Does "apostasy" mean "departure" which means "rapture"?

[CrowCross]

In dispensationalist terms, for example, the leading away or mass deceiving of people worldwide, (to the degree that even the elect, (were it possible), would be led astray. (Matthew 24)).

We have already seen this. Why is it called THE departure?

The word "the" makes it sound pretty much like an event.

Do you think the Greys will come and disclose they were the creators of man, society and religion? The the Anti-Christ be revealed?

 

[CrowCross]

Falling away from the faith is not a bad translation when you realize that the Greek scriptures always uses the noun apostasia as a departure from the faith.

When Paul says in 1 Cor 15:23 “But each in his own turn: Christ, the first fruits; then, when he comes, those who belong to him. Then the end will come.”
he is agreeing with the words of Jesus about the wheat and the tares in
Mat 13:30 "Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn."

The gathering of all believers happens at the 2nd coming and no believer (wheat) will suffer God's wrath, only the unbelievers (tares) suffer God's wrath.

Do you think you will make it through the tribulation?

 

[CrowCross]

Arial said:
All are from the 1500's. A pre-trib rapture was not even on their radar.

And you know this how????

 

[Tambora]

Do you think you will make it through the tribulation?

A great multitude from every nation will come out of great tribulation
dressed in white robes washed in the blood of the
Lamb that shall lead them unto living fountains of waters. (see Rev 7:9-17)

 

[Arial]

Arial said:
All are from the 1500's. A pre-trib rapture was not even on their radar.

And you know this how????

Because I use reason and logic in my thinking, instead of lenses fogged over with what I want to believe.

 

[makesends]

We have already seen this. Why is it called THE departure?

The word "the" makes it sound pretty much like an event.

Do you think the Greys will come and disclose they were the creators of man, society and religion? The the Anti-Christ be revealed?

It isn't called THE departure. I thought I mentioned that back several posts ago.

 

[CrowCross]

A great multitude from every nation will come out of great tribulation
dressed in white robes washed in the blood of the
Lamb that shall lead them unto living fountains of waters. (see Rev 7:9-17)

You do know these people are in heaven? How else could they have fallen on their faces before the throne and worshiped God?

You do know they are not those who survived the 7 year tribulation on earth?

So, once again.....Do you think you will make it through the tribulation?

Rev 6: 8 And I looked, and behold, a pale horse! And its rider’s name was Death, and Hades followed him. And they were given authority over a fourth of the earth, to kill with sword and with famine and with pestilence and by wild beasts of the earth.

Rev 8:11 The name of the star is Wormwood. A third of the waters turned bitter like wormwood oil, and many people died from the bitter waters.

Rev 9:15 And the four angels having been prepared for the hour and day and month and year were released, so that they might kill a third of mankind
Rev 9:18 By these three was the third part of men killed, by the fire, and by the smoke, and by the brimstone, which issued out of their mouths.
Re 13:7 Also it was allowed to make war on the saints and to conquer them. And authority was given it over every tribe and people and language and nation,

 

[CrowCross]

It isn't called THE departure. I thought I mentioned that back several posts ago.

Apparently you didn't make your case well enough.

Literal Standard Version
do not let anyone deceive you in any way, because if the departure may not come first, the man of lawlessness may [not] be revealed—the son of destruction,

Geneva Bible of 1587
Let no man deceiue you by any meanes: for that day shall not come, except there come a departing first, and that that man of sinne be disclosed, euen the sonne of perdition,

Coverdale Bible of 1535
Let noman disceaue you by eny meanes. For the LORDE commeth not, excepte the departynge come first, and that that Man of synne be opened, euen the sonne of perdicion,

Tyndale Bible of 1526
Let no ma deceave you by eny meanes for the lorde commeth not excepte ther come a departynge fyrst and that that synfnll man be opened ye sonne of perdicion

World English Bible
Let no one deceive you in any way. For it will not be, unless the departure comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of destruction,

1539 Cramer Bible
Let no man deceaue you by eny meanes, for the Lorde shall not come excepte ther come a departynge fyrst, and that that synfull man be opened, the sonne of perdicyon,

Same is true with the 1384 Wycliffe Bible as well as the 1576 Breeches Bible, 1583 Beeze Bible.
From what I understand even Jerome in the 4th century translation of the Latin Vulgate used the latin word for departure.

 

[Arial]

@CrowCross







Strong's Lexicon
apostasia: Apostasy, rebellion, defection, falling away
Original Word: ἀποστασία
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: apostasia
Pronunciation: ah-pos-tah-SEE-ah
Phonetic Spelling: (ap-os-tas-ee'-ah)
Definition: Apostasy, rebellion, defection, falling away
Meaning: defection, apostasy, revolt.

