The Patch and Wineskins

[Carbon]

21 No one sews a piece of unshrunk cloth on an old garment. If he does, the patch tears away from it, the new from the old, and a worse tear is made. 22 And no one puts new wine into old wineskins. If he does, the wine will burst the skins—and the wine is destroyed, and so are the skins. But new wine is for fresh wineskins.” Mark 2:21-22

Whats the meaning of this parable and how does it apply to us today?

 

[Marilyn C]

21 No one sews a piece of unshrunk cloth on an old garment. If he does, the patch tears away from it, the new from the old, and a worse tear is made. 22 And no one puts new wine into old wineskins. If he does, the wine will burst the skins—and the wine is destroyed, and so are the skins. But new wine is for fresh wineskins.” Mark 2:21-22

Whats the meaning of this parable and how does it apply to us today?

I think old wine skins have become hardened and thus would spoil the new wine.

As to today, (not that I like taking what is said to Israel as to the Body of Christ). However, just as a saying by itself I would say today that what Christ is doing in His Body cannot be contained in the old format of lecture type meetings. This is where one person stands up and gives a sermon regularly while the audience just sit and listen. This is not a good format to use frequently.

The Lord is freeing His Body from the constraints of the old order and drawing them into a closer walk with Himself and other believers in all sorts of daily activities.

 

[Sparrow]

21 No one sews a piece of unshrunk cloth on an old garment. If he does, the patch tears away from it, the new from the old, and a worse tear is made. 22 And no one puts new wine into old wineskins. If he does, the wine will burst the skins—and the wine is destroyed, and so are the skins. But new wine is for fresh wineskins.” Mark 2:21-22

Whats the meaning of this parable and how does it apply to us today?

This parable explains that the “old” does not accept the ”new” very well.

The context of the passage is that both the disciples of John and the Pharisees were following traditions of fasting (far more often than the one day required in Leviticus 23:27), and they wondered why Jesus and His disciples were not. Perhaps they thought that if they did more than was required, God would notice and be pleased; but they had actually burdened themselves and others with man-made rituals in order to draw attention to their own piety. They had become like old, worn out garments and dried up wineskins.

Jesus answered this way: “Can the friends of the bridegroom fast while the bridegroom is with them? As long as they have the bridegroom with them they cannot fast. But the days will come when the bridegroom will be taken away from them, and then they will fast in those days.”(Mark 2:19-20) Jesus was announcing not only the importance of His presence among them, but also the sad truth (for them) that He would be taken away. To His own people, Jesus was like a new piece of cloth sewn onto an old garment or new wine poured into an old, dried wineskin. They could not accept His new ways, and He was about to cause the temple veil to be torn from top to bottom. God would never again dwell within a temple made by man after that day. Then would come the time to fast and mourn.

This parable is especially significant for us today because while the Pharisees were both puzzled and angered, we can actually understand it.
In Christ, our “old self” is destroyed to make room for the new, and it’s not always an easy process. We are broken to be made new, like the fresh wineskins. We also need to be sure that we don’t allow ourselves to be overtaken by the old, worn traditions of men; but rather keep ourselves refreshed daily in the Word.

 

[Sheila3]

21 No one sews a piece of unshrunk cloth on an old garment. If he does, the patch tears away from it, the new from the old, and a worse tear is made. 22 And no one puts new wine into old wineskins. If he does, the wine will burst the skins—and the wine is destroyed, and so are the skins. But new wine is for fresh wineskins.” Mark 2:21-22

Whats the meaning of this parable and how does it apply to us today?

Could it be referring to our new bodies which we will receive in the new heaven and then you are? Both spirit and body incorruptible. Putting a corrupt spirit in a new body will not work and putting a non-corruptible spirit in these old bodies will not work for these old bodies will sin and perish.

As far as today _ could it be referring to being Born Again of the spirit, yet in this fallen flesh it is like patchwork. For the spirit is willing but the flesh is weak. And far to many times the flesh is given into and sin of some sort takes place.

 

[juxtaposeraphim]

.
Mar 1:1 presents a setting that opens the scene as “ The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God; “

Mark 1: goes on to describe John the Baptist who was the messenger who prepares the way before Jesus. John baptized in the wilderness, preached the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins.

John also preached, saying, There cometh one mightier than I after me, the latchet of whose shoes I am not worthy to stoop down and unloose. ……. he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost.

In mark 2: Jesus was being questioned specifically about John the Baptist and also about the Pharisees whom they, in the past, were known for fasting.

verse :15 explains that Jesus was sitting where people were eating food in a house with many publicans and sinners, also his disciples were there

In verse :18 Jesus is with people who are eating a meal, some of the people begin to then ask Jesus “” Why do the disciples of John and of the Pharisees fast, but thy disciples fast not ? “

:19 And Jesus said unto them, Can the children of the bridechamber fast, while the bridegroom is with them? as long as they have the bridegroom with them, they cannot fast.

