shall also reign with him: if we deny him, he also will deny us:

Abide in faith, but not faith alone!

 

[Eleanor]

Matthew 6:14 For if you forgive others their trespasses [their reckless and willful sins], your heavenly Father will also forgive you. 15 But if you do not forgive others [nurturing your hurt and anger with the result that it interferes with your relationship with God], then your Father will not forgive your trespasses. AMP

Premise 1: If God does not forgive you then you're going to hell (as you have sin that has not been imputed to Christ)
Premise 2: If you do not forgive someone then God will not forgive you (v.15)
Premise 3: You are judged according to your relationship with God at the point of time that you die
Conclusion: You are going to hell if you die and have not forgiven someone

To make matters more complex
Premise 1: We are not saved by works (many verses)
Conclusion: Assuming the above is true is seems that one must do the work of "forgiving other" in order to be saved which contradicts premise 1.

@Arial @Carbon ....I'm interested in your opinion as we tend to have a common theological foundation

Or failure to forgive simply means you are not born again and forgiven.

 

[donadams]

Or failure to forgive simply means you are not born again and forgiven.

In your understanding is that the same with losing your salvation, and are fallen from grace?

 

[Eleanor]

In your understanding is that the same with losing your salvation, and are fallen from grace?

No, it means you were never born again.

The born again forgive as they were forgiven.