Word Origin: Derived from ἀφίστημι (aphistēmi), meaning "to stand away" or "to depart."


Corresponding Greek / Hebrew Entries: The concept of apostasy in the Old Testament is often related to the Hebrew word מְשׁוּבָה (meshubah), meaning "backsliding" or "turning away," as seen in passages like Jeremiah 3:6.

Usage: The term "apostasia" refers to a departure or defection from a previously held position, often in the context of religious faith. In the New Testament, it is used to describe a falling away from the truth or a rebellion against God. It implies a deliberate abandonment of faith or a turning away from previously held beliefs.

Continued

 

[CrowCross]

Word Origin: Derived from ἀφίστημι (aphistēmi), meaning "to stand away" or "to depart."

We've already discussed this.

 

[Arial]

@CrowCross
Continued:



Cultural and Historical Background: In the Greco-Roman world, "apostasia" could refer to political rebellion or a military defection. Within the Jewish context, it was often associated with a turning away from the covenant with God. In the early Christian church, apostasy was a significant concern as believers faced persecution and the temptation to revert to pagan practices or Jewish legalism. The term underscores the gravity of abandoning one's faith in Christ, which was seen as a serious breach of loyalty to God.

646 apostasía (from 868 /aphístēmi, "leave, depart," which is derived from 575 /apó, "away from" and 2476 /histémi, "stand") – properly, departure (implying desertion); apostasy – literally, "a leaving, from a previous standing."
NAS Exhaustive Concordance
Word Origin
from aphistémi
Definition
defection, revolt
NASB Translation
apostasy (1), forsake (1).



STRONGS NT 646: ἀποστασία

ἀποστασία, ἀποστασιας, ἡ (ἀφισταμαι), a falling away, defection, apostasy; in the Bible namely, from the true religion: Acts 21:21; 2 Thessalonians 2:3; ((Joshua 22:22; 2 Chronicles 29:19; 2 Chronicles 33:19); Jeremiah 2:19; Jeremiah 3629) 32 Complutensian; 1 Macc. 2:15). The earlier Greeks say ἀπόστασις; see Lob. ad Phryn., p. 528; (Winer's Grammar, 24).
Strong's Exhaustive Concordance
falling away, apostacy
Feminine of the same as apostasion; defection from truth (properly, the state) ("apostasy") -- falling away, forsake.

NEVER, EVER, DOES THE WORD TRANSLATED AS DEPARTURE IN THE 14th CENTURY BIBLES, MEAN A TRANSLATION OR RAPTURE OF CHRISTIANS FROM PLANET EARTH.

 

[Arial]

We've already discussed this.

Well, read posts #129 and #131. You can't just pick and choose. Not even when translated as "departure" it does not mean leaving earth.

 

[Arial]

We've already discussed this.

We can't actually discuss it if all that is considered or read (I know it would a dangerous thing to do so best to avoid it)is you picking out one word and giving it your own definition instead of the correct one. Does it seem wise to go no farther than what one wants something to say though? Or is rightly handling the word of God and arriving at truth wise?

 

[CrowCross]

@CrowCross
Continued:



Cultural and Historical Background: In the Greco-Roman world, "apostasia" could refer to political rebellion or a military defection. Within the Jewish context, it was often associated with a turning away from the covenant with God. In the early Christian church, apostasy was a significant concern as believers faced persecution and the temptation to revert to pagan practices or Jewish legalism. The term underscores the gravity of abandoning one's faith in Christ, which was seen as a serious breach of loyalty to God.

646 apostasía (from 868 /aphístēmi, "leave, depart," which is derived from 575 /apó, "away from" and 2476 /histémi, "stand") – properly, departure (implying desertion); apostasy – literally, "a leaving, from a previous standing."
NAS Exhaustive Concordance
Word Origin
from aphistémi
Definition
defection, revolt
NASB Translation
apostasy (1), forsake (1).



STRONGS NT 646: ἀποστασία

ἀποστασία, ἀποστασιας, ἡ (ἀφισταμαι), a falling away, defection, apostasy; in the Bible namely, from the true religion: Acts 21:21; 2 Thessalonians 2:3; ((Joshua 22:22; 2 Chronicles 29:19; 2 Chronicles 33:19); Jeremiah 2:19; Jeremiah 3629) 32 Complutensian; 1 Macc. 2:15). The earlier Greeks say ἀπόστασις; see Lob. ad Phryn., p. 528; (Winer's Grammar, 24).
Strong's Exhaustive Concordance
falling away, apostacy
Feminine of the same as apostasion; defection from truth (properly, the state) ("apostasy") -- falling away, forsake.