:20 But the days will come, when the bridegroom shall be taken away from them, and then shall they fast in those days.
:21 No man also seweth a piece of new cloth on an old garment: else the new piece that filled it up taketh away from the old, and the rent is made worse.

:22 And no man putteth new wine into old bottles: else the new wine doth burst the bottles, and the wine is spilled, and the bottles will be marred: but new wine must be put into new bottles.

We know John came preaching and had began his ministry before Jesus had began his ministry ( first. _ John baptized and taught his disciples or followers around him that he was preaching about someone who would come in soon future, after him and that this person would baptize with the Spirit, Holy.

Could it be that Jesus was answering the question specifically about what he being asked, concerning John, in fasting - - and that Jesus was explaining that in his new ministry, his own purpose and his new message was to deliver a new part of God’s plan, to teach and nurture the people concerning things that he was purposed to bring to the world and that fasting at this specific time, while he was just beginning the teaching and revealing of his new message and ministry, it was not the time and his purpose to suddenly compel and call people to fasting.

and that fasting at this time would be like piecing in a new cloth onto an old garment - or putting new wine into old containers - it was time for a new beginning to treat and deal with the people he was teaching as new garments and new wineskins

 

[juxtaposeraphim]

I think this was actually what everyone was saying.

 

[Rockerduck]

Jesus was giving the example how the new message about Kingdom of God is not compatible with the old Mosaic Law. In other words, the age of Grace is not compatible with works, as the law of Moses was.

 

[Arial]

21 No one sews a piece of unshrunk cloth on an old garment. If he does, the patch tears away from it, the new from the old, and a worse tear is made. 22 And no one puts new wine into old wineskins. If he does, the wine will burst the skins—and the wine is destroyed, and so are the skins. But new wine is for fresh wineskins.” Mark 2:21-22

Whats the meaning of this parable and how does it apply to us today?

It is a parable of the old and new covenants. One is passing away (when Jesus spoke) the new is coming in. They are completely different covenants. The one a covenant of works, the other a covenant of grace, or faith. He fulfills the old to make way for the new, and the two won't mix without doing damage.

 

[CherubRam]

21 No one sews a piece of unshrunk cloth on an old garment. If he does, the patch tears away from it, the new from the old, and a worse tear is made. 22 And no one puts new wine into old wineskins. If he does, the wine will burst the skins—and the wine is destroyed, and so are the skins. But new wine is for fresh wineskins.” Mark 2:21-22

Whats the meaning of this parable and how does it apply to us today?

Matthew 9:17
Neither do people pour new wine into old wineskins. If they do, the skins will burst; the wine will run out and the wineskins will be ruined. No, they pour new wine into new wineskins, and both are preserved.”

Mark 2:22
And no one pours new wine into old wineskins. Otherwise, the wine will burst the skins, and both the wine and the wineskins will be ruined. No, they pour new wine into new wineskins.”

Luke 5:37
And no one pours new wine into old wineskins. Otherwise, the new wine will burst the skins; the wine will run out and the wineskins will be ruined.

Luke 5:36-39
36 He told them this parable: “No one tears a piece out of a new garment to patch an old one. Otherwise, they will have torn the new garment, and the patch from the new will not match the old. 37 And no one pours new wine into old wineskins. Otherwise, the new wine will burst the skins; the wine will run out and the wineskins will be ruined. 38 No, new wine must be poured into new wineskins.

See here why you should listen to me.
(39 And no one after drinking old wine wants the new, for they say, ‘The old is better.’”)

Born Again
The "New Wineskin" is the "New Man," and the "New Wine" is the "New Covenant."

Ephesians 2:15
Having abolished in his flesh the hostility, of even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;

Luke 22:20
In the same way, after the supper he took the cup, saying, “This cup is the new covenant in my blood, which is poured out for you.

1 Corinthians 11:25
In the same way, after supper he took the cup, saying, “This cup is the new covenant in my blood; do this, whenever you drink it, in remembrance of me.”


We are the wine skin and the new wine is the new covenant. The old covenant of circumcision has been revoked. Patching up the old covenant invites disaster.

 

[donadams]

It’s a reference to the old and new covenants!

Similar in Jn 2 they saved the best for last!

 

[donadams]

It’s a reference to the old and new covenants!

Similar in Jn 2 they saved the best for last!

Wow!

