If it's True That Justification by Faith ...

[Eleanor]

Adds nothing to Justification before God !

Faith, or believing, the act of the creature [old or new] adds nothing to Justification before God, that fact was accomplished solely by Christ's Blood, however it does give Joy and Comforth in the Knowledge of the fact, Paul's meaning here Rom 15:13

Now the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, that ye may abound in hope, through the power of the Holy Ghost.

Note: Believing is through the Power of the Holy Ghost !

Yet Justification is a Divine Fact before we believe it, Faith causes us to believe the Fact of our free Justification, as it is made known in the Gospel Rom 1:17. Justification is our Righteousness, and is made known to the Spiritual eye of Faith, and so the Gospel is also called the word of Faith Rom 10:8,17 !

In the temporal order on earth, justification occurs by faith (Ro 3:28), not before faith, which faith is a gift (Php 1;29, 2 Pe 1:1, Ac 13:48, 18:27, Ro 12:3).

 

[brightfame52]

In the temporal order on earth, justification occurs by faith (Ro 3:28), not before faith, which faith is a gift (Php 1;29, 2 Pe 1:1, Ac 13:48, 18:27, Ro 12:3).

Yet Justification is a Divine Fact before we believe it, Faith causes us to believe the Fact of our free Justification, as it is made known in the Gospel Rom 1:17. Justification is our Righteousness, and is made known to the Spiritual eye of Faith, and so the Gospel is also called the word of Faith Rom 10:8,17 !

 

[prism]

Relevance?

Who authorized your ordo salutis?

I was thinking more in terms of the primacy of justification, rather than the ordo salutis

 

[Eleanor]

Yet Justification is a Divine Fact before we believe it, Faith causes us to believe the Fact of our free Justification, as it is made known in the Gospel Rom 1:17. Justification is our Righteousness, and is made known to the Spiritual eye of Faith, and so the Gospel is also called the word of Faith Rom 10:8,17 !

Faith causes us to
be saved from God's judgment on sin by remission of that sin (Eph 2:8-9),
be justified (declared "not guilty" because of that sinlessness) (Ro 3:28) and
be reckoned as righteous by the imputed righteousness of Christ (Ro 1:17, 3:21, 4:5, Php 3:9).

 

[Eleanor]

I was thinking more in terms of the primacy of justification, rather than the ordo salutis

Do you understand why the epistles were written?

 

[brightfame52]

@Eleanor

Faith causes us to
be saved from God's judgment on sin by remission of that sin (Eph 2:8-9),

False, Christ did that. You contributing to faith, believing, what should only be contributed to Christ. Now faith receives the knowedge of what Christ did to put away sin by His Blood Matt 26:28

28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

 

[prism]

Do you understand why the epistles were written?

Not sure which Epistles you are referring to, but Paul mainly wrote his epistles to the Gentiles to explain the work of Christ and how to live in the light of that knowledge.

 

[EarlyActs]

Not sure which Epistles you are referring to, but Paul mainly wrote his epistles to the Gentiles to explain the work of Christ and how to live in the light of that knowledge.

but the topic most of the time was how to detangle from Judaism, because the Judaizers would go around, as in Corinth, Galatia, Colossae and tell people that 'real' Christians kept the Law.

 

[Hazelelponi]

The simple fact is the late date is built on baseless speculation, and it is that position that should be justifying itself.

I don't accept Irenaeus' late dating but I don't see dating to matter because of the entirety of the timespan Revelation speaks of and to. (e.g., it starts prior to the birth of Christ in symbolism and encompasses until the second coming)

Do you honestly think dating actually matters? I have been taking the position that it truly doesn't.

 

[brightfame52]

A virtual Justification of the elect in the resurrection of Christ !

Rom 4:25

25 Who was delivered for[because of] our offences, and was raised again for[because of] our justification.

Before individuals are called in time, they had a realistic Justification from their sins in Christ the Head of the Church, when He was raised again for their Justification

 

[prism]

but the topic most of the time was how to detangle from Judaism, because the Judaizers would go around, as in Corinth, Galatia, Colossae and tell people that 'real' Christians kept the Law.

That sounds more like the letter to the Galatians rather than the Romans.

 

[Eleanor]

@Eleanor


False, Christ did that.

Ya' think?

 

[Eleanor]

Not sure which Epistles you are referring to, but Paul mainly wrote his epistles to the Gentiles to explain the work of Christ and how to live in the light of that knowledge.

And why were they on different subjects to different groups?

 

[Eleanor]

@Eleanor

False, Christ did that.

Agreed. . .through the gift ( Php 1:29, 2 Pe 1:1, Ac 13:48, 18:27, Ro 12:3) of faith (Eph 2:8-9).

 

[Eleanor]

Not sure which Epistles you are referring to, but Paul mainly wrote his epistles to the Gentiles to explain the work of Christ and how to live in the light of that knowledge.

Do they address a particular situation which is sinful or a doctrine that needs clarifying because of misunderstanding or error?

 

[brightfame52]

Agreed. . .through the gift ( Php 1:29, 2 Pe 1:1, Ac 13:48, 18:27, Ro 12:3) of faith (Eph 2:8-9).

False, He did it by Himself, faith had nothing to with it, except maybe His own faithfulness to the covenant

 

[Eleanor]

False, He did it by Himself, faith had nothing to with it, except maybe His own faithfulness to the covenant

Your issue is with Eph 2:8-9.

 

[brightfame52]

Your issue is with Eph 2:8-9.

No Im in agreement with those scriptures, you dont understand them.

 

[Eleanor]

No Im in agreement with those scriptures, you dont understand them.

Please Biblically demonstrate that the gift of faith (Php 1:29, 2 Pe 1:1, Ac 13:48, 18:27, Ro 12:3) has nothing to do with one's salvation, justification according to Eph 2:8-9, Ro 3:28.

 

[brightfame52]

Please demonstrate that faith has nothing to do with one's salvation, justification per Eph 2:8-9, Ro 3:28.

I never said faith doesnt have a role in Justification/Salvation, Ive demonstrated that one is Justified b4 God based on Christ alone b4 Faith or believing