NEVER, EVER, DOES THE WORD TRANSLATED AS DEPARTURE IN THE 14th CENTURY BIBLES, MEAN A TRANSLATION OR RAPTURE OF CHRISTIANS FROM PLANET EARTH.

For the last time....I hope...One of the key to this is with 868. aphistémi. Click on the link....GO LOOK TO THE RIGHT ON YOUR SCREEN....read the verses that use the verb form of the word 646 apostasía....Once you've done that tell me a majority of them doesn't speak of a PHYSICAL departure.

 

[CrowCross]

We can't actually discuss it if all that is considered or read (I know it would a dangerous thing to do so best to avoid it)is you picking out one word and giving it your own definition instead of the correct one. Does it seem wise to go no farther than what one wants something to say though? Or is rightly handling the word of God and arriving at truth wise?

Just for the records...I have not given it the definition. Many others before me have studied the scriptures and have shown a physical departure is the best way to look at the scripture. I even presented you with a very well done video where Andy Woods explained it.

In your closed mind I don't even think you have even admitted nor understood the word CAN mean a physical departure and in several instance the verb of the word most certainly DOES mean a physical departure.

Until you recognize that simple fact arguing this point with you is futile on my part.

 

[CrowCross]

Well, read posts #129 and #131. You can't just pick and choose. Not even when translated as "departure" it does not mean leaving earth.

Leaving earth?

Acts 12:10 And having passed through a first and a second guard, they came to the iron gate leading into the city, which opened to them by itself. And having gone out, they went on through one street, and immediately the angel departed from him.

Where did the angel go? Pittsburgh?

 

[Arial]

For the last time....I hope...One of the key to this is with 868. aphistémi. Click on the link....GO LOOK TO THE RIGHT ON YOUR SCREEN....read the verses that use the verb form of the word 646 apostasía....Once you've done that tell me a majority of them doesn't speak of a PHYSICAL departure.

Irrelevant as aphistemi is not used in 2 Thess 2:3. APOSTASIA is. 646.



Original Word: ἀποστασία
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: apostasia
Pronunciation: ah-pos-tah-SEE-ah
Phonetic Spelling: (ap-os-tas-ee'-ah)
Definition: Apostasy, rebellion, defection, falling away
Meaning: defection, apostasy, revolt.





Acts 21:21 N-AFS
GRK: σοῦ ὅτι ἀποστασίαν διδάσκεις ἀπὸ
NAS: the Gentiles to forsake Moses,
KJV: the Gentiles to forsake Moses, saying
INT: you that apostasy you teach from
2 Thessalonians 2:3 N-NFS
GRK: ἔλθῃ ἡ ἀποστασία πρῶτον καὶ
NAS: you, for [it will not come] unless the apostasy comes
KJV: there come a falling away first,
INT: shall have come the apostasy first and

 

[Arial]

Leaving earth?

Acts 12:10 And having passed through a first and a second guard, they came to the iron gate leading into the city, which opened to them by itself. And having gone out, they went on through one street, and immediately the angel departed from him.

Where did the angel go? Pittsburgh?

It isn't about where the angel went. It is about the angel didn't stay with them but departed from them. You are truly grasping at straws to avoid what is being placed right in front of your face. Deflection won't change a thing.

 

[Arial]

Just for the records...I have not given it the definition. Many others before me have studied the scriptures and have shown a physical departure is the best way to look at the scripture. I even presented you with a very well done video where Andy Woods explained it.

You bought into the error though in spite of all the evidence to the contrary. And the error didn't even come into existence until 1830 with Darby. Do you think it is going to hurt beyond endurance to change your mind? Or is it fear of having to face what a dispensational interpretation of Revelation and tribulation has frightened people out of their minds with? And then offered a promise that is nowhere found to be a promise of God. Don't be one departing from faith when troubles comes with persecution and the war enters its final battle. Gain the strength of perseverance and endurance from trusting God who is able to send a raven to feed a starving and persecuted man. Who is able to keep him alive and safe, even if he dies. A God who can bring water out of a rock and make the sun stand still and raise the dead to life.

 

[CrowCross]

Irrelevant as aphistemi is not used in 2 Thess 2:3. APOSTASIA is. 646.

When it comes to hermeneutics it's very relevant. You of all people should know that.