 

[Mr GLee]

I would paraphrase Mark 2 :20-24

Mark 2 :20-24 But the days will come, when the Christ bridegroom The Holy Spirit who works in His bride the church , The husband Christ shall be taken away from them, and then shall fast in those days. when Gods a famine for hearing the water of the word the gospel . . . .the voice of many waters . No man mixes the things a dried up body of death with new born again spirit life else the dried up spiritless body tears away from the new spirit and It made worse. And no man put new spirit life into dying dried up flesh else the new living spirit burst the dying flesh. But new wine as spirit life must be put into new incorruptible containers that will never dry up . And it came to pass, that he went through the corn fields used to represent flesh on the sabbath day; and his disciples began, as they went, to pluck the ears of corn. And the Pharisees said unto him, Behold, why do they on the sabbath day that which is not lawful?

It would seem To show them he is the object of rest . . .he revealed the fathers powerful labor of love to demonstrate the work of our inviable head, our husband, Christ.

Christ in effect saying; rest in my labor of Love (Corn and wine) .A new body housing a new spirit. Never to dry up ever again.

Genesis 27:37 And Isaac answered and said unto Esau, Behold, I have made him thy lord, and all his brethren have I given to him for servants; and with corn and wine have I sustained him: and what shall I do now unto thee, my son?

 

[Josheb]

21 No one sews a piece of unshrunk cloth on an old garment. If he does, the patch tears away from it, the new from the old, and a worse tear is made. 22 And no one puts new wine into old wineskins. If he does, the wine will burst the skins—and the wine is destroyed, and so are the skins. But new wine is for fresh wineskins.” Mark 2:21-22

Whats the meaning of this parable and how does it apply to us today?

The gospel is not a patch on the old wineskin of Judaism. Assuming the new "wine" is Christ dead and resurrected for the propitiation of sin and the gifting of the Spirit, then the resurrection and Spirit is not poured into that old wineskin.

The context(s) of the wineskin analogy is that of the pending wedding feast and removal of the bridegroom. Both analogies were spoken in reference to Jesus dining with sinners, declaring himself (through a third analogy) to a doctor healing the sick (with its implied repudiation of the "righteous" scribes and Pharisees. Jesus' use of the "new wine" motif comes straight out of the OT as a reference to the tithe, or portion of God's blessing returned to God in tribute; the first offerings or first born. Jesus is the first born among many so...

Yes, the text does apply to us (the ecclesia), and to us today, but not identically as it did/does to Jesus. We're not dying for sinners. We're not anyone's propitiation. We're the propitiated, and we want all others to join us (according to God's will). The psalms and the later prophets declare the new wine infinite and satisfying to a people from whom new wine had been withheld (due to disobedience and desolation), and the prophet Zechariah reported it flourishing, beautiful, pure and purifying.

 

[CherubRam]

21 No one sews a piece of unshrunk cloth on an old garment. If he does, the patch tears away from it, the new from the old, and a worse tear is made. 22 And no one puts new wine into old wineskins. If he does, the wine will burst the skins—and the wine is destroyed, and so are the skins. But new wine is for fresh wineskins.” Mark 2:21-22

Whats the meaning of this parable and how does it apply to us today?

We are the wine bag and the NEW WINE is the New Covenant. The Old Wine is the Old Covenant. A new man (born again) for the New Wine.
New Wine: https://christianforum.boards.net/thread/644/new-wine-covenant

 

[Mr GLee]

We are the wine bag and the NEW WINE is the New Covenant. The Old Wine is the Old Covenant. A new man (born again) for the New Wine.
New Wine: https://christianforum.boards.net/thread/644/new-wine-covenant

I would offer.

New wine (the gospel)

As sons of God, born again Christians what we will be is not given .All die not receiving the new incorruptible (non aging) wine skins .

We are in the old wine skin (corrupted dying mankind ) body of death . Not what we will be as the bride.

As new creatures. No longer Jew nor gentile, male nor female. The family of God

Galatians 3:27-29King James Version For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

1 John 3:1 Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not.Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.

In that way I think in a non visible faith sense, Satan the father of confusion is behind all this Gender dysphoria, chemical castration etc (Democratic party mind set )

Gnosticism (secret wisdom) It would seem beginning with homosexuality . . .societies approval. And as goods increase new letters are added to the LGBTQ+ alphabet. It would seem P is next (pedophiles) .

Gnosticism, as if the ressurection had come and the non redeemed put thier trust in reincarnation. . not trusting the unseen head, Christ.

The gospel must go out . It would seem the time period we are in could be compared to the first century.

2 Timothy 2:17-19King James Version17 And their word will eat as doth a canker: of whom is Hymenaeus and Philetus; Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the [COLOR=rgb(97, 189, 109)](new)[/COLOR] faith of some. Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity

History repeating itself .At the rise and fall of every empire or family it has to do with morals laws designed by the law giver..

The end will come like a thief in the night like the days of Noah.

 

[Tambora]

21 No one sews a piece of unshrunk cloth on an old garment. If he does, the patch tears away from it, the new from the old, and a worse tear is made. 22 And no one puts new wine into old wineskins. If he does, the wine will burst the skins—and the wine is destroyed, and so are the skins. But new wine is for fresh wineskins.” Mark 2:21-22

Whats the meaning of this parable and how does it apply to us today?

In the 3 gospels (Matthew, Mark, Luke) Jesus uses the wine and wineskins parable in response to their question about fasting, and that one does not fast when the bridegroom is with them.

 

[Mr GLee]

In the 3 gospels (Matthew, Mark, Luke) Jesus uses the wine and wineskins parable in response to their question about fasting, and that one does not fast when the bridegroom is with them.

Amen, as Sons of God we are not what we will be when receive our new incorruptible wineskins.

1 John 3:1Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not. Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.

 

[ChristB4us]

21 No one sews a piece of unshrunk cloth on an old garment. If he does, the patch tears away from it, the new from the old, and a worse tear is made. 22 And no one puts new wine into old wineskins. If he does, the wine will burst the skins—and the wine is destroyed, and so are the skins. But new wine is for fresh wineskins.” Mark 2:21-22

Whats the meaning of this parable and how does it apply to us today?

It means once saved is always saved ( even though not many will be ready for the Bridegroom for when he comes for why they will be "excommunicated" from attending the marriage Supper in Heaven )

Mark 2:21-22 is the same as reading this.

1 Corinthians 6:19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own? 20 For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.

2 Corinthians 5:17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new. 18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;

Hence new creature is new wineskin able to hold the forever indwelling Holy Ghost.

That is why we are warned not to grieve the holy Spirit by sowing to the works of the flesh because He is stuck in us forever.

Ephesians 4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.
But again, when Christ comes as the Bridegroom He will excommunicate those saved believers not found abiding in Him and His words but that means those left behind are still saved, but will die, and be resurrected after the great tribulation as vessels unto dishonor in His House, the vessels of wood and earth, to serve the King of kings on earth.
Look at how God will judge every believer in that day of the pre great tribulation rapture event for when God will judge His house first.
1 Corinthians 3:10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon.

11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.

12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;

13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.

14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.

15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?

17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

So if believers do not look to Jesus Christ daily in trusting Him as their Good shepherd & Friend to help them resist sin and cast off the works of darkness and casting down wicked thoughts & wicked imaginations to think on good things, then they are sowing to the flesh in reaping corruption & defiling that Temple of God for why they will be left behind in that day per verse 13 to die a physical death per verses 16-17 BUT per verse 15, they are still saved as that seal of adoption is not going anywhere.
So Mark 2:21-22 as well as Mattew 9:17 is a testimony from God for how He is dwelling within us having made us His, are saved.

Matthew 9:17 Neither do men put new wine into old bottles: else the bottles break, and the wine runneth out, and the bottles perish: but they put new wine into new bottles, and both are preserved.

 

[atpollard]

John 4:21-24 [NLT]
Jesus replied, "Believe me, dear woman, the time is coming when it will no longer matter whether you worship the Father on this mountain or in Jerusalem. (old garment / old wineskin) You Samaritans know very little about the one you worship, while we Jews know all about him, for salvation comes through the Jews. But the time is coming--indeed it's here now--when true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and in truth. The Father is looking for those who will worship him that way. For God is Spirit, so those who worship him must worship in spirit and in truth." (new patch / new wine)

Mark 2:21-22 [from the OP]
No one sews a piece of unshrunk cloth on an old garment. If he does, the patch tears away from it, the new from the old, and a worse tear is made. And no one puts new wine into old wineskins. If he does, the wine will burst the skins—and the wine is destroyed, and so are the skins. But new wine is for fresh wineskins.”

Same message! Hidden from Jews, revealed to a Samaritan woman at a well.

 

[Soyeong]

21 No one sews a piece of unshrunk cloth on an old garment. If he does, the patch tears away from it, the new from the old, and a worse tear is made. 22 And no one puts new wine into old wineskins. If he does, the wine will burst the skins—and the wine is destroyed, and so are the skins. But new wine is for fresh wineskins.” Mark 2:21-22

Whats the meaning of this parable and how does it apply to us today?

Jesus gave that parable to answer a question about why his disciples weren't fasting and I can't tell you how many times I've seen people try to apply that parable in a way that nothing to do with addressing the question that Jesus was asked or try to turn that parable against walking in obedience to the Mosaic Law in spite of the fact that Jesus spent his ministry setting a sinless example for us to follow of how to walk in obedience to it. Jesus had just finished selecting his disciples and he was being questioned about his selection and the whole point of a rabbi/disciple relationship is for the rabbi to teach his disciples how to obey the Mosaic